Naval Battle League 2016-2018

[Alphasus]

 

@8bitgammers

Please reupload the file.

Edited June 3, 2016 by Alphasus

[AlexanderTeaH]

I'm getting the hang of this landing thing!

Edited June 4, 2016 by AlexanderTeaH

[Iago]

16 hours ago, AlexanderTeaH said:

I'm getting the hang of this landing thing!

Do want

[Alphasus]

@8bitgammersIf you don't reupload in 2 days, I will eject the shot from your bomber and replicate the hit. I will post the fixed persist for @Servo.

Edited June 4, 2016 by Alphasus

[Alphasus]

@8bitgammers
You have until Monday at 10:22 A.M. EST before I fix your turn as best I can.

[panzer1b]

Well after a while of on and off armor development i think im on to something...

My latest ship is the first ship ive EVER seen that can tank fire from zeke's 10.5t super torpedo:

It is still prone to the occasional luckshot that vaporizes the core, but the frequency of this is so low that for all intents and purposes you cannot kill my new ship with anything reliably (gutting the internals is another matter though ).  Against anything smaller it basically just doesnt care unless its prolonged bombardment (multiple shots will eventually reduce it to a wreck and you cant really defend against this while sticking to 180 part hull).

The SK-CRV-IVg4 uses a newly developed armor system, which actually does not follow my old (and apparently flawed) rule of never clip anything unless absolutely necessary.

For starters i used layered interlocked armor, which basically stops anything but excessively heavy and or powerful ordinance in its tracks.  The idea is to place 2x2 structural panels so that there is overlap near critical sections.  Because it is not part count or mass efficient, i limited the technique to only be near critical spots.  The core itself used interlocking armor that comes off of both the front and rear interior armor plating which will either disintegrate or failing that slow enemy weapons to the point they are virtually unable to do any more damage.  For anyone here who wants to make better armor, use interlocking 2x2 plates near anything you want to protect relatively well.  It is best to have each plate attached to the core with different parts, just make sure to interlock them so that they overlap around 50% (you can do more or less depending on how much protection you need and how much you are willing to put into mass/part count).

The other technique involves clipping nukes in fuel tanks.  Now i dont know why, but the combination of a fuel tank with a nuke inside it (or well partially inside it) seems to resist engine knock outs more, and doesnt really destroy the hull or anything else when it does go out with a bang (well its not really any more dangerous to having a fully exposed nuke inside the hull).  Saves space too, since i can have a fuel tank essentially integrated with the nuke.  Also, the ship does clip SOME fuel, which up to this point ive also considered a death sentence to armor, but if you do the clipping in such a way that the likely event of the whole stack exploding doesnt actually do further damage to the vessel, it is more beneficial then harmful.  If you want to clip fuel tanks at all i suggest making a stack of 2-3 and then placing the nuke at the end.  there should be nothing intersecting this stacked and clipped fuel/engine tube, and with my own ship i manage to do this by having what are essentially 3 separate compartments that are fully empty and go from the middle to the entire rear of teh ship.  The sides house 1 nuke and 2-3 fuel tanks each (depending on configuration), while the middle houses a cockpit with FLT-400 and aerospike for emergency thrust.  Not very useful until realtime MP but i try to actually make my ships capable of being used in MP in the likely event it is released in teh future (or someone makes a DMP clone that isnt crap).

While im talking about engines and clipping, there are 4 ions and the corresponding drive system clipped into the core which both acts as ablative armor which seems to cut down probability of being 1 shotted to the root part, and act as backup emergency engines if you happen to have both your nukes and aerospike shot apart.  It is a VERY good idea to have a very weak ion drive as an emergency backup because from experience it is near impossible to actually destroy such a system entirely, even if your batteries are lousy/non existent you will always have some thrust leftover and the efficiency means that even a couple of small ion tanks will be enough to make a final desperate move late game (after your enemy thinks the ship is dead in the water).  Ofc this depends on battle environment, if its kerbin or some high dV place id never even bring them as loss of main engines makes you useless since small amounts of emergency dV are pointless, but somewhere like the mun or even duna as little as 500dV is still enough to move and attack at least once.  Sadly its a bit of a part count comittment, but personally ill give up a few parts tht could have gone elsewhere to have a emergency backup thruster and ~500 or so dV of fuel for it.

