[1.5] KOOSE mini reentry pod aka escape pod

[Stratickus]

30 minutes ago, Gordon Dry said:

@Stratickus you updated AllYall and BetterBurnTime, right?

I don't use AllYall, but I also updated BBT - and the game does not finish loading, it's stuck in the loading screen.

Correct. Those were the two mods that were updated. However, when I uninstall Koose, with the updated BBT and All Y'all, everything works fine. I have not tried using the 'old' version of BBT and Koose though.

Cheers,

[Rafael acevedo]

1 hour ago, Stratickus said:

Correct. Those were the two mods that were updated. However, when I uninstall Koose, with the updated BBT and All Y'all, everything works fine. I have not tried using the 'old' version of BBT and Koose though.

Cheers,

It loads with bbt, the issue for me was interstellar fuel switch and changes in b9

[TiktaalikDreaming]

Could I get some logs? I don't use the other mods mentioned, and haven't tested with them. But the way it fails is reminiscent of old memory limits, but that wouldn't normally be triggered by the updates for those mods as far as I know. But there will likely be hints in the output. There could be something in the koose triggering something in one of those mods.

[Tonka Crash]

10 hours ago, Stratickus said:

The game is locking up on load at KOOSE/Parts/KoosePod/KooSEpod

It worked fine yesterday. I have uninstalled and reinstalled via Spaced Dock and CKAN with the same results. The only difference between my game today and yesterday is that I have updated two mods via CKAN that were already installed. I'm stumped.

Let me know if logs will be useful to you.

Cheers, 

EDIT: I took a look at the logs, it appears to be locking up on the decoupler for the cradle. Here is a snip from the KSP.log

 

The errors for the fx group decoupler should not be a problem. My game did that for months until I tracked it down a couple weeks ago. It doesn't look like @TiktaalikDreaming got my last suggestion pushed out yet. If you update your local KOOSE .cfg files according to the following post it will clear the decoupler messages. KooSEpod is also deprecated. The current parts are all named KOOSE* not combinations of Koose, KooSE, etc. KooSEpod did not use decouplers it was using docking parts that created other problems which is why they were deprecated.

Edit to add: I went to Spacedock for comparison to my install and the version there was 1.1.11

 

Edited December 3, 2018 by Tonka Crash

[Stratickus]

Problem solved. It looks like BBT was the culprit after all. Snark pushed out a new update and all seems to be working.

Cheers,

[Tonka Crash]

@TiktaalikDreaming  There is a bug in 1.6.0 & 1.6.1 that can lock up the parts menu in the VAB if a bulkheadProfiles isn't defined for each part. The following thread discusses it.

./KOOSE/Parts/KooseChute.cfg needs bulkheadProfiles = srf added to the file. It the only problem part I found in this mod. I'm just notifying mod makers when I run across the problem.

 

[TiktaalikDreaming]

3 hours ago, Tonka Crash said:

@TiktaalikDreaming  There is a bug in 1.6.0 & 1.6.1 that can lock up the parts menu in the VAB if a bulkheadProfiles isn't defined for each part. The following thread discusses it.

./KOOSE/Parts/KooseChute.cfg needs bulkheadProfiles = srf added to the file. It the only problem part I found in this mod. I'm just notifying mod makers when I run across the problem.

 

Thanks for the heads up.

[Def_por4]

Really cool mod, thank you! I made a russian localization, so you can include it into next release

