What do you think of Robotic Parts in KSP?

[Problemless Mods Wanter]

Open for discussion.

[Snark]

I would probably use them more often, but they've got some bugs that can be intrusive in certain use cases.

Most common use cases, for me:

1. Extensible arms for solar panels
2. Tilt-engine VTOLs (this is where the bugs bite, for me)
3. Custom landing gear for large craft
4. Propeller craft for exploring non-oxygenated atmospheres (Duna, Eve)
5. Fold-out heat shields for aerobraking

[paul23]

I'd love stock (non exploding) robot arms alike kas, for easier and stronger docking. Especially if the arm could "extend and rotate around joints", and thus move the crafts. (moving relative to the main ship, as due to physics obviously the center of mass of the total ship stays in the same spot).

[Lisias]

I find them very well polished, and that KAL-1000 is magnificent, but IR has some thingies that I learned to use and appreciate a lot.

I didn't had to mix them yet, but I use them both regularly.

[panzer1b]

My primary use for robotic parts are doors on vessels, since we lack any solid method to have hangar doors in stock.  I used to use combination of cargo bays, antennas, airbrakes, control surfaces, ect, but all those methods required massive part count and looked really bad if you were trying to go for a clean appearance with the doors.  The best way imo were cargo err bomb bays like 2 MK2s arranged so that when extended fully their doors meshed and closed a larger opening, but even that method didnt look very pretty and required massive space to implement in a way that wasnt visually jarring.

Probably the best example of this is on my dimension class cruiser.  It has a tiny hangar just big enough for a starfighter or 2 (2 if they are small ones), and the improved version uses the actuators for sliding doors that fit almost perfectly with the rest of the ship in asthetic dept (ended up using MH panels since they just fit the looks better, but i could have always used normal wing panels if i didnt want to touch MH parts for some reason).  Thusfar, doors are the only truly common use i have for robotic parts, since its relativelhy bug free to make em, and solong as you give the actuators enough force to hold doors open in gravity, it functions flawlessly.

The other somewhat common use is the propellers, they are a bit buggy, but its finally a way to make a practical EVE transport that doesnt require constant IRSU.  Powering props on EVE is still a major hurdle (we dont have any big RTGs and larger solar panels tend to break off), but at least we have a method of propelling flying vessels there without mods or cheats.  Also useful on kerbin but less so since there are jet engines (they still use fuel, but are so damn efficient that you might as well just pack alot of LF and call it a day).  Nice on duna as well, but more difficult to use and rockets are still not too bad due to the ultra-low drag and ability to use nukes at ground level (near max ISP even though there is atmo).

The next thing that i actually use is for suspensions on vehicles.  With the dumb autostrut locked feature you cant really make the wheels jump around like you could in the old days and make springs by putting wheels on the end of 5+ cubic struts thatd flex.  With robit parts you can actually force disable the autostrut by putting a robotic part somewhere in the loop, and set it to allow like no degrees of travel.  Its a hacky solution, and it will NOT work for every vehicle (sometimes the wheels start to wobble like mad especially if its heavy), but its finally opened the door for actual custom suspensions and while i only have 1 vehicle that ive successfully made using it, it is a neat feature i like to mess with.  the screenshots aint that great, but it shows the gist of what i use, those small servos have a girder and the wheel is attached to the girder, allowing the wheel to move up/down far more then the crappy default suspension would have allowed it.  The vehicle is a bit of a prototype, but sofar the hull itself (without any armor on it) can survive a drop on duna with 1 single parachute cause the suspension resists pressure so well...

Finally, i use legs for making mechs, albeit thusfar ive been unable to make a actual functional robit that walks on 2 legs, and can engage in combat, ive managed the 2 legged walk, but the weapons were so damn inaccurate they were useless.  That and while this was what i was most excited with regards to robit parts, the combination of bugs and i guess my inability to make a 2 legged thing work reliably has limited my enjoyment thusfar of that 1 aspect of the DLC.

Still, i think the DLC was worth it.  Its alot less screwy then IR was (havent tried any recent iterations of it, but the last time i did use it it had way more limitations and was just buggy much moreso then stock robitics is), and it opens up some neat options in the game imo.  The ground stuff not a huge deal, but i still think the planet scatters look neat, and the sci stuff adds to immersion (even if i only play sandbox, looks really cool stuck out in front of a orbitally dropped housing unit/outpost.

