Over-throttling engines?

[BillKerman1234]

I was reading through ‘the missing manual’ (https://www.scribd.com/document/244400937/Kerbal-Space-Program-The-Missing-Manual-Volume-I-pdf) and noticed this:

“On the left side of the navball (between 6:30 and 10 o’clock, if the navball were a clock face) is your throttle indicator. It has a little white arrow indicator that tells you where your throttle is positioned. The very bottom of the scale, your engines are off, the very top of the scale, your engines are at full thrust. The scale also has a red area that currently is not used by the game. I’m assuming that this will be used in the future when it is possible to throttle your engines over their rated thrust”. 

Upon more searching, I found I was not the first person to notice this; 

 

In fact, in the very early versions of KSP it was a feature; 

Unfortunately this feature was removed. However, it shouldn’t be too difficult to make a mod for it. I can think of several great ways of implementing it, most of which have already been discussed in the reddit thread I linked to. For example, if you were to continue holding shift once you reach 100%, the engine would continue throttling up to say, 150%, until you release shift and it drops to 100% again. Engines being over-throttled might overheat or lose a significant amount of their ISP, and never be able to regain their previous ISP and thrust levels again, and maybe if you over-throttle an engine for too long it explodes. I’m also thinking that if you were to over throttle an ion engine it would lose some efficiency, electric charge consumption would skyrocket (sometimes literally), and if an ion drive if over-throttled for too long the batteries on you’re ship are fried. And if you were too over-throttle a nuclear drive, any Kerbals within a certain radius die of radiation poisoning if the drive is left on for too long. 

Edited June 30, 2019 by BillKerman1234
Fixed grammar

[Nightside]

I never knew about that feature.

any idea why it was pulled?

[BillKerman1234]

2 hours ago, Nightside said:

I never knew about that feature.

any idea why it was pulled?

It wasn’t a true over-throttle system, just a light saying ‘OVR THR” that lit up, which was later replaced by the RCS indicator. I’m not too sure of any of the other mechanics around it, all I really have is that one photo and some YouTube videos from back then, none of which acknowledge it. From what I can tell, the feature wasn’t complete, and didn’t do much. It would still be nice if it was brought back though.

Unfortunately I have no coding skills whatsoever, so I have no idea how much work it would be to implement something like that. Do you know how difficult it would be?

[SRB]

I wonder if it was a reference to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RS-25#Upgrades

[BillKerman1234]

15 minutes ago, SRB said:

I wonder if it was a reference to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RS-25#Upgrades

Some people on reddit suggested that, but it probably wasn’t, due to the over-throttling on the SSMEs being in relation to the original variant, not the current one. I think it was supposed to be like https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_emergency_power 

Edited June 30, 2019 by BillKerman1234

[linuxgurugamer]

What a coincidence.  I'm going to be releasing a new mod in the next few days called BurstAtomicThrustModule, designed for atomic-powered rockets, will provide the ability to do a burst of power followed by a period of little to no power.  It was specifically written for the Orbital Utility Vehicle (orbital tug) which has special atomic engines.

[zer0Kerbal]

I believe this is still in the game - just, well, hidden and forgotten. I use a patch based upon KerbalEfficiencies and it includes this:

Spoiler

@EXPERIENCE_TRAIT[Pilot]:Needs[SQUAD]:Final
{
	%EFFECT[MaxThrottle]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
}

 

GameData\Squad\Experience\Traits.cfg

[Superfluous J]

The problem is, there is no random breakage in the game and no wear and tear, so there would be no penalty for over-throttling. As the game stands now, allowing over-throttling engines would be tantamount to giving Spinal Tap an amp that goes up to 11.

Now if those were implemented, or maybe you use 10% more fuel for every 1% more you over-throttle (I have no idea if that's even realistic but there has to be a down side) then they could revisit this.

Though I like that find @zer0Kerbal. Giving it as a bonus to pilots is a nice way to buff a class whose utility tends to decline over time.

[zer0Kerbal]

1 hour ago, 5thHorseman said:

The problem is, there is no random breakage in the game and no wear and tear, so there would be no penalty for over-throttling. As the game stands now, allowing over-throttling engines would be tantamount to giving Spinal Tap an amp that goes up to 11.

Now if those were implemented, or maybe you use 10% more fuel for every 1% more you over-throttle (I have no idea if that's even realistic but there has to be a down side) then they could revisit this.

Though I like that find @zer0Kerbal. Giving it as a bonus to pilots is a nice way to buff a class whose utility tends to decline over time.

Agree - agree - and well, frankly, I give an agree again.

full pilot efficiencies. (full patch on my github iirc)

Spoiler

@EXPERIENCE_TRAIT[Pilot]:Needs[SQUAD]:Final
{
	%EFFECT[FuelUsage]
	{
		%modifiers = 0.99, 0.97, 0.94, 0.90, 0.85
	}	
	
	%EFFECT[EnginePower]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
	
	%EFFECT[FullVesselControlSkill]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
	
	%EFFECT[AutopilotSkill]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
	
	%EFFECT[MaxThrottle]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
}

// zer0Kerbal

 

 

[BillKerman123]

5 hours ago, zer0Kerbal said:

Agree - agree - and well, frankly, I give an agree again.

full pilot efficiencies. (full patch on my github iirc)

  Hide contents

@EXPERIENCE_TRAIT[Pilot]:Needs[SQUAD]:Final
{
	%EFFECT[FuelUsage]
	{
		%modifiers = 0.99, 0.97, 0.94, 0.90, 0.85
	}	
	
	%EFFECT[EnginePower]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
	
	%EFFECT[FullVesselControlSkill]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
	
	%EFFECT[AutopilotSkill]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
	
	%EFFECT[MaxThrottle]
	{
		%modifiers = 1.01, 1.03, 1.06, 1.10, 1.15
	}
}

// zer0Kerbal

 

 

Unfortunately i couldn't find the patch on Github, so instead I looked through the KSP files and found the cfg that controls kerbal traits, and pasted your code into it. Amazingly, it worked! 

 

 

 

 

 

I actually cant believe that worked. Amazing!

With that being said though, it would be nice for actual over-throttling to be in the game, where you can temporarily go over the engines throttle limit at the penalty of overheating, massively reduced efficiency, and/or the engine exploding. Unfortunately as I said earlier, i have no idea how to even start coding that.