IncongruousGoat

The Ultimate Challenge Continued (originally by Just Jim)

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2 hours ago, Xurkitree said:

Alas. Time to do it again, but better.

I look forward to seeing it.

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Remember me?

I did do it better!

I started a thread in Mission Reports to document this here.

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15 minutes ago, Xurkitree said:

Remember me?

I did do it better!

I started a thread in Mission Reports to document this here.

I'm liking the look of it already. I admit, I have a serious soft spot for the no-ISRU grand tour - it's a less common approach, for obvious reasons, and (I feel, anyways) that the missions one gets from that approach are more interesting than ISRU-based ones. I wish you the very best of luck in your attempt, and look forward to seeing it flown to completion.

EDIT: in the interest of transparency, I freely admit I read the start of your report with a big ole smile on my face. The sort of mission you're flying is exactly the kind of thing I took up administering this challenge to see.

Edited by IncongruousGoat
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Created 3 Landers, but my PC still can't connect to internet so i can't post screenshots yet, will NOT use ISRU, Hopefully a Nigh reusable mission with raw rocketry, oh and it's single launch.

Planned name : Sheep v3

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Le Landers :

MWTWA7w.png

Small Lander, gets Moho or smaller and return to orbit safely, fixes Duna as well.

IIEqzOu.png

(Hope)Fully reusable Tylo Lander, also does Laythe with no problem.

kcoRUqR.png

Eve Lander.

Verp3EL.png

What reached orbit with a proper-ish ascent from 2161 meters ASL in Hyperedit test.

UYPyG0j.png

Dock-able parachutes for Duna and Laythe.

(note : first 2 Landers brought 2 Kerbals, did a remodification after i posted their Screenshots).

B84Xiin.png

Special flag for this mission, and i changed my mind, this first shot won't really go far, so i'll be using ions, never used ions for something big though LOL, don't really want to kill my potato-ish PC yet.

Estimated fuel reserve :

No refuel for Eve Lander, one landing (Eve Only)

1 Refuel for Big Lander, 2 Landings (Tylo & Laythe, est.5 tons per refuel).

Unknown amount of Refuels for Small Lander, 9 Landings (Duna, Moho, Vall, Eeloo, Mun, Dres, Ike, Bop, Minmus (sorted from largest Gees), est.1 tons per refuel).

2 Bare EVA Landings (Pol & Gilly).

Est.10-11 Required fuel reserve total.

Edited by GRS

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Any advice for Non ISRU Grand Tours ???

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39 minutes ago, GRS said:

Any advice for Non ISRU Grand Tours ???

 

Non ISRU Grand Tour recipe:

Design a lightweight refuelable lander that can get from moho orbit to surface and back. This can do at least everything  but Eve, Tylo and Laythe.

Build a disposable Eve lander.

Check if your Eve lander can get from orbit to surface and back on Laythe and Tylo in one piece and then be refuelled. And if this is more efficient than a separate lander.

If yes, you are done. If not build a lander for laythe and Tylo. You could build one that gets to surface and back in one piece at laythe, but which is staged and disposed at Tylo. Laythe is easier, as you can land almost for free due to its atmosphere.

At least one of the above crafts should be able to do duna. This could at best be the lightweight lander, depending on your design. Due to its atmosphere, you can land here also almost for free, while Dunas atmosphere is so thin and gravity so weak, that even small engines can get you back to orbit.

 

Now you will need something to travel between planets. It's probably a bad idea to take all the needed fuel and the heavy landers with you from planet to planet. You could split your rocket in kerbin orbit into several refuelling pods,  sending them directly to where you will need them.

The order also matters. Try to get rid of heavy things early.

 

Now strip all this together in a big rocket, and you are done :D

 

To fullfill the Ultimate Challenge in game contract, I think you will need to do all this using a pod that's dockable to all your landers instead of some command seats. As this contract requires to land the same vessel everywhere.

Edited by Kergarin
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14 minutes ago, Kergarin said:

 

Non ISRU Grand Tour recipe:

Design a lightweight refuelable lander that can get from moho orbit to surface and back. This can do at least everything  but Eve, Tylo and Laythe.

Build a disposable Eve lander.

Check if your Eve lander can get from orbit to surface and back on Laythe and Tylo in one piece and then be refuelled. And if this is more efficient than a separate lander.