Spoiler

ru
    {
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0001 = ООО "Спасительные Капсулы"
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0002 = Испытанная временем компания, образованная много лет назад в результате слияния двух производителей противозапроных средств. Они производят слабительные капсулы уже более века, но в последние несколько десятилетий переключились на спасательные, в основном из-за путаницы в названии.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0003 = Тепловой щит КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0004 = Ключевой "Я Не Хочу Поджариться Заживо" компонент Кербальской Орбитально-Ориентированной Спасательной Экипировки.  Прикрепляется снизу капсулы.  Встроенного количества Высокотехнологичного Нано Аблятора (также известного как "Пробка") достаточно для НКО.  Для более агрессивного спуска в атмосферу существуют щиты с большим количеством слоев ВНА.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0005 = Паращют КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0006 = Этот небольшой парашют подходит к верхней части Кербальской Орбитально-Ориентированной Спасательной Экипировки и обеспечивает торможение к концу вашего путешествия.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0007 = Капсула КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0008 = Первоначально запланированное как "Кербальский Ограниченный Отсек Сверх-Эконом", название было изменено на "Кербальская Орбитально-Ориентированная Спасательная Экипировка". Эта капсула - минимальное средство для спуска в плотные слои атмосферы на одного кербонавта. Сход с орбиты производится четырьмя небольшими ТТУ. Наличествует РСУ, который может быть использован для увеличения дельта-V при необходимости. Небольшой радиомаячок включен бесплатно. Используйте с соответствующим теплозащитным щитом и парашютом, чтобы сохранить гарантию.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0009 = Гнездо КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0010 = Деталь диаметром 2,5м для крепления шести капсул Кербальской Орбитально-Ориентированной Спасательной Экипировки.  Поддерживается отсоединение, но не присоединение.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0011 = Одиночное гнездо КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0012 = Узел крепления капсул КООСЭ для монтирования радиально на поверхности.}

[TiktaalikDreaming]

15 hours ago, Def_por4 said:

Really cool mod, thank you! I made a russian localization, so you can include it into next release

  Reveal hidden contents

ru
    {
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0001 = ООО "Спасительные Капсулы"
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0002 = Испытанная временем компания, образованная много лет назад в результате слияния двух производителей противозапроных средств. Они производят слабительные капсулы уже более века, но в последние несколько десятилетий переключились на спасательные, в основном из-за путаницы в названии.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0003 = Тепловой щит КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0004 = Ключевой "Я Не Хочу Поджариться Заживо" компонент Кербальской Орбитально-Ориентированной Спасательной Экипировки.  Прикрепляется снизу капсулы.  Встроенного количества Высокотехнологичного Нано Аблятора (также известного как "Пробка") достаточно для НКО.  Для более агрессивного спуска в атмосферу существуют щиты с большим количеством слоев ВНА.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0005 = Паращют КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0006 = Этот небольшой парашют подходит к верхней части Кербальской Орбитально-Ориентированной Спасательной Экипировки и обеспечивает торможение к концу вашего путешествия.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0007 = Капсула КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0008 = Первоначально запланированное как "Кербальский Ограниченный Отсек Сверх-Эконом", название было изменено на "Кербальская Орбитально-Ориентированная Спасательная Экипировка". Эта капсула - минимальное средство для спуска в плотные слои атмосферы на одного кербонавта. Сход с орбиты производится четырьмя небольшими ТТУ. Наличествует РСУ, который может быть использован для увеличения дельта-V при необходимости. Небольшой радиомаячок включен бесплатно. Используйте с соответствующим теплозащитным щитом и парашютом, чтобы сохранить гарантию.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0009 = Гнездо КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0010 = Деталь диаметром 2,5м для крепления шести капсул Кербальской Орбитально-Ориентированной Спасательной Экипировки.  Поддерживается отсоединение, но не присоединение.
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0011 = Одиночное гнездо КООСЭ
        #autoLOC_KOOSE0012 = Узел крепления капсул КООСЭ для монтирования радиально на поверхности.}

That's awesome.  Thanks heaps.

[TiktaalikDreaming]

I'll shortly be adding a second KOOSE.  This is closer to the original MOOSE concept, and I'm not sure why I never tried before.  But, an inventory item for Kerbal Inventory System, using the jetpack slot, that equips as an inflatable heat shield.  Initial tests have shown that it works quite well.  You don't loose access to the kerbanaut maneuvering unit thrusters when it's deployed, so re-entry burn is sorted.  Kerbanauts come with their own chute these days (if unlocked, but realistically, you should need to unlock personal chutes before using personal inflatable re-entry shields), so that becomes usable once you unequip the heat shield.

