[1.2] L-Tech Scientific Industries V4.2

[rottielover]

So what's the plan for the cameras with the new way science works?

Since science is now limited in other means by the fact that experiments are a 'use once' thing, I think a way to balance the camera would be to simply allow many, many pictures to be taken, but each one has rather low scientific value. One picture, after all, from the surface of Mars is cool, but doesn't really tell us much. Effectively the camera would be balanced by extremely high data size and transmission efficiency, but somewhat low scientific value, except it can be repeated.

I like this, but I also like the idea that if you capture something significant in the photo it should be worth a lot. I'm not sure how you would implement that (could be as "simple" as asking the SCANsat guy how he did his code to detect anomoly's, or maybe even putting the the coordinates of known ones like if you are within X number of meters).

But it seems that if one were to capture an image of magic Boulder or a monolith, that should be worth a lot.

Just some random thoughts.

Here is an experiment idea but you may need to talk to flex racks guy. In flex racks there is a pic of his tubes (looks like those tubes you take blood samples in). Anyway, it would be cool to run a chemical analysis on a surface sample. Collect sample, place sample into the tubes part, sample is destroyed but could give bonus science depending on where you are?

Sorry about rambling.

[ludsoe]

I like this, but I also like the idea that if you capture something significant in the photo it should be worth a lot. I'm not sure how you would implement that (could be as "simple" as asking the SCANsat guy how he did his code to detect anomoly's, or maybe even putting the the coordinates of known ones like if you are within X number of meters).

But it seems that if one were to capture an image of magic Boulder or a monolith, that should be worth a lot.

Just some random thoughts.

Here is an experiment idea but you may need to talk to flex racks guy. In flex racks there is a pic of his tubes (looks like those tubes you take blood samples in). Anyway, it would be cool to run a chemical analysis on a surface sample. Collect sample, place sample into the tubes part, sample is destroyed but could give bonus science depending on where you are?

Sorry about rambling.

Ill look into processing surface samples maybe. As for the detecting whats in the view of the camera is easy. I just need to find nearby objects of importance and possibly distant ones (Planets) And do some angle math to check if they are in focus of the camera, Along with some ray-tracing and it should work flawlessly. I just need to find the code functions That return anomaly's and planets. (Maybe a kind soul can give me a pointer or two the right direction.)

[blipadouzi]

I just downloaded this mod today and I'm loving it.

I've been reading some of last discussions in the thread and it got me thinking.

How about converting the IC Camera into a HD Camera, thus making a new science line "HR pictures".

You could do something similar with the radios where one detects low frequencies (ULF, VLF, SLF), and the other detects high frequencies (UHF, VHF, SHF)

Edited December 21, 2013 by blipadouzi

[Sandworm]

I suggest two cameras, paralleling realworld tech and leveraging .23s new science limitations.

(1) A film camera. Zero transmission capability. Film/camera must be recovered to yield any science.

(2) A digital camera. 100% transmission. No point in returning anything as all digital images can be transmitted.

As to what is in the image, I wouldn't bother. Realworld images of distant bodies almost always yield new data even if not realized at the time. So the high/low/landed structure could remain the same.

[IdiotSavant]

I'd love to see a weather station experiment (wind speed, humidity, precipitation), which would give science on bodies with atmosphere. Obviously there's some overlap with the existing barometer / thermometer.

And you can just tweak the cameras and other experiments by adding "rerunnable = True" to their ModuleScienceExperiment block.

[ludsoe]

V1.7 **Warning this is incompatible with older versions. Remove the Skylab and its experiments from your ships before updating.

-Made it so you can change the camera resolution while in game.

-Changed the Skylab experiments to all share a part.

-Made Skylab experiments require resources. **Subject to change based on opinion.

-Increased the Skylab experiment research values, and fixed one of the flavor texts.

-Changed the Skylab to use the fancy new lab.

I suggest two cameras, paralleling realworld tech and leveraging .23s new science limitations.

