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[1.2] Real Solar System v12.0 Dec 8

NathanKell

By NathanKell
in KSP1 Mod Releases

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Starwaster

Starwaster

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Posted
All I can think is that your parachute is about to explode. I'll be honest, I do see heating effects on ascent with two-stage rockets, but normally those don't have any solids involved.

Amazingly nothing exploded. It didn't make orbit either, it's not really built for that though. This is just my 'what new and creative ways can I get Jebediah killed this time?'

He didn't die though so on the next launch I just launched straight up. Nice fiery effects on that one but still nothing exploded.

Jeb died of excessive G-forces though, which maxed out at 39.1 Gs. (I modified the DR code a bit to allow smaller parts to survive high G-Forces so the capsule was ok)

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dlrk

dlrk

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Posted

Okay, thanks to your help, as well as trial and error, I believe I've figured out my problem. If I keep the TWR under 2 using throttle, and use forward joystick to stop the pitch up, the rocket doesn't explode. So, now I just need to work out the profile/circularization

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sephirotic

sephirotic

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diablos: when I get a sec I'll use asmi's ECLSS framework to add orbital decay. :)

sephirotic: That's weird. Coulda sworn I did set up Titanilaythe's atmosphere, but apparently not. Fixed for next. Note that you only need to specify *either* a body's mass or its surface gravity; RSS will calculate the other, based on radius.

Regarding LAN, meanAnomaly, and AoP: I was unable to find reference data for those, so I didn't configure them for moons; that seems to be because moons' orbits are perturbed sufficiently rapidly by their parent bodies that those values change over time. If you can find that data for moons (I'm using the J2000 epoch BTW) then you can configure them just like the planets' are: by adding the appropriate keys to the Orbit {} block.

Yeah i researched a little about Saturn moon's orbital parameters and they are kinda chaotic with no long-therm stable orbits so it figures.

About Laythe, i deducted as much that mass vs radius would give density and gravity and thus the mod will calculate by itself, but what intrigued me more was the lack of any atmospheric data for Titan. I fix'd it myself and added the following:

atmosphereScaleHeight = 40

maxAtmosphereAltitude = 450

atmosphereMultiplier = 1.4478

(FAR was showing 1.8 ATM when i touched down at Titan, [with hyperedit, obviously] witch was strange since i thought it should had maxed out at 1.44)

Also, Maxaltitude was just to have a cut off, Titan's atmosphere spams noticeable over 1000km i tought 450km was a good arbitrary value to cut it out without subtle decelerations.

I was very excited to try some propelers in Titan's with FAR mod. And this new question also came: Does FAR has compatibility with that famous props mod?

ANyway, I sill need to ACTUALLY get to titan in the first place. Without any mining mods a return trip would be impossible. For now i'm in the final stages of a less audacios mission to Europa. This is what i've already managed to assemble in-orbit with FAR + RSS + RMS:

c9kjrPw.jpg?1

Also, I've used Planet Factory's planets to create more complete replica of our solar system to anyone possibly interested:

Here is a quick pick on all the orbital and physical parameters needed for doing so and my personal choice of more similar bodies available:


 Sun
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 696342000
  Mass = 1.9891E+30
 }
 Moho
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 2439700
  rotationPeriod = 5067031.68
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 2.11
  Mass = 3.3022E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 57909100000
   eccentricity = 0.20563
   inclination = 7.005
   meanAnomaly = 174.796
   period = 7600530.24
   LAN = 48.331
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 29.124
  }
 }
 Eve
 {
  SSTScale = 0.99868058647931
  Radius = 6051800
  rotationPeriod = 20996798.4
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 177.36
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 15.9
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 220000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 5
  GeeASL = 0.905
  Mass = 4.8676E+24
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 108208000000
   eccentricity = 0.0067
   inclination = 3.39458
   meanAnomaly = 50.115
   period = 19414166.4
   LAN = 76.678
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 55.186
  }
 }
 Kerbin
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 6371000
  rotationPeriod = 86164.1
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 23.44
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 7.5
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 104000
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 149598261000
   eccentricity = 0.01671123
   inclination = 0
   meanAnomaly = 357.51716
   period = 31558149.7635456
   LAN = 348.73936
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 114.20783
  }
  SSFStart = 78000
  SSFEnd = 80000
  PQSfadeStart = 80000
  PQSfadeEnd = 100000
  PQSSecfadeStart = 80000
  PQSSecfadeEnd = 100000
  PQSdeactivateAltitude = 105000
  PQS
  {
	  Kerbin
	  {
		PQSMod_VertexSimplexHeightAbsolute // doubles
		{
			deformity = 1000 // 485
			persistence = 0.7 // 0.60000002384185791
			frequency = 36 //12 // 24
		}
		PQSMod_VertexHeightNoiseVertHeightCurve2 // floats
		{
			deformity = 6000 // 4000
			ridgedAddFrequency = 48 // 48
			ridgedSubFrequency = 32 // 32
			//ridgedAddOctaves = 8 // 6 INT
			simplexHeightStart = 400 // 800
			simplexHeightEnd = 7000 // 4600

