SQUAD

KSP Weekly: Thrusting into the future

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Just now, Nertea said:

Well unless it's 2 completely different textures for switching. You know, for waste.

Oof that'd be no good why duplicare the end caps and nozzle?

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4 hours ago, passinglurker said:

As far as the community is concerned yellow is now shorthand for monoprop so people could find it odd and inconsistent to find other parts sporting the yellow stripes.

I think this is a good point, especially since the majority of the current player base came on board after v0.25 was released when Porkjet's spaceplane parts were added.  As such, I'd be willing to bet that most people associate "yellow stripes" with monoprop parts, despite the alternate textures introduced in 1.4.0.

Regarding the RT-10 and RT-5 revamps, I'm satisfied for the most part.  With the exception of the legacy 2.5m Rockomax Brand Decoupler, I always thought the existing RT-10 and RT-5 were the most hideous parts in the library, and I never used them.  But now I might.

They kind of remind of a stack of gunpowder rolls that were used on Iowa-class battleships in their main guns.  More powder rolls, the further it goes...kinda like the RT boosters. :sticktongue:

iowashellpowder2.jpg

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I'd like to know why you ignore some 1.4.5 bugs, especially this: https://bugs.kerbalspaceprogram.com/issues/19427?issue_count=19&issue_position=1&next_issue_id=19558

But instead of fixing something making game not quite playable you revamp parts for 1.5 and fix some "frustrating issues with camera" and "ambient sound in editor"

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11 hours ago, SQUAD said:

this week the team worked on fixing a quite annoying aspect of the Camera in the VAB/SPH.

Uhhh, who cares? That's been around since day one, and to the best of my knowledge nobody has complained.
Where's my goddamded joystick support?
Are you going to fix the mk3 cargo ramp?
How about the bouncing LY-01?
The EVA issues on console?

There are over 1200 open bugs on the tracker, and the VAB camera ain't one of them.

Can we please get some updates on the bugs people care about?

 

27 minutes ago, ThirdOfSeven said:

I'd like to know why you ignore some 1.4.5 bugs

My 2c? Because that would require some actual coding, and some work on the game engine. Apparently Squad isn't interested in fixing the hard bugs, they'd rather distract people with shiny pictures.
Wheels have been broken in some way since 1.1, I guess Squad is just incapable of fixing them properly.


@SQUADAs for the part-revamp itself, you're still not up to the standard set by several mod creators. Better, but not there yet.  I'm not going to bother with specifics as it's already been said better by others.
Your attempt at building hype is not working on me anyway, as I'm still waiting for bugfixes before I even consider buying your DLC or installing the latest broken release.
If 1.5 fixes, at a minimum, the bugs I mentioned above, I might reconsider.

Edited by steve_v

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Imagine if squad were trolling us with this artwork and the actual release is quality stuff :P

sigh. I’m really pleased they still work on the game but Squad should stick to bug fixing and implementing features If this is the kind of art we’re going to be getting 

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1 hour ago, steve_v said:

they'd rather distract people with shiny pictures.

This approach only works if the pictures are...well...shiny.

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7 hours ago, sh1pman said:

I like SRBs from Ven’s revamp more.

bty0ZOf.png

rmuPgJs.png

I love the rt 1 and rt 2. They’re the 0.6m parts right? We so need them in stock ;.;

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Well.

I have very mixed feelings about the boosters.

First of all, the end caps look gorgeous. I never understood why any part would have a hole at the end, and this completely banishes that complaint. All end caps should look like this. In fact, why not use the end cap texture for every side of every part? End cap loading screen? End cap merchandise?

Ahem.

Second of all, the overall style of the boosters makes 'em much more useful for everyday application. I don't think I used the old two in any non-fleahopper rocket, but I can see myself using these in quite a few different situations.

Unfortunately, they seem to have lost a little character. I don't know... Perhaps a little to similar to the other parts? The sides do resemble a monopropellant tank, and the taller booster just looks like the same texture was pasted twice to make up for the height. As far as the bottom goes (the side opposite the glorious end cap), it looks a little bleh. I was unable to find any real-world booster that had a similar, fuel-tank-like area on the bottom. (Ironically, the first image that came up when I searched "Solid Fuel Booster" was of the old "Hammer" booster!) They were all flat-bottomed, had a skirt extension, like the hammer, or had that weird round thing, like the flea. I would recommend changing the base by adding one of the things just mentioned: It would go a long way in making the parts unique.