(1) A film camera. Zero transmission capability. Film/camera must be recovered to yield any science.

(2) A digital camera. 100% transmission. No point in returning anything as all digital images can be transmitted.

This is a interesting concept. I might change one of the cameras to be film based.

I'd love to see a weather station experiment (wind speed, humidity, precipitation), which would give science on bodies with atmosphere. Obviously there's some overlap with the existing barometer / thermometer.

And you can just tweak the cameras and other experiments by adding "rerunnable = True" to their ModuleScienceExperiment block.

Well i might be able to implement a weather station, if i can get some flavor text that makes it interesting.

Edit: I think i need to update my pictures, I should do that later....

Edited December 23, 2013 by ludsoe
Stuff

[DasBananenbrot]

Does someone know if anyone already made a IVA for the Lab?

[Vahal]

Well, the weather station would be redundant with atmospheric sensor on Sensor Array Computing Nose Cone don't you think? The nice way would be to make atmospheric sensor, barometer and thermometer in a single science module, a weather station. The main advantage of weather station would be to have an atmospheric sensor that is rerunable cause usally weather station are autonomous module delivering datas continuously.

[CattyNebulart]

Its semi Biome aware, i can only support the biomes that the devs added so far. Which are only on kerbin and the Mun, Each has its own flavored text. Other planets/moons have Orbital,Landed texts too. Also good ideas ill look into them.

If you could detect latitude and longitude it would be nice if say the picture gave science when landed near an anomaly. Probably easier than determining what is in the picture.

[ludsoe]

V1.8 **The camera update!

Thanks to Rubber Ducky for making this update happen.

-Changed the cameras to use a new system that gives science out based on whats in the picture.

*This effects the RL picture setting so you can get science while also taking real pictures, or you can just get the science you would get otherwise.

*Currently gives science out for pictures taken of different locations, and anomalies.

-Added a .txt file in the Mod folder with the version as its name.

This is a beta update for the new camera system. I want you guys to reply any bugs, ideas, feedback.

Also the flavor text is a bit bland right now, as I couldn't think of anything for the anomalies.

Well, the weather station would be redundant with atmospheric sensor on Sensor Array Computing Nose Cone don't you think? The nice way would be to make atmospheric sensor, barometer and thermometer in a single science module, a weather station. The main advantage of weather station would be to have an atmospheric sensor that is rerunable cause usally weather station are autonomous module delivering datas continuously.

Would said weather station have a higher transmission rate? So its actually useful compared to having multiple lighter sensors for each?

[biohazard15]

This is a interesting concept. I might change one of the cameras to be film based.

There is a Spy Camera mod on Spaceport: http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/spy-camera/. It functions like Keyhole cameras - you have a camera and a data capsule to store film. The capsule can be then jettisoned and returned to Kerbin for recovery.

[SirAtomBrysicle]

I downloaded the mod and have been trying it out. Here are my comments and questions...

1. Studying Model Rockets gave me a 200% transmit bonus. Is this intentional?

2. Couldn't study MicroGravity... Not enough clipboards?

Otherwise I am very interested in this mod and really enjoy how it expands on the experiments we can do for science! I am looking forward to more original models, especially an original Lab! Any more info on the use and mechanics of the mod would be appreciated. Thanks!

EDIT:

Ty to JeffreyCor for fast response!! ^^ Got my MicroGravity experiments up and running.

Possible bug...

Study of Model Rockets did not consume Insight or a Model Rocket. I am even able to send the lab with no model rockets or gathered Insight and still do that experiment.

Edited December 28, 2013 by SirAtomBrysicle

[JeffreyCor]

Fill the supply module with clipboards and dock it with the station, this will give you a supply of clipboards to be able to do microgravity experiments. I don't know of any other way to get more up there.

[ludsoe]

V1.9 **This may break saves with the supply container on ships! (Sorry bout this, There was a really bad bug I had to fix.)

-Changed one of the cameras to use film when taking pictures. (This only limits your ability to generate science from pictures.)