		}
		PQSMod_VertexRidgedAltitudeCurve // floats
		{
			deformity = 1800 //1100 // 750
			ridgedAddFrequency = 140 // 25 // 140
			//ridgedAddOctaves = 8 // 3 INT
		}
		PQSMod_VertexHeightMap // doubles
		{
			heightMapDeformity = 7000 // 5000
		}
		PQSMod_AltitudeAlpha // doubles
		{
			atmosphereDepth = 6000 // 4000
		}
		PQSCity
		{
			KEYname = KSC
			repositionRadial = 158200.0, -220.0, -570000.0
			lodvisibleRangeMult = 6
		}
	  }
	  KerbinOcean
	  {
		PQSMod_AerialPerspectiveMaterial // floats
		{
			atmosphereDepth = 7500 // 5000, scale height in m
		}
	  }
	}
	//Export
	//{
		//resolution = 8192
		//maxHeight = 12000
		//oceanColor = 0.1255, 0.22353, 0.35683
	//}
 }
 Mun
 {
  SSTScale = 0.9832
  Radius = 1737100
  rotationPeriod = 2360584.68479999
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 1.5424
  GeeASL = 0.1654
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 384399000
   eccentricity = 0.0549
   inclination = 23.435 //5.145 to ecliptic; 23.435 avg to Earth's equator (+-5.145)
   period = 2360584.68479999
  }
  SSFStart = 170000
  SSFEnd = 175000
  PQSfadeStart = 170000
  PQSfadeEnd = 175000
  PQSdeactivateAltitude = 180000
  PQS
  {
	Mun
	{
		PQSMod_VertexHeightMap
		{
			heightMapDeformity = 9500 //7500
		}
		PQSMod_VertexSimplexHeight // doubles
		{
			deformity = 1200 // 400
			persistence = 0.7 //0.5
			frequency = 1 // 12
			//octaves = 10 // 8 // A DOUBLE
		}
		PQSMod_VertexHeightNoiseVertHeight // floats
		{
			deformity = 1200 // 400
			frequency = 12 // 12
			//octaves = 7 // 6 // INT
		}
		PQSMod_VoronoiCraters
		{
			KEYvoronoiSeed = 462
			deformation = 600 //200
			//voronoiFrequency = 100 //50
		}
	  }
	}
 }
 Duna
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 3396200
  rotationPeriod = 88642.6848
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 25.19
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 11.1
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 154000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 0.0069
  GeeASL = 0.379
  Mass = 6.4185E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 227939100000
   eccentricity = 0.093315
   inclination = 1.85
   meanAnomaly = 19.3564
   period = 59354294.4
   LAN = 49.562
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 286.537
  }
 }

// Phobos = Bop (largest mars's moon)
 Bop
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 11100
  tidallyLocked = true
  Mass = 10720000000000000
  GeeASL = 0.02
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 9377200
   eccentricity = 0.0151
   inclination = 26.04
   period = 27553.843872
   referenceBody = Duna
  }
 }
//Deimos = Gilly (smaller mars's moon, AKA: Marathon)
 Gilly
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 6200
  tidallyLocked = true
  Mass = 1480000000000000
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 23460000
   eccentricity = 0.0002
   inclination = 27.58
   period = 109074.816
   referenceBody = Duna
  }
 }

//4 Vesta = Inacessable

Inaccessable
 {
 SSTScale = 1
 Radius = 287000
 rotationPeriod = 19231
 tidallyLocked = false
 axialTilt = 3
 GeeASL = 0.025
 Mass = 1.305E+22
 Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 321820000000
   eccentricity = 0.08862
   inclination = 7.134
   meanAnomaly = 307.8
   period = 114553440
   LAN = 103.91
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 149.84
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
}

//Ceres =  Ascension
 Ascension
 {
 SSTScale = 1
 Radius = 487300
 rotationPeriod = 32667
 tidallyLocked = false
 axialTilt = 3
 Mass = 1.305E+22
 GeeASL = 0.028
 Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 413690604000
   eccentricity = 0.0791
   inclination = 10.857
   meanAnomaly = 113.410
   period = 145123488
   LAN = 25
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 70
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
 }

//Jupiter = jool
 Jool
 {
  SSTScale = 0.9999
  Radius = 69911000
  rotationPeriod = 35730
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 3.13
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 27
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 374000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 10
  Mass = 1.8986E+27
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 778547200000
   eccentricity = 0.048775
   inclination = 1.305
   meanAnomaly = 18.818
   period = 374335776
   LAN = 100.492
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 275.066
  }
 }