 

So, to summarize the ramble with another:

Please do consider uniformity and uniqueness. Right now, the boosters are uniform with the other parts, and that's a good thing: it allows them to be used with a wide variety of rockets and constructions. They, however, are not really unique. They kind of have a procedural-parts-y look and, even though their function is different, they're practically a fuel tank with a cone. And an end cap. Oh, what an end cap... Adding a greeble on the base and changing the side textures would go a long way in keeping 'em uniform while adding uniqueness.

 

Thank you, I appreciate your work, and good luck on the rest of the revamp!

Edited by GearsNSuch
I don't think there's been a single post I didn't edit. Wow, three contractions in one sentence.

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4 hours ago, ThirdOfSeven said:

But instead of fixing something making game not quite playable you revamp parts for 1.5 and fix some "frustrating issues with camera" and "ambient sound in editor"

4 hours ago, steve_v said:

Uhhh, who cares? That's been around since day one, and to the best of my knowledge nobody has complained.
Where's my joystick support?
Are you going to fix the mk3 cargo ramp?
How about the bouncing LY-01?

There are over 1200 open bugs on the tracker, and the VAB camera ain't one of them.

Can we please get some updates on the bugs people care about?

 

Apparently Squad isn't interested in fixing the hard bugs, they'd rather distract people with shiny pictures.
Wheels have been broken in some way since 1.1, I guess Squad is just incapable of fixing them properly.

Right. It's not like Squad has dozens of people on staff working on those behind the scenes, silently cloning the bug reports to their internal tracker as they tackle them, since NDA or whatever probably keeps them from updating bugs on the public tracker until release or something, idk.
It's not like the art team is working on their own thing simultaneously, independently of QA and the other developers.
It's not like Uomo and Badie probably have to fight squad's draconian higher ups for clearance to release anything at all, and likely only clearance to talk about and show "finished" content. (Why do you think nobody saw the dang mission builder until like a month before release, and all we got were part teasers?)

What, Squad is a centralized mess where the heads interfere with open dialogue and developers are held to silence over most matters? No way, they're totally just lazy.

 

Also, my joystick has worked fine since i first plugged it in and bound it in the main menu settings, so... idk what problem you're having.

Edited by Lupi

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2 minutes ago, Lupi said:

Right. It's not like Squad has dozens of people on staff working on those behind the scenes, silently cloning the bug reports to their private internal tracker as they tackle them, while Uomo and Badie have to fight squad's draconian higher ups for clearance to release anything at all, and likely only clearance to talk about and show "finished" content.

We think there is reason for some (very few) bugs to get status changed from "New" to "Confirmed" when it goes to internal bug tracker if it exists at all cause otherwise they just can't track which reports are processed and which are not.

5 minutes ago, Lupi said:

Why do you think nobody saw the dang mission builder until like a month before release, and all we got were part teasers?

We had entire year of screenshots and news releases about it. Now we have 2 paragraphs about 1 part getting new texture and one non-critical (or not even reported) bug fixed (something single person can get done as hobby, to be honest) each week. Don't you feel any difference?

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9 minutes ago, ThirdOfSeven said:

We had entire year of screenshots and news releases about it. Now we have 2 paragraphs about 1 part getting new texture and one non-critical (or not even reported) bug fixed (something single person can get done as hobby, to be honest) each week. Don't you feel any difference?

I'm not talking about Making History on the whole, i'm talking about the supposed core feature, the mission builder itself. You know, that thing that was so poorly described and displayed that people thought it was gonna be a career mode revamp?

We got maybe 1 or 2 indev screenshots over that year of the builder itself, until the very final stretch where I presume they started approving "finalised-looking" pictures of it for release.

For most of Making History's development, the only complete-looking stuff they could show off were parts, so it's more of the same now as it was then.

 

There's more I wish I could say, but then I would be running way afoul of not one, but TWO NDAs. Lucky me, being a content creator AND a playtester. Only reason I even said what I did is because it's either public knowledge, personal speculation, or something I observed before signing either of them.

Edited by Lupi

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2 minutes ago, Lupi said:

You know, that thing that was so poorly described and displayed that people thought it was gonna be a career mode revamp?

