[1.12.x] NOT RO - Kerbal Construction Time - Unrapid Planned Assembly

[evileye.x]

Hello everyone! Especially @magico13 and @linuxgurugamer !

KCT is essential career gameplay mod for me  for a long time, it's really great improvement for "Space Program" part in KSP.

Recently  I  started to play (again) with JNSQ. And JNSQ has great inbuilt Kerbal Konstructs config, utilizing Omega's Stockalike Structures.  Altogether it makes quite unique Kerbin experience. 

I know that KCT has KK integration, however it's not quite perfect and sometimes awkward. Let me elaborate on it furthermore below:

KK (JNSQ config in particular) has several launchpads, runways, helipads, water launches (docks, boat sheds?...), but also VABs, SPHs, even CommNet masts, antennas, fuel storages, vehicle storage hangers.

Would be extremely cool (and, I suppose, extremely complicated to implement?...) to have more advanced integration between KCT and KK.

What we have now:

1) KK integrates multiple launch sites from Making History (launch site selector in VAB). Pressing them in the VAB bypasses KCT build order completely, so I disabled this option in game settings - not a big deal really, but still worth to note it.

2) With disabled MH launch site selector: pressing launch button from VAB/SPH KCT adds craft to VAB or SPH build queue - those are physically located at KSC, obviously. If you've purchased (let's call it -) "virtual production line" you can have several craft built in the same VAB / SPH simultaneously. 

3) When you craft is ready and in KCT list, you can choose launch site by pressing the button to the left of list and then craft will be launched / rolled to selected site. Which means KCT teleports craft to KK building all over the globe. Also, KCT have "virtual launchpads" (that can be purchased) selector  below  craft list, but unfortunately it cannot select KK runways / launchpads.

 

What we actually will be happy to have.

1) Instead of  "virtual production lines" KCT handles  VABs and SPHs from opened KK bases. One VAB or SPH can produce 1 craft at time, but you can have several all over the world. When you press "build" KCT asks where you want it to be built at.

2) When the craft is ready, it's not in the common list, but tied to actual location and can be rolled out only to launchpads / runways / helipads / boat sheds (can be several of those) that belong to particular KK base. When you press "launch", KCT asks which launchpad (for VAB built crafts) or which runway/helipad/boatshed/rover parking lot

3) When recovered to SPH / rolled back to VAB, craft gets tied to VAB/SPH within base.

4) If no craft modification needed, simple vehicle storage or refuel can be handled by KK itself - it has hangars and fuel depots. Or even better, refueling from proper KK fuel depot also integrated in KCT (refueling not instant, etc.)  Launch from proper KK vehicle storage  also integrated in KCT for runway/helipad/boatshed/rover parking lot selection when craft removed from storage.

Please note, I'm talking about Omega's Stockalike Structures specifically, because it utilizes stock textures (low memory impact) and modelled building are extremely stockalike   (means highest, B9 (!) quality.) 

Few screenshots to illustrate and inspire:

Spoiler

Just think about all the gameplay fun - making decisions, what you actually what to build where, in what locations to put upgrade points, may be even what kerbals operate what bases, where to land and recover your crafts,  etc. All of it utilizing multiple base infrastructure, built using @Omega482 beautiful works.

 

Thank you for your attention!

 

 

 

Edited December 3, 2020 by evileye.x

[siimav]

13 hours ago, Strych74 said:

Would it be possible to implement a toggle / flag that would restrict the number of tech nodes that can be researched concurrently?

 

13 hours ago, magico13 said:

I think that RP-0 did.

This is the formula you mentioned: https://github.com/KSP-RO/RP-0/blob/master/GameData/RP-0/KCT_Presets/RP1_KCT_Presets.cfg#L38

The key part looks to be

sign(-[I])

where "I" is the current index inside the queue.

Edited December 3, 2020 by siimav

[magico13]

28 minutes ago, siimav said:

This is the formula you mentioned

Yep, that sounds right. I would usually make it so that a negative value gets treated as "disabled" and treat 0 as positive in the sign function, so index 0 would have a positive rate and index 1 would be negative. You could do sign(1-I) to have two positive rates instead. So @Strych74if you modify that formula to multiply by sign(-I) then it should end up only allowing one node at a time. Note that the "I" should be in square brackets [] but the forum thinks I'm trying to italicize stuff.

Edited December 3, 2020 by magico13

[phraggers]

Hello! I'm having a problem, Construction Time has stopped loading, are there any know conflicts? It was working last time I played, I updated some mods using CKAN (I just clicked update without checking what was updating... rookie error!) and now I just get a grey bar where CT should be: https://imgur.com/6udhIm2

modlist:
https://imgur.com/a/YC5dqTF

Edit: I just thought: there's probably a log I need to paste or something, sorry I'm a newbie at debugging mod problems, let me know what I need to do to help diagnose the issue. Thanks

UPDATE: OK I right-clicked on Kerbal Construction Time in CKAN and clicked re-install, now it works, so disregard this post, if you have the same problem just try reinstall it using CKAN.

Edited December 7, 2020 by phraggers

[vardicd]

I have a question for anyone who might be able to answer, I have seen in several youtube videos an air-launch option when launching craft, but I have yet to figure out how to do this. Is it dependent on some other mod? is there a setting I need to enable somewhere? Do I need a certain technology or building upgrade in the game? I've tried looking through the getting started guide, and reading through some of the forum, but if the answer is there, I've missed it.

[Beetlecat]

1 hour ago, vardicd said:

I have a question for anyone who might be able to answer, I have seen in several youtube videos an air-launch option when launching craft, but I have yet to figure out how to do this. Is it dependent on some other mod? is there a setting I need to enable somewhere? Do I need a certain technology or building upgrade in the game? I've tried looking through the getting started guide, and reading through some of the forum, but if the answer is there, I've missed it.

You mean like literally air launching from the VAB or SPH?  I don't think that's a thing, unless you saw someone testing craft using KRASH, that allows you to put craft immediately in the air so you can test just the landing approach, etc.

Otherwise there *may* be a mod that uses Kerbal Konstructs or similar to add a launch-already-in-the-air mode, but I'm not remembering one.

Edited December 8, 2020 by Beetlecat

[vardicd]

53 minutes ago, Beetlecat said:

You mean like literally air launching from the VAB or SPH?  I don't think that's a thing, unless you saw someone testing craft using KRASH, that allows you to put craft immediately in the air so you can test just the landing approach, etc.

Otherwise there *may* be a mod that uses Kerbal Konstructs or similar to add a launch-already-in-the-air mode, but I'm not remembering one.

Okay, I know I've seen it in realism overhaul for sure, the beardy penguin and n9's for all kerbal kind youtube series, a soviet/american moon race series, they use the airlaunch feature all the time {unless it's a game hack and i've just misunderstood}, so maybe it's a RO thing, but I thought I had seen it in stock games as well, and that it was a feature of KCT. thought maybe I'm remembering wrong.

[Beetlecat]

21 minutes ago, vardicd said:

Okay, I know I've seen it in realism overhaul for sure, the beardy penguin and n9's for all kerbal kind youtube series, a soviet/american moon race series, they use the airlaunch feature all the time {unless it's a game hack and i've just misunderstood}, so maybe it's a RO thing, but I thought I had seen it in stock games as well, and that it was a feature of KCT. thought maybe I'm remembering wrong.

Oh, nice! Does it actually load in the carrier craft, or is it just simulated by launching already at a certain altitude/speed?

[siimav]

41 minutes ago, Beetlecat said:

Oh, nice! Does it actually load in the carrier craft, or is it just simulated by launching already at a certain altitude/speed?

The airlaunched vessel will just spawn in the air without any carrier plane required. This feature is mostly meant for RP-1 and thus I don't know if it's correctly configured for stock. 

The config for it is here: https://github.com/linuxgurugamer/KCT/blob/master/GameData/KerbalConstructionTime/AirlaunchLevels.cfg

Are these tech nodes names even valid for the stock tech tree? Another issue with the current stock implementation is that it doesn't add dummy PartUpgrade icons into the tech tree so the player doesn't know about the airlaunch tech progression.

[Strych74]

On 12/4/2020 at 1:54 AM, magico13 said:

Yep, that sounds right. I would usually make it so that a negative value gets treated as "disabled" and treat 0 as positive in the sign function, so index 0 would have a positive rate and index 1 would be negative. You could do sign(1-I) to have two positive rates instead. So @Strych74if you modify that formula to multiply by sign(-I) then it should end up only allowing one node at a time. Note that the "I" should be in square brackets [] but the forum thinks I'm trying to italicize stuff.

