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[1.12.3+] UnKerballed Start v1.3.1 (Happy New Year! Jan 01, 2022)


theonegalen
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Hey, I just started playing KSP again after 2-ish years and gave this mod a try since UBM is dead now :( I love it and am currently putting up mun probes! The only suggestion I have so far is that there should probably be a 1.5m liquid fuel engine placed at the 'Advanced Rocketry' tech node.

 

From my experience (I'm playing a custom hard campaign with reduced tech rewards and higher costs so take with a grain of salt I guess) I've noticed that at one point I had a bunch 1.5m tanks and parts sitting around but with no real way to launch them outside of the memey "more boosters" way since the smaller .625m engines can be incredibly unstable at lifting 1.5 tanks and kind of ruins the more realistic looking rocket design approach I was going for.

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9 hours ago, EleSigma said:

Hey, I just started playing KSP again after 2-ish years and gave this mod a try since UBM is dead now :( I love it and am currently putting up mun probes! The only suggestion I have so far is that there should probably be a 1.5m liquid fuel engine placed at the 'Advanced Rocketry' tech node.

 

From my experience (I'm playing a custom hard campaign with reduced tech rewards and higher costs so take with a grain of salt I guess) I've noticed that at one point I had a bunch 1.5m tanks and parts sitting around but with no real way to launch them outside of the memey "more boosters" way since the smaller .625m engines can be incredibly unstable at lifting 1.5 tanks and kind of ruins the more realistic looking rocket design approach I was going for.

Spink Akron's idea behind it (discussed in old UKS thread) is to use few smaller engines first, before going with single 1.5m engine. Making History DLC offer engine plates parts that can help you building rocket. You can also use small cube or octagonal truss to help you with engine placement. I have ended creating scaled down 1-2,1-3 and 1-4 adapters. Might still have MM patch for this somewhere. It is not needed for users that have Making History DLC.

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  • 1 month later...

I can't seem to get the UnKerballed Start' tech tree to load into the game. I see that Missing History is a suggested mod as well as Community Tech Tree and Custom Barn Kit being requirements so i have those downloaded. I'm not sure what to do with the barn kit one, but missing history parts are not showing up on the tech tree. The tree looks like the Community tech tree is the only one working. I'm hoping someone here can help me out.

Thank you.  

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3 hours ago, Orvishana said:

I can't seem to get the UnKerballed Start' tech tree to load into the game. I see that Missing History is a suggested mod as well as Community Tech Tree and Custom Barn Kit being requirements so i have those downloaded. I'm not sure what to do with the barn kit one, but missing history parts are not showing up on the tech tree. The tree looks like the Community tech tree is the only one working. I'm hoping someone here can help me out.

Thank you.  

Post a screen shot of your game data folder.

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3 hours ago, Orvishana said:

I could not figure out how to just paste an image, so i made am imgur account.

https://imgur.com/HRbAIQL

https://imgur.com/HRbAIQL

Sorry for the double post, was trying to figure out how to quote correctly.

It is hard to tell from picture only, but it seems OK. Only from log files should be possible to tell. Does not hurt to read this thread, though, to check if you done everything to avoid install mistakes and to understand better how mods works in KSP:

In this thread you can find info how to search for log files:

With slight disclaimer, though. In that thread is mentioned how to find unity game engine log files, some moder developers still prefer "KSP.log" file located in same folder as KSP executable. In gamedata folder you can also find useful file: "ModuleManager.ConfigCache" that tell more about order of installed mods in case of some conflicts.

One silly question at the end, though. Have you started new game after installing UKS mod or you have tried on already saved game ?
Asking because all of tech tree related mods take effect only on new game, to change layout of tree nodes.

If that is not the case, upload your KSP.log file on some cloud, like dropbox, google drive or similar and put link to that file on forum. A lot of hastle, but you have put some effort, so that others can help you.

 

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Actually, it doesn't look good in the pictures... I'm pretty sure you installed several mods wrong, maybe even all of them. At least UnKerballedStart, TransferWindowPlanner, Missing History, CustomBarnKit and Community TechTree because they are having version numbers on their folders, which tells me, you unzipped the mods into a folder with the same name of the zip file.

If you take a closer look, you will notice that, for example Missing History-1.9.2 will contain two more folders named "Optional" and "GameData" and the latter one contains "Missing History", the license and ModuleManager. You'll find something similar within the other mod folders as well.