Finally, I used short ibeams as the entire skeleton (including teh root part).  The reason is that they combine reasonable mass with a very small hitbox.  The stubby girder i used to use in older ships like the 3rd gen class-IV is both lighter and has a larger hitbox then a ibeam, and thus tends to be easier to destroy.  Girders still make great armor and can be used for the core, but it seems that a ibeam is a hair less likely to be vaporized and anything that phases has near impossible odds when it comes to hitting it at high speeds.  That said, large girders make exceptional armor, but should not be used for essential core sections.

Edited June 6, 2016 by panzer1b

[quasarrgames]

21 hours ago, panzer1b said:

snip

Ha you put so much effort into deigning your ships, panzer. My design logic is just:

-Does it look pretty?

-Does it shoot straight?

-Does it have decent thrust and delta v?

-Does it survive a couple whack-a kerbal shots?

If you answered yes to one or more of these questions, your ship is Quasarr Certified!

[Spartwo]

Just the one?

[panzer1b]

19 hours ago, quasarrgames said:

Ha you put so much effort into deigning your ships, panzer. My design logic is just:

-Does it look pretty?

-Does it shoot straight?

-Does it have decent thrust and delta v?

-Does it survive a couple whack-a kerbal shots?

If you answered yes to one or more of these questions, your ship is Quasarr Certified!

Maybee im different, but my standards of armor are ALOT higher then most people on here...

 

 

Basically all my ships use the following requirements:

*At least 2000 dV on primary engines (discounting RCS or emergency engine units if present).  As for why 2000, its the bare minimum to get to Jool from high kerbin (or mun/minmus) orbit.

*At most 80t for a frontline capital ship (although most tend to be below 70t), 60t for support, 50t for sub capitals (such as flakboats and the like, stuff thats similar in size to bombers or heavy fighters but actually carry decent armor).

*Max hull part count of 200.  I shoot for around 150 though since lower is better (and you cant really make armor below that reliably, though one of my really old warships did have a 120 part hull and not the worst protection either).  Also, with weapons loaded, no more then 300 parts if its going to be used in a fleet scale battle, no more then 400 for 1 vs 1.

*Capable of surviving at least 6 direct hits from ibeam style weapons like the SRM-6M most of the time.

*Capable of surviving 4 RT-5 torps (just a RT-5 with a structural impactor, nothing fancy) most of the time.

*Capable of surviving 1 competitive torpedo (~10t mass), or 2 semi competitive torpedoes (~6t mass) most of the time.

 

 

Yes i know that last requirement is utterly insane (no vessel ive ever come across actually fits under my requirements except my latest SK-CRV-IVg4) but these are my standards.  Ohh and im now attempting the impossible, creating a flakboat that has the armor of a capital ship, weights around 50t, and still carries decent firepower (dual SRM-6M with drones against starfighters).  I dont knwo why, but i just cannot have a ship anymore without a SRM-6M on it, its my single best weapon since basically no ships utilizing past era hull design and below 800 parts can actually survive it, very good luck aside.

Also, whack-a-kerbal is a very bad way to test armor...  Not saying you shouldnt use it, but actual weapons usually feature shrapnel (as in break apart to maximize component damage once inside), are usually shaped very differently from whack-a-kerbal ammo (most decent ones are very longto maximize odds of colliding at phasing velocity), and whack-a-kerbal is indestructible non-persist debris essentially, cannot really be compared to a real weapon.

Ohh and in other news, i made a joke weapon that actually is extremely lethal!  Basically abuses the fact that fairings are indestructible anywhere but the base.  Make a super long lance style thing and impale ships with it .  Best part is that it almost always get imbedded inside the target after the hit and takes no damage (reuseable weapon much), not to mention looks hilarious.  That said, due to how OP this thing is, fairings are going into my personal list of banned weapons (along with the XL-3 wheel and the Tripedo-S/H which was based upon it).

Also, while i didnt make any screenies of it, the largest fairing size (when its the size of a ship) will instantly vaporize the target when its going fast enough every time...