//pol = IO
 Pol
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1821300
  tidallyLocked = true
  Mass = 8.9319E+22
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 421800000
   eccentricity = 0.0041
   inclination = 2.21
   period = 152853.5047104
   referenceBody = Jool
  }
 }

//Eeloo = europa
 Eeloo
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1560800
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0.1
  Mass = 4.7998E+22
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 671100000
   eccentricity = 0.009
   inclination = 0.47
   period = 306822.0384
   referenceBody = Jool
  }
 }

//Ganymede = Tylo
 Tylo
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 2634100
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0.2
  Mass = 1.4819E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 1070400000
   eccentricity = 0.0013
   inclination = 0.2
   period = 618153.375744
   referenceBody = Jool
  }
 }

//Callisto = Ike
 Ike
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 2410300
  tidallyLocked = true
  Mass = 1.075938E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 1882700000
   eccentricity = 0.0074
   inclination = 0.192
   period = 1441931.18976
   referenceBody = Jool
  }
 }

//Saturn = Sentar (Will only load with Planet Factory nov7+)
Sentar
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 60268000
  rotationPeriod = 38052
  tidallyLocked = false
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 59.5
  Mass = 5.6846E+26
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 1433449370000
   eccentricity = 0.055723219
   inclination = 2.485
   meanAnomaly = 320.34675
   period = 929596608
   LAN = 113.642811
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 336.013862
   }
 }

//Mimas = Thud
Thud
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 202000
  rotationPeriod = 81389
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  GeeASL = 0.0648
  Mass = 1.080E+20
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 185520000
   eccentricity = 0.0196
   inclination = 1.574
   meanAnomaly = 90
   period = 81389
   LAN = 0
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 179
   referenceBody = Sentar
  }
 }


//Enceladus = Vall
Vall
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 252100
  rotationPeriod = 118386
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  GeeASL = 0.011
  Mass = 1.080E+20
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 237948000
   eccentricity = 0.004
   inclination = 0.019
   period = 118386
   LAN = 0
   referenceBody = Sentar
  }
 }

//Tethys = Dres  (mid sized Saturn Moon)
 Dres
 {
    SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1076000
  rotationPeriod = 163106
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  GeeASL = 0.0147
  Mass = 6.174E+20
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 294619000
   eccentricity = 0
   inclination = 1.12
   meanAnomaly = 43
   period = 163106
   LAN = 0
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 50
   referenceBody = Sentar
  }
 }

//Titan = Erin 
Erin
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 2576000
  tidallyLocked = true
  Mass = 1.3452E+23
  GeeASL = 0.14
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 40
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 450
  atmosphereMultiplier = 1.4478
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 1221870000
   eccentricity = 0.0288
   inclination = 0.34854
   period = 1377648
   referenceBody = Sentar
 }
}
//Iapetus = Skelton
 Skelton
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1492000
  rotationPeriod = 6853334.4
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 0.1
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 0.1
  atmosphereMultiplier = 0.1
  GeeASL = 0.023
  Mass = 1.8056E+21
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 3560820000
   eccentricity = 0.028612
   inclination = 15.47
   meanAnomaly = 90
   period = 6853334.4
   LAN = 0
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 179
   referenceBody = Sentar
  }
 }

//uranus = Ringle

Ringle
 {
   SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 25559000
  rotationPeriod = 62063.712
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 97.77
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 27.7
  GeeASL = 0.886
  Mass = 8.681E+25
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 2876679082000
   eccentricity = 0.04440558
   inclination = 0.772556
   meanAnomaly = 142.955717
   period = 2661041808
   LAN = 73.989821
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 96.541318
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
 }

//Puck = Pock (uranus 7th largest moon)

Pock
 {
  Radius = 83000
  rotationPeriod = 65822
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  GeeASL = 0.023
  Mass = 1.8056E+21
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 86004000
   eccentricity = 0.028612
   inclination = 0.31921
   meanAnomaly = 0
   period = 65822
   LAN = 0
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 0
   referenceBody = Ringle
  }
 }

//Titania = Ablate (largest Uranus moon)
Ablate
 {
  Radius = 788400
  rotationPeriod = 752218
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  GeeASL = 0.038
  Mass = 3.527E+21
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 435910000
   eccentricity = 0.001
   inclination = 0.340
   meanAnomaly = 0
   period = 752218
   LAN = 0
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 0
   referenceBody = Ringle
  }
}


//Neptune = laythe 
 Laythe
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 24764000
  rotationPeriod = 31751136
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 28.32
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 19.7
  GeeASL = 1.14g
  Mass = 1.0243+10E+26
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 4553946490000
   eccentricity = 0.011214269
   inclination = 1.767975
   meanAnomaly = 267.767281
   period = 5200418592
   LAN = 225
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 0
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
 }


