Mathrilord

Kerbal Express Delivery - Transport Fever *NEW MISSION

Should space only craft be allowed?  

7 members have voted

  1. 1. Should space only craft be allowed?

    • No
      3
    • Yes
      3
    • I don't care
      1


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[Picture go here]

Summary: Build the best vehicle to transport cargo, participate to event and cargo mission.

 

Kerbal Express Delivery managers came up with a new strategy to adapt their fleet of vehicles to the needs of the market. KED is a fast shipping company present everywhere in the Kerbol system. Their supercomputer(my brain) use some truely absurd mathematic theorem(my random idea) to predict the future requirements(my will) of the company. They use these prediction to decide wich vehicle they gonna buy to replace to older one. Your task is to offer that match the best their needs for current round of buy. Kerbal Express Delivery want the best of the best, they want cargo-vehicles with high efficiency or transport solution. Your craft will be given a spec sheet by the reviewer of the company with his specification and their notes, then current prediction will be multiply to your spec sheet and the sum of all the resulting numbers will be the score of the craft for the current round. NEW!: To demonstrate the effeciency of your transport solution and prove his usefulness you can present a working and complete transport network.

Disclaimer: english isn't my native language (french is) be tolerant for error and weird phrasing of a sentence. I do my best. Also feel free to correct me.

Rules
*All mods listed are optional, stock always better.

-Game version= 1.5.1
-Parts(compatibility confirmed): stock + making history + airplane plus + kerbal aircraft expansion + mk2 expansion + mk3 expansion + b9 procedural wing + b9 part switch + eva handrails continued + mk.1 stockalike open cockpit + K.A.S. + ablativeairbrakes + Wetterwings + mk1 cabin hatch + Kerbal foundries(when updated) + opt reconfig(main) + Kerbonov
-other: Bonvoyage + TCA + worldstabilizer + IFS(no parts) + ballast water tank (submarine only) + tweakableeverythingcontinued (no abuse)
-STXContinued:(no engine: some are unbalance with stock game)(may get remove)
-tweakscale(use with moderation to not get caugth by the police)
-dock rotate(use with moderation to not get caugth by the national guard)
-AtmosphereAutopilot, optional but please use it. AWESOME
-Craft that cause my computer to lag won't be reviewed plus I'll erase them of the known univers. If it make crash my computer well... use your imagination.
-Clipping= max 20% of a part volume. To use only for good reason. I don't like evil. Ex: Compressing fuel tank to get more space is bad.
-2 craft max per week per person for more take one leave one
-Autostrut yes but only for big thing when it's the only way to prevent your craft from exploding when spawning
-no addons that affect physic of the game
-No free moving cargo in/on a craft
-Electric propellers and engines are allowed providing the power comes mainly from battery and/or fuel consumming devices.
-No more thant 1 RTG for 25 parts allowed on atmospheric planet. Can't use RTG has main source of power for Ion engine.
-You can't use any unfair bug or exploit as a propulsion method. (Wheel Hover bug is ok)
-NO NUCLEAR engine in use below 50 km on kerbin
-neistridlar can only use Neist Airliner Parts
-squad staff and moderator can only use upside down command pod
-S.A.S. is disabled on pair day


Cargo definition:

A cargo(it's a payload, a marchandise, a commodity) can be a lot of thing from fuel and ore to a whole rocket, it's also kerbals. Cargo has a mass and a size and. If a cargo is, for example, a ressource that doesn't have a physic existence in the game, then the cargo have to be in a container. You can submit container.

 

Craft

Your craft can be manned or not, if not make sure to have enough power and antenna range. Your craft can be anything that can contribute to a transport logistic.

Ground: for wheeled vehicle on kerbin apply the rule for electric engine(extra point for minimal use of solar panel) and no mining.

Liquid: you'll need dock to load and unload cargo, we don't supply them.

Atmosphere: range above 5000 Km is kinda useless.

Space: Temporarly space only vehicle won't be allow for the challenge.

 

Transport Network WIP

 

Submission

Guidelines (your craft should):

  • be fully reusable, durable and safe (for reusability, any detachable component need to be reattachable. Ex: in a missile delivery system, missile has to be reloadable+give the price for one) 
  • be able to; move cargo from a point to an other (vehicle)/store cargo (container)
  • be the most efficient/effective in any way* (speed, crew capacity, range, fuel consumption and maintenance cost are relative to cargo capacity)
  • have the least amount of part per cargo capacity
  • be easy to use
  • be the most flexible (on cargo configuration)
  • stay stable and manoeuvrable whatever cargo configuration is use (vehicle)
  • be as cheap as possible
  • have a good range of operation (for your kind of vehicle)
  • extra points for style and originality.

*Example: If, for the same price, you can buy a big aircraft or an other two time smaller and two time faster, then, they are both equivalent.

Complete judging criteria(reviewer secret checklist):

Spoiler

bigger(higher cargo capacity) mean slower, more crew, higher fuel consumption, higher maintenance cost and more range.

For later.

 

Submission rules:

  • Name your company and your craft
  • Describe his cargo capacity
  • A Picture
  • Main spec(that apply to your craft) ex: speed, range, cost, part, cruise altitude, deltaV,... 
  • any relevant information like safety stuff
  • pilot manual(how to use it)
  • actions groups and commands needs to be listed in the in game craft description
  • link to your craft file using kerbalx (or steam but steam workshop is bad)
  • do some blabla
  • say wich mod you are using but most importantly if you are using or not atmosphereautopilot

 

What should look like a submission:

Spoiler

For now copy KEA

For reviewer

Spoiler

For now copy KEA

 

Score, event, mission, round, prediction and badge

Event (new post every time)
Two things will happen through time; When I decide to, a new round will start(ending the previous one) with new prediction. The second thing will be mission and event.

-Prediction affect the score of your craft by redefining how much point worth(multiplication) each stats. You get a badge while one of your craft is on top of the leaderboard when round end.

-Event can be a lot of thing but mostly . You may get a badge by accomplishing them on time. You need to post screenshot as proof of success.

-Cargo delivery mission: see below.

You'll be able to see your score when the google doc(or excel or other) will be completed.
Awesome super secret special badge can also be obtain by BlaBlaBlaBlaBlaBlaBlaBlaBla.......... THEY ARE MINE! Find them by yourself!

 

Mission list

Car delivery
WIP

Rocket plane
Goal: Make the most efficient rocket cargo plane.
Rules: rocket engine only, max 10km altitude
Score: 100*range(km)*cargo capcity(mass t)/cost

Russian doll
Goal: Make a vehicle carrying a vehicle, carrying a vehicle, carrying[...] a kerbal.
Rules: Max mass=100t
Score: range(km)*number of step/1000

 

Badge

Spoiler

Will come later, wayyyyyyyy later.

 

Link
-Google sheets need time to do that.

 

This challenge have been simplified to make sure everyone can have fun while doing it. Below are the original rules that you can still follow to get extra point, mention it in your submission as hardcore mode. You should know that they are not complete and may never be, there is a lot of missing elements that only exist in my mind.

Spoiler

General challenge info(don't know where to put them):

Spoiler

-Nuclear rules: nuclear engine need to be shut down in non-radioactive atmosphere, under 200m from any non-radioactive celestial body and under 1km from any spacecraft, station, installation, satellite,... Irradiated vehicles(long term exposition to radiation) can't enter non-radioactive atmosphere, land on non-radioactive celestial body or get under 1km from any habitable outpost. No RTG on (including atmosphere) kerbin, duna, laythe and minmus(because nobody want irradiated cheese).
-Kerbol and Jool are valid destination for cargo especially snacks and (unwanted)kerbals.
-Space is low radiation level, high temperature treat, 0Kpa pressure and can get to high radiation level during kerbol eruption.
-One RTG is low radiation, ???? and more is high radiation, working nuclear engine is high radiation.
-In Vacuum radiation is directional while in fluid its diffuse.

Cargo definition:

A cargo(it's a payload, a marchandise, a commodity) can be a lot of thing from fuel and ore to a whole rocket, it's also kerbals. Cargo has a type, useless for us, it has a category, a mass, a size and a classification. If a cargo is, for example, a ressource that doesn't have a physic existence in the game, then cargo refer to his container.

 

Cargo categories(also good for container) are made in fonction of how it's stored in/on the craft(a craft can be a container): spoiler to rework later

Spoiler

1. Do you need the VAB or SPH to attach/mount or detach/demount the cargo from your craft?(if strut=yes)
Yes= Extra
No= 1.1.

1.1. Does it use a docking port(grabber might be tolered, or any reusable rigid attachment/storring system like for K.I.S.) to connect to the craft?
Yes= 2.
No= Extra

2. Is it outside the craft?
yes=2.1.
no=3.

2.1. Is it mount on a reusable attach point?
yes=external reusable container
no=external storage

3. Is it in a fairing and is detachable?
yes=extra
no=3.1.

3.1. Is it a ressource in a part undetachable from the craft?
yes=internal ressource storage
no=cargo bay storage

-internal ressource storage(internal): ex fuel/kerbal(passenger) in a tank/cabin that is undetachable from the craft
-cargo bay storage(cargobay) need at least one opening that can be open and close as much as we want. All opening need to be closable. 
-external storage(external): KIS crate
-external reusable container(hauldp): drop pod, added tank, externally mounted on a docking port
-extra(payload): payload in the fairing of a rocket, space shuttle mounted on a plane with a decoupler, everything that use strut

 

Cargo capacity(mass and size):

Every cargo have it's own mass(should we add kerbals mass?). While your craft can carry multiple cargo it should not exceed his global mass limit nor any local mass limit.
-Global mass limit is (craft mass(with fuel) + total emport mass(total cargo mass + total container mass)) the maximum mass of your craft to be safely operated.
-Local mass limit is the safe maximum mass than can carry a section of your craft to maintain structural integrity.

Cargo size is trickier and depend on its category(see above).
-internal: use the unit of the ressource ex: 300kallons of lf, 3 kerbals, 200u of ore
-cargobay: represent the size of the cargo with a prism(and give its dimensions) that have a rescalable part equivalent. ex: 3m diam X 10m length cylinder. (Because you don't put liquid fuel in a cargobay, you put a container(craft) containing liquid fuel.)
-external: we'll see first if something fit this category
-hauldp: same as cargobay
-payload: contextual

 

Cargo classification aka protection level:

Cargo classification (is compose of the letter R follow by a + or a -, four numbers going from 0 to 9 and none, one or more letters) determine whether or not your craft can transport a given type of cargo. It work by assigning positive(R+) code to represent protection level and capacity of a container and negative(R-) code to represent protection level and capacity needed at the DESTINATION of a cargo. Depending on your transport solution you may get higher protection level needed. Important to know, here container have a large definition, a fuel tank is a container, a cargobay is a container and even your craft is a container. To see if your craft can transport a specific cargo take all the R+ that apply to the cargo, keep the highest number of each column and keep all letter(number order care but letter don't), do the same with the R-, then if R+ have a higher or equal number in each column and have at least the same letter than R- your craft can transport the cargo(well if not too heavy or too big). In R+ some letter like g depend on your piloting skill.

Spoiler

[R±####@]

+=characteristic of the container
-=minimum requirements of the cargo, needed in any situation
"none"=Environmental description

container:

[R+###(#)@] self-Containment:
0=no protection,
1=cover,
2=protected against direct elements,
3=closed no solid infiltration,
4=sealed no liquid infiltration,
5=pressurize support vacuum and moderate high pressure,
6=support two times kerbin temperature variation plus ultra low,
7=basic radiant protection support short exposition to low radiation,
8=space grade protection counter low radiation and support short exposition to high radiation,
9=high density protection counter high radiation

[R+##(#)#@] Solidity:
00=nothing,
10=framed,
20=boxed,
30=solid box can be stack,
40=basic radiant protection,
50=space grade protection and support direct sun ligth(in space),
60=high pressure protection,
70=high density protection,
80=high temperature protection,
90=extreme protection

[R+#(#)##@] Durability:
000=durability nul,
100=painted/treated or good materials,
200=painted/treated and good materials,
300=basic abrasion protection,
400=solid chemical protection,
500=liquid chemical protection,
600=great abrasion protection,
700=gaz chemical protection,
800=space shuttle grade abrasion protection,
900=enchanted diamond protection

[R+(#)###@] Extra component:
0000=nothing special,
1000=have a docking port/can be externaly powered
2000=short term electric capacity
3000=medium term electric capacity or generator from fuel,
4000=long term electric capacity or solar panel,
5000=have solid booster and/or parachute,
6000=have wheel or rcs or wing,
7000=automated(ex:can move from a spaceship to a space station by it-self),
8000=fully capable unmanned craft,
9000=fully capable manned craft