Since @kcs123 already linked my tutorial, I would suggest to follow the link and read how to install the mods properly and that will most likely fixes your issues :)

 

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8 hours ago, kcs123 said:

It is hard to tell from picture only, but it seems OK. Only from log files should be possible to tell. Does not hurt to read this thread, though, to check if you done everything to avoid install mistakes and to understand better how mods works in KSP:

In this thread you can find info how to search for log files:

With slight disclaimer, though. In that thread is mentioned how to find unity game engine log files, some moder developers still prefer "KSP.log" file located in same folder as KSP executable. In gamedata folder you can also find useful file: "ModuleManager.ConfigCache" that tell more about order of installed mods in case of some conflicts.

One silly question at the end, though. Have you started new game after installing UKS mod or you have tried on already saved game ?
Asking because all of tech tree related mods take effect only on new game, to change layout of tree nodes.

If that is not the case, upload your KSP.log file on some cloud, like dropbox, google drive or similar and put link to that file on forum. A lot of hastle, but you have put some effort, so that others can help you.

 

 

8 hours ago, 4x4cheesecake said:

Actually, it doesn't look good in the pictures... I'm pretty sure you installed several mods wrong, maybe even all of them. At least UnKerballedStart, TransferWindowPlanner, Missing History, CustomBarnKit and Community TechTree because they are having version numbers on their folders, which tells me, you unzipped the mods into a folder with the same name of the zip file.

If you take a closer look, you will notice that, for example Missing History-1.9.2 will contain two more folders named "Optional" and "GameData" and the latter one contains "Missing History", the license and ModuleManager. You'll find something similar within the other mod folders as well.

Since @kcs123 already linked my tutorial, I would suggest to follow the link and read how to install the mods properly and that will most likely fixes your issues :)

 

Thank you both for the help, got it all working! I'm excited to finally try out some mods after a couple years of playing.

Thanks again!

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Anybody done an Aies Aerospace cfg since it has been reborn from years ago it seems? Good parts pack but need some reconfig on the tech tree for UKS and I unfortunately do not have the expertise. 

 

Edited by theersink
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21 hours ago, 4x4cheesecake said:

Actually, it doesn't look good in the pictures... I'm pretty sure you installed several mods wrong, maybe even all of them. At least UnKerballedStart, TransferWindowPlanner, Missing History, CustomBarnKit and Community TechTree because they are having version numbers on their folders, which tells me, you unzipped the mods into a folder with the same name of the zip file.

If you take a closer look, you will notice that, for example Missing History-1.9.2 will contain two more folders named "Optional" and "GameData" and the latter one contains "Missing History", the license and ModuleManager. You'll find something similar within the other mod folders as well.

Since @kcs123 already linked my tutorial, I would suggest to follow the link and read how to install the mods properly and that will most likely fixes your issues :)

 

Good catch. I missed that version numbers in folder names. In my defence I can only say that it was late in night and I was tired when I wrote that post :). However, my guess was right that something is wrong with install, as it it most common mistake. And your linked thread explains in great detail how mods works in KSP, what can go wrong when you install mods and how to prevent mistakes. So, it is easier to put link on that thread than explain everything what could possibly go wrong on mod install.

13 hours ago, Orvishana said:

Thank you both for the help, got it all working! I'm excited to finally try out some mods after a couple years of playing.

Thanks again!

You are welcome. I'm glad that you are able to solve your issues, despite the fact that I missed what was wrong from picture.

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50 minutes ago, kcs123 said:

Good catch. I missed that version numbers in folder names. In my defence I can only say that it was late in night and I was tired when I wrote that post :).

Haha, you don't need to defend yourself and I hope my response didn't give you any reason to do so. It's perfectly normal to miss something, it happens to everyone ;)

53 minutes ago, kcs123 said:

And your linked thread explains in great detail how mods works in KSP, what can go wrong when you install mods and how to prevent mistakes. So, it is easier to put link on that thread than explain everything what could possibly go wrong on mod install.

Thanks for your appreciation :)
That's exactly why I wrote it and I'm always happy to see, when it was helpful to others :)   

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So I was looking at the code of UKS, just to see how things worked, and see if in the future (when I learn a bit more) I could edit a few things to fit more of my playstyle. I dont undertand much yet but something caught my eye. In the Restockplus.cfg, in line 68 it says the following:

 

@PART[restock-fuel-tank-0625-1|restock-fueltank-sphere-125-1]:NEEDS[CommunityTechTree]:BEFORE[zzzUnKerballedStart]

However, all the other lines that have that format use [CommunityTechTree&ReStockPlus] or [CommunityTechTree,ReStockPlus] as the argument of NEEDS. Is this intended?  What are the differences between using "&" or ","?