If yes, you are done. If not build a lander for laythe and Tylo. You could build one that gets to surface and back in one piece at laythe, but which is staged and disposed at Tylo. Laythe is easier, as you can land almost for free due to its atmosphere.

At least one of the above crafts should be able to do duna. This could at best be the lightweight lander, depending on your design. Due to its atmosphere, you can land here also almost for free, while Dunas atmosphere is so thin and gravity so weak, that even small engines can get you back to orbit.

 

Now you will need something to travel between planets. It's probably a bad idea to take all the needed fuel and the heavy landers with you from planet to planet. You could split your rocket in kerbin orbit into several refuelling pods,  sending them directly to where you need them.

The order also matters. Try to get rid of heavy things early.

 

Now strip all this together in a big rocket, and you are done :D

 

Thanx, guess i'll try.

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No problem :wink:

I guess the hardest part is planning all the transfers between planets and the needed fuel for this in advance.

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4 hours ago, GRS said:

Any advice for Non ISRU Grand Tours ???

Moho takes a lot of of fuel to get to, so you want the lander to be light. I would suggest making the entire Moho run ion powered, since you're already near the Sun so you may as well take advantage of all the solar power.

Eve should be a disposable lander, not much else that can be done there. If you can land away from the shore on some of the mountainous regions you could easily get above 2 or 3 kilometers when you land.

Duna may need it own lander, but you could get away with using a Tylo lander and refueling it. 

Tylo and Laythe will likely need their own landers. Jet power is the best for Laythe and I would say spark engines are the best way to make a small Tylo lander.

All the others could just use a single refuelable lander.

For my grand tour I had the landers come back to Kerbin to refuel, so I'm suggesting that, but you could do what @Kergarin said and send fuel pods. For interplanetary transport I suggest ion power. It will take a long time, but if you build the ship correctly, it is by far the most efficient way to traverse deep space.

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6 hours ago, JacobJHC said:

Moho takes a lot of of fuel to get to, so you want the lander to be light. I would suggest making the entire Moho run ion powered, since you're already near the Sun so you may as well take advantage of all the solar power.

Eve should be a disposable lander, not much else that can be done there. If you can land away from the shore on some of the mountainous regions you could easily get above 2 or 3 kilometers when you land.

Duna may need it own lander, but you could get away with using a Tylo lander and refueling it. 

Tylo and Laythe will likely need their own landers. Jet power is the best for Laythe and I would say spark engines are the best way to make a small Tylo lander.

All the others could just use a single refuelable lander.

For my grand tour I had the landers come back to Kerbin to refuel, so I'm suggesting that, but you could do what @Kergarin said and send fuel pods. For interplanetary transport I suggest ion power. It will take a long time, but if you build the ship correctly, it is by far the most efficient way to traverse deep space.

Thanx mate, i'll be thinking of it later.

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Here's the Mission Report of my Grand Tour, with no ISRU or refuelling what so ever.

:)

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5 hours ago, Xurkitree said:

Here's the Mission Report of my Grand Tour, with no ISRU or refuelling what so ever.

:)

Sweet, hope i can do things like that later, but with 5 Kerbals (so i can have Val on Vall, Bob on Bop, Bill EVA landed on Pol, Jeb Jeb'd Laythe and My boi Simone striking Tylo's dignity and kicking Eve's massive bottom).

@IncongruousGoat come and check that out.

Edited by GRS
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@Xurkitree Congratulations on completing the challenge! Everything seems to be in order. Your entry has been added to the Hall of Fame, and you may claim the badge at your leisure.

I found myself very impressed with your mission. The temptation is strong, when confronted with the problem of a non-ISRU grand tour, to just throw ion engines and/or moar boosters at the problem, but you did neither. A healthy mix of single-use and re-usable landers, of nuclear, chemical, and ion propulsion, and lots and lots of clever piloting makes for a good mission indeed. And all of this after having a submission rejected. Most people don't do the challenge once; I think you're the first to ever have attempted it twice. Take your badge and wear it with pride. You've certainly earned it.

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Quick update, Here's a Vall Lander i made today, it's below 1 tons.

NskRRmu.png

Tangles Duna as well.

