parts [1.10.x] SDHI Service Module System (V4.0.4 / 11 October 2020)

[Guest]

Thank you, sumghai & team! Excellent work as always.

Edited June 11, 2015 by Jack Wolfe

[BPI_Bel]

Glad to see one of my favorite mods updated.

I noticed that CKAN isn't listing SDHI. Has that entry been updated?

[sumghai]

Glad to see one of my favorite mods updated.

I noticed that CKAN isn't listing SDHI. Has that entry been updated?

Not yet - I made a pull request to the CKAN folks yesterday, but it takes some time for them to review the metadata files needed for the update to be listed properly.

[Dermeister]

I have Real chutes installed is it normal I cant Change the settings for the Docking port/chute part from this mod?

[Capt. Hunt]

yeah, Sumghai set the chutes to not be editable in game

[Svm420]

yeah, Sumghai set the chutes to not be editable in game

Anyway to fix that?

[technerd89]

Thank you, sumghai & team! Excellent work as always.

http://i.imgur.com/5dPDXZ3.png

That's a very nice looking psuedo-ICPS. I recognize the KW tanks and parts, but how did you manage the 2.5 -> 1.25 adapter section with the mono tanks?

[Starwaster]

That's a very nice looking psuedo-ICPS. I recognize the KW tanks and parts, but how did you manage the 2.5 -> 1.25 adapter section with the mono tanks?

Could be wrong .... But KWR style procedural fairing?

[sumghai]

I have Real chutes installed is it normal I cant Change the settings for the Docking port/chute part from this mod?

yeah, Sumghai set the chutes to not be editable in game

Anyway to fix that?

As per the FAQ in the first post:

Q: Your parachute-equipped docking ports rely on RealChutes, yet they don't use the latest tweakables system. What gives?

A: The parachutes installed in the docking ports is a drogue-mains system carefully tuned for a safe and comfortable landing on Kerbin, for pad abort, in-flight abort and re-entry scenarios. Allowing them to tweakable would inadvertently permit users to accidentally mis-configure the parachutes and result in fatal landings.

Users are welcome to modify the parachute configs as they wish, but in doing so they will void their warranty and become ineligible for official help/support.

[Bomoo]

Been driving me nuts trying to figure out what causes that heatshield reentry vector offset. If you guys could maybe drop a hint in my direction, I'd greatly appreciate it. No offense, but I think I prefer it without the lifting body effect.

[Guest]

That's a very nice looking psuedo-ICPS. I recognize the KW tanks and parts, but how did you manage the 2.5 -> 1.25 adapter section with the mono tanks?

It's from the TurboNisu Reloaded mod. Works well and carries a fair amount of fuel.

[Starwaster]

It's from the TurboNisu Reloaded mod. Works well and carries a fair amount of fuel.

Link plz? I get only two results searching for it. This thread and Tantares ???

[cheech420now]

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/102041-0-90-TurboNisuReloaded-Stock-a-Like-Parts-Pack-5-12-14/members/200-caneb

[sumghai]

Just a heads-up guys - with the updated stock reentry heating system that dropped with 1.0.3/1.0.4, Deadly Reentry and SDHI SMS will also be updated to take advantage of it. More details to come.

[TimothyC]

I've installed the latest version on my 1.0.2 install, and I can't get the service module decoupler to work at all. Am I possibly missing something?

Edit: Never mind, I think I've forgotten animateddecouplers. I feel dumb now.

Edited July 1, 2015 by TimothyC

[Starwaster]

I've installed the latest version on my 1.0.2 install, and I can't get the service module decoupler to work at all. Am I possibly missing something?

You're missing the Animated Decouplers plugin. Link on first post

[Ricky_Jay]

Hey there, love these parts so much that I've included every piece except the fairings(I use procedural) in my very nit picky installation (there's only a handful of squads parts still installed to give you an idea of how ruthless I've been cutting away at the fat in my part list).

That being said I do have one problem, I know it's intentionally this way, but I don't like not being able to stage the decouples. I've got tweakable everything (with custom configs so it doesn't interfere with parts like the parachute docks) so I can make the part un-stageable by choice where I see fit. I'd prefer to have the choice. Also, with more recent KSP versions (I'm still using 1.0.2 for mods atm) the staging icon still appears, at launch when you get to the decoupler stage, a noise is made and the icon moves up into the next stage section, still not decoupling.

