[1.0] Enhanced Navball 1.3

[Haze-Zero]

Perhaps its just me, but did anyone else upon install of this mod, seem to have all the positions of their planted flags (or perhaps landed vessels?) shifted like 3km away from where they were originally? It might just be some weird glitch on my end.

[ZodiusInfuser]

This mod is great! One suggestion, would it be possible to add ghosting to the velocity and target vector when in Target mode? I don't think it does this already.

[pa1983]

Im not much for mods but I do like mods that add necessary information and UI functions that the game should have stock. Great mod will give it a go later.

[kitoban]

This mod is great! One suggestion, would it be possible to add ghosting to the velocity and target vector when in Target mode? I don't think it does this already.

It's something I was looking into, certainly possible but I am taking a cautious approach to make sure I only add what is necessary to assist and not overload for information. But I think you are right it is required for rendezvousing although might not be necessary for the actual docking procedure.

[ZodiusInfuser]

It's something I was looking into, certainly possible but I am taking a cautious approach to make sure I only add what is necessary to assist and not overload for information. But I think you are right it is required for rendezvousing although might not be necessary for the actual docking procedure.

That's understandable, I like the unintrusive approach the current system has. And yes, I was mainly thinking to assist with rendezvousing as there's other great mods that help with docking. Perhaps just ghosting the target vector would be sufficient. I'm sure it will be great whatever you decide

[Superfluous J]

I just had a flash. If you're targeting a docking port, add an alignment indicator so you know exactly where to face. If you're facing that way and the yellow prograde circle is there too, you know you're golden.

I know the Docking Alignment Indicator does this already. I'm thinking of being able to not use it, and instead have all the data I need where it belongs: on the navball.

[Zeroignite]

I just had a flash. If you're targeting a docking port, add an alignment indicator so you know exactly where to face. If you're facing that way and the yellow prograde circle is there too, you know you're golden.

I know the Docking Alignment Indicator does this already. I'm thinking of being able to not use it, and instead have all the data I need where it belongs: on the navball.

That's the pink "target" indicator.

[kitoban]

That's understandable, I like the unintrusive approach the current system has. And yes, I was mainly thinking to assist with rendezvousing as there's other great mods that help with docking. Perhaps just ghosting the target vector would be sufficient. I'm sure it will be great whatever you decide

Thanks for the vote of confidence

I just had a flash. If you're targeting a docking port, add an alignment indicator so you know exactly where to face. If you're facing that way and the yellow prograde circle is there too, you know you're golden.

I know the Docking Alignment Indicator does this already. I'm thinking of being able to not use it, and instead have all the data I need where it belongs: on the navball.

I have been in contact with NavyFish with regards to this, not sure on exactly the best way to represent this as the Navball is a 3D object whereas NavyFish's Docking alignment is a 2D plane so not sure on the final exactly how this might work yet. If/When (probably when) this is in credit would be needed for NavyFish as the docking alignment indicator is a fantastic piece of work that I have yet to try and get my head round the maths behind it.

The Pink indicator only current is if your pointing at the other docking port, not if you are aligned to it, I've also noticed it can sometimes be offset due to it not taking off center docking ports into consideration.

Perhaps its just me, but did anyone else upon install of this mod, seem to have all the positions of their planted flags (or perhaps landed vessels?) shifted like 3km away from where they were originally? It might just be some weird glitch on my end.

The mod does not do anything in a actual scene, as the gameobject for the icons are on the same layer as the rest of the UI so shouldn't be having any effects. Only thing I've seen move craft about is if they are spawned above ground with landed tag, they Snap-to the ground so not sure why they would shift 3km sideways.

Edited October 2, 2013 by kitoban
Answering Haze's glitch reporting

[Cirdan]

Would it be possible for two markers to represent alignment? One that points to the target docking port and one at a fixed point relative to the craft (the docking port on your ship). Alignment occurring when one node is exactly over the other. Would that work or is there some factor I'm forgetting?

[xZise]

[…]I have been in contact with NavyFish with regards to this, not sure on exactly the best way to represent this as the Navball is a 3D object whereas NavyFish's Docking alignment is a 2D plane so not sure on the final exactly how this might work yet. If/When (probably when) this is in credit would be needed for NavyFish as the docking alignment indicator is a fantastic piece of work that I have yet to try and get my head round the maths behind it.[…]

Now I don't want to diminish how complicated it is to develop this, but isn't showing the correct alignment easy? Instead of showing your offset (like the DPAI does) you add a marker which you need to “hit†to be aligned. For example two crafts in equatorial orbits and the targeted docking port is facing south you add a marker on the navball at the normal vector* facing north. I don't know how to do this exactly, but when you know the direction the targeted docking port is facing add the marker on the navball where vector inverted does point.

The more complex thing would be to show the lateral offset/movement, if that's it what are you talking about. And I personally think that can't be integrated into the navball as it is.

And I haven't tested it yet, but it looks awesome. Especially the retro-maneuver node would be sometimes handy, when you placed the command pod the wrong way.

