KSP Loading... Preview: Breaking Ground - Go-ob ED Monitor

[Just Jim]

5 hours ago, The Doodling Astronaut said:

Meh, I don't like fan fiction

That's cool... lots of people aren't into fan-fic stuff.

But I was a fan-fiction writer on here long before I got hired...  and while I don't have time anymore, I'm hoping someone decides to write "The Goo..."

I mean, come on, ya got to admit... it practically writes itself... lol  

Edited May 10, 2019 by Just Jim

[Rejected Spawn]

3 hours ago, St4rdust said:

-- I will share your comments with devs --

This makes me very happy.  Not expecting any immediate attention to the matter, I'm quite aware that I'm very "wordy" and mostly bring attention to nearly random matters that nobody else seems to be talking about, though I certainly tend to put enough thought into what I post that it should be useful feedback. No game will ever be "perfect" but as KSP continuously improves I'm sure these things would eventually be getting a lot more attention from displeased players who had their other more pressing issues resolved already. The log spam if left unattended is in a way kind of similar to a memory leak, I may be an amateur in programming but that still sort of makes my skin crawl and it does seem to cause weird slowdowns in the game so that's likely a priority to take a look at once the frantic work to finish up the DLC is done. The mission system rework suggestions are likely far more time consuming to implement and the current system still works reliably even if it's sort of... bad. Not holding my breath for any improvements there any time soon. At any rate, thanks for your reply!

@MechBFP Normal stuff indeed rarely generates anywhere near that much log spam, but there is in fact an exception - and not using mods: Tourist contracts. You get an avalanche of messages because every sub objective is logged for every individual tourist, take a dozen contracts at the same time and have those 40 tourists orbit around Kerbin and come back down, then your message log is insanely bloated from a single trip. Early game I strongly favor combining these "orbit kerbin" tourists with a "stranded kerbal" to bolster my forces and fatten my wallet in a single easy as pie launch (as a personal record I've had the entire KSC fully upgraded before dawn day 2 by taking "sub orbit" tourists on a high G trip to the edge of the atmosphere and then rocket-rushing them back down) you can probably imagine what that does to the log...  Anyway thanks so much for the tip, sounds like a reliable workaround until this stuff gets dev attention!

[StrandedonEarth]

I can’t help but think it should be named more like GO-OB-ERD

[Poodmund]

20 hours ago, Rejected Spawn said:

Since I brought it up I might as well be helpful enough to suggest a better format for the mission selection: As an alternative to an ability to forever stop certain unwanted mission types from spawning, maybe splitting them up into numerous tabs based on type would be a better option. Each tab would respawn its own missions on offer based on your overall renown and the number of simultaneous offers would increase the more of these specific missions you clear or the more you fulfill some relevant criteria such as which planets you've visited. Also it feels completely wrong that the last upgrade for the building unlocks "unlimited missions" when the game doesn't even offer more than just over a dozen at the same time, what's even up with that?

4 hours ago, St4rdust said:

Thank you so much for your suggestions about UI and the missions spam I will share your comments with devs. About the new features on Breaking Ground, for now, we can't share everything about it.  And... keep hyped about the DLC.  

@Rejected Spawn, so you basically mean how Contract Configurator tackled this issue?
 

A complete overhaul of how contracts are generated, offered and their content would really benefit the games extensibility when it comes to not only playing career for the first time but when playing it for the umpteenth time as we all tend to do.

[tater]

It monitors ED? Sounds like late night TV ads.

[Rejected Spawn]

41 minutes ago, Poodmund said:

-- Contract Configurator --

That certainly looks similar to what I have in mind. Though I'd prefer the classical contracts to remain unaltered, that one looks like it starts imposing weird restrictions such as leaving that "Tito" fellow in space for hours on end, would drive me up the wall if I had to sit around and wait for something like that. Sure I don't always speedrun things - but I often speedrun things. My latest career profile has 2 captured asteroids, 110 rescued Kerbals on standby (never once paid for anyone) tech tree fully unlocked, KSC was fully upgraded by lunchtime instead of dawn on day 2 because I goofed off a little too much, spent 15 million on silly things like a 50m wide orbital refuel station and a rocket powered tow truck on Minmus but still have 60 million in funds... and Kerbin is on day 92. You should see me in a year.  Anyway tampering with contract parameters and adding pointless delays would be... what's another word for "undersirable" but 600 levels more intense and with a strong hint of disdain? That's how I feel anyway, I only want many more contracts (preferrably sorted similar to what that screenshot indicates) and to not have to manually decline literally thousands of terrible ones.