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3 hours ago, SiCaRiO31 said:

However, all the other lines that have that format use [CommunityTechTree&ReStockPlus] or [CommunityTechTree,ReStockPlus] as the argument of NEEDS. Is this intended?  What are the differences between using "&" or ","?

Someone more like to write "&", others prefers more "," sign when writting patch. Meaning is same, but all of included patches are not created by same person, therefore are differences in writtngs. You can found more about that syntax on MM wiki page. To be more specific, this piece from that page:

Quote

You can use & (ampersand) for AND, | (pipe) for OR and ! (exclamation) for NOT in the needs listing. To maintain backward compatibility , (comma) is treated as an alias for & (AND). If you combine several | and &, eg NEEDS[Mod1|Mod2&!Mod3|Mod4] this is treated as ( Mod1 OR Mod2 ) AND ( ( NOT Mod3 ) OR Mod4 ).

As explained, MM was not created by one person either, and for certain not at once. Therefore multiple operators were supported for same thing as there was already a lot of patches created in one way. Excluding support for older operator would break a lot mods that use legacy syntax.

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Is Custom Barn Kit required or optional? CKAN seems to think it's a dependency but the OP in this thread says it's "optional." I'd really like to be able to not install it, since it has a bug in it which prevents all the tracking center upgrades from working. (Maneuver nodes, EVA, etc.)

If it's actually optional, can it be removed as a dependency in CKAN?

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7 hours ago, kraetos said:

Is Custom Barn Kit required or optional? CKAN seems to think it's a dependency but the OP in this thread says it's "optional." I'd really like to be able to not install it, since it has a bug in it which prevents all the tracking center upgrades from working. (Maneuver nodes, EVA, etc.)

If it's actually optional, can it be removed as a dependency in CKAN?

I use Custom Barn Kit, with Unkerballed start, and I have never encountered the issue you mention.

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14 hours ago, kraetos said:

Is Custom Barn Kit required or optional? CKAN seems to think it's a dependency but the OP in this thread says it's "optional." I'd really like to be able to not install it, since it has a bug in it which prevents all the tracking center upgrades from working. (Maneuver nodes, EVA, etc.)

If it's actually optional, can it be removed as a dependency in CKAN?

Custom Barn Kit is used in UKS to increase allowed part numbers in level one buildings. AFAIK, Custom Barn Kit on it's own does nothing. Instead, it allows others to write MM patches to customise each KSC buildings behaviour.

Issue you have mentioned more likely comes from someone else MM patch that deliberately prevents some upgades, rather than it is unintended bug. UKS does not change buildings in that way.

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15 hours ago, kraetos said:

I'd really like to be able to not install it, since it has a bug in it which prevents all the tracking center upgrades from working. (Maneuver nodes, EVA, etc.)

I've had this issue too. A fix seems to be to return to the KSC screen, then launch a new vessel, and then you should be able to switch back to the previous vessel with everything working.

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Hello,

I just come from the "Probes before Crew" forum post where somebody linked to this mod. What are the differences between unkerballed start and probes before crew? Is it only a tech tree revamp or do some elements has changed properties (science values,...)(saw description : tech tree move + new parts)

Also do you recommand changing the science slider in the difficulty settings? At which value? I plan to do a hard science run with  no labs and no tracking stations, but I don't use modded parts.

Thanks!

Edited by Goufalite
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  • 2 weeks later...
On 4/28/2021 at 8:07 AM, Goufalite said:

Hello,

I just come from the "Probes before Crew" forum post where somebody linked to this mod. What are the differences between unkerballed start and probes before crew? Is it only a tech tree revamp or do some elements has changed properties (science values,...)(saw description : tech tree move + new parts)

Also do you recommand changing the science slider in the difficulty settings? At which value? I plan to do a hard science run with  no labs and no tracking stations, but I don't use modded parts.

Thanks!


Welcome. I usually do change the science slider, but I use mods with a lot of extra science parts. The problem with simply changing the science slider is that at 100%, initial science from first flight, height records, etc add up quickly and allow you to blow through multiple tech nodes in one mission, but at 50% or lower, getting beyond nodes that require 45 or more science can take a very long time. I usually go with 50% on my personal playthroughs, and I also use severedsolo's  Bureaucracy mod to change the way funding works in KSP. I'm not using any reduction in my most recent playthrough because I hope to actually get to Jool before I restart everything.
 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi, I'm started playing for a little while (flyby of Mun atm) and it's epic! Exploring biomes by planes for science and not just because of exploration gives KSP another very interesting pathway!