Fabian

*: Of course it is not always the normal vector.

Edited October 4, 2013 by xZise

[m4v]

Now I don't want to diminish how complicated it is to develop this, but isn't showing the correct alignment easy?

maybe you should try doing it yourself if you think is easy, the code is GPL'ed.

[xZise]

maybe you should try doing it yourself if you think is easy, the code is GPL'ed.

Actually I would love to, but I have basically no knowledge in C# or the KSP API. My computer is also not set up to develop plugins for KSP. But I did a quick look in the source codes of both plugins and it might work, but I want to test it first. So maybe I set up all that to test it.

[kitoban]

The actual translation onto the navball is a simple process, is more the maths behind the orientation, which as you say "should" be relatively straightforward, maths has never been one of my strong points.

Looking at how mechjeb is achieving this for guiding the position of the ship it does not look too tricky to achieve this, as a developer IRL don't like to over promise things Am hoping to get time soon to work on these next few adjustments, just job hunting has taken priority.

[enki]

Have to thank you Kitoban, and thanks for stopping by my stream. Love the plugin and all of the work you put into it.

[kitoban]

Glad you enjoy it enki, can definitely recommend your twitch stream as a good stream to work while watching, I got most of the 1.2 update done over a couple of your streams.

[xZise]

The actual translation onto the navball is a simple process, is more the maths behind the orientation, which as you say "should" be relatively straightforward, maths has never been one of my strong points.

Looking at how mechjeb is achieving this for guiding the position of the ship it does not look too tricky to achieve this, as a developer IRL don't like to over promise things Am hoping to get time soon to work on these next few adjustments, just job hunting has taken priority.

As I said I don't want to diminish your great work. Especially the ghosting is useful (although I would have used little arrows at the edge of the navball, so you could show more than two markers without blocking the view on the navball).

And although I like the DPAI quite a lot it would be nice if you only need one instrument, so I'm really looking forward to see docking instrumentation.

Fabian

[kitoban]

Testing on this against KSP 0.22 looks to be fine.

[MK3424]

my game somehow was going crazy and i got this navball by result:

I somehow liked the look and i wonder if it will be used and also the borders used for target docking rotation.

[kitoban]

my game somehow was going crazy and i got this navball by result

It looks like the Z position on the speed reference got changed. All the elements of the navball UI are actually in a row along the Z axis, which you view from a dedicated camera.

Is interesting that that element got moved. The currentlt code doesn't interact with these elements, but your right it might make it clearer on docking approach to his elements you don't need, i.e. heading, although you do still need the speed represented in some way.

[evilC]

Could you please add the ability to ghost prograde and retrograde by 90 degrees?

If you are piloting a craft in VTOL mode (-v- on navball is forwards, but VTOL engines are pointing downwards, where the v is pointing) then something like this would totally make it flyable.

As it is, the KCA mod is great, but overly difficult to land.

[boberts314]

I'm no longer certain how I ever survived without this.

[kitoban]

Could you please add the ability to ghost prograde and retrograde by 90 degrees?

If you are piloting a craft in VTOL mode (-v- on navball is forwards, but VTOL engines are pointing downwards, where the v is pointing) then something like this would totally make it flyable.

As it is, the KCA mod is great, but overly difficult to land.

Think I follow what you are asking here, but would it not be simpler to mount a probe body orientated in the direction you want to see on the navball and use "control from here"?

[evilC]

Yes, but it ruins the immersion and means you have to have a silly bit sticking out of your ship, plus in career mode, all you have are pods etc.

I would imagine it would be a trivial change, the only real issue I suppose is that you have no GUI to configure stuff. A setting in an INI file would be fine, hell I can even compile myself if you tell me what bit of code to edit.

I can maybe help you out if UI and saving of settings are not things you know how to do, but it has been a while. Probably the best staring point there is Taranis Elsu's project here. That is based on a project of mine (which was based a project of his), so I should know how to implement a UI using that system, but the whole point of it was to let mod writers get on with writing the mod itself, and not working out how to hook into KSPs UI and settings and such, so you should be able to work it out...

[RoboRay]

Think I follow what you are asking here, but would it not be simpler to mount a probe body orientated in the direction you want to see on the navball and use "control from here"?

That doesn't work if you fly from the cockpit. As soon as you enter an IVA, that pod becomes the control reference.

A mod that could flip the Navball orientation between vertical and horizontal regardless of the pod orientation would be a great addition. Not just the markers, but also the horizon itself.

[kitoban]

evilC - Makes sense about avoiding the sticking out part, thanks for the reference material that stuff looks really useful, the code is available on github if you do want take a look at recompiling it, I imagine it is a simple matter of applying the calculation for the radial vectors onto the surface vectors in order to get the points. Afraid to say I've just not had any free time to do much more than keeping an eye out for issues.

RoboRay - yes I would imagine this would reset the reference point point on the craft, however you would lose the navigation marks on the IVA as the IVA navball does not link to the one in normal view.