Better staging

[Ryaja]

I think KSP 2 needs better staging a more Spaceflight simulator style, but mixed with original KSP style, so we can add engines twice for ssto's with both vacuum and atmospheric engines we can press space and the atmo engines will turn off while the vac engines turn on. and of course better staging order.

Edited July 21, 2022 by Ryaja
Run on sentences FTW

[Ember12]

I agree.  In general, it would be useful for things that are now in action groups (i.e. opening solar panels, shutting off engines, deploying landing legs, etc.) to be accessible in the staging lineup.

[James M]

Could you give an example on how exactly you'd improve upon the staging system? From my perspective, action groups give the player all the versatility they would ever need. Furthermore they're editable during flight? 

[Ryaja]

1 minute ago, James M said:

Could you give an example on how exactly you'd improve upon the staging system? From my perspective, action groups give the player all the versatility they would ever need. Furthermore they're editable during flight? 

it would just change that to a one button control basically (But there still would be action groups).

[James M]

Just now, Ryaja said:

it would just change that to a one button control basically (But there still would be action groups).

Like the spacebar? Even in SFS, don't you still have to tap on the engines to turn them on or off? Is there some way in that game to turn a group off and another different group on? I don't remember that game having any action group type thingies.

Edited July 21, 2022 by James M

[Ryaja]

11 minutes ago, James M said:

Like the spacebar? Even in SFS, don't you still have to tap on the engines to turn them on or off? Is there some way in that game to turn a group off and another different group on? I don't remember that game having any action group type thingies.

They added staging

[Bej Kerman]

5 hours ago, James M said:

Like the spacebar? Even in SFS, don't you still have to tap on the engines to turn them on or off? Is there some way in that game to turn a group off and another different group on? I don't remember that game having any action group type thingies.

SFS now lets you stage any part that has an action. There's no reason you shouldn't be able to add e.g. solar panels to the staging list of a vessel in KSP as well.

[intelliCom]

20 hours ago, Bej Kerman said:

There's no reason you shouldn't be able to add e.g. solar panels to the staging list of a vessel in KSP as well.

Especially if you have "one time" functions like solar panel extension after being deployed. It'd also be interesting to have certain parts be stageable multiple times, like science equipment.

I'm starting to think that stages need to have labels instead of dumb numbers counting down to 0. Also; with numbers as a default, start from 1 and count up, not count down!

[Vl3d]

On 7/21/2022 at 6:10 AM, Ember12 said:

it would be useful for things that are now in action groups (i.e. opening solar panels, shutting off engines, deploying landing legs, etc.) to be accessible in the staging lineup.

I support this.

[Ryaja]

21 hours ago, intelliCom said:

It'd also be interesting to have certain parts be stageable multiple times

Yes, you could also stage engines multiple times to turn them on and off

 

21 hours ago, intelliCom said:

like science equipment.

But I never thought about science equipment in staging. That's a really good idea!

[Ryaja]

expanding on this idea the staging could activate different parts of scripts or different scripts, so stage 1 activates a basic launch script and that goes to orbit, stage 2 intercepts the mun, stage 3 lands, and stage 4 drives a rover to points of interest.

But you would of course have to code everything yourself so it is not just a button to do it for you.

Edited July 23, 2022 by Ryaja

[darthvader15001]

On 7/21/2022 at 5:17 AM, Bej Kerman said:

e.g. solar panels to the staging list of a vessel in KSP as well.

well then you could open them with staging but what about closing them?

15 hours ago, Ryaja said:

expanding on this idea the staging could activate different parts of scripts or different scripts, so stage 1 activates a basic launch script and that goes to orbit, stage 2 intercepts the mun, stage 3 lands, and stage 4 drives a rover to points of interest.

But you would of course have to code everything yourself so it is not just a button to do it for you.

this would probably completely change the direction of the development and make a HUGE delay. Why not just wait for a ksp2 mod like that or make one yourself when it comes out?

[Ryaja]

16 minutes ago, darthvader15001 said:

well then you could open them with staging but what about closing them?

Well... Ya

16 minutes ago, darthvader15001 said:

this would probably completely change the direction of the development and make a HUGE delay. Why not just wait for a ksp2 mod like that or make one yourself when it comes out?

Unless #1 it is already being made #2 it could be a future update. If not I better learn how to code mods.

[Ember12]

49 minutes ago, darthvader15001 said:

well then you could open them with staging but what about closing them?

If all actions could be activated by staging, then you could close them, toggle them, anything.

[Bej Kerman]

57 minutes ago, darthvader15001 said:

On 7/21/2022 at 10:17 AM, Bej Kerman said:

e.g. solar panels to the staging list of a vessel in KSP as well.

well then you could open them with staging but what about closing them?

Then assign the close action to a stage instead of an action group. I don't see the need to restrict stages just to engines and decouplers.

[t_v]

The only important downsides I see here are over cluttering and over complication for beginners. The clutter can be solved with standard good UI, and for over complication, have it so that “essential components” (like in KSP 1) are automatically added to the stages, and other actions are tucked inside a different interface so that a new player isn’t swarmed with icons and buttons right away. The upsides are great, as a framework that allows any action to be run using staging means adding new parts only requires additional effort to add to the staging list if new icons need to be drawn to represent actions, and it creates opportunities for UI parallel between stating and action groups. 

[pandaman]

59 minutes ago, Bej Kerman said:

Then assign the close action to a stage instead of an action group. I don't see the need to restrict stages just to engines and decouplers.

But aren't 'stages', by their nature, one time sequential events?

That could be a bit inconvenient for things like solar panels.  Surely an Action Group is a better solution for them.

[Bej Kerman]

16 minutes ago, pandaman said:

But aren't 'stages', by their nature, one time sequential events?

Is having 'deploy panels with fairing sep' on Stage n+1 and 'retract panels for re-entry' on Stage n+2 not an option? Why should I not be allowed to have my panels open/close with other important parts that already have staging support?

17 minutes ago, pandaman said:

That could be a bit inconvenient for things like solar panels.  Surely an Action Group is a better solution for them.

Again, I don't see the point in such pointless restrictions. You only have so many action groups, anyway.

[Vl3d]

Clearly we should be able to add actions and action groups to stages.

[Ryaja]

30 minutes ago, Vl3d said:

Clearly we should be able to add actions and action groups to stages.

Yes

[darthvader15001]

2 hours ago, pandaman said:

That could be a bit inconvenient for things like solar panels.  Surely an Action Group is a better solution for them.

I agree. Also, it would be cool to have any extendable part other than airbrakes automagically retract when you enter the atmo and legs and landing gears extend like 1300 m off the ground.

[Ryaja]

7 minutes ago, darthvader15001 said:

I agree. Also, it would be cool to have any extendable part other than airbrakes automagically retract when you enter the atmo and legs and landing gears extend like 1300 m off the ground.

That would be toggleable right?

[darthvader15001]

idk cause im not a dev btw but it should be toggleable for the hardcore players (not me)

[Turtlegirl1209]

On 7/21/2022 at 5:10 AM, Ember12 said:

I agree.  In general, it would be useful for things that are now in action groups (i.e. opening solar panels, shutting off engines, deploying landing legs, etc.) to be accessible in the staging lineup.

What if you could set action groups to the staging window? Including custom groups, of course! I think this would be a wonderful solution

[Ember12]

 

2 hours ago, Turtlegirl1209 said:

What if you could set action groups to the staging window? Including custom groups, of course! I think this would be a wonderful solution

That wouldn't be as flexible as just assigning the actions themselves.  Assigning the actions, rather than groups, to staging means you can free up more action groups for other purposes, things you have to do more than once.