[djr5899]

Me personally, I'd love to use the robotic parts and the prop parts.  But, even though I've been playing for several years, I don't build many "complex" craft.  For me personally, I haven't found a good tutorial on creating prop planes and flying them, or on using robotic parts and the KAL-1000.  As much as I want to use them (and have tried a few times), I don't have the patience to do trial and error for several hours (which I have tried a few times) trying to get them to work how I think they should work, or how they seem to actually work.

When the hinges came out, first thing I tried to make was a Star Wars X-Wing.  Out on the runway, the wings just flopped around and didn't work anything like I expected.

I still maintain that not adding a tutorial showing how to build/fly a basic prop plane, and how to use/control the robotic parts was a HUGE oversight by SQUAD.

[Cavscout74]

2 hours ago, djr5899 said:

Me personally, I'd love to use the robotic parts and the prop parts.  But, even though I've been playing for several years, I don't build many "complex" craft.  For me personally, I haven't found a good tutorial on creating prop planes and flying them, or on using robotic parts and the KAL-1000.  As much as I want to use them (and have tried a few times), I don't have the patience to do trial and error for several hours (which I have tried a few times) trying to get them to work how I think they should work, or how they seem to actually work.

When the hinges came out, first thing I tried to make was a Star Wars X-Wing.  Out on the runway, the wings just flopped around and didn't work anything like I expected.

I still maintain that not adding a tutorial showing how to build/fly a basic prop plane, and how to use/control the robotic parts was a HUGE oversight by SQUAD.

@XLjedi  and @Brikoleurmade really nice tutorials on prop & helicopter guides, but it is kinda crazy that Squad didn't include their own with the DLC. 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Cavscout74

[djr5899]

9 minutes ago, Cavscout74 said:

@XLjedi  and @Brikoleurmade really nice tutorial on prop & helicopter guides, but it is kinda crazy that Squad didn't include their own with the DLC. 

 

 

Thanks.  I know I looked at the @XLjedi doc, as I have a comment on that post.  At first glance I thought it looked great, but if I recall, I still had issues once I got into the document.  Going to look at it again and take another crack at it.

[XLjedi]

51 minutes ago, djr5899 said:

Thanks.  I know I looked at the @XLjedi doc, as I have a comment on that post.  At first glance I thought it looked great, but if I recall, I still had issues once I got into the document.  Going to look at it again and take another crack at it.

The points in my doc are all still valid...  although there are a few additional tricks I've picked up along the way and @Squad rejiggered the blade pitch on us in the 1.8 upgrade (although nothing too dramatic).  If you have something specific you need help with in terms of how to setup blades or how to use the KAL-1000 let me know.  I built a pretty cool articulated claw for one of my rovers to pick up stuff with the KAL, and recently I made a folding ramp with it for a landing craft.  I could try to post a short-ish video if you have something in mind?  ...although lately my "short videos" have been an hour long. 

[djr5899]

16 hours ago, XLjedi said:

The points in my doc are all still valid...  although there are a few additional tricks I've picked up along the way and @Squad rejiggered the blade pitch on us in the 1.8 upgrade (although nothing too dramatic).  If you have something specific you need help with in terms of how to setup blades or how to use the KAL-1000 let me know.  I built a pretty cool articulated claw for one of my rovers to pick up stuff with the KAL, and recently I made a folding ramp with it for a landing craft.  I could try to post a short-ish video if you have something in mind?  ...although lately my "short videos" have been an hour long. 

I think my biggest thing is, I am a total noob at planes.  It's been a few months, but I think when I read through your document, all the information was fabulous....but at the end I still had to build a plane and get it to work and....it didn't.  In terms of tutorials

• Take your document one step further (ok, maybe 2 steps), showing the building/setting tweaking/flying of a simple single prop plane, and the same thing with a dual prop engine plane.  Talk about how you are controlling the plane, any adjustments you need to make etc. to fly the plane with stability.
• I'd love to see a document/video on using the KAL.  Assume I am a brand new player who just bought KSP and has like 10 hours of gameplay.  Show somebody how to do something simple like move a hinge up and down, use a servo for a tilt engine, and maybe end with something a little more complex like a small walker or other more complex craft.

Thanks for the document and your offer to help.  No obligation.

