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Week One Adventures


Nate Simpson

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12 minutes ago, The Aziz said:

The list in the op contains things that are already done. Since the post was done few days ago you can assume that more are coming, possibly including the ones you mentioned.

Not necessarily.  More bugs will certainly be fixed in the development branch but they'll most likely be in the next patch. You usually freeze the RC, verify the fixes in it, and push it out. If you keep adding fixes you'll never get it out of QA!

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2 hours ago, Periple said:

Not necessarily.  More bugs will certainly be fixed in the development branch but they'll most likely be in the next patch. You usually freeze the RC, verify the fixes in it, and push it out. If you keep adding fixes you'll never get it out of QA!

True, but Nate did say there could probably be more than just those listed.  Not 'promised' though.

Either way it's a start and step in the right direction. 

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So those aren't what they're planning, but what is already completed? That is even worse, that is how much better the game could be RIGHT NOW, but which we are forced to wait weeks for for no reason.

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Just now, BmB said:

So those aren't what they're planning, but what is already completed? That is even worse, that is how much better the game could be RIGHT NOW, but which we are forced to wait weeks for for no reason.

The universe in which the devs unlocked interstellar content immediately is the Universe where you complain that they didn't hold off such features until they were ready for access.

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I am complaining that they released too early, I already said I'm empathetic to the fact that such release dates are set by publishers although the devs do have a hand in not meeting whatever internal deadlines were set.

But they did release too early, so unless they're going to do a recall they need to release the fixes they have.

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3 minutes ago, BmB said:

But they did release too early, so unless they're going to do a recall they need to release the fixes they have.

Okay, so if they did release too early (a stance I'm inclined to agree with), why should they rush things further? Think of this as the normal progress that would've happened behind closed doors if we weren't waiting for the second early access version by now. I'm sure your outlook would have been different if that were the case.

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8 minutes ago, BmB said:

I am complaining that they released too early

9 minutes ago, BmB said:

unless they're going to do a recall they need to release the fixes they have

You're complaining that they released early - and yet, at the same time, as you conveniently demonstrate for me, you're complaining that they don't release updates early...

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13 minutes ago, BmB said:

 

But they did release too early, so unless they're going to do a recall they need to release the fixes they have.

But only if those fixes are stable. Would you rather have fixes that work and don't cause other problems, or rushed fixes that sort of work sometimes but break other things because they didn't check them properly first?

Yes, of course we all want fixes ASAP, but only if they do actually fix things.  By not testing and checking it could be even worse.

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You need to test the fixes you have implemented so that they don't break other things, and actually "take" as in, the fixes actually work. I'm sure we've all seen "Fixed X" dev notes in any of our fave games only to go test that fix and, welp, no, it's not fixed. 

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48 minutes ago, RayneCloud said:

You need to test the fixes you have implemented so that they don't break other things, and actually "take" as in, the fixes actually work. I'm sure we've all seen "Fixed X" dev notes in any of our fave games only to go test that fix and, welp, no, it's not fixed. 

To drive this point home, a game I'm playing just pushed an update that fixed some ray tracing aspects. In the process it seems to have broken some light occlusion in other places.

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On 3/3/2023 at 6:35 PM, RobHeffo said:

As a developer myself, I can definitely say that while I am working on some larger bugs, I may need some time to clear my head, so I switch temporarially to some more simple bugs, then come back to the bigger one with a fresh perspective.

Also, while you got some team mebers assigned busy working on the bigger bugs, you can have other team members cleaning up the low hanging fruit. After all, getting the issues fixed no matter how big or small is the name of the game.. 

Then couple that with public expectation... If for example, the team released an update that only resolved the Terrain performance issue, people will be sitting there saying "What?? Is that all you got done!! What have you been wasting the rest of your time on?". This update is a good mix of fixes, I am looking forward to it even though deep down I really want > 2fps trying to launch on my GTX1650.

Great work @Nate Simpson and the rest of the team. Pass on my regards!

Great work?! Lol what?

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I've got some gasoline here,

The Witcher 3 is well established. I play it. I love it. The Next gen Edition Broke the game. The patches "helped" some issues, broke others that were fine before...The next patch "helped" some things and yet still...broke more. I don't play it right now because...it broke. Regarding KSP 2 right now, it's hard and lot's to complain about, but we should just be patient and see what the devs come up with in the coming patches. As long as T2 doesn't flush this project down the toilet I believe they will bring this game up to our expectations. Fingers crossed.

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8 hours ago, pandaman said:

But only if those fixes are stable.

No, not when the game is in this poor of a state. Once it gets more stable only then it will make sense to test patches more thoroughly

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1 hour ago, BmB said:

No, not when the game is in this poor of a state. Once it gets more stable only then it will make sense to test patches more thoroughly

So you want them to release fixes that don't actually fix anything? 

Apart from being very frustrating for us (including you) it would be a PR disaster.

The only way to make it more stable is to release fixes that actually work, which means CHECKING them first.

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1 hour ago, BmB said:

No, not when the game is in this poor of a state. Once it gets more stable only then it will make sense to test patches more thoroughly

I thought you were upset about the state the game is in.

And now you're saying you want it in a worse state?

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2 hours ago, Kerbart said:

I thought you were upset about the state the game is in.

And now you're saying you want it in a worse state?

(S)he is just angry at the state of the game. Deep down we're all torn apart between having it fixed ASAP and having it fixed good.

But only having it fixed good will be a viable long-term solution.

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Releasing patches isn't going to make the game worse [snip]

Yes, it may introduce some new bugs, emphasis on MAY, that is still better than leaving bugs this bad unfixed for weeks, and those new bugs can themselves be fixed. It's something you only worry about when the game is already stable and you don't want to accidentally make it unstable. But that's not the case right now, the case is they have fixes and they are withholding them for no reason.

Edited by Snark
Redacted by moderator
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Yeah, can't imagine the positive response when a patch would introduce more potentially gamebreaking bugs.

They have one shot at redeeming themselves in eyes of general public, they can't afford taking chances like that.

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Leaving us with a broken product for extended periods is what will ruin their reputation. If they release fixes promptly that is the only thing that will save that. If, and that's only IF they accidentally make something else broken, they apply the same principle and fix it promptly or roll back a version. You should do this until the game is stable enough to justify waiting for QA.

And I'm talking about the showstoppers here, if they have a fix for KSC appearing in front of you and destroying your ship, then they need to release it now, not in two weeks. If they have a fix for rockets bending out of shape and destroying themselves, they need to release it now. The launch button randomly stops working? Fix now. Ships loading in all broken and messed up? Now. There's plenty of game breaking bugs like this which can't wait. These are the exact type of bug that you are more worried about hypothetical versions of that may or may not get introduced, than the actual bugs that are in the game right now, to justify not fixing what is there that makes it unplayable.

You don't need to defend such excrementsty development practices, you really don't. You get nothing out of it.

Edited by BmB
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12 minutes ago, BmB said:

Releasing patches isn't going to make the game worse, where do you shills get this stuff from?

Yes, it may introduce some new bugs, emphasis on MAY, that is still better than leaving bugs this bad unfixed for weeks, and those new bugs can themselves be fixed. It's something you only worry about when the game is already stable and you don't want to accidentally make it unstable. But that's not the case right now, the case is they have fixes and they are withholding them for no reason.

Have patience my young padawan. 

Rushing devs has never in the history of gaming resulted in an improved situation. 

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