RemoteTech configs applied without RT being installed?

[hendrack]

Righto, usually I just slap on direct or relay antennas on every craft, but now that I found some very nice cube sats in BDB, Luciole or KK's spacex, I don't want to put external antennas on them.

For some reason, they behave different, or to rephrase, what's the point of internal antennas when I don't have a link even at the pad on KSC. The CommNet wiki explains signal strength etc, but not the description in the VAB.

Let's have a look at the luciole sat, VAB shows me Class 2 RT antenna passive, ok, make sense.  I guess its used to relay signals, but the ModuleDataTransmitter in the config is DIRECT. Most pods and command modules have that kind of orange font description, but I don't get it.

Now this one, relay antenna, all good... but no description with that "Class something antenna"

Next one is this, where nothing works (I guess that is some config issue with Coatl mod)

I am mildly confused. 

Edited June 13, 2020 by hendrack

[Streetwind]

I have no experience with these parts, but: the shorthand "RT" is typically used for the mod "RemoteTech", which throws the stock commnet out the window and replaces it with something else (the mod existed long before stock commnet became a thing).

So it's very likely that these probes are configured for use with RemoteTech, but do not have the built-in stock transmitter at all.

You can confirm this yourself. Open (for example) ...GameData\Squad\Parts\Command\probeCoreOcto\probeCoreOcto.cfg, and scroll down. You will see at the bottom a ModuleDataTransmitter with antennaType = INTERNAL.

Now, find the part mod's directory in your GameData folder, find the probe core you want to use, and open its config. Look through it for a similar ModuleDataTransmitter with antennaType = INTERNAL. Can you find one? If yes, it should work, and for some reason it doesn't. If no, then well, there's your answer. If you politely bring this up to the mod author, they may add such a module for future releases. In the meantime, you can probably copy&paste the module you found in the stock probe core to the modded one's config, as literally all internal data transmitters in stock KSP have the exact same stats.

Edited June 13, 2020 by Streetwind

[bewing]

Please note that the text information in the Description is entirely for show, and has no actual function whatsoever. The only important functional information about any part is either in the main info box (mass/tolerance/temp rating), or in the extended info section on the right where the module information is listed.

 

Edited June 13, 2020 by bewing

[hendrack]

Interestingly, also the stock parts have this kind of info text, maybe there is some mod which applies a rogue patch, I'll look again.

Edit: the orange text comes from filter extensions, BUT: every pod has a RemoteTech config applied, without RT being installed 

Edit2: I have found the offender: zzz_RemoteTechAddMissingModuleSPUPassive.cfg in zFinal_FilterExtensions

Edit3: NVM, there's other mods that have a remotetech patch applied, like Coatl, without RT being installed.

Is that example MM patch kosher? 

//CA-L100 'Landvermesser' Lander
@PART[ca_landv_core]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech]
{
    %MODULE[ModuleSPU] {
    }
    
    %MODULE[ModuleRTAntennaPassive]    {
        %TechRequired = unmannedTech
        %OmniRange = 3000
        
        %TRANSMITTER {
            %PacketInterval = 0.3
            %PacketSize = 2
            %PacketResourceCost = 15.0
        }
    }
}

 

Edited June 13, 2020 by hendrack

[hendrack]

For some reason my MM thinks I have RemoteTech installed and applies every RT config it finds. How can this be? 

ModuleManager.log:

[LOG 18:14:48.232] :FOR[REMOTETECH] pass
[LOG 18:14:48.237] Applying update REPOSoftTech/ResearchBodies/ResearchBodiesMMRemoteTech/@PART[TrackBodiesTelescope]:FOR[RemoteTech] to REPOSoftTech/ResearchBodies/Parts/telescope/telescope.cfg/PART[TrackBodiesTelescope]
[LOG 18:14:48.241] :AFTER[REMOTETECH] pass
[LOG 18:14:48.243] Applying update JX2Antenna/Patches/jx2_RemoteTech/@PART[jx2LDA]:AFTER[RemoteTech] to JX2Antenna/jx2lda.cfg/PART[jx2LDA]
[LOG 18:14:48.251] Applying update JX2Antenna/Patches/jx2_RemoteTech/@PART[jw1MDA|ju1MDA]:AFTER[RemoteTech] to JX2Antenna/ju1mda.cfg/PART[ju1MDA]
[LOG 18:14:48.252] Applying update JX2Antenna/Patches/jx2_RemoteTech/@PART[jw1MDA|ju1MDA]:AFTER[RemoteTech] to JX2Antenna/jw1mda.cfg/PART[jw1MDA]

Non-DLL mods added (:FOR[xxx]):
  CommunityPartsTitles
  .....
  RemoteTech

It is not installed, I have no RT folder, I checked my GameData folder for all .dll files. NO RT! 