-Fixed a bug related to the sky-lab changing size after reloading. I have no clue why this happens, but this temp fix should hold till I get new custom models.

-Fixed a bug where the model rockets experiment didn't take resources.

-Nerfed the total science pool you get from the lab experiments. (If your short on science just send it to the mun or something.)

-Changed the lab experiments only to have 100% transmission rate.

-Some other things I think.

I downloaded the mod and have been trying it out. Here are my comments and questions...

1. Studying Model Rockets gave me a 200% transmit bonus. Is this intentional?

2. Couldn't study MicroGravity... Not enough clipboards?

Otherwise I am very interested in this mod and really enjoy how it expands on the experiments we can do for science! I am looking forward to more original models, especially an original Lab! Any more info on the use and mechanics of the mod would be appreciated. Thanks!

EDIT:

Ty to JeffreyCor for fast response!! ^^ Got my MicroGravity experiments up and running.

Possible bug...

Study of Model Rockets did not consume Insight or a Model Rocket. I am even able to send the lab with no model rockets or gathered Insight and still do that experiment.

I fixed that bug. Hopefully things should be a lot smoother on everybody's end now that I got all the new features wrangled. Now I can look into making it look/feel nicer and maybe add a few more experiments. As for info, Ill try to be better at that when I redo the OP for v2.0. I'm not the best at communicating info.

[TheGamingNoobster]

Lovely mod! Great to see that you, ludsoe,the mod creator, are so active on the forum for this! Could the radio wave detector possibly detect radio waves that may show sign of life when near other space ships, in deep space or laythe? Could you also create a laser powered soil scanner (practically getting surface samples for probes and they can be taken while flying in non-atmosphereic planets/moons? Another suggestion is a life scanner? That would probably use a surface sample and scan chemicals in the ground and detect possibly alien life. Another thing that would be lovely if added would be a radio telescope that has to be used in non-atmospheric environment. It will probably collect radio pollution from kerbin in but it could be used to detect stars etc. Thanks for reading the ramble!

[SirAtomBrysicle]

Wow! Well played Thanks for the fast response time. Your dedication to improving this mod is greatly appreciated. All the best!

[kiwiak]

I wonder if it woudl be possible to watch captured pictures in-game.

[rottielover]

Just my humble opinion, with scoop-O-matic and the other one (sorry don't remeber the name), I think you can safely avoid the "collect surface sample" thing, unless you want to make it way more interesting somehow.

The camera thing, simply awesome, excellent job sir!

[kiwiak]

Will we get some GUI for camera, like in Tasier space telescope?

[DasBananenbrot]

Really like that mod, but the RL picture feature apparently increases RAM usage momentarily. I am using a lot of mods so I am close to the edge and whenever I take a RL picture with the camera part my game crashes due to memory overload. Well , will continue to use it for extra science though

[UAL002]

Really like that mod, but the RL picture feature apparently increases RAM usage momentarily. I am using a lot of mods so I am close to the edge and whenever I take a RL picture with the camera part my game crashes due to memory overload. Well , will continue to use it for extra science though

Yea, I haven't been crashing, but I've had this wierd bug where i get zoomed out real far and the camera gets "wobbly" I think it takes the picture though. The folder has got some pics in it. But I cant seem to find the feature that knows what Im looking at for science. When I do "snap picture" i still get the "above biome" science.

[SirAtomBrysicle]

Alright, I hope I don't annoy you but I have a few more bugs/quirks to give you a heads up on...

-Insight and model rocket/clipboard consumed upon clicking "Study..." button, and remains consumed even if cancelled or reset. (Kind of a pain when trying to "preview" the scientific results of an experiment. I know not realistic to see the results of the experiment without actually committing resources but it's helpful and it's just the way everything else is so I feel it should maybe be adjusted accordingly. I don't like losing resources on experiments I have already done but did again to check if I had done the experiment in that biome. )

-At one point it felt like the MicroGravity and Model Rocket experiments overlapped (I only did MicroGravity, and when I went to do Model Rockets it asked if I wanted to reset the experiment or cancel, as if I already had done that experiment but I hadn't. )

This only happened on my first flight with the supply lab on the new update and I wasn't able to recreate it since so maybe don't worry too much about this one.

