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Never recompile anything without asking (aparently this is now a discussion about what I did wrong).


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It's unfortunate you think I am lying.

I can't provide quotes, but suffice to say your tone from the beginning has been more than holier than thou. Your intentions were good, your actions less so.

And I read all your notes. Saw your checkins. It was not going well for you.

If there was one thing I'd follow up on, it would be your linux comments and no one ever taking the time to ping. How many hundreds of arguments just like this exist in the usenet archives? Really? You want to claim that people just pick up old code and no one's feelings ever get hurt or, on the other hand, _extreme_ miscommunication? I will take that bet, right here, right now.

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35 minutes ago, Grigetio said:

I can't provide quotes

Yeah, I wonder why.

I know it probably matters little to you, but I worked as a member of the press for a long time.  I can't lie, really.  I have a reflex against it.  I was taught journalism ethics at a young age, back when they mattered.  I can withhold the truth, but that's about it.  Otherwise my brain makes me very very upset.

35 minutes ago, Grigetio said:

And I read all your notes. Saw your checkins. It was not going well for you.

Yeah, the rename broke everything because scatterer references it's own name in shader names.  It was going fricking awful and was outright comical.

You weren't on the original fork though, I removed that because people complained that I used the same name.  That one worked fine other than sun flares and water shaders, and some users here still have a build of it.  Don't make me get some to prove my point, because I actually can.

Look, I'll be frank, provide proof or quit telling tall tales.  You and I both know that's a lie and it makes it rather pointless as this isn't a popularity contest.  I didn't think you are lying (rather, assumed confused) but now that you are defending it, unfortunately I know you are.

I have only one question: Why?  What does it gain you?  What does it gain anyone?

Oh, and I lied, second question.  What feature was I adding?  I want to know.  It'll be hard to actually do it if I don't know!

It was a pet frog for all the kerbals, wasn't it?

Darn I am so transparent.

35 minutes ago, Grigetio said:

If there was one thing I'd follow up on, it would be your linux comments and no one ever taking the time to ping. How many hundreds of arguments just like this exist in the usenet archives? Really? You want to claim that people just pick up old code and no one's feelings ever get hurt or, on the other hand, _extreme_ miscommunication? I will take that bet, right here, right now.

You think the whole of the linux community exists in the usenet bubble or something?

I've never even been on usenet.  So maybe I missed some rage of of the nerds, who knows.  I just know i helped people and no one tried to murder my rep like this.  Rather, I got a lot of thanks from users of razer mice, in particular.

Edited by R-T-B
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I know you were a member of the press. I've read every word you've written over the last 24 hours.

Since you were a member of the press you can certainly understand parody (a la Adam Schiff). Perhaps not.

Anyone can read your posts. You told an author you had big plans, therefore you would make your own repo private. That one example smacks of everything I summed up in my parody.

For all your greatness, your overwhelming tone-deafness just kills it for me.

I bid you adieu, your highness.

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2 hours ago, Grigetio said:

You told an author you had big plans, therefore you would make your own repo private.

Quote

I will do so.  My appologies, your mod is a fave of mine.  I hope you don't mind if I merely mark the repo private because I have plans for it. 

I had plans for myself, yes.  The plans include keeping the original fork exactly how it is, which he isn't doing.  He plans a complete rewrite and I like it just the way it is, albeit compatible with latest release.

That's really not a new feature, nor will it be released.  Again, please quit this nonsense.  Maybe reread where that quote came from:

Quote

I've read every word you've written over the last 24 hours.

I haven't worked in over a year dude, but cool story.

EDIT:  I think I misunderstood that one.  Sorry, being on the defensive so much has me reading things and maybe even ill-intent that isn't there.

I think you just misunderstood me.  Can we try to start from scratch?  Pretty please?  I mean I could be disingenuous and start over with a new account (well, really I'd never do that), but really why?  Why can't we just get past this.

2 hours ago, Grigetio said:

Since you were a member of the press you can certainly understand parody (a la Adam Schiff). Perhaps not.

I was a technical writer, not a comedian.  Plus being high-functioning autistic (don't get weird, it isn't THAT bad) I can safely say I have no idea where your parody starts or ends, apologies.  I'm basically tone deaf online yes.  Don't claim otherwise.

EDIT:  Now that I think about it, It is probable that Autism (high functioning yes, but still) does factor into this a bit.  I mod for the end users.  I don't give two cares about my pride.  I do care about people's feelings, and if told I am hurting them I will stop (and I did).  But it's inherently alien to me to mod for pride.  I do it to be helpful.

I do generally get along with people though, and it's genuinely upsetting to me that some users are being so darn hostile towards me for something that a.) was just trying to help and b.) has been apologized for for nearly 2 days now.

Edited by R-T-B
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2 hours ago, Grigetio said:

Yes.

Oh my god, I want to hug you so much right now.  You are like, the only person all this time who has been willing to even say that, and I have asked a lot of people.

Thank you!

In my other forums, I am known as "The Priest of the Evil Frog God" (hence the avatar).  Yes, he will consume all.  Except you.  Because I like your post.  You will simply be a good servant for the egg hatchery.

Yes, at this point, I am trying to get this thread closed.  I reported it hours ago.  I just want to make sure my report is noticed, but blessing you with frog slime is ok, right?

Edited by R-T-B
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2 minutes ago, Poodmund said:

:D This is the funniest thing in this whole thread.

Curse is named accurately, eh?  I used to say they were the curse of curse, which is twice as bad as a normal curse.