Well, I wasn't this person cause I didn't miss a single KSP Weekly release and it was very clear what it is going to be with even sketches like here

http://kerbaldevteam.tumblr.com/post/160853705704/ksp-weekly-fixing-projects-and-making-contact

You need to understand I'm not attacking code guys or design guys for being lazy (it is your words), it is more like question about do we still have developers we used to exist at all. Maybe they are gone? Maybe "squad's draconian higher ups" fail at setting priority here towards what players demand vs what they think will bring more players? Then i have bad news:  revamping parts will not bring more people if they will not be able to play game cause physics is outright weird or joystick doesn't work at all or whatever bug will stick into their eye from very beginning. Many people I know either play 1.3 cause "there less bugs here" or don't play at all anymore and don't even think about going into 1.4 and expansion for that reason.

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17 minutes ago, ThirdOfSeven said:

Maybe "squad's draconian higher ups" fail at setting priority here towards what players demand vs what they think will bring more players? Then i have bad news:  revamping parts will not bring more people if they will not be able to play game cause physics is outright weird or joystick doesn't work at all or whatever bug will stick into their eye from very beginning. Many people I know either play 1.3 cause "there less bugs here" or don't play at all anymore and don't even think about going into 1.4 and expansion for that reason.

What i'm saying is that Squad's management likely have a tight grip on what is publicly said and shown. The developers who are working on all these problems are doing so silently while Squad only approves "visually complete" things for public display.

You didn't see my 50 or so bug reports from playtesting what I did all those months back, because those were on a restricted tracker that only squad and those playtesting that specific thing could see. Just because you don't see things changing on the public tracker doesn't mean they're not happening behind the scenes. If they cloned one of your aforementioned 1200 bug reports to it, you wouldn't know. But they'd still be working on it.

 

There was a time when Squad was okay talking about bugs, but then someone up top got it in their head that it would be unprofessional to be open like that. Heck, some of Kerbal's development was even livestreamed. But now, whoever's in charge of approving content for release has decided "No, only stuff that reflects well on us, so we seem professional" even though it just makes them seem distant, disconnected, and uninterested.

Edited by Lupi

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3 minutes ago, Lupi said:

What i'm saying is that Squad's management likely have a tight grip on what is publicly said and shown. The developers who are working on all these problems are doing so silently while Squad only approves "visually complete" things for public display.

It is not right approach to bugs in public release like 1.4.x. You can hide something in version nobody can see (and nobody outside tight circle cares much about bugs in 1.5 yet), but you can't just keep silence about something people have and experiencing already. Currently it looks like nobody cares about 1.4.x bugs and 1.4.6+ releases with bug fixes are not going to be released (from last 4-5 weeks).

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1 minute ago, ThirdOfSeven said:

It is not right approach to bugs in public release like 1.4.x. You can hide something in version nobody can see (and nobody outside tight circle cares much about bugs in 1.5 yet), but you can't just keep silence about something people have and experiencing already. Currently it looks like nobody cares about 1.4.x bugs and 1.4.6+ releases with bug fixes are not going to be released (from last 4-5 weeks).

...you do realize when i say "public release" i mean the KSP weeklies and other blog posts, not actual versions of the game, right?

 

Edited by Lupi

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1 minute ago, Lupi said:

...you do realize when i say "public release" i mean the KSP weeklies and other blog posts, not actual development versions of the game, right? 

I understand your whole point about hiding something from KSP weeklies. I don't understand your point about hiding something from public bug tracker (and reported for version available for public) while putting something non-critical and not reported on KSP weeklies instead. Doesn't it seem even more unprofessional?

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Just now, ThirdOfSeven said:

I understand your whole point about hiding something from KSP weeklies. I don't understand your point about hiding something from public bug tracker (and reported for version available for public) while putting something non-critical and not reported on KSP weeklies instead. Doesn't it seem even more unprofessional?

Because if they didn't say anything about any bugfixes at all, people would complain about that.

Blasted if you do mention an attempt to fix bugs, blasted if you don't.

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1 hour ago, Lupi said:

What, Squad is a centralized mess where the heads interfere with open dialogue and developers are held to silence over most matters? No way, they're totally just lazy.

Whatever. The result is the same to the end-user, lots of unfixed bugs and little information. The face you present is the one people will judge you by.
Regressions are still appearing, the game is still a bug-riddled mess on release-day, and Squad is still waffling on about anything but the old, unfixed bugs in the dev notes.
I just want the game I backed in alpha to grow up and be playable without random breakage every update.

 

1 hour ago, Lupi said:

idk what problem you're having.