*Edit* I was able to recreate it. It all works fine if you transmit the data from the initial experiment, but you can't "keep data" for both experiments. If MicroGravity is kept, doing Model Rockets will overwrite that experiment. ( Once again not a huge deal since transmit value is 100% so there isn't much point in storing them. Merely just so people aren't clicking keep and not realizing that one is actually lost. It is my habit to keep all my experiments and transmit in bulk so it bit me )

Otherwise keep up the fantastic work and I hope my input has been somewhat helpful!

[ludsoe]

Will we get some GUI for camera, like in Tasier space telescope?

I haven't looked into it yet, But i do plan to have a preview Gui later down the line. Along with some more info on it.

Really like that mod, but the RL picture feature apparently increases RAM usage momentarily. I am using a lot of mods so I am close to the edge and whenever I take a RL picture with the camera part my game crashes due to memory overload. Well , will continue to use it for extra science though

The snap picture option is just a easy way to get science without taking a actual photo and saving it to your hard drive. Are you using a higher resolution then 1? Higher resolution's can chew up ram and in some-case's crash the game.

Yea, I haven't been crashing, but I've had this wierd bug where i get zoomed out real far and the camera gets "wobbly" I think it takes the picture though. The folder has got some pics in it. But I cant seem to find the feature that knows what Im looking at for science. When I do "snap picture" i still get the "above biome" science.

I'm not sure about the wobbly camera issue, But the getting zoomed out part sounds like a map to ship view transition, Does it happen while switching ships or after taking a picture?

The feature that knows what your looking at only takes anomalies in to account. Feel free to suggest anything else I should look for.

Alright, I hope I don't annoy you but I have a few more bugs/quirks to give you a heads up on...

-Insight and model rocket/clipboard consumed upon clicking "Study..." button, and remains consumed even if cancelled or reset. (Kind of a pain when trying to "preview" the scientific results of an experiment. I know not realistic to see the results of the experiment without actually committing resources but it's helpful and it's just the way everything else is so I feel it should maybe be adjusted accordingly. I don't like losing resources on experiments I have already done but did again to check if I had done the experiment in that biome. )

-At one point it felt like the MicroGravity and Model Rocket experiments overlapped (I only did MicroGravity, and when I went to do Model Rockets it asked if I wanted to reset the experiment or cancel, as if I already had done that experiment but I hadn't. )

This only happened on my first flight with the supply lab on the new update and I wasn't able to recreate it since so maybe don't worry too much about this one.

*Edit* I was able to recreate it. It all works fine if you transmit the data from the initial experiment, but you can't "keep data" for both experiments. If MicroGravity is kept, doing Model Rockets will overwrite that experiment. ( Once again not a huge deal since transmit value is 100% so there isn't much point in storing them. Merely just so people aren't clicking keep and not realizing that one is actually lost. It is my habit to keep all my experiments and transmit in bulk so it bit me )

Otherwise keep up the fantastic work and I hope my input has been somewhat helpful!

The overlapping is small oversight in the code when I decided to merge the science modules into a custom one, I can look around for a fix if its a big enough deal.

As for the resources being used without getting the science, I guess I can fix that.

Also I love getting peoples input on the mod. Shows me people care enough to tell me something is broke or could be touched up.

[Wren]

Looks interesting indeed.

Will download when I get home from work.

Will I have to start a new career mode or will the parts just show up in the stuff I've already unlocked?

[ludsoe]

Looks interesting indeed.

Will download when I get home from work.

Will I have to start a new career mode or will the parts just show up in the stuff I've already unlocked?

You don't have to start a new save, you just have to unlock the parts in the RD building if you already unlocked their node.