[Poodmund]

33 minutes ago, Rejected Spawn said:

That certainly looks similar to what I have in mind. Though I'd prefer the classical contracts to remain unaltered, that one looks like it starts imposing weird restrictions such as leaving that "Tito" fellow in space for hours on end, would drive me up the wall if I had to sit around and wait for something like that.

The contract being displayed that you're referring to is a custom made contract for the 'Tourism Plus' mod... Contract Configurator is just the backbone to make the interface and contract system available to mod extensively (thats what I was showing).

Out of interest though, from what you have said, it sounds like the surface side experiment contracts are going to be a "wait x hours/days/years for the experiment to complete" style of mission.

[sh1pman]

4 hours ago, 5thHorseman said:

If I had to guess, that solar panel generates "science power" that will power the science stuff nearby.

I think it’s just “if there’s a solar panel nearby, then the experiment will work”, nothing too complicated.

[micha]

5 minutes ago, sh1pman said:

I think it’s just “if there’s a solar panel nearby, then the experiment will work”, nothing too complicated.

I hope it's more general than that - sure have the "science solar panel" available, but also let experiments be powered by standard parts nearby (eg, a base which already produces power).

[Rejected Spawn]

1 hour ago, Poodmund said:

-- the surface side experiment --

Oh I see, well then I guess that Contract Configurator thingy was pretty good by itself as an example of how it could work! As for the deployable surface stuff I call Schrödinger's equipment on that for now. Until we get official word exactly how it works it could be anything between deploy and wait a year and it "finishes" or deploy (with proper power and comm support) and it constantly and automatically feeds science back to Kerbin without having to bother with maintenance. Regardless of that there's also the question if the parts have their own contracts or if they do their own thing (which I think would be preferrable) but we'll just have to wait for either an explanation or the DLC itself.

[Guest]

 

 

 

9 hours ago, St4rdust said:

Sometimes we have to land really quickly to do this, don't be mad about it. lol 

No, I meant this

 

What is that? A science container? please tell me @St4rdust

[VoidCosmos]

On 5/10/2019 at 4:28 AM, St4rdust said:

Note: Please allow trained Scientists to deploy for best results.

Also Note: Please do not return to Kerbin. Ever!

Okay!!! Go for launch!!!!!!

 

[Pthigrivi]

8 hours ago, Poodmund said:

@Rejected Spawn, so you basically mean how Contract Configurator tackled this issue?
 

A complete overhaul of how contracts are generated, offered and their content would really benefit the games extensibility when it comes to not only playing career for the first time but when playing it for the umpteenth time as we all tend to do.

I’d sort of rather see contracts organized by planet rather than by type. Because of launch windows generally at any given time players are planning missions to a specific place first and may or may not be able to dovetail available contracts into that. There are a few ways to deal with players having different preferences of contract type. Arsonide did some brilliant work but its a complicated problem. We don’t necessarily want to flood players with available contracts even if they could be sorted into ignorable folders. Ideally we’d also want to give players the chance to switch focus over the course of the game. I often find myself in a mode where I’m phasing out tourism and building more stations and bases or doing more mining only to wish I could switch back later into the save. The best way I can think of to solve this would be to give players more direct control over the kinds of contracts that regularly pop up using Strategies in the Admin Building. There could be one for each contract type and depending on the kind of program you were trying to build you could set your level of commitment, which would in turn determine the chance contacts of that type would be offered. It would be a great way to give players real strategic control and a sense they were plotting their own destiny rather than relying on a slot machine of missions. 