#17984. Generic joysticks do not work at all on GNU/Linux, and attempting to bind a "Steam Controller" crashes the game. Introduced in 1.4.0.
FWIW, this particular regression is stalled with "We are unable to provide a date as to when that task may be prioritized at this stage."  Weasel-speak translation: We're not fixing this anytime soon, go away.
Meanwhile, trivial bugs that nobody noticed are being worked on, presumably because they are easy and don't involve fixing the janky game-engine. :rolleyes:

The same thing occurred when 1.1 was regularly crashing with memory management errors: Pretend it isn't happening and pour on the hype for the next major release. When called out, blame Unity and claim there's no way to fix it.

15 minutes ago, Lupi said:

Blasted if you do mention an attempt to fix bugs, blasted if you don't.

Blasted if you introduce a major regression on a supported platform, then leave it unfixed and unmentioned through 5 patches. Blasted if you announce a new major version, again without mentioning it.

Edited by steve_v

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42 minutes ago, Lupi said:

Blasted if you do mention an attempt to fix bugs, blasted if you don't.

Well, how it looks when it is professional you can see in many-many issue trackers of many products:

1) Any new bug gets status change to "neeed more info" or "confirmed" or "not a bug", etc with possible comment from one who does report processing.

2) Then bug is closed as "resolved" or "impossible to deal with" or "someday, maybe, cause we don't have time".

People know they are not alone. People will report bugs on it and people will know it is here to be processed. This way people know bug tracker is a tool to make product better, not something nobody cares about. This is how it is done by textbook for support engineers in any place where they exist. They never allow their customers to feel lost and helpless.

And you don't even need to say anything on KSP Weekly about this bug! Job is simply done.

Like it was before even if it was affecting less than 1% of all users probably (I had this with Squad when 1.3 was released and it was done in a professional way).

So, please, let us know we are not alone by putting more attention to reported bugs. Even what was done for joystick bug ("we can't fix it now") is better than silence.

Edited by ThirdOfSeven

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13 minutes ago, ThirdOfSeven said:

Even what was done for joystick bug ("we can't fix it now") is better than silence.

Actually fixing the regressions you introduce is even more "professional".
Doing nothing and waiting for someone else (Unity, the community) to fix bugs, as is/was the case with joysticks not working, crashing if pulseaudio isn't installed, and expecting players to hex-edit the executable to get the game to start (yes, seriously, this was standard practice for several releases) is not what I would call professional at all, particularly for a released game. Yet Squad is still doing it.
This, along with the game being consistently broken on release, is why they get blasted.

Edited by steve_v

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17 hours ago, SQUAD said:

Update 1.5 continues to be at the forefront of the agenda. Each passing week, new elements are being added to this upcoming and substantial free addition to KSP. For instance, this week the team worked on fixing a quite annoying aspect of the Camera in the VAB/SPH. Some of you may have noticed that if you removed the root part  after having moved the camera, the camera would not be reinstated into its initial position, which in turn could cause a bit of confusion sometimes, especially if the new root part was out of view. With this fix, the camera will be reset to its original position every time a root part is removed from the editor.

 

17 hours ago, SQUAD said:

new elements are being added

 

17 hours ago, SQUAD said:

this week the team worked on fixing

What...?This is some straight up trolling. What is new?
I'm ashamed of my love for this game.
Delete T2 from craft file.
Send to Eve's darkest trenches.
Hold ALT with brick; bash F4 with stupid re-textured Hammer.
Revert to last dev team.

Edited by Dark Lion
Moderator who won't name yourself: if you're going to edit me, do it properly!

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Used to love this game so much. At this point I find the sheer lack of support to be intentional and disrespectful. After a thorough review of the rules I have found my following statement to be in full compliance.

For those of you sharing my frustration, go check out SimpleRockets 2! Still in development but looks incredible and seems to be a really solid attempt at replacing KSP entirely. The developer is constantly responding to feedback, being entirely transparent and actually seems to care about their fan base. They are completely supportive of player made mods just like Squad has been and almost every single part can be resized/adjusted to meet your needs without having to stack a bunch of stock parts together.

Squad, you did great for a very long time and I’ve never had so much enjoyment from playing a video game. You will always have that special place in my heart and I will always miss the good ol’ days. The time is coming to pass the torch.

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2 hours ago, ThirdOfSeven said:

Then i have bad news:  revamping parts will not bring more people if they will not be able to play game cause physics is outright weird or joystick doesn't work at all or whatever bug will stick into their eye from very beginning.

What is the art team to do? Sit on their hands and do nothing because you "demand it"? Do you want Squad to fire the art team simply because you think that will allow the programmers to concentrate on fixing bugs?

News Flash: The art team cannot do anything about fixing bugs, but they still need to earn their keep.

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