1sFlHnP.png

8e6gIYS.png

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That is tiny @GRS

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Now for The Moho Ion Lander, Ion Lander, and a Big Lander, The Ion Lander will propell The Ion Mothership, that Vall Lander is even lighter than my previous design, it's 1.37 tons in Duna form while unkerbed, will be 1464 kilograms while kerbed, full mass roughly 885 kg unkerbed, i'll be working on Moho Lander, Big Lander and Ion Lander after school, i'll see if The Big Lander works fine on Laythe "Laythe-r" (a stupid KSP pun i made other than "Delta Eve", "Thatmo-sphere", "Pol-ar orbit", "Dres-cent" and maybe more).

Also @JacobJHC and @Kergarin, how to record videos, even after my first craft that can beat this challenge is done, i won't start except i learn how to record myself while playing, tell me the apps, and their hotkeys.

Edited by GRS
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12 hours ago, GRS said:

Now for The Moho Ion Lander, Ion Lander, and a Big Lander, The Ion Lander will propell The Ion Mothership, that Vall Lander is even lighter than my previous design, it's 1.37 tons in Duna form while unkerbed, will be 1464 kilograms while kerbed, full mass roughly 885 kg unkerbed, i'll be working on Moho Lander, Big Lander and Ion Lander after school, i'll see if The Big Lander works fine on Laythe "Laythe-r" (a stupid KSP pun i made other than "Delta Eve", "Thatmo-sphere", "Pol-ar orbit", "Dres-cent" and maybe more).

Also @JacobJHC and @Kergarin, how to record videos, even after my first craft that can beat this challenge is done, i won't start except i learn how to record myself while playing, tell me the apps, and their hotkeys.

OBS is how I do it. It's free, no recording limit (I've accidentally left it on and had 25 hour recordings) and has no water mark. I edit them in movie maker.

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What's the recording hotkey ??? (for storage space saving).

Edited by GRS

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Spoiler

Jeb : We can't let Simone hog all the glory !!! We'll show him what we can really do !!!

Val, Bill and Bob : YEEEAAHHH !!!

Simone : Whatev...give me a break and i'll leave everything but Tylo and Eve to you guys, but first...let me test the landers.

JESmaSf.png

Moho Ion Lander.

rRUXr5U.png

Tylo-Laythe Lander.

UulHYNv.png

Ion Lander. (Eeloo really is a good place to practice suicide burns)

V9tiWau.png

The Duna-Vall Lander, turns out, i only need to place the dock-able parachute somewhere as long as it's not in the lander, it'll fix Duna system anyways, no refuel.

(Yes, Simone tested all the landers, he need a better space suit for himself)

Edited by GRS

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7 hours ago, GRS said:
  Reveal hidden contents

Jeb : We can't let Simone hog all the glory !!! We'll show him what we can really do !!!

Val, Bill and Bob : YEEEAAHHH !!!

Simone : Whatev...give me a break and i'll leave everything but Tylo and Eve to you guys, but first...let me test the landers.

JESmaSf.png

Moho Ion Lander.

rRUXr5U.png

Tylo-Laythe Lander.

UulHYNv.png

Ion Lander. (Eeloo really is a good place to practice suicide burns)

V9tiWau.png

The Duna-Vall Lander, turns out, i only need to place the dock-able parachute somewhere as long as it's not in the lander, it'll fix Duna system anyways, no refuel.

(Yes, Simone tested all the landers, he need a better space suit for himself)

You really don't need RTG's on the Eeloo Lander. Solar Panels work just as well - the main factor of landing is Battery power

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7 minutes ago, Xurkitree said:

You really don't need RTG's on the Eeloo Lander. Solar Panels work just as well - the main factor of landing is Battery power

Yes, but i'm afraid the charging will take "eons" since Eeloo is so far away, at least that thing charges, maybe you can tell me if medium panels give me more electricity than RTGs in Eeloo.

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1 hour ago, GRS said:

Yes, but i'm afraid the charging will take "eons" since Eeloo is so far away, at least that thing charges, maybe you can tell me if medium panels give me more electricity than RTGs in Eeloo.

No they don't. What you do have is timewarp. They'll charge allright.

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1 hour ago, Xurkitree said:

No they don't. What you do have is timewarp. They'll charge allright.

OK, i'll just use them to get rid of some mass, i'll do it after School (I'm in School right now).

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