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[1.8-1.10] Ferram Aerospace Research Continued: v0.16.0.1 "Mader" 24/11/20


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I have this mod that adds fairing halves, it has cargo bay module in it so it would protect anything inside of it. is there a way to reduce drag of this part mod without completely removing the protection? im thinking of maybe an MM patch for it.

EDIT: all it does is the second stage flips at 35km (intended separation height), its a replica mod thats why I cant just engineer it better..

Edited by Captain_Teemo13
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由于一部分机翼模型中不含有与FAR有关的机翼数据,在FAR下使用会使得FAR的计算方式失效,也就失去了安装FAR的意义。我是否可以为那一个部件编写一个适于FAR下的配置文件,之后将它连同源代码上传至Github和KSP Forum?

Github上Pull requests #239

Edited by Peter JY
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On 8/9/2020 at 12:55 AM, Peter JY said:

由于一部分机翼模型中不含有与FAR有关的机翼数据,在FAR下使用会使得FAR的计算方式失效,也就失去了安装FAR的意义。我是否可以为那一个部件编写一个适于FAR下的配置文件,之后将它连同源代码上传至Github和KSP Forum?

Github上Pull requests #239

(呃,虽然有翻译软件,我还是翻译一下。)

I’m translating this post into English, although I realize that there’re a bunch of softwares for that.<^_^>Oh, also the fact that a lot of people here actually understand Chinese. just trying to help out,

 

According to @Peter JYPeter JY hoped to write a patch for a wing part (or some wing and aero parts) , which is currently not compatible with FAR. He/she also hopes to upload the patch together with the source code, to this forum as well as Github. Peter JY has also submitted a pull request at Github(#239).

 

BTW, I don't know if I got the wrong Github link, but the only active pull request I see at FAR, Github, is not about this issue.

So the link I took was https://github.com/dkavolis/Ferram-Aerospace-Research/pulls

Edited by AllenLi
Changed some terms which may arouse misunderstanding
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On 8/10/2020 at 12:05 AM, AllenLi said:

(呃,虽然有翻译软件,我还是翻译一下。)

I’m translating this post into English, although I realize that there’re a bunch of softwares for that.<^_^>Oh, also the fact that a lot of people here actually understand Chinese. just trying to help out,

 

According to @Peter JYPeter JY hoped to write a patch for a wing part (or some wing and aero parts) , which is currently not compatible with FAR. He/she also hopes to upload the patch together with the source code, to this forum as well as Github. Peter JY has also submitted a pull request at Github(#239).

 

BTW, I don't know if I got the wrong Github link, but the only active pull request I see at FAR, Github, is not about this issue.

So the link I took was https://github.com/dkavolis/Ferram-Aerospace-Research/pulls

我把我的pull放到这里了:wacko:https://github.com/ferram4/Ferram-Aerospace-Research/pull/239

既然是这个地方,那我就翻译成英文后在你给的网址下重新pull一次

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Hi. I've had this problem for a long time but only now did it start bothering me because this rocket flips in upper atmosphere.

When I pick up and replace wings (any type, on any rocket), some stability derivatives go from green to red or from red to green. It's like the mod calculated them using different formulae each time, or something.

SxZYhE5.jpg1yaVVBN.jpeg

I found the solution. Clicking the calculation button too quickly after placing parts calculates the values for the rocket without those parts. Clicking it again recalculates them. Can you perhaps add a delay to the button, @dkavolis?

Also, there's another bug which isn't caused by the delay. The last pitch control derivative (the red one) changes to green or to red semi-randomly when I replace the wings. I have no idea how it's calculated and if it's important.

Also here's a tip: set the mach number for upper stages when building rockets. Even if something is stable at low speeds, it can become unstable at high speeds, like upper stages sometimes do.

Edited by Krzeszny
solution found
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3 hours ago, Krzeszny said:

Hi. I've had this problem for a long time but only now did it start bothering me because this rocket flips in upper atmosphere.

When I pick up and replace wings (any type, on any rocket), some stability derivatives go from green to red or from red to green. It's like the mod calculated them using different formulae each time, or something.

SxZYhE5.jpg1yaVVBN.jpeg

I found the solution. Clicking the calculation button too quickly after placing parts calculates the values for the rocket without those parts. Clicking it again recalculates them. Can you perhaps add a delay to the button, @dkavolis?

Also, there's another bug which isn't caused by the delay. The last pitch control derivative (the red one) changes to green or to red semi-randomly when I replace the wings. I have no idea how it's calculated and if it's important.

Also here's a tip: set the mach number for upper stages when building rockets. Even if something is stable at low speeds, it can become unstable at high speeds, like upper stages sometimes do.

Check out dev branch, stability derivatives and a few other buttons are now disabled while voxelization is active.

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12 hours ago, dkavolis said:

Check out dev branch, stability derivatives and a few other buttons are now disabled while voxelization is active.

I couldn't find the "dev branch" here, on GitHub or anywhere else.

By the way, I still have a problem with Mδe (M delta e) changing values even if I place the wings in the same spot. Mδe is sometimes green, sometimes red. I will have to uninstall this mod, as it just makes the game too hard and complicated for me. I can't make my upper stage fly prograde even if I add the biggest wings (the Let's Fly model) as stabilizers and Mδe changes randomly.