I've tried changing "staged = false" in ModuleAnimatedDecoupler to true, but when I go to launch the parts after this change, they decouple as soon as physics loads at the launch site... If someone could point me to where exactly this behavior is programmed into SDHI so I can tweak it I would be mighty appreciative XD

Again, if the mod author sees this post, thumbs up for the awesome mod, but consider what I've said about the way decouplers are now handled (I believe the stage icon wouldn't appear on old versions of KSP and decoupling was only available through right click and actions).

[sumghai]

Hey there, love these parts so much that I've included every piece except the fairings(I use procedural) in my very nit picky installation (there's only a handful of squads parts still installed to give you an idea of how ruthless I've been cutting away at the fat in my part list).

That being said I do have one problem, I know it's intentionally this way, but I don't like not being able to stage the decouples. I've got tweakable everything (with custom configs so it doesn't interfere with parts like the parachute docks) so I can make the part un-stageable by choice where I see fit. I'd prefer to have the choice. Also, with more recent KSP versions (I'm still using 1.0.2 for mods atm) the staging icon still appears, at launch when you get to the decoupler stage, a noise is made and the icon moves up into the next stage section, still not decoupling.

I've tried changing "staged = false" in ModuleAnimatedDecoupler to true, but when I go to launch the parts after this change, they decouple as soon as physics loads at the launch site... If someone could point me to where exactly this behavior is programmed into SDHI so I can tweak it I would be mighty appreciative XD

Again, if the mod author sees this post, thumbs up for the awesome mod, but consider what I've said about the way decouplers are now handled (I believe the stage icon wouldn't appear on old versions of KSP and decoupling was only available through right click and actions).

- I have no intention of making the Service Module-Heatshield decoupler be stageable, as the current system discourages staging via panicky spacebar-spamming.

- Tweakable Everything has never been compatible with SDHI SMS, and so I recommend you not use it.

[Ricky_Jay]

- I have no intention of making the Service Module-Heatshield decoupler be stageable, as the current system discourages staging via panicky spacebar-spamming.

- Tweakable Everything has never been compatible with SDHI SMS, and so I recommend you not use it.

Thanks for the reply. I understand your reasoning behind designing the decouples like that but atm the staging icon appears and makes a disappointing "hiss" sound when you hit space. It kinda feels broken with this behaviour. I believe in older versions of KSP the staging icon would not be there at all. That at least would feel better even if I don't have the choice.

I'm not asking for you to change the mood on my behalf, far from it. Just pointing out this incompatibility, as I know it's annoyed me and has confused other users posting here. It would be nice if you could point me to where this behavior is implemented though so I can customise my own version. I'm a games development student but I'm unfamiliar with the configs and my experiments have come to no avail...

As for the Tweakable everything mod I found out about the incompatibility myself when making the modded install. If it wasn't for not being abe to animate parts in the VAB (WHYS QUAD WHY CANT I OPEN MY DAM SOLAR PANELS IN THE VAB!!!!) I would of just deleted it, but I've got rid of the Tweakable Everything configs and wrote my own. So far everything seems fine but if the incompatibility stems from the Tweakable's DLLs then I guess I'll have to do a test flight every time I want to see what a craft design with animated parts really looks like :'(. (If it is just the configs, I could give you a CFG that will take of the offending modules after TweakableEverything has run if you'd like?)

[Starwaster]

Thanks for the reply. I understand your reasoning behind designing the decouples like that but atm the staging icon appears and makes a disappointing "hiss" sound when you hit space. It kinda feels broken with this behaviour. I believe in older versions of KSP the staging icon would not be there at all. That at least would feel better even if I don't have the choice.

The hiss sound happens anytime you stage even if there are no parts to be staged, even if you make a blank stage... so it's not really controllable in anyway by Sumghai...

And as far back as 0.24.2, I can confirm that the stock decoupler has inserted a staging icon regardless of whether the decoupler was capable of being staged or not. However, the decoupler that SDHI uses for the service module is an extension of the stock decoupler so it's probable that I could override that behavior if Sumghai agrees that that would be desirable. I think that requires some thought though to guard against unforeseen consequences.

Now, as far as the problem you described with setting staged = true, that sounds like something that would happen if you tested with an already staged part on the launch pad. (that is, you tried staging an SDHI service module, couldn't, exited game and set staged = true, then loaded game back up and went right back to that ship. THAT would definitely cause the part to decouple as soon as it loads in)

[sumghai]

I'm of two minds on whether to keep that staging icon:

- On one hand, I want people to clearly know that the Service Module has its own decoupler, so that people don't go hunting for another one (I recall at least one PEBKAC case where someone put a DRE UP decoupler between the Service Module and the Heatshield, and then wondered why the pod no longer sit snuggly in the Service Module recess)

- On the other hand, it is confusing that the staging icon suggests it is stageable, when in fact, it is not.