@siimav and @magico13 - I've added in the suggested code and it works just as I was hoping.  Thank you both, you're legends!

[vardicd]

3 hours ago, Strych74 said:

@siimav and @magico13 - I've added in the suggested code and it works just as I was hoping.  Thank you both, you're legends!

I'm interested in adjusting KCT so it only allows one research node to be unlocked at a time as well, but I'm having trouble understanding exactly what needs to be inserted and exactly where.  If you could help me, I'd be really grateful. I believe it needs to be added to the KCT preset config I'm using specifically this line? : KCT_Preset_Formula { NodeFormula = 2^([N]+1) / 86400 Do I just add * sign(- I) with the [] * like in the RP-0/RP1 config, so I have a line like this:  KCT_Preset_Formula { NodeFormula = 2^([N]+1) / 86400 * sign(- I) * or is there something else I need to do? Sorry I'm bad at understanding things like this. 

Edited December 9, 2020 by vardicd

[hemeac]

@vardicd, think it is important to have the I in brackets, this was working for me: 

2^([N]+1) / 86400 * sign(-[I])

 

[vardicd]

3 minutes ago, hemeac said:

@vardicd, think it is important to have the I in brackets, this was working for me: 

2^([N]+1) / 86400 * sign(-[I])

 

thank you, I knew the I had to be in brackets [] but when i tried putting them in my example above, it made everything italics, so i showed it without.  looks like I had a better understanding of what was needed, except that I put an * after the I] I've removed that from my preset config, and will test out tomorrow. thank you for the aid.

[hemeac]

12 hours ago, siimav said:

The airlaunched vessel will just spawn in the air without any carrier plane required. This feature is mostly meant for RP-1 and thus I don't know if it's correctly configured for stock. 

The config for it is here: https://github.com/linuxgurugamer/KCT/blob/master/GameData/KerbalConstructionTime/AirlaunchLevels.cfg

Are these tech nodes names even valid for the stock tech tree? Another issue with the current stock implementation is that it doesn't add dummy PartUpgrade icons into the tech tree so the player doesn't know about the airlaunch tech progression.

@siimav, those nodes are in the stock tech tree.

[siimav]

3 hours ago, hemeac said:

@siimav, those nodes are in the stock tech tree.

In that case I don't see a reason why it wouldn't work in non-RP-1 installs provided that the player is using a tech tree that has all these stock tech nodes. There's supposed to be a "Prep for airlaunch" button in the SPH built vessels tab that works similar to the rollout mechanic.

[Clamp-o-Tron]

5 hours ago, siimav said:

In that case I don't see a reason why it wouldn't work in non-RP-1 installs provided that the player is using a tech tree that has all these stock tech nodes. There's supposed to be a "Prep for airlaunch" button in the SPH built vessels tab that works similar to the rollout mechanic.

I see that button in 1.9.1 with the latest release. Something might be incompatible on your end.

[vardicd]

Would anyone know, how to edit the formula for tech node unlocking to make it take longer for it to unlock? I'm pretty sure the config line responsible is: NodeFormula = 2^([N]+1) / 86400 but I don't understand it enough to know what part of this needs changed, or how, if say I wanted to make it take double the length of time for a node to unlock?

[magico13]

20 hours ago, vardicd said:

Would anyone know, how to edit the formula for tech node unlocking to make it take longer for it to unlock? I'm pretty sure the config line responsible is: NodeFormula = 2^([N]+1) / 86400 but I don't understand it enough to know what part of this needs changed, or how, if say I wanted to make it take double the length of time for a node to unlock?

That formula gives the rate of the research in science points per second. So with N being 0 (no upgrades) it's 2 / 86400 or 2 science per 24 hour day, with N = 5 it's 64 / 86400 or 64 science per day. Easiest way to make things take a flat 2x as long would be to just add a " / 2" to the end (formulas don't follow order of operations, just left to right) but you could also change 86400 to 172800 or change the "([N]+1)" to just "[N]". All of those are equivalent and are just dividing the rate by two. Edit to add that that's safe to do for any in-progress stuff since it affects the rate and will update right away. Changing formulas that control the "cost" of something, like the BP cost of a ship, won't update right away unless you force it to recalculate by editing a ship or completing another vessel.