If anyone's wondering what M delta e is, it's the 'this should be green/positive or you'll flip at high speeds' value.

Edited by Krzeszny
Mδe
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7 hours ago, Krzeszny said:

I couldn't find the "dev branch" here, on GitHub or anywhere else.

By the way, I still have a problem with Mδe (M delta e) changing values even if I place the wings in the same spot. Mδe is sometimes green, sometimes red. I will have to uninstall this mod, as it just makes the game too hard and complicated for me. I can't make my upper stage fly prograde even if I add the biggest wings (the Let's Fly model) as stabilizers and Mδe changes randomly.

If anyone's wondering what M delta e is, it's the 'this should be green/positive or you'll flip at high speeds' value.

It seems that you have more issues to properly control rockets than design / red stability derivatives value faults. When comes to rockets, it is "normal" to have red values for stability derivatives. Main control issue comes if you try to steer rockets in sam way as in stock aero physics. With FAR you should not steer more than 5 degree from prograde vector when you are in atmosphere. If you do it properly, your rocket should not need fins at all, especially if you have engine with decent gimbal and RCS.

Even unproperly calculated derivatives in VAB should not have that significant impact if you gradually steer rocket instead of sudden 45 degree steering from prograde vector like most of new players have habit to do in stock game.

Just my guess what is going on, it is hard to say with provided info, some screenshots or short video from flight scene might reveal if I guessed proerly or not.

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I know this isn't officially updated for 1.10.1 yet, but I wanted to share an observation;  Everything seems to work ok except for one thing (that I've found).  I set my airspeed to "IAS - knots" - this works as expected most of the time.  going into cockpit view and back out again however, will screw it up and set it back to m/s (although it will remember the IAS part).  If the cockpit has its OWN digital/stockalike airspeed indicator, this will continue to show KIAS but the normal navball outside of cockpit view will be stuck in m/s ... until a new launch, then it's fine again.  This behavior is new in 1.10.1, just wanted to report it as something that might need looking at before the official release for 1.10.1 compatibility.  Thanks!  let me know if you need any additional information, tests, etc.

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Update to MM 4.1.4
Update to KSP 1.10

Added more config options (see FARConfig.cfg):

  • Additional log messages can be enabled
  • Log FAR flight variables to text file
  • Debug voxels are now colored by part (customizable)
  • Removed FARGUIColors.cfg and integrated it into FARConfig.cfg

Added new DLL FerramAerospaceResearch.Base.dll which is independent of KSP
Unchanged configs should no longer be saved to new files
Update Chinese localization (thanks @tinygrox, #88)
Workaround for KSPUpgradePipeline with removed stock control surface modules
Fix KSP resetting shielded state on decouple
Heating should now be closer (and higher) to stock values, KSP applies magic scaling to areas which made FAR calculated exposed areas significantly smaller than stock (can be reverted with MM patch)
Meshes used for voxelization are now displayed in log with debug FAR log level
Fix inconsistent voxelization when changing from VAB/SPH to Flight scene and reverting (#89)
Fix voxelization starting before part is set up in editor
Ignore launch clamps in editor simulations
Fix NRE with MechJeb on destruction (#93)
Resized stock button image to 36x36 px
Simulation buttons are now disabled while voxelization is active
Invisible meshes are ignored for voxelization by default

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On 8/26/2019 at 7:45 PM, MOPC said:

Updated the config for Airplane Plus mod with latest wing parts, except those which were already added by @Wronk and @theonegalen. If you guys okay with that, I can merge three configs together for ease of use.

Also added simple configs for APP flaps, but not yet sure if they work correctly - would be great if someone tests them.

Link: https://pastebin.com/AdiUwgkB

 

UPD: found and fixed a bug in the .cfg above, which caused NRE when using Basic Curve Winglet (warhawkwing). Thanks to @qromodynmc. Also merged with two aforementioned configs.

Also tested the stock propellers, and looks like they don't work as I expected - flap/spoilers feature of FAR doesn't work the same way as Deploy for stock-configured rotor blades, sadly.

  Reveal hidden contents

@The-Grim-Sleeper, here, I inserted "proper" values for stock rotor blades, following the FAR wiki guide: https://pastebin.com/nnrcyB8L. Not tested that yet, still to open them in career.

Maybe FAR will take over the deployment control if parts have configs, or perhaps we could assign deployment to thrust axis via Action Groups?

 

Thanks for your config. But does it have all the configs in @Wronk @theonegalen and @qromodynmc 's configs? and can I put it into my group (e.g. Facebook group)? is it has licenses? No License? CC? MIT? GPL?