Logs here: https://yadi.sk/d/dlNPvJJWyZhJQA

Edited June 13, 2020 by hendrack

[Gargamel]

Moved to Modded TS by request. 

[hendrack]

Allright, this was hard to chew on and find, I think I have found 2 mods interacting together:

I have set up a barebone KSP 1.9 for debugging, only MM, ZeroAVC and JX2Antenna to test if RT patches are applied.

Try 1:

Researchbodies (+Contract Configurator - dependancy) alone: stock antenna, all good, allthough the MM log shows it applied some RT patches:

[LOG 23:04:54.054] Applying update JX2Antenna/Patches/jx2_RemoteTech/@PART[jx2LDA]:AFTER[RemoteTech] to JX2Antenna/jx2lda.cfg/PART[jx2LDA]
[LOG 23:04:54.055] Applying update JX2Antenna/Patches/jx2_RemoteTech/@PART[jw1MDA|ju1MDA]:AFTER[RemoteTech] to JX2Antenna/ju1mda.cfg/PART[ju1MDA]
[LOG 23:04:54.055] Applying update JX2Antenna/Patches/jx2_RemoteTech/@PART[jw1MDA|ju1MDA]:AFTER[RemoteTech] to JX2Antenna/jw1mda.cfg/PART[jw1MDA]

Despite this, parts look normal CommNet-wise

Try 2:

Filter Extensions alone: all stock CommNet, no RT patches applied in the log:

Try 3: 

Only Contract Configurator: no RT patches, stock CommNet

Try 4:

Filter Extensions + Researchbodies:

Now every stock pod has RT config applied, because zzz_RemoteTechAddMissingModuleSPUPassive.cfg thinks RT is installed.

Try 5:

Researchbodies + Coatl, no Filter Extensions:

Just to highlight this: as far as I understand, Researchbodies for some reason wants to apply every RT patch to every pod and antenna. But without that Filter Extension config its just a useless part item if ModuleRTAntenna isnt applied.

[LOG 23:45:03.552] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[antenna_quetzal]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/antenna_quetzal.cfg/PART[antenna_quetzal]

 

