Cargo Bay Kerbal Implosion

[Tibrogargan]

I've put an external command seat in the cargo bay of a plane, along with a materials bay and goo container.  The idea being that the scientist in the seat can do EVA reports while seated, then leave the seat in order to restore the materials bay and goo container.  Problem is, when the plane is moving the Kerbal scientist becomes subject to aerodynamic forces even while the cargo bay is closed, with unfortunate results (for the Kerbal at least)

Obviously, since both the materials bay and goo container are not biome specific while flying there is little actual point to being able to do this ... however ... I want to   (realism or something).

Is there any way to designate a space as "enclosed" so that Kerbal can be "unattached" and remain relatively safe?

[Lisias]

Just now, Tibrogargan said:

[…] Problem is, when the plane is moving the Kerbal scientist becomes subject to aerodynamic forces even while the cargo bay is closed, with unfortunate results (for the Kerbal at least) [..]

Is there any way to designate a space as "enclosed" so that Kerbal can be "unattached" and remain relatively safe?

Nops, this is a flaw on KSP physics. I think (but didn't tried yet) that FAR does it correctly - but there're a trade-off, FAR have their own set of glitches too. You choose your shoes in function of where you feet hurts (not how bad this got translated to English).

One thing that you can do is to put a shield (ablator, perhaps?) to protect the Kerbal. You can clip that shield on the part just in front of the Kerbal for aesthetics, but you will have to live with the extra mass.

[Tibrogargan]

28 minutes ago, Lisias said:

One thing that you can do is to put a shield (ablator, perhaps?) to protect the Kerbal. You can clip that shield on the part just in front of the Kerbal for aesthetics, but you will have to live with the extra mass.

Will this protect from aerodynamic forces, or just heat?  Heat hasn't been a problem so far - he's just getting bounced around and explodes (although, if you're quick he can grab something and be safe)

[bewing]

What version are you playing? I thought this had gotten fixed in the current release.

Alternately, you can use a fairing instead of a cargo bay, and that should work -- if that suits your sense of realism?

[stelarKerbal]

I think you are not havving actually "aerodinamic" forces, but the problem is just how anything "physical" works on the engine of the game.

that saying, it does not happen fully correctly what happens in reality as, "you are inside a plane then the plane velocity is added to you".

on thegame as soon as your kerbal "stops" being attached to the chair, its the same as being on the air.

the only thing that stops it from falling are the "walls" of the plane,  so basically the kerbal has a constant "acceleration" of your plane velocity.

someting it "may" help is, besides having it with the chair. before doing what you want to do make it stand up and find a way to put a leder into it, I think that while in a leder is considered to still be part of the plane. solving your issue (as it also allows you for all experiments)

 

[Tibrogargan]

11 minutes ago, bewing said:

What version are you playing? I thought this had gotten fixed in the current release.

Alternately, you can use a fairing instead of a cargo bay, and that should work -- if that suits your sense of realism?

Playing 1.5.  Trying to make the kind of plane that is used to collect science information from (for instance) the Arctic, or from hurricanes.  People can move around in the "cargo" area and do their work without being sucked out of the plane.  Technically I guess a faring would be better than a cargo bay, since normally there's no ability to open the working area of a science plane.

[OHara]

@Tibrogargan, I think the new kid has your answer.    Welcome to the forums, @stelarKerbal

Kerbals are fine inside a closed cargo by in the chairs, or on ladders, but when they try to walk around inside a cargo bay, the game seems to act as if they are walking on the ground below the craft.  It's not the aerodynamic forces, or at least the game isn't applying aerodynamic forces, but it sure looks the same. You can see this effect even while moving a couple m/s on the runway. (Given how important it was to get the physics correct in this game, this omission does seem strange.  Maybe nobody tried walking kerbals around on moving craft early enough in development.)

So, the Kerbals running equipment inside the cargo bay will have to remain seated, or if you have a crew container with a door into the cargo bay they can come out that door but stay on ladders to do their jobs.

[Lisias]

9 hours ago, Tibrogargan said:

Will this protect from aerodynamic forces, or just heat?  Heat hasn't been a problem so far - he's just getting bounced around and explodes (although, if you're quick he can grab something and be safe)

Reading the posts after mine, I'm considering that I'm answering the wrong problem.  

But it worths to mention anyway: I attach the "protective" part on the hull. If there are not a node available where I want, I attach it on the nearest one and move it to where I want. Then I attach the chair to the protective part, doing the same if needed.

As long the Kerbal is on the seat, and the airstream is hitting the protective part, he's protected - with or without a cargo bay.

Remember, however, that drag is omnipresent in the stock physics. Everything do drag, even inside cargo bays. (Don't ask)

[stelarKerbal]

As I explained before, even if you set protections, thats not the problem on your kerbal.

The problem is, if he is not part of the ship, its calculated as "something else", and thats the problem. the only solution I see is somehow make it part of the physics of the ship, and the only way i know for such is, to set it on a leather.

or may be have several command seats so it can jump from one to another (but I am not sure that will work). I will test both theories later.

[Tibrogargan]

On 10/30/2018 at 4:50 PM, bewing said:

Alternately, you can use a fairing instead of a cargo bay, and that should work -- if that suits your sense of realism?

Looks like the faring does not work either.

The Kerbal is still being treated as a separate craft and immediately gets subjected to physics separately from the "parent".  There seems to be no concept of being enclosed / inheriting parent physics unless the Kerbal is literally attached, by being in a chair / inside a capsule / on a ladder.  Probably just going to have to accept it.  There goes my dream of a Kerbal Dyson Sphere

Tangential question.  Is there a way of building a procedural fairing between two pieces of a craft without having to put some connector through the middle first?  I assume the new engine plates use this type of mechanism, but it would be cool to have a customizable fairing instead of the plain cylinder.

[bewing]

1 hour ago, Tibrogargan said:

Is there a way of building a procedural fairing between two pieces of a craft without having to put some connector through the middle first?

Attach the fairing base, then click the "Interstage Nodes" button in the context menu for the fairing. This will create a set of nodes for attaching the top piece of the craft above the fairing.

[Dafni]

Wait, the "Kerbals are not occluded" bug is back??

[Tibrogargan]

On 11/5/2018 at 12:04 AM, Dafni said:

Wait, the "Kerbals are not occluded" bug is back??

If by "the Kerbals are not occluded bug" you mean that Kerbals that are not connected to, but still contained by a craft are affected by the surrounding environment as if they were not contained, then "yes", I guess?

[Movingg]

On 10/31/2018 at 3:00 AM, Tibrogargan said:

I've put an external command seat in the cargo bay of a plane, along with a materials bay and goo container.  The idea being that the scientist in the seat can do EVA reports while seated, then leave the seat in order to restore the materials bay and goo container.  Problem is, when the plane is moving the Kerbal scientist becomes subject to aerodynamic forces even while the cargo bay is closed, with unfortunate results (for the Kerbal at least)

Obviously, since both the materials bay and goo container are not biome specific while flying there is little actual point to being able to do this ... however ... I want to   (realism or something).

Is there any way to designate a space as "enclosed" so that Kerbal can be "unattached" and remain relatively safe?

 

ok)