Edited December 14, 2020 by magico13

[Artemis13]

This mod is something I always wished to heave in my game, beacause I dont know why I heave an obsesion to nuclear things.Anyways, thank you very much!!!!

[Vitaeus]

Just started a couple weks ago, really enjoying this mod, having a build time makes it feel less gamey, thanks for supporting this.

[Vitaeus]

On the subject of how many nodes unlock at a time. The player can self impose that by only selecting one or whatever. Which formula would need to change to spread your Upgrade Research Points to all the selected so the more you do the slower the individual project? If this is covered somewhere ele a pointer will be awesome. Thanks. This mod kerbalism and Unkerballed start are the main mods I am using as a newbie...

[LittleBitMore]

Does anyone know how well it fares in 1.10.1? I'm about to use the 1.9.x verson in CKAN for the time being

[NoiR111]

Hi!

Didn't find anything with search, but KCT worked a treat in 1.11.x for a time. Then suddenly the KTC main window keeps "minimized/un-clikable" and log is filled with EXC. Is this a known problem and if so pls point me to where it's discussed. Will ofc provide logs if needed. A must have mod and big thanks for keeping it alive! <3

Cheers!

[EXC 10:03:55.976] KeyNotFoundException: The given key was not present in the dictionary.
    System.Collections.Generic.Dictionary`2[TKey,TValue].get_Item (TKey key) (at <ad04dee02e7e4a85a1299c7ee81c79f6>:0)
    KerbalConstructionTime.KCT_TechItem.GetBlockingTech (KerbalConstructionTime.KCT_GameStates+KCT_TechItemIlist`1[T] techList) (at <2bee4448738248838f78a85622bf5bbd>:0)
    KerbalConstructionTime.KCT_Utilities.NextThingToFinish () (at <2bee4448738248838f78a85622bf5bbd>:0)
    KerbalConstructionTime.KerbalConstructionTime.FixedUpdate () (at <2bee4448738248838f78a85622bf5bbd>:0)
    UnityEngine.DebugLogHandler:LogException(Exception, Object)
    ModuleManager.UnityLogHandle.InterceptLogHandler:LogException(Exception, Object)
    UnityEngine.Debug:LogException(Exception)
    KerbalConstructionTime.KerbalConstructionTime:FixedUpdate()

[panarchist]

16 hours ago, LittleBitMore said:

Does anyone know how well it fares in 1.10.1? I'm about to use the 1.9.x verson in CKAN for the time being

No major reported issues. I ran it in one of my installs for a bit in 1.10.0 and 1.10.1 with no apparent issues.

[linuxgurugamer]

17 hours ago, NoiR111 said:

Hi!

Didn't find anything with search, but KCT worked a treat in 1.11.x for a time. Then suddenly the KTC main window keeps "minimized/un-clikable" and log is filled with EXC. Is this a known problem and if so pls point me to where it's discussed. Will ofc provide logs if needed. A must have mod and big thanks for keeping it alive! <3

Cheers!

[EXC 10:03:55.976] KeyNotFoundException: The given key was not present in the dictionary.
    System.Collections.Generic.Dictionary`2[TKey,TValue].get_Item (TKey key) (at <ad04dee02e7e4a85a1299c7ee81c79f6>:0)
    KerbalConstructionTime.KCT_TechItem.GetBlockingTech (KerbalConstructionTime.KCT_GameStates+KCT_TechItemIlist`1[T] techList) (at <2bee4448738248838f78a85622bf5bbd>:0)
    KerbalConstructionTime.KCT_Utilities.NextThingToFinish () (at <2bee4448738248838f78a85622bf5bbd>:0)
    KerbalConstructionTime.KerbalConstructionTime.FixedUpdate () (at <2bee4448738248838f78a85622bf5bbd>:0)
    UnityEngine.DebugLogHandler:LogException(Exception, Object)
    ModuleManager.UnityLogHandle.InterceptLogHandler:LogException(Exception, Object)
    UnityEngine.Debug:LogException(Exception)
    KerbalConstructionTime.KerbalConstructionTime:FixedUpdate()

busy right now, but post the link to the log and I'll see if I can get some time