[R+####(@)] special device:
u=internal stay up device (take a lot of space)
h=anti-G suit(work only on kerbals and animals)
(no g because gravity generator hasn't been invented... yet)
f=foam, polystyrene, cardboard,...
p=gotta go fast
d=need a licence and some stickers
l=uv lamp and water
a=some food and water
k=passenger seats
v=luxurious bed and antenna
s=hide them where nobody can find them
t=kid go play somewhere helse

 

cargo:

[R-###(#)@] what & destination
0=waste/have it's own protection
1=at least you could cover it
2=don't like weather
3=is solid(powder or small rock) or don't like it,
4=is liquid or don't like it,
5=is gaz or don't like it,
6=don't support temperature variation/avoid low temperature,
7=just don't like radiation and sun burn/hazardous I
8=to send in space/don't like radiation/hazardous II
9=to send in Kerbol or Jool/no radiation/hazardous III

[R-##(#)#@] travel time & container need
00=direct expedition/rigid
10=bit longer/should be on a pallet
20=bit bit longer/should be in a crate
30=longer weeks?/should be stackable
40=monthS/anti theft and don't burn
50=year/bullet proof
60=yearS/unbreakable no deformation by high pressure
70=more years/x-ray and laser proof
80=should get to destination some day/get be melt down by any way
90=arrival in infinite/Thor and Hulk proof

[R-#(#)##@] transport condition
000=god like transport
100=vip
200=kerbal like condition
300=will be transport qui a bit
400=a lot of dust
500=will meet highly reactive liquid like salt water
600=may go outside
700=will meet moutarde gaz
800=can do an atmospheric reentry alone
900=will be transport in the worst condition

[R-(#)###@] Extra component:
0000=just some cargo
1000=may need to be powered
2000=need small battery
3000=need medium battery or a limited way of generating power
4000=need big battery or solar panel(because nuclear reactor and RTG is illegal on cargo container. Power of wind? Where do you come from!)
5000=need to be launch on the go
6000=need to be move around on wheel or rcs
7000=need automated transfer
8000=need automated delivery
9000=need manual delivery

[R-####(@)] special condition
u=there's an up and a down,
h= no high G,
g=need gravity
f=fragile
p=perishable
d=danger
l=living(plant)
a=animals(are they green too???)
k=kerbals
v=vip(need a luxurious bed(take more place) and an antenna for the tv)
s=snacks
t=toy


 

Vehicles

Should write something but what?

VARIANT explanation to do or see KEA because I'm too lazy and I want to play.

Vehicle category and type:

Spoiler

[@:@]

Craft type is for the purpose. [(@):@]
Vehicle, Transfer vehicle, Container, Special and Manned and/or Automate. 
V: Travelling vehicle
T: Vehicle meant to move thing
C: Meant to be a container. Include: drop pod, crate,...
X: Extra type for special/weird creation. Ex: I don't know... catapult? Can be combine to another type(V, T, C,).
M: Have crew and can be controlled by them. Always combined with another type(V, T, X). Can be combined to U.
U: Can be controlled remotly and/or can be automatised. Always combined with another type(V, T, C, X). Can be combined to M.

Craft categories are define by the environment they are made to move in. [@:(@)]
Four categories plus five hybrids, three multiroles and the ultimate
Ground, liquid, atmosphere, space----->G,A,S,L,G+L,G+A,G+S,A+L,A+S,G+L+A,G+A+S,A+L+S,G+L+A+S
G: Things made to move on the ground like rover, truck, tank, hover car(wheel bug)...
L: boat, submarine(X:L), hydrofoil
A: aircraft, plane, blimp(X:A), vtol, balloon(X:A), helicopter, glider, gyrocopter(autogire)(impossible?), gyrodyne, tiltrotor, ornithopter, supersonic(white effect), hypersonic(red effect), rocket plane, seaplane(don't travel long distance on water)
S: spaceship, lander(no wheel)
GA: flying car(powered wheel)
SG: rocket rover
LG: amphibious car, hovercraft(if it's possible X:LG)
LA: flying boat
AS: ssto, space shuttle, suborbital vehicle, spaceplane
LAG: ground effect vehicle, wheeled(powered) flying boat, flying amphibious car, duck
GAS: winged ssto car(powered wheel)
SAL: space boat
SLAG: alien ship