But now I have a sort of bottleneck...

I'm playing without additional ground stations and with comm required for control and... well 2G antennae are a little far in the tech tree and their prerequisite are quite expensive...

So the problem is I can't build an early-mid relay constellation around Kerbin (HG-5 antennae are too weak to reach Mun) and I need control for doing Mun insertions and other stuff. Another problem is that my unlocked probes can only stabilize and not prograde/retrograde lock, so even without comm required they wouldn't burn correctly when out of comm range... Obviously Probe control point command pods are not accessible and again HG-5 are too weak...

Did it happen to somebody else here?

My options:

  • Put off comm required => won't work because my probes don't have other SAS locks than stability
  • Rush electricity + 2G antennae => by doing this I don't research other things like heavy rocketry to lift heavier ships for Mun...
  • Aim for Minmus instead

I'll currently try to land on Minmus with a probe but it might be grindy...

Thoughts? Thanks in advance!

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  • 2 weeks later...

I seem to be encountering an issue where the stayputnik does actually have control even though it should not. Not sure what's causing it or if it's an interaction with some other mod. I went looking into the files to see where the tweak actually gets made and, having checked all the MM patches UKS uses, I can't find where the change to make the Stayputnik not have control is actually made. Any chance you could help me out with this? If you need logs or to see my mod list I'll gladly provide them, just let me know. Thanks.

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56 minutes ago, Sahadara said:

I seem to be encountering an issue where the stayputnik does actually have control even though it should not. Not sure what's causing it or if it's an interaction with some other mod. I went looking into the files to see where the tweak actually gets made and, having checked all the MM patches UKS uses, I can't find where the change to make the Stayputnik not have control is actually made. Any chance you could help me out with this? If you need logs or to see my mod list I'll gladly provide them, just let me know. Thanks.

I had this when installing linuxgurugamer's dependencies ClickThroughBlocker and ToolBar Controller

I opened a ticket but it got closed.  https://github.com/linuxgurugamer/WaypointManager/issues/5

If it's still not fixed I'll take a further look.

EDIT: I went a little fast... my mentionned bug is for command pods or probe assisted ships...

How do you know your stayputnik shouldn't have control ? Out of range ? Out of electricity ? Full SAS instead of no SAS ? SAS without locks ?

Edited by Goufalite
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16 minutes ago, Goufalite said:

I had this when installing linuxgurugamer's dependencies ClickThroughBlocker and ToolBar Controller

I opened a ticket but it got closed.  https://github.com/linuxgurugamer/WaypointManager/issues/5

If it's still not fixed I'll take a further look.

EDIT: I went a little fast... my mentionned bug is for command pods or probe assisted ships...

How do you know your stayputnik shouldn't have control ? Out of range ? Out of electricity ? Full SAS instead of no SAS ? SAS without locks ?

The stayputnik isn't supposed to allow control with UKS. By which I mean, it shouldn't allow me to steer. I have signal so I should be able to activate components and throttle but I shouldn't be able to steer until I get a better probe core. As it stands it is allowing me to steer the vessel, which eliminates a fun challenge that UKS presents in the early game.

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6 hours ago, Sahadara said:

The stayputnik isn't supposed to allow control with UKS. By which I mean, it shouldn't allow me to steer. I have signal so I should be able to activate components and throttle but I shouldn't be able to steer until I get a better probe core. As it stands it is allowing me to steer the vessel, which eliminates a fun challenge that UKS presents in the early game.

It should only be possible if some other mod patching stayputnik part and add SAS to it.  ModuleManager.ConfigCache file and your KSP.log file should be able to reveal what mod is culprit for this. UKS for certain does not add SAS to stayputnik probe.  Stock config file "probeStackSphere.cfg" and "probeStackSphere_v2.cfg" also does not provide SAS. So, only logical explanation is that some other mod add SAS to stayputnik or mybe even all probes, or you have your own custom patch file that does that and you are not aware of it.

 

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9 hours ago, Sahadara said:

The stayputnik isn't supposed to allow control with UKS. By which I mean, it shouldn't allow me to steer.

You can steer the stayputnik, but you obviously need something to steer (RCS, reaction wheel, fins/elevons). Stayputnik doesn't have SAS so you can steer but not stabilize. That what the difficulty is at the beginning.

You should try a fresh vanilla install of KSP to see how the stayputnik behaves.

If you want a no control you can hibernate the probe so it won't react to fine controls like partial throttle, RCS, steering,...

With the bug I found on my side I could SAS it although it's forbidden. Heck I could even SAS debris (without movement)!!!

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