Edited by Peter JY
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On 8/26/2020 at 11:15 PM, dkavolis said:

Update to MM 4.1.4
Update to KSP 1.10

Added more config options (see FARConfig.cfg):

  • Additional log messages can be enabled
  • Log FAR flight variables to text file
  • Debug voxels are now colored by part (customizable)
  • Removed FARGUIColors.cfg and integrated it into FARConfig.cfg

Added new DLL FerramAerospaceResearch.Base.dll which is independent of KSP
Unchanged configs should no longer be saved to new files
Update Chinese localization (thanks @tinygrox, #88)
Workaround for KSPUpgradePipeline with removed stock control surface modules
Fix KSP resetting shielded state on decouple
Heating should now be closer (and higher) to stock values, KSP applies magic scaling to areas which made FAR calculated exposed areas significantly smaller than stock (can be reverted with MM patch)
Meshes used for voxelization are now displayed in log with debug FAR log level
Fix inconsistent voxelization when changing from VAB/SPH to Flight scene and reverting (#89)
Fix voxelization starting before part is set up in editor
Ignore launch clamps in editor simulations
Fix NRE with MechJeb on destruction (#93)
Resized stock button image to 36x36 px
Simulation buttons are now disabled while voxelization is active
Invisible meshes are ignored for voxelization by default

 Pc1uzUc.png

I'm finding the latest FAR update is causing this error when I open the game, when I use the previous version it loads fine

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8 hours ago, Wronk said:

 Pc1uzUc.png

I'm finding the latest FAR update is causing this error when I open the game, when I use the previous version it loads fine

I will need more information than just a screenshot, at least provide KSP.log, please.

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On 8/31/2020 at 12:00 AM, dkavolis said:

I will need more information than just a screenshot, at least provide KSP.log, please.

Sorry, here's the ksp.log https://www.dropbox.com/s/3v7jdm9pxq46j63/KSP.log?dl=0

and the output.log https://www.dropbox.com/s/220ggqvtnggvpky/output_log.txt?dl=0

Having a scan over it myself, it seems like it might be a conflict with wild blue tools, but I don't really have the time to test myself with a full clean install and isolating those two mods, so it's not urgent just making you aware of it

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1 hour ago, Wronk said:

Sorry, here's the ksp.log https://www.dropbox.com/s/3v7jdm9pxq46j63/KSP.log?dl=0

and the output.log https://www.dropbox.com/s/220ggqvtnggvpky/output_log.txt?dl=0

Having a scan over it myself, it seems like it might be a conflict with wild blue tools, but I don't really have the time to test myself with a full clean install and isolating those two mods, so it's not urgent just making you aware of it

With just WBI and MOLE I can't reproduce the issue. Can you try running with the following MM patch?

@FARConfig:FINAL
{
    @Debug
    {
        %logLevel = debug
    }
}

It will give more info on what FAR is working on when KSP crashes. Also, a comparison between logs with old and new FAR may give additional clues to what is going wrong.

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Hi, 

how does FAR deal with CoPOffset and CoLOffset

I've recently removed an ablator from Mk1 pod to make use of a heat shield necessary. And to my surprise a pod with a heat shield is very unstable. In the thin upper atmosphere it has tendency to fly sideways, which with Deadly Reentry ends really bad really fast. I expected it to be even more stable as the heat shield adds mass to the bottom while preserving shape. Now I realized that all stock heat shields have an offset to CoL and CoP, which probably are the cause of the problem. I'd like to correct them as now they obviously lead to unrealistic behavior. Should I just remove them or does FAR need them but with different values?

EDIT: well, removing offsets from both the pod and the heat shield seems to improve stability a lot. So I guess they do affect things when FAR is installed. I wonder which behavior is more realistic - with or without the offsets. 

Edited by JebIsDeadBaby
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On 5/7/2020 at 7:15 PM, dkavolis said:

can you try FAR from dev branch?

How do you get the dev branch-FAR?

I have the same issue, now it got even weirder; when i leave to space hangar after i have moved the carrier into open sea and reenter it from the space center it works short but then starts spinning violently; could it be because it is a one part carrier and the rudders work wrong?

https://mega.nz/file/W1wi2KoZ#O8N5TLD_U_wxDqpVozSaMyzpmGf3EWllxsTXq7Yp2hE

Edited by Neros7
Video
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When having a MK1 command pod with a parachute and a Flea booster somehow the cross section of the MK1 pod is ignored leading to very high transsonic drag.

Interestingly if you add basic fins to the flea booster the cross section seems to be calculated correctly. 

Tested in 1.10.1 with the latest FAR

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On 8/30/2020 at 8:57 AM, Wronk said:

 Pc1uzUc.png

I'm finding the latest FAR update is causing this error when I open the game, when I use the previous version it loads fine

Hello,

 

I have the same ISSUE with the latest FAR and the latest MFI. KSP 1.10.1Crash with this Crash-Image.

 

Without MFI my KSP works correct but the Planet Pack JSNQ Required MFI and dont work without it.

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Hi Guys,

This is one of my favorite mods. I was waiting to play with this one.

I am trying to install it from CKAN, but it says this is not compatible with 1.10.1.2939. It is not listed as compatible mods but when I click on it, it says Max KSP version: 1.10.99. I'm wondering what is wrong here. Please help!

 

6t4cixQ.png

Edited by spock19
Updated image with latest version of CKAN
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  • dkavolis changed the title to [1.8-1.10] Ferram Aerospace Research Continued: v0.16.0.1 "Mader" 24/11/20

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