I remember when they almost killed bukkit with explosive unexpected advertising, only to have Mojang finish the job later.  No friends there.

I just noticed a lot of links to Curse.  *shrugs.*  Glad you hate them too.

Edited by R-T-B
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@R-T-B Late I know, but I'd just like to say I don't think you really did anything wrong at all. You just fell afoul of an idiosyncrasy of this little community. Your enthusiasm is actually rather refreshing.

Stuff happens, things will cool down around here once the game stabilises on a new and not-borked release and modders have time to relax. Please do try again someday, now that you are aware how easily ruffled some of our feathers are.

 

22 minutes ago, R-T-B said:

Glad you hate them too.

You two are far from alone in this, long live Spacedock.

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One things you guys seem to misunderstand is that fame is not why anyone should be modding IMO.  Seriously, in my work I do not care beyond keeping the project free and license accordingly. 
Pride is not a factor.  It's about my users and helping people.  I don't care if you think I'm satan incarnate for whatever I've made...  that's not my problem, it's free.

Accordingly, I will certainly try again, whether you like it or not, because I'm going to do it on my own anyways and there is no valid reason to not share.  But as I DO care about other peoples feelings and DO understand not everyone here sees things like I do, it certainly won't be a fork.

But if anyone ever forks my stuff, I can promise you I'll not care one bit.

If you have any ideas, run them by me.  I toyed with backporting the new boosters to 1.7 but the legaleese there is probably impossible.


PS:  By the way, according to the other large board I frequents dev section, this is indeed not a usual convention that I should've expected.  After posting some tidbits of what happened, here is their basic line of thought which mirrors mine minus the "waste of time" part.  (Kerbals are a waste of time yes, but a GOOD one).

img-20191021-021522.jpg

Yes, you can find these people, but don't bother them.  They've respected my request to just keep our little issue seperate, and a forum war would serve no one.  I just asked for outside perspective to be certain I wasn't mad about this policy being unusual.

...

 

On second thought, except Ford, he still hasn't played Kerbal and he needs corrections...  feel free to bug him immensely.  I've been doing exactly that for years.

Edited by R-T-B
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44 minutes ago, R-T-B said:

One things you guys seem to misunderstand is that fame is not why anyone should be modding IMO.  Seriously, in my work I do not care beyond keeping the project free and license accordingly. 

This is you. Some other people are "doing Open Source" to collect on it, be on exposure ("hey, it's cool, it's open source"), be on having access to "free code".

And then these ones go on bullying practices, with ethics and etiquete allegations, to close back the projects and not having to give their counter-part of the bargain. Mafia Style, had anyone watched "The Grandfather"? ;)

One key feature of this situation is that these ones don't care about the community, they care about what they can extract from it - and they don't mind going scorched earth when they are opposed, blackmailing the community into rallying to them for fearing the damages.

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Yeah.  I'm not going to go that far, because if they are coding for free you really lose the right to complain about the wishes of the author at all, ethically speaking.  If they are doing it for magic internet fame or a big resume that's fine.  Cool, hope it works for you.  But please, let me know in the license, or at least understand when I make an mistake in assuming it meant what it said.

The fact that people still are telling me how bad what I did was literally 48 hours after my pulls is kinda amazing to me, but not in any good way.  Worse yet, my mods are aparently being reported as causing issues "all over" (mod told me this in a PM).  I have no idea how that's possible as the only one to be up for any amount of time outright refused to load due to the rename and thus never produced a logger entry...  There's a guy on the forums here somewhere who tested it and knows that to be the case.  It literally can't be showing up in logs at all and yet people are blaming me for...  heck if I know, something broke and I didn't do it.  When I break things, I do it to completion *chuckles*

I would like a mod to close this sooner than later though.  This needs to be in the past, and the only place we should talk about this is in our very justified "ethics" thread.

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27 minutes ago, R-T-B said:

The fact that people still are telling me how bad what I did was literally 48 hours after my pulls is kinda amazing to me, but not in any good way.  Worse yet, my mods are aparently being reported as causing issues "all over" (mod told me this in a PM).

Bullying practices. I know this well - good thing I'm a stubborn Sun on Your Beach that knows the trade, and don't fear hard work. ;)

 

25 minutes ago, R-T-B said:

Yeah.  I'm not going to go that far, because if they are coding for free you really lose the right to complain about the wishes of the author at all, ethically speaking. 

You will see that most successful projects are directly or indirectly derived from half a dozen pioneers, that gave their code and scarce free time on the very same conditions that are being denied to us nowadays.

They also deserve their wishes to be respected. And they stated that on the license they choose.

 

Edited by Lisias
Hit "save" too soon.
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1 hour ago, R-T-B said:

fame is not why anyone should be modding IMO. 

Agreed, and sadly I have seen this from both sides of the fence, fame-grubbing hostile takeover attempts and capricious "what's mine is mine" licence changes included.
 

2 minutes ago, R-T-B said:

The fact that people still are telling me how bad what I did was literally 48 hours after my pulls is kinda amazing to me, but not in any good way.

Also agreed.
 

I'm not sure I have ever actually started a thread here TBH, but I too have had my head bitten off for posting interim updates and patches for features I wanted, so now I simply don't bother sharing them.
It sucks, but as I'm not willing to maintain all the stuff I like myself (largely on account of screw .NET for a joke) I'll take it over having those projects disappear. Ordinarily that wouldn't be a credible threat, but it's happened before in this peculiar corner of the internet.
Perhaps with enough people who share your attitude, that might become a choice I no longer have to suffer. :D

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