//Minmus = Triton

 Minmus
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1353400
  rotationPeriod = 507773
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0.772556
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 30
  atmosphereMultiplier = 0.07
  GeeASL = 0.08 
  Mass = 2.14E+22
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 354759000
   eccentricity = 0
   inclination = 129.608
   meanAnomaly = 156.885
   period = 507773
   LAN = 73.989821
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 96.541318
   referenceBody = Laythe
  }
 }

//pluto = not much point without a nice replica of a bi-planetary system with charon

Anyway, thanks a lot for the reply

Edited by sephirotic
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NathanKell

NathanKell

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Posted

Here's what I ended up using, based on some googling: it tries to get the fallloff approximately right by messing with the exponent too. Just a holdover until we get a pressureCurve.

  atmosphereScaleHeight = 30
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 245000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 1.5
  staticPressureASL = 2

Note that max Atmosphere altitude is just for show; what actually cuts the atmosphere off is when (staticPressureASL * e) ^ (-alt_in_km / atmosphereScaleHeight) < 0.000001

Regarding orbital params: asmi pointed out I can just borrow the ones Orbiter uses for J2000 for the moons. So that'll be in the next release too.

Your config looks cool! I'm very leery of depending on PlanetFactory, though, given all its issues, but for those who have it, that's a cool config!

I believe FAR does support Firespitter, although there are some issues with combined wing/control surface parts. But check the FAR thread and post there, and I'm sure the kind folks who use them both will explain.

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metaphor

metaphor

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Posted

Is atmosphereMultiplier meant to simulate atmospheric pressure at sea level, or atmospheric density? They are pretty different for some planets because of different molecular compositions and temperatures. For example, Titan's atmospheric pressure is 1.5 times Earth's, but its atmospheric density is 4.5 times Earth's (at "sea level"). I'm not sure which one FAR and other mods use for calculations. Deceleration on re-entry seems like it should use density instead of pressure.

Other planets' atmospheric density as multiples of Earth's: Venus 55, Mars 0.016, Jupiter 0.13, Saturn 0.16, Titan 4.5, Uranus 0.34, Neptune 0.37 (gas giants at 1 atmosphere of pressure).

Also, what's SSTScale in the config file?

Very nice sephirotic, I had no idea you could use RSS's config file on Planet Factory planets.

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NathanKell

NathanKell

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Posted

Pressure. KSP just calculates density as a linear function of pressure. :(

So even if you check atmosphere density, you just get a multiple of pressure.

Ferram is about to add support for different-composition atmospheres, though, so we may not have to worry about density on this end, other than specifying per-body atmo compositions.

SSTScale is for scaling the models that show up in map view or when in orbit (the scaled space mesh; we're scaling the scaled space transform). Because I haven't regenerated them yet (although ZRM kindly told me about an easier way than I was planning) they don't match perfectly, so sometimes you have to scale them a bit differently than just (newRadius/oldRadius).

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metaphor

metaphor

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Posted

Does pressure actually enter directly into any equations or in-game effects in any way? If it's all based on density (as just a constant 1.225 times pressure) then we can just make atmosphereMultiplier based on density instead of pressure. Is there anything wrong with that?

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Starwaster

Starwaster

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Posted
Pressure. KSP just calculates density as a linear function of pressure. :(

So even if you check atmosphere density, you just get a multiple of pressure.

Ferram is about to add support for different-composition atmospheres, though, so we may not have to worry about density on this end, other than specifying per-body atmo compositions.

SSTScale is for scaling the models that show up in map view or when in orbit (the scaled space mesh; we're scaling the scaled space transform). Because I haven't regenerated them yet (although ZRM kindly told me about an easier way than I was planning) they don't match perfectly, so sometimes you have to scale them a bit differently than just (newRadius/oldRadius).

Is that why my ship kept 'crashing' when it was in a stable orbit around 'Pluto' when I exited to Space Center?

And why my favorite valley landing site mysteriously vanishes during final descent? Will I ever see it again?

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Sternface

Sternface

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Posted (edited)

I know you asked for some screens, so I took some of the probe + launcher I built for my mission to Jool with around tech-4 parts. Since I needed to put on a ton of solar panels, my payload came in at just under 22 tons. At tech-4, my most powerful motor was ~950kN. My second most powerful was ~450kN. :huh:

But I got her up in 3 stages :cool:

'

Javascript is disabled. View full album

P.S. Sorry it's a little dark. Fullscreen it to see details.

Edited by Sternface
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Sternface

Sternface

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Posted (edited)
It looks kind of ominous with all those panels... like some kind of... space kraken...

lol, right? That's my 'workaround' to my solar panel woes.

Speaking of ominous, check out this screen I took of my LGM-30 Minuteman III replica:

screenshot102_zps806e6620.png

screenshