Stoup Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 One thing I definitely wish is that relevant information, specifically from: Twitter Pinned Discord Posts uh, I guess mostly just those two come to mind would at least on some regular basis be mirrored in the Social Posts thread here on the forums. Doesn't have to be constant, but even weekly updates to make sure as much info as possible is mirrored in the right places would be very nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pthigrivi Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 4 minutes ago, Moons said: I told you before and i will tell you again - i think most of what you do (or to be more specific the place where you do it) is sadly a waste of time - in my opinion. Discord isnt a good tool for the management and communication with a big community - I mean I certainly prefer the pace here and the ability for all of the thoughtful folks here to take their time and have compelling discussions (well, for the most part haha), but my or your opinion on the nature of a given format just isn't as relevant as the shear volume of eyes and voices on those other platforms. Reach and scale are really important. Its all well to have a detailed discussion with half a dozen folks on the board about the strategy going forward, but if no one sees that discussion it doesn't really matter. In some ways this board is probably more important for lurking devs to take in thorough feedback on gameplay functionality like the maneuver nodes, gaps in the flight planner, etc. than it is for CMs to reach people on development optics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moons Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, tstein said: I am not sure it is needed any more communication unless there is something to communicate. TO make a post or annoucement when there is no proper content or plan would not help. I am very critic of this game quality, but I know it is not words that will fix it. When they have a schedules plan for patches that is when a more detailed communication could be helpful. What I hope is that this experience can be absorbed by PD/intercept and they learn to prioritize things, that the basics are more important than the sprinkles on top. I think your wrong. When there is a lot of negativity its important to reassure people by keeping up communication and it always helps if people feel a more personal connection by showing that issues are seen etc. and that problems arent ignored - even when there is a lot of work done behind the scenes - it wont help if people dont know about it. 4 minutes ago, Pthigrivi said: I mean I certainly prefer the pace here and the ability for all of the thoughtful folks here to take their time and have compelling discussions (well, for the most part haha), but my or your opinion on the nature of a given format just isn't as relevant as the shear volume of eyes and voices on those other platforms. Reach and scale are really important. Its all well to have a detailed discussion with half a dozen folks on the board about the strategy going forward, but if no one sees that discussion it doesn't really matter. In some ways this board is probably more important for lurking devs to take in thorough feedback on gameplay functionality like the maneuver nodes, gaps in the flight planner, etc. than it is for CMs to reach people on development optics. But is it really reach? You miss 99% of all people not using discord and searching with google - and you get lots of people that will simply join your channel because tehy have discord running anyways besides 50 other channels and will do some casual talking mostly. How do people even discuss anything in any meaningful way in a channel where hundreds of people constnatly casually write things? If at all i would use Discord as a casual community chat. I just recently joined their discord - and what did i see - it looks like a chat window with people randomly saying stuff - sometimes 1 or 2 people respond at most and thats it. Sometimes there is casual talk about something else - its more like a random casual chat with lots of people. I sometimes use Discord aswell - but only for small groupds of friends to play games and communicate etc. - it doesnt seem like a good solution for much more. Edited March 3, 2023 by Moons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Community Manager Dakota Posted March 3, 2023 Community Manager Share Posted March 3, 2023 4 minutes ago, Stoup said: One thing I definitely wish is that relevant information, specifically from: Twitter Pinned Discord Posts uh, I guess mostly just those two come to mind would at least on some regular basis be mirrored in the Social Posts thread here on the forums. Doesn't have to be constant, but even weekly updates to make sure as much info as possible is mirrored in the right places would be very nice. Yesterday we added the #dev_tracker channel to the Discord which should only have pinned "important" information moving forward. Also, I'm working on the forums backend (investigating why we're having cache issues) and once that's done, I'd like to be able to highlight tweets somewhere on the forums - like the sidebar or subheader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbodiah Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 Maybe if KSP2 dies we can get some more updates for KSP1. Here's hoping.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoup Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 Yeah, I saw a few updates to the discord yesterday but I guess I missed that part specifically ; I guess it would be redundant to ask for an explanation for where to find info on when these kind of new features get pushed, there's so much going on and I'm glad to see an effort being made! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullmetal Analyst Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 1 hour ago, Moons said: Also - i think your overly negative - NASA isnt a private company either. well the same applies for NASA, they even killed several astronauts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moons Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Fullmetal Analyst said: well the same applies for NASA, they even killed several astronauts I dont get your point - obviously what NASA is doing is very dangerous - getting people to space - and they have pretty high safety standards - i have no idea what you are trying to say? Edited March 3, 2023 by Moons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullmetal Analyst Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Moons said: I dont get your point my point is that they should have focused on security, instead of being faster/better than the russians i havent seen spacex kill anyone so far Edited March 3, 2023 by Fullmetal Analyst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted March 3, 2023 Author Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) I went and looked at the KSP2 'Socials'. They are garbage. Twitter: Literally "Everything is FINE! -- Let's do a Challenge!" (as if the game were fully performant). They're treating this like a normal launch with a functioning, game that people are enjoying playing as designed. Discord: the place is a chaotic mess. Maybe there are a bunch of people there - but the critical content is getting lost in the noise. The refrain is 'Post substantive bug reports on the forum'. Okay. Why? If you spend any time on either of those places you get a completely skewed perspective. This is the only place where people are actually trying to test and report on things that adversely affect enjoyment and playability. Edited March 3, 2023 by JoeSchmuckatelli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullmetal Analyst Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 34 minutes ago, Dakota said: I'd like to be able to highlight tweets somewhere on the forums - like the sidebar or subheader. wow you seriously think that linking your 280 character twitter messages on the forum is a smart idea? how about linking to the forum on twitter instead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vl3d Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 11 minutes ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said: I went and looked at the KSP2 'Socials'. They are garbage. Twitter: Literally "Everything is FINE! -- Let's do a Challenge!" (as if the game were fully performant). They're treating this like a normal launch with a functioning, game that people are enjoying playing as designed. Discord: the place is a chaotic mess. Maybe there are a bunch of people there - but the critical content is getting lost in the noise. The refrain is 'Post substantive bug reports on the forum'. Okay. Why? If you spend any time on either of those places you get a completely skewed perspective. This is the only place where people are actually trying to test and report on things that adversely affect enjoyment and playability. Joe's mad. There there, it's all gonna be fine. All bugs will be fixed, the game will become performant, the terrain textures will be photorealistic and the clouds will be puffy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tstein Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 3 minutes ago, Vl3d said: Joe's mad. There there, it's all gonna be fine. All bugs will be fixed, the game will become performant, the terrain textures will be photorealistic and the clouds will be puffy. We don't speak of clouds here.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vl3d Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 Just now, tstein said: We don't speak of clouds here.... I remember I was one of the very few to criticize the clouds before launch. Everyone was saying "oh the clouds don't matter". How you like them clouds now, eh!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyDausus Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) I'll give you the best example of a player who quits the game. ME ,because i can't really play it,many of us can't play it with this poor performance. Edited March 3, 2023 by BobbyDausus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pthigrivi Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 18 minutes ago, Vl3d said: I remember I was one of the very few to criticize the clouds before launch. Everyone was saying "oh the clouds don't matter". How you like them clouds now, eh!? Haha they remain one the least critical issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyDausus Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 19 minutes ago, Vl3d said: I remember I was one of the very few to criticize the clouds before launch. Everyone was saying "oh the clouds don't matter". How you like them clouds now, eh!? I'm playing KSP 1 with the BETA clouds from EVE....it's quite amazing,quite better looking than KSP 2 clouds,not to mention the FPS ,got full graphic mods overhaul and it looks good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted March 3, 2023 Author Share Posted March 3, 2023 30 minutes ago, Vl3d said: Joe's mad. There there, it's all gonna be fine. All bugs will be fixed, the game will become performant, the terrain textures will be photorealistic and the clouds will be puffy. Grin. I did go from KSP2 'apologist' to largely critical. I still believe in the potential - just amazed at the current state + lack of communication. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PakledHostage Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 31 minutes ago, Vl3d said: All bugs will be fixed, the game will become performant, the terrain textures will be photorealistic and the clouds will be puffy. Are you talking about KSP2 or MSFS2020? I'll admit that I'm in the "everything will be fine" camp on KSP2, but I suspect I have lower expectations than a lot of people here. I play it maybe an hour a week with my 4 and 8 year old kids. I am also hosting a challenge over in the Challenges sub forum. I hope the game succeeds, and I am not too fussed about the $50 I risked on it (I've spent a lot more than that on MSFS2020). Sure it is disappointing in its current state, but how is much of what's written on these forums going to help in that regard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gussi111 Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 27 minutes ago, Pthigrivi said: Haha they remain one the least critical issues. I think that is exactly what his point is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted March 3, 2023 Author Share Posted March 3, 2023 7 minutes ago, gussi111 said: I think that is exactly what his point is. Now that I think about it... I'm nostalgic for the way we were when @Vl3d was posting all his concerns about clouds and artwork! (I will say - I'm impressed with the little bit of terrain I'm seeing. One thing I wish for the far-distant future is they get those chunks of trees &etc to fade in less chunkily. But... man I am holding that one close. I'll be happy to just be able to undock my munar lander without both crafts disappearing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.Random Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) 31 minutes ago, PakledHostage said: Are you talking about KSP2 or MSFS2020? KSP 1, probably. Edited March 3, 2023 by J.Random Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meecrob Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Dakota said: Can't comment on player-count or retention rates or anything like that - but I'll say again that T2/PD are 100% behind the Intercept team. I'd like to give some insight as to why people are asking for more communication from you. Merely saying T2/PD are 100% behind the intercept team has no proof. Logically, if they were behind the Intercept team, they wouldn't have kneecapped the release so they could add it to their shareholder's report (or whatever that was for; it surely wasn't because the game was ready) . Let me use the example of a corporation with a supply chain that manufactures a consumer product: in order to create a certain consumer experience, you need to provide a certain level of quality. When integrating a product, you cannot directly control the quality of all your suppliers. If one of them drops their quality below a certain point as to affect the end consumer's experience, you tell that supplier about the discrepancy. That supplier then usually responds and lays out a plan to achieve the required quality. Suppliers that say "don't worry, we are 100% committed to quality" are replaced because it is basically gaslighting. If you guys don't have a plan, just say so. "Look community, with the state the game is in, we need to explore to figure out the best course of action with regards to what issues we will attack first" then follow it up when you try something. Update us when what you tried worked or failed (failures are not failures if you engage the community about what you tried). We know you aren't superhuman and this won't be fixed overnight, but the cold, hard truth is that sales are being impacted because of the poor communication. The whole world knows this release went disastrously. Stop pretending its a small bump in the road. Admit it blew up in your face, and I guarantee you people will be more open to believing you when you say you are behind the game. Truth and honesty is what is going to sell this game for you. Another cold, hard truth is that if you guys screw the pooch on KSP2, the community has enough skilled and passionate people to make a spiritual successor without you. Forward that to your higher ups at T2/PD. I'm not aiming this squarely at you, Dakota, I get you are in the in-enviable position of "messenger" but this has to be said. Edited March 3, 2023 by Meecrob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer_S Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 16 hours ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said: https://steamdb.info/app/954850/charts/ Not that SteamDB is the end all be all of good info - but I do think it is telling that the numbers have dropped so precipitously. Virtually zero interaction from the Community Management team, no word on a patch and the rare possibility from pure guesswork that Friday might be a day to expect something... But maybe not. Perhaps the numbers tick up on the weekend, perhaps they jump after news of a patch comes out. Or maybe they drop the price by 50% (looking at you, Mexico) in hopes of getting new players into the pay for Alpha experience. The press on this, the word of mouth is terrible... And yet we die-hard fans are still here, still hoping. Maybe that is why the CM team seems so unengaged. Useless. Can you show the same chart for a similar, long duration, early access game? Say, Baldur's Gate 3. Gut feel: lots of people bought as it *will* be an awesome game but they don't want to faff around on a daily basis. I loaded up BG3 at EA inception and then left to let things sort out. I'll be back at full release. I only got into KSP1 at about 0.8 or so. Missed a great deal of these same issues. Homer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anth Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 5 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said: The problem with Steam's numbers is that it doesn't take into account people who bought from either Epic or the PD store directly. I wanted a direct download so I bought directly from the PD Store (it said Direct Download) but instead they sent me an email with a steam key. So its really just Steam or Epic. I wasn't happy about it but at least it ended up on my second choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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