Edited May 11, 2019 by Pthigrivi

[cfds]

On 5/10/2019 at 9:00 AM, micha said:

You get the gains by -deploying- the experiment using a scientist rather than ham-fisted Jeb, not by having the scientist standing next to it the whole time.  The video is, assuming there's any sense to it at all apart from marketing, probably the scientist performing a post-deploy shakedown test before leaving the experiment to itself.

Makes sense,  I always call scientists instead of pilots when I need furniture moved...

[Superfluous J]

On 5/11/2019 at 5:13 AM, cfds said:

Makes sense,  I always call scientists instead of pilots when I need furniture moved...

New flavor text:

Warranty void if used as dorm furniture.

On a more serious note I think the idea is a scientist can place it correctly and make last minute modifications to maximize returns.

Edited May 15, 2019 by 5thHorseman
s/of/if

[klgraham1013]

2 hours ago, cfds said:

Makes sense,  I always call scientists instead of pilots when I need furniture moved...

I know.  Pilots are always making plane noises and walking in zig zags when carrying stuff.

[micha]

4 hours ago, cfds said:

Makes sense,  I always call scientists instead of pilots when I need furniture moved...

It's not moving your couch. It's more installing a high-end entertainment system. Sure, you can plug it all in together yourself, but the guys from the shop can place everything optimally [for your room and furniture layout] and test the setup (eg speaker positions) for optimal performance.

Difference between things working, and things working well.

Edited May 11, 2019 by micha

[Guest]

I do ask; How do you connect experiments with solar power? And does it have to be operated 24/7 and if you shut it off say for the night do you have to restart your whole experiment? I NEED MORE ANSWERS 

Also can someone please tell me what this is

I am going to be more clear though... what are those containers on the Crew capsule? Are those experiment containers?

P.S I posted one about this and it got deleted

 

 

 

18 hours ago, Just Jim said:

I mean, come on, ya got to admit... it practically writes itself... lol  

Haha very funny 

[Pthigrivi]

28 minutes ago, The Doodling Astronaut said:

I am going to be more clear though... what are those containers on the Crew capsule? Are those experiment containers?

They aren’t saying, buts likely the transport containers for the deployable experiments. 

[basic.syntax]

Love the animations! Sound effects, too!!

[Pthigrivi]

On 5/10/2019 at 7:09 PM, sh1pman said:

I think it’s just “if there’s a solar panel nearby, then the experiment will work”, nothing too complicated.

Thinking on it I sort of do hope it’s about this simple. One of peoples’ biggest gripes with the current science system is how clicky it is. I’m sure having more to do on the surface will be a big improvement generally but I’d hate for it to be so time consuming it felt like a chore. So long as we’ve thought through the requirements just plonking down the experiments and turning them on should be fine. It might be nice if we had a vessel nearby to be able to remotely gather all data with one click. There are a lot of simple bits of streamlining that could happen to the existing system as well. 

I tend to think as far as mechanics go there’s a difference between something being complex and something being laborious. Complex is usually good, because it asks the player to thoughtfully consider alternatives and gives satisfaction when something is optimized and when synergies are discovered. Laborious is usually bad, typified by many repetitious tasks that don’t take any thought to execute. This is why I think building lifters and spaceplanes and even tasks like executing maneuvers remains fun even though I’ve done them 8 million times, while clicking through 8 different science readouts every time I land feels underwhelming. The thought and planning is already done, and the multiple clicks just feel like going through the motions. To some degree this is inevitable, but the more these kinds of tasks can be reduced and simplified the better. 

Edited May 13, 2019 by Pthigrivi

[warrior606]

What is the video people keep referring to?

[MechBFP]

1 hour ago, warrior606 said:

What is the video people keep referring to?

Literally in the very first post of this thread. 

[GearsNSuch]

Great job on the attention to detail in both the model and the animation! It looks very kerbal!

NASA would probably mount roughly two hundred thousand instruments and such on the thing, but eh, all you need is a camera and a fan motor!

Edited May 13, 2019 by GearsNSuch

[RedSun Rocketry]

It seems to me like a lot of people don't get this item's purpose of continuous science on a planet while kerbals get to move on, in fact this DLC seems very focused on things like ongoing science, and better rovers, probes and the like