Edited June 7, 2016 by panzer1b

[quasarrgames]

2 hours ago, panzer1b said:

Maybee im different, but my standards of armor are ALOT higher then most people on here...

Also, whack-a-kerbal is a very bad way to test armor...  Not saying you shouldnt use it, but actual weapons usually feature shrapnel (as in break apart to maximize component damage once inside), are usually shaped very differently from whack-a-kerbal ammo (most decent ones are very longto maximize odds of colliding at phasing velocity), and whack-a-kerbal is indestructible non-persist debris essentially, cannot really be compared to a real weapon.

Ohh and in other news, i made a joke weapon that actually is extremely lethal!  Basically abuses the fact that fairings are indestructible anywhere but the base.  Make a super long lance style thing and impale ships with it .  Best part is that it almost always get imbedded inside the target after the hit and takes no damage (reuseable weapon much), not to mention looks hilarious.  That said, due to how OP this thing is, fairings are going into my personal list of banned weapons (along with the XL-3 wheel and the Tripedo-S/H which was based upon it).

Also, while i didnt make any screenies of it, the largest fairing size (when its the size of a ship) will instantly vaporize the target when its going fast enough every time...

I'll admit whack a kerbal isn't the most accurate way to test armor, but it can be used in a pinch. Also, you'd probably still be hard-pressed to survive a 10-ton whack a kerbal cube at max velocity.

And about that faring weapon, that's pure genius. I hope you don't mind that i "adapted" it for a new purpose:

triple-layer faring armor FTW

If you've "copywrighted" it i won't use it though

Otherwise, i really hope it's legal in battle... @Spartwo?

Edited June 7, 2016 by quasarrgames

[panzer1b]

20 hours ago, quasarrgames said:

triple-layer faring armor FTW

If you've "copywrighted" it i won't use it though

Otherwise, i really hope it's legal in battle... @Spartwo?

Im going to say is that i have tried that myself (the first thing that came into my mind after witnesing the weapon (if it doesnt explode when used to impale people, why would it explode when impaled?).  Ive developed 2 ships that use (or should i say abuse) fairings, and they are very tough but can be neutralized if you target the joint areas.  That said, i dont personally like fairings as they look ugly (the second we get hexagonal shaped ones (or even a bloody square cross section) im all for it, but until then fairings dont look pretty, and while i am by no means entirely driven by appearance, i refuse to pilot anything that doesnt at least look cool to some extent.

Ohh and as for copyrights, i do not honor any sort of "copyrights" when it comes to concepts or ideas.  That means it goes both ways, you are free to use any of my ideas, and im free to use anyone else's ideas in my ships.  As for actual ships, thats another story, i dont like to copy other people's work since id rather make my own ship, and actually learn something in the process even if that ship may feature many elements of other people's ships in its design.

Finally, im gonna do a bit more testing and ill make a decision as to how powerful the fairing armor really is.  The few tests ive done before were more or less 50/50, sometimes the round didnt do squat, sometimes a massive chunk blew off and all engines were destroyed..  My preliminary testing suggests its effective but not OP, but i havent tried many varietaions of that hull style, so i may very well be wrong and there may be a method to make a near invincible ship with them (anything that has sections that cant be destroyed like cargo bays is inevitable going to be abused, but at least in the case of cargo bays the effect seems negligible.

 

Edit:

Ive done some extensive testing and ill say that the "fairing armor" is honestly 50-50, although it does a great job at augmenting existing armor schemes.  Ive found that it makes it harder to destroy something inside a fairing, but comes at the cost of basically guaranteed dead ship in the event that one of the fairing bases are separated from the ship and arent destroyed in the process.  If any of the fairings separate they essentially clip into your ship and vaporize it.

All in all, great for smaller vessels, but you should not rely on them to save larger ships as they can potentially create weakspots that might end up vaporizing the entire vessel.  Im still working on developing the concept (as it is a hell of alot better then conventional armor in its current form), but it only kills off low velocity ammo (hence why its OP on fighters and similar vessels), hypervelocity phasing crap will still destroy your vessel at least some of the time! 

Edited June 8, 2016 by panzer1b

[Alphasus]

@8bitgammers

Your turn has been simulated. I attempted to replicate your attack. https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3IvrPbGhZWFOTVJdG1uV1JaX3c

@Servo

His turn was replicated.