[XLjedi]

@djr5899  Cool ideas!   I certainly wouldn't be the first to create a "how to build a plane in KSP tutorial" though.  So not sure how much extra value I could add there...  I did recently build a very simple dual juno jet plane that you could take a look at.  It's also a great candidate for prop-conversion.  When it comes to propeller craft dual engine is easier to manage than single engine.  I think my one exception to the norm is I very much prefer to map both torque and rpm power curves to the throttle. 

The KAL-1000 for noobs video would be pretty easy, since we are all still noobs.  Hasn't really been around too long for anyone to have gained gifted status.  I have not even tried to implement a walker-type rover.  I would put that on the higher end of the complexity ladder, and probably questionable in terms of usability.  A walker may be something I look into, but for now I don't really see it as a valid type of mission craft.  From what I've seen others try, they seem to rely on scripted loops for walk/run and then fall over if you try to stop or turn.  So maybe a cool toy, but probably not really mission ready. 

For KAL usage I would start with implementations that I think are both cool and have valid mission use on craft like:

• Engine Control Module Mapping
• Spotlights Tied to Yaw
• Adding Steering to Larger-sized Landing Gear!
• Hinged Doors that can be toggled open/close with a single key press
• Folding Ramps
• Refueling Booms / Robotic Arms
• Articulated Pincher-style Claw
• Hydraulic Braces for Docked Craft
• Directional Thrusters
• Variable Geometry Wings*

* I haven't been too thrilled with the "floppiness" of the robotic joints so I've put my variable geometry wing designs on hold for now.

Edited November 21, 2019 by XLjedi

[Guest]

My main issue with them is that they really make me want a better way to script them than the KAL. Even so I love them.

[XLjedi]

1 minute ago, Brikoleur said:

My main issue with them is that they really make me want a better way to script them than the KAL. Even so I love them.

For me...   I think the main thing that is missing is some sort of event driven deployment.  For example, being able to link play position to speed or altitude.  Maybe throw in something related to maintaining balance for a walker?  Tie it to the navball maybe? 

I also feel like I could use maybe one extra set of translation-style X,Y,Z key sets. 

[CBase]

On 11/19/2019 at 12:45 AM, Snark said:

• Extensible arms for solar panels
• Tilt-engine VTOLs designs
• Custom landing gear for large craft (where damping is really aweful)
• Propeller craft for exploring non-oxygenated atmospheres (Duna, Eve) -> only in testing so far
• Fold-out heat shields for aerobraking

• flexible docking for rovers

 

[Pds314]

I love that we have them but they could have certain things about them improved.

[RizzoTheRat]

Not bad but could be better. 

So far I've used them for:

• A concertina of hinges to lift a rover from a carrying module to the ground and back
• Fold out flap to allow vertical Gigantors on a base without needing the extra width at launch
• Docking clamps on a transport vessel that fold out a docking ring to go on each end of the docked module
• A folding Mun base with 6 attachment points for additional modules that fold in to the core for easy transport
• Folding "legs" to keep a base module stable while resting on the ground without bouncy landing gear.

However I have had a few issues

• Why when I lock hinges to they not lock in the current position, but seem to leap to one extremity unless I disconnect the motor first?
• Landing gear and wheels seem to be automatically autostrutted, which cause some big issues if they're autostrutted to something the other side of the hinge.
• Hinges and rams are great, but I could use a traverse mechanism, I've bodged it using a ram but it's wobbly as it's only attached one end.
• The power consumption is insane
• There's no simple way to lock and disengage power to all robotic parts, I've written a KOS script to lock all my hinges but that really ought to be in the KAL controller.

[CBase]

3 hours ago, RizzoTheRat said:

Why when I lock hinges to they not lock in the current position, but seem to leap to one extremity unless I disconnect the motor first?

The lock function requires that the motor current is 0. Which is either at desired position if steady state without gravity forces is reached or extrem points while movement changes direction for short duration or unpowered state.

[ShuttleHugger]

I use the Breaking Ground robotic parts fairly extensively in my shuttle program, primary for the robot arm and to be able to fold payloads to let them fit in the payload bay. The robotic arms were also key to my shuttle's proudest moment: retrieving a stranded satellite from orbit (which was not designed to be retrieved) by maneuvering it into the payload bay and clamping it in place with hinges and grip pads throughout the deorbit and retry process. On the other hand, I have sometimes been frustrated by the sometimes buggy interactions between the robotic parts in the arm and the docking ports I use for connection. Overall I love the robotic parts but there's definitely room for improvement.