 

Vehicles categories specifications:

(read what you can in the trash can at bottom)

Spoiler

M: manned

U: drone

G: ground

L: liquid

A: atmosphere

S: space

Submission(craft)

Guidelines (your craft should):

  • be fully reusable, durable and safe
  • be able to; move cargo from a point to an other (vehicle)/store cargo (container)
  • be the most efficient/effective in any way (speed, crew capacity, range, fuel consumption and maintenance cost are relative to cargo capacity)
  • have the least amount of part per cargo capacity
  • be easy to use
  • be the most flexible (on cargo configuration)
  • stay stable and manoeuvrable whatever cargo configuration is use (vehicle)
  • be as cheap as possible
  • have a good range of operation (according to his type and category)
  • have the best cargo classification

Submission rules:

  • Name your company and your craft
  • Give his tag (see nomenclature below)
  • Give his type and category (see vehicle above)
  • Describe his cargo capacity according to the cargo section + classification(rewiewer can do it)
  • A Picture
  • Main spec(that apply to your craft) ex: speed, range, cost, part, cruise altitude, deltaV,... (see vehicles categories specifications)
  • any relevant information like safety stuff
  • pilot manual(how to use it)
  • actions groups and commands needs to be listed in the in game craft description
  • link to your craft file using kerbalx (or steam but steam workshop is bad)
  • do some blabla

 

Craft name nomenclature + mandatory tag

Spoiler

How to name your craft... that's a question every kerbal engineer ask itself at a moment or another. Some have found or create an answer for it but very few have serious, complete and working nomenclature system and fewer will rigorously follow it. tag mandatory to any submission made to this challenge. Second(and optional) is a try of myself to make a good nomenclature.

 

Tag them all!

This tag gonna help make the google sheets clearer. I've design it around(I don't remember what it was, maybe nothing). It comes in two section;
-First one is a pseudo that will replace your username in the google sheets(the same for all your craft). 3 to 6 alphanumeric only caracter (case sensitive) no accent with at least one letter and one number.(possibilities: 7 809 656 400 not enough)
-Second is your craft model or name abreviation. 3 to 9 alphanumeric caracter (case sensitive) no accent.(possibilities: 13 759 005 997 837 736)

 

Name nomenclature

Will do when I'll feel it.
 

Abreviation, units, formula

Spoiler

For now you need to guess

 

Condition level through the Kerbol system describe using cargo classification

Spoiler

Kerbol
i. orbit
ii. atmosphere

Moho
i. orbit
ii. ground

Eve
i. orbit
ii. atmosphere
iii. ground
iv. lake, ocean

-Gilly
i. orbit
ii. ground

Kerbin
i. orbit
ii. atmosphere
iii. ground
iv. lake, ocean

-Mun
i. orbit
ii. ground

-Minmus
i. orbit
ii. ground

Duna
i. orbit
ii. atmosphere
iii. ground

-Ike
i. orbit
ii. ground

Dres
i. orbit
ii. ground

Jool
i. orbit
ii. atmosphere

-Laythe
i. orbit
ii. atmosphere
iii. ground
iv. lake, ocean

-Vall
i. orbit
ii. ground

-Tylo
i. orbit
ii. ground

-Bop
i. orbit
ii. ground

-Pol
i. orbit
ii. ground

Eeloo
i. orbit
ii. ground

Those things are leftover from the wip. You can read them for more information as they're still valid. Do some clean up

Spoiler

So you have:
-total cargo mass limit
-fix capacity for each ressources (liquid fuel, oxydizer, xenon, monopropellant, ?electricity?, ore, passenger)
-cargo bay capacity, number of cargo bay, volume(use cylinder) and mass limit(if there's one) for each individual cargo bay and their acces point(ramp, lateral door...)
-haul point, mass and size limit for each of them
-extra payload, yes/no, size limit (payload inside fairing of a rocket would be in this category)

 

terrestrial: rover, boat, ?submarine?

atmospheric: aircraft(max range= 1.5 circumnavigation), duck

spatial: space ship, space station tug

hybrid: ssto, seaplane, suborbital vehicle, lander, space shuttle*(glider)
*: valid only if launch by a reusable system.