One issue I've had with the backpack style koose is directional stability.  I'm not sure how it's handling CoM, but while re-entering there's no sense that it can keep the shield in front.  So, I'm experimenting with adding inflatable drag devices to pull the koose around so it's headin shield first.  

[zer0Kerbal]

:like:

[GoldForest]

27 minutes ago, TiktaalikDreaming said:

I'll shortly be adding a second KOOSE.  This is closer to the original MOOSE concept, and I'm not sure why I never tried before.  But, an inventory item for Kerbal Inventory System, using the jetpack slot, that equips as an inflatable heat shield.  Initial tests have shown that it works quite well.  You don't loose access to the kerbanaut maneuvering unit thrusters when it's deployed, so re-entry burn is sorted.  Kerbanauts come with their own chute these days (if unlocked, but realistically, you should need to unlock personal chutes before using personal inflatable re-entry shields), so that becomes usable once you unequip the heat shield.

One issue I've had with the backpack style koose is directional stability.  I'm not sure how it's handling CoM, but while re-entering there's no sense that it can keep the shield in front.  So, I'm experimenting with adding inflatable drag devices to pull the koose around so it's headin shield first.  

[snip]

Reminds me of NASA's emergency deorbit heatshield. 

It was literally a heatshield with some RCS thrusters and a seat with a parachute. Once the shield was through most of the atmosphere, the astronaut would kick off and free fall until chute deployment height. 

https://falsesteps.wordpress.com/2012/07/17/paraconemoosesaverairmat-escape-pods-from-orbit/

[TiktaalikDreaming]

7 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

Reminds me of NASA's emergency deorbit heatshield. 

It was literally a heatshield with some RCS thrusters and a seat with a parachute. Once the shield was through most of the atmosphere, the astronaut would kick off and free fall until chute deployment height. 

https://falsesteps.wordpress.com/2012/07/17/paraconemoosesaverairmat-escape-pods-from-orbit/

Yep, that's the MOOSE, which the KOOSE is based off. The first koose I made, the main part of this mod, couldn't really do it quite as minimally as it should. But using KIS and KSP's new personal parachutes, it looks like I can do a "proper" KOOSE now.

I'm on a bus right now, but I'll pop up more pics soon. It's most definitely one of those moose designs now. Although they didn't have the very useful balloon animals for aerodynamic stability.

14 minutes ago, zer0Kerbal said:

:like:

It's just not right <thumps table>! Something needs to be done about this lack of likes.

[GoldForest]

1 minute ago, TiktaalikDreaming said:

 Although they didn't have the very useful balloon animals for aerodynamic stability.

The real MOOSE would have used the RCS jets for stability, IIRC. 

You could also get stability artificially if you move the COM off center of the part. 

[zer0Kerbal]

2 minutes ago, TiktaalikDreaming said:

It's just not right <thumps table>! Something needs to be done about this lack of likes.

+1

:like: :like:

[TiktaalikDreaming]

Just now, GoldForest said:

The real MOOSE would have used the RCS jets for stability, IIRC. 

You could also get stability artificially if you move the COM off center of the part. 

I've played around with things a bit. The part centre is used as the attach point for kis as far as I can tell, so the CoM is fixed without playing with the config options and I'm not sure they work for inventory items. The shield doesn't have a trailing cone shape to keep it pointed blunt end first. But the kerbanaut's built in rcs works fine. And it is plenty to keep it pointed right during reentry.

But. It would be nice to have dynamic stability. I'm going to experiment getting the various shapes they played around with. At the moment it's really a truncated version of the classic moose. Failing that, balloon animals.

[GoldForest]

5 minutes ago, TiktaalikDreaming said:

I've played around with things a bit. The part centre is used as the attach point for kis as far as I can tell, so the CoM is fixed without playing with the config options and I'm not sure they work for inventory items. The shield doesn't have a trailing cone shape to keep it pointed blunt end first. But the kerbanaut's built in rcs works fine. And it is plenty to keep it pointed right during reentry.