[LOG 23:45:03.548] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[antenna_tv]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/antenna_tv.cfg/PART[antenna_tv]
[LOG 23:45:03.550] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[antenna_cone_toggle]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/antenna_cone_toggle.cfg/PART[antenna_cone_toggle]
[LOG 23:45:03.551] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_vor_comm]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Vorona/ca_vor_comm.cfg/PART[ca_vor_comm]
[LOG 23:45:03.552] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[antenna_quetzal]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/antenna_quetzal.cfg/PART[antenna_quetzal]
[LOG 23:45:03.554] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_landv_omni]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/GroundOps/Parts/Landvermesser/landv_omni.cfg/PART[ca_landv_omni]
[LOG 23:45:03.555] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_ant_gps]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/antenna_GPS.cfg/PART[ca_ant_gps]
[LOG 23:45:03.556] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_vor_sar]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Vorona/ca_vor_sar.cfg/PART[ca_vor_sar]
[LOG 23:45:03.557] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_mer_leu]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Meridiani/mer_leu.cfg/PART[ca_mer_leu]
[LOG 23:45:03.558] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_landv_hga]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/GroundOps/Parts/Landvermesser/landv_hga.cfg/PART[ca_landv_hga]
[LOG 23:45:03.559] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_landv_orbiter_HGA]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/GroundOps/Parts/Landvermesser/landv_orbiter_hga.cfg/PART[ca_landv_orbiter_HGA]
[LOG 23:45:03.560] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[dish_deploy_S2]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/dish_deploy_S2.cfg/PART[dish_deploy_S2]
[LOG 23:45:03.561] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_vor_dish]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Vorona/ca_vor_dish.cfg/PART[ca_vor_dish]
[LOG 23:45:03.563] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[dish_S]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/dish_S.cfg/PART[dish_S]
[LOG 23:45:03.566] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[dish_quetzal]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/dish_quetzal.cfg/PART[dish_quetzal]
[LOG 23:45:03.568] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[dish_L]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/dish_L.cfg/PART[dish_L]
[LOG 23:45:03.569] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[mer_dish]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Meridiani/mer_dish.cfg/PART[mer_dish]
[LOG 23:45:03.570] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[dish_deploy_S]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/dish_deploy_S.cfg/PART[dish_deploy_S]
[LOG 23:45:03.571] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[dish_tatsujin]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/dish_tatsujin.cfg/PART[dish_tatsujin]
[LOG 23:45:03.571] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[dish_hera]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/dish_hera.cfg/PART[dish_hera]
[LOG 23:45:03.573] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[dish_xihe]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Antenna/dish_xihe.cfg/PART[dish_xihe]
[LOG 23:45:03.574] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_argo-mk2-hga]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Argo/_argo-mk2-hga.cfg/PART[ca_argo-mk2-hga]
[LOG 23:45:03.575] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Antennas/@PART[ca_argo-mk2-mast]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Argo/_argo-mk2-mast.cfg/PART[ca_argo-mk2-mast]
[LOG 23:45:03.576] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[ca_explorer]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Telescopes/explorer.cfg/PART[ca_explorer]
[LOG 23:45:03.577] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[ca_landv_core]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/GroundOps/Parts/Landvermesser/landv_core.cfg/PART[ca_landv_core]
[LOG 23:45:03.578] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[ca_landv_orbiter_core]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/GroundOps/Parts/Landvermesser/landv_orbiter_core.cfg/PART[ca_landv_orbiter_core]
[LOG 23:45:03.579] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[ca_vor_core]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Vorona/Vorona.cfg/PART[ca_vor_core]
[LOG 23:45:03.580] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[ca_fom_lander]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Vorona/Fomalhaut.cfg/PART[ca_fom_lander]
[LOG 23:45:03.582] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[torekka]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Command/torekka.cfg/PART[torekka]
[LOG 23:45:03.584] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[quetzal]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Command/quetzal.cfg/PART[quetzal]
[LOG 23:45:03.585] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[barquetta]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Command/barquetta.cfg/PART[barquetta]
[LOG 23:45:03.586] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[tatsujin]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Command/tatsujin.cfg/PART[tatsujin]
[LOG 23:45:03.588] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[meridiani]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Meridiani/_Meridiani.cfg/PART[meridiani]
[LOG 23:45:03.593] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[ca_draco]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Meridiani/_Draco.cfg/PART[ca_draco]
[LOG 23:45:03.594] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[ca_hera]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Command/hera.cfg/PART[ca_hera]
[LOG 23:45:03.595] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[ca_aegis]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Command/aegis.cfg/PART[ca_aegis]
[LOG 23:45:03.596] Applying update Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Compatibility/CA_RemoteTech_Probes/@PART[xihe]:AFTER[CoatlAerospace]:NEEDS[RemoteTech] to Coatl Aerospace/ProbesPlus/Parts/Command/xihe.cfg/PART[xihe]

@linuxgurugamer and @JPLRepo I don't know whats going on between your two mods.  Anyway, thanks for your time and effort despite those hiccups!!

Also giving a shout to @Lisias, I have the impression he enjoys these kind of puzzles

And the logs: https://yadi.sk/d/P_Y_er4YKE4TQQ

Edited June 13, 2020 by hendrack

[Lisias]

Wow, pretty extensive research, kudos!

1 hour ago, hendrack said:

Also giving a shout to @Lisias, I have the impression he enjoys these kind of puzzles

And the logs: https://yadi.sk/d/P_Y_er4YKE4TQQ

Found the problem:

[LOG 20:00:14.231] Config(@PART[TrackBodiesTelescope]:FOR[RemoteTech]) REPOSoftTech/ResearchBodies/ResearchBodiesMMRemoteTech/@PART[TrackBodiesTelescope]:FOR[RemoteTech]
[LOG 20:00:31.212] [ModuleManager] INFO: Applying update REPOSoftTech/ResearchBodies/ResearchBodiesMMRemoteTech/@PART[TrackBodiesTelescope]:FOR[RemoteTech] to REPOSoftTech/ResearchBodies/Parts/telescope/telescope/PART

The file REPOSoftTech/ResearchBodies/ResearchBodiesMMRemoteTech.cfg is applying a patch with :FOR[RemoteTech], and so Module Manager thinks that there is, indeed, RemoteTech installed.

Usually, :FOR is reserved to be used by that Add'On, but don't take it as an error for sure - I could think on one or two UseCases in which you need a patch to be applied at the same time that Add'On, as you don't know exactly when your patch would be applied using :AFTER and you need to be absolutely sure that everybody that would try to patch something on that part would have your patches applied first.

Assuming this is the case, that patch should use :NEEDS[RemoteTech]:FOR[RemoteTech] I think. The :NEEDS would get rid of the patch if RemoteTech is not installed, and so the :FOR will not have a chance to run, and the RemoteTech symbol will not be created on the "add'ons installed" list.

Otherwise, i think that :AFTER or just :NEEDS should be used.

Edited June 13, 2020 by Lisias
Hit "save" too soon.