I'm sure someone here would insist that the simple solution is "Just make it stageable!", but I feel the current system is a good way of mistake-proofing unintended decouplings.

[Guest]

I'm of two minds on whether to keep that staging icon:

- On one hand, I want people to clearly know that the Service Module has its own decoupler, so that people don't go hunting for another one (I recall at least one PEBKAC case where someone put a DRE UP decoupler between the Service Module and the Heatshield, and then wondered why the pod no longer sit snuggly in the Service Module recess)

- On the other hand, it is confusing that the staging icon suggests it is stageable, when in fact, it is not.

I'm sure someone here would insist that the simple solution is "Just make it stageable!", but I feel the current system is a good way of mistake-proofing unintended decouplings.

Evidently no one makes checklists anymore, mental or paper. Nor are they bothering to learn how parts work and interact. I'm perfectly happy with the way you have things configured because it makes the most sense. Yes, this is a game. A complicated one. Making a checklist isn't ridiculously hard, it just requires a bit of thought.

[softweir]

I'm sure someone here would insist that the simple solution is "Just make it stageable!", but I feel the current system is a good way of mistake-proofing unintended decouplings.

My personal take on this: I feel that you can only go so far in protecting people from absent-mindedness and panic. ALL staging events are prone to error and disaster, whether they are SRBs jettisoned too soon (BOOM!) or parachutes opened too soon (FLOP!) or the player attempting to light an upper stage before the lower stage has shut down. (CRUNCH!) There is no mistake-proofing in the rest of the game. It's one of the things that KSP teaches us all the time: don't make mistakes.

Of course in real life each and every damn staging event would have multiple safeguards up to and including safety-covers and sanity-checking by software. That makes real-world flying a lot safer, but more fiddly. A serious flight sim might attempt to duplicate this in order to help teach pilots how to use the real-world safety features, but that is not the KSP style - people aren't protected from life-threatening mistakes, because no player has ever died as the result of a silly mistake. Instead, it teaches them what the silly mistakes are.

Can I suggest that you opt for the Least Surprising option, which is that the Service module is stageable. If anybody really finds they are jettisoning the SM by accident they can use the Stage Lock feature, or even rebind the staging event to a harder-to-access key combination.

BTW, I can't remember when I last thanked you for all the work you do creating your mods. THANK YOU!

Edited July 12, 2015 by softweir
Typo

[sumghai]

V3.0.1 released - see first post for download link

3.0.1 - 10 July 2015
---------------------------

Changes / Fixes:
 - Compatibility Patch for KSP 1.0.4
 - Heat shield is now compatible with 1.0.4's updated thermal system
    - Deadly Reentry support has also been updated accordingly, and the corresponding patch is now compatible with DRE 7.2.x
 - Fallback patch for stock parachute behaviour has been updated
    - Deployment altitude increased to 1000m
    - Minimum air pressure required to open reduced to 0.04 kPa
    - Both values are comparable to stock parachute part performance
    - Note: RealChute is still the recommended default

Bugs/Known Issues
 - Mk 1-2 Pod Umbilical Port is now also toggleable outside of the VAB/SPH editor scenes
    - This is due to a limitation with the current stock KSP ModuleAnimateGeneric behaviour, but is not game-breaking.
 - Part testing contracts are generated in Career Mode
    - This not intended behaviour, since the SDHI SMS is intended to be  tested as a complete assembled stack rather than in piecemeal
    - A future update might include a proper contract for testing the SDHI SMS

Another huge thanks to Starwaster, for updating the heat shield configs for compatibility to KSP 1.0.4 and DRE V7.2.0

[Bomoo]

Can I suggest that you opt for the Least Surprising option, which is that the Service module is stageable. If anybody really finds they are jettisoning the SM by accident then can use the Stage Lock feature, or even rebind the staging event to a harder-to-access key combination.

BTW, I can't remember when I last thanked you for all the work you do creating your mods. THANK YOU!

I'm curious: in what situation would you ever need to stage the service module that makes right clicking it and selecting Decouple, or hitting the abort button, massively inconvenient?

Anyway, I believe Tweakable Everything exposes the "Staging enable/disable" tweakable toggle on stock parts with staging. Maybe that functionality could be worked into the SM decoupler? I, for one, appreciate it not being staged normally, but if you absolutely MUST stage it with spacebar, that could be an option. Still, I fail to see why.

Edited July 12, 2015 by Bomoo