But. It would be nice to have dynamic stability. I'm going to experiment getting the various shapes they played around with. At the moment it's really a truncated version of the classic moose. Failing that, balloon animals.

Hmmm, invisible with almost no collision mesh part to move the COM?

Edited October 2, 2019 by GoldForest

[TiktaalikDreaming]

8 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

Hmmm, invisible with almost no collision mesh part to move the COM?

It doesn't work, the CoM for a kerbal part is just the root of the part in unity. The same root used by kis to attach. There is a cfg stanza to move it though, but as noted that's for parts, not sure if it works on inventory. Hell, I'm not sure the CoM isn't just the Kerbal still. But I can change the aero . And it is supposed to be inflatable, and thus relatively light

[TiktaalikDreaming]

Extending the "craft" a bit forward so it mostly covers the body of the kerbanaut made it very slightly better.  Basically what the original design was;

but, it a very very truncated cone.

For testing, I basically aim at a gentle re-entry, then time warp, then start a spin using rcs, and then cut off control.  With the new version with the shroud going forward of the kerbanaut a bit (still not covering the helm etc) it managed to stop spinning just after the re-entry effects. Trying with balloon animals next

[Drakenred65]

I was about to suggest that you  may want to take a look at inline ballutes  mod., but then I remembered that what I used  was a modded a command chair with Ballute  and a tweaked of the size on the ballot till it  until it was tinny and that worked  just fine,,, and I’m about to murder auto-correct sorry it wants to auto correct Ballutes to ballot.

 

 

Edited October 2, 2019 by [email protected]

[TiktaalikDreaming]

5 minutes ago, [email protected] said:

I was about to suggest that you  may want to take a look at inline ballutes  mod., but then I remembered that what I used  was a modded a command chair with Ballute  and a tweaked of the size on the ballot till it  until it was tinny and that worked  just fine,,, and I’m about to murder auto-correct sorry it wants to auto correct Ballutes to ballot.

 

 

Yeah, I was tempted to have a look at the external command seat module for this.  And I may still do a version for that. 

I think I'm about to give up attempting dynamic stability, as it looks like the inventory isn't a separate entity in the physics.  The aero forces for example just have one instance.  So there's not going to be any torque to swing it around.  I suspect the mass will be the same.  Which ruins my excuse for balloon animals.  But frees me up to just do something that looks like the MOOSE.

Anyway, as the shaped balloon re-entry stabilization system is going away, screenshot before it's gone;

[Jognt]

How about offsetting CoL or CoP or CoD? That way you dont have to fiddle with moving CoM forward. 

[linuxgurugamer]

1 hour ago, Jognt said:

How about offsetting CoL or CoP or CoD? That way you dont have to fiddle with moving CoM forward. 

I was going to suggest this.  Look at the Mk 1-2 (I think) to see an example.  The CoM should be below the CoL, try moving it 1/2 m down and see what happens

[TiktaalikDreaming]

51 minutes ago, Jognt said:

How about offsetting CoL or CoP or CoD? That way you dont have to fiddle with moving CoM forward. 

I think the issue is going to be that the part can have it's CoM and CoL etc moved about, but in game there's just a kerbal and some graphics added.  The physics is all applied through the kerbal centre.  

So, messing around with the inventory item, isn't helping.  At least, that's what seems to be happening.  It's basically acting as a point mass with a drag and lift force also acting on that single point.  Again, this is because I can't shift the centres for the kerbal.  And the inventory appears to not alter that.

[Jognt]

I have no idea how KIS items work, but maybe its possible to use the stock inventory to turn a heatshield/chair combo into something they can fit in their front pocket? 

I think you should also be able to modify a Kerbal’s CoM/CoL since it’s technically just another part, but you might have to write a plug-in to change it depending on the status. (Boarded vs Eva)

Though I admit that may be a bit too much work.  

do KIS jet pack items extend the kerbal itself or do they count as another part?

Nm, you mentioned it all being calculated for just the kerbal. 

Edited October 2, 2019 by Jognt