Edited June 8, 2016 by Alphasus

[Servo]

14 minutes ago, Alphasus said:

@8bitgammers

Your turn has been simulated. I attempted to replicate your attack. https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3IvrPbGhZWFOTVJdG1uV1JaX3c

@Servo

His turn was replicated.

Sorry, but I'm going to drop out of this. I've been working on a couple more interesting (to me) projects, namely a Constellation recreation. Ignore my ships/delete them/start over.

[Andem]

38 minutes ago, Servo said:

Sorry, but I'm going to drop out of this. I've been working on a couple more interesting (to me) projects, namely a Constellation recreation. Ignore my ships/delete them/start over.

Ooh!! If possible, transfer crew between the abandoned ships and "hijack" them!!!

[Alphasus]

8 minutes ago, Servo said:

Sorry, but I'm going to drop out of this. I've been working on a couple more interesting (to me) projects, namely a Constellation recreation. Ignore my ships/delete them/start over.

@8bitgammers

Do you forfeit with your 1 ship vs my 4?

[Andem]

1 hour ago, Alphasus said:

@8bitgammers

Do you forfeit with your 1 ship vs my 4?

Please consider:

 

1 hour ago, Andem said:

Ooh!! If possible, transfer crew between the abandoned ships and "hijack" them!!!

Please? 

[Alphasus]

1 minute ago, Andem said:

Please consider:

 

Please? 

Wouldn't work out. He has 1 crew left.

[Redrobin]

Ayy I'm back!

Just made this new destroyer.  It's a bit blocky, but whatever.

Holy crap, my old Falcon class Command ship from 0.25 is compatible

Time to refit this baby as the missiles got busted and NERVAs no longer use oxidizer.

Edited June 10, 2016 by Redrobin
Holy crap

[quasarrgames]

Hey @panzer1b, do you know where i could get a copy of that 10t super torpedo? I have a ship that i'd really like to test it on. All the missiles i make just bounce off of it.

[panzer1b]

On 6/11/2016 at 2:21 PM, quasarrgames said:

Hey @panzer1b, do you know where i could get a copy of that 10t super torpedo? I have a ship that i'd really like to test it on. All the missiles i make just bounce off of it.

I pulled it off of the "squid class destroyer" made by zekes.  I use it for testing because up to this point i have not found a more powerful 1.25m weapon, and well if i can make a ship immune to it (well nothing is 100% immune yet) then i can rest assured most smaller weapons wont be able to kill it without sustained fire.  Its somewhere on zeke's craft repository, so search there, but if you cannot find it ill just upload the missile itself for you if necessary...

[ScriptKitt3h]

Kept you waiting, huh?

NX-series warships (plus a potential grab-bag of extras) drop on the SCE no later than 6/18/16 (if not sooner).

 

 

I've still got much more in store, but that's still under wraps- for now.

[ScriptKitt3h]

Now that there's a functional version of hyperedit for 1.1.2, I've also gotten to take out two of my newer ships on test flights.

Top one's the NX-19 over Duna, bottom's a hangar shot from the SC-112 Jormungand super-carrier's hangar bay with the doors open above Minmus.

EDIT: Also, fun fact: my ASM Evo missiles can be fired as ICBMs/ABMs from Duna's surface, making them all the more versatile.

Edited June 14, 2016 by ScriptKitt3h

[panzer1b]

4 hours ago, ScriptKitt3h said:

I dont even want to know the part count on that thing...

Anyways, as for ships, im taking a break from armor development for a while and making some purely for fun junk (as it can get a tad annoying after a few weeks of non stop armor testing and design that is when im even playing videogames in the 1st place)...

Latest one is this, anyone know what its modeled after?

[ScriptKitt3h]

46 minutes ago, panzer1b said:

I dont even want to know the part count on that thing...

Matter of fact, it's a tad bit over 1400 or so parts with a full fuel load, though minus any sub-craft docked in the hangar. However, it also weighs in a 775 tons, meaning the massive LF/O engines in the rear are a necessity for keeping it moving.

[Spartwo]

So mass accelerators work again...