 

specs: speed, range,

note: stability, 

-Higher number is better: max cargo mass*range, max cargo mass*speed, mcm/price, mcm/average fuel burn rate
-Size is not very important because if it's cheaper to send multiple small craft over one big we'll go for the small one.
-Your craft can be manned or unmanned. For unmanned make sure to have antenna and electricity that match the range of your craft. For manned you need to define (minimum, optimal and maximal) crew capacity for operationnal status. Depend on size, range and cargo class of your craft.
-One big engine vs a lot of small. We estimate that engine fail probability is ?????. It means that less engine you have, less time your craft will spend in maintenance. Also, depending on your craft design, more engine can means less chance of an emergency situation cause by engine failure. Define the minimum amount of engine needed to work.
-Less part is better.
-Range come in three numbers; at full load(cargo), half load and empty. For non atmospheric vehicle is in deltaV. For atmospheric range is estimated with this formula ????? those number are tested with 70% fuel load.  For hybrid?????. Everything else is in Km.

-Crew, cargo and electronics need to be protected from radiation. Electronis stop working while expose to radiation but won't be damage by short exposure. Heat shield and some other parts (???) counter high radiation. Gold foild, thermal grade materials and space graded parts counter low radiation.
-All space vehicle require fly wheel stabilisation, they also require rcs(need to scale with your deltaV) to proceed to any menoeuvre below 200m from any other spacecraft.
-Vehicle need to stay stable while empty, with any proposed payload configuration and with a displacement of the center of mass of ????? in any direction.
-For takeoff and landing shorter is better.
-Easier a craft is to use better it is.

 

Edited by Mathrilord

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So, my first thought about this is: too much text and too complicated. Try condense the Idea down to just two paragraphs or something like that.

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On 11/10/2018 at 2:09 PM, neistridlar said:

So, my first thought about this is: too much text and too complicated. Try condense the Idea down to just two paragraphs or something like that.

And now?

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8 hours ago, Mathrilord said:

And now?

Much better. It's much easier to grasp now. Still I think it would be good to have more distinct goals. The way I read it now, you are kind of saying go out there and make the best food possible, while you should probably be more like, make the best apple pie possible, if you get what I am saying. It could for instance be make a system to deliver 300.000 units of ore from KSC to the north pole, a system being a single vehicle or multiples, moving it all in one go, or in bits and pieces.

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On 11/12/2018 at 8:47 AM, neistridlar said:

Much better. It's much easier to grasp now. Still I think it would be good to have more distinct goals. The way I read it now, you are kind of saying go out there and make the best food possible, while you should probably be more like, make the best apple pie possible, if you get what I am saying. It could for instance be make a system to deliver 300.000 units of ore from KSC to the north pole, a system being a single vehicle or multiples, moving it all in one go, or in bits and pieces.

Thanks. I understand(or I think so) your point and agree with but at the same time it's not the goal of this challenge. The main idea was to create a challenge KEA like that focus on cargo transport and that allows a wider range of vehicle. As new idea poped in my head I tried to integrate them to the challenge. My opinion is that diversity is good and allow other to participe the way they like. I know it adds complexity but only me and reviewer will have to deal with it.

The idea of a delivery system is a good idea and I will add it as transport network, will be optional.

Transporting a specific cargo to a specific destination is already a thing. This is the purpose of cargo event. It's inspired by the STS challenge with their mission. I've make it different by making them time limited to keep this challenge alive for longer. As cargo event are optional I also add the prediction system to again keep the challenge alive longer.

If you are concern by how to make score fair for any kind of participation/submission well that is why I first make cargo classification and all those stuff.

I you think people will give up because of the complexity or the presentation of the challenge then I don't know what to do because for me it's clear and quite easy. If you still think it's necessary  to make modification I'll ask you to tell me what and how because me I don't see. The thing is that I don't think like most people do and that lead to me trying to explain things that for me are simple while the other person does understand anything.

Edited by Mathrilord

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It might help if you simplify and shrink the description.

Maybe have a specific payload to deliver.

Also allow only stock parts to make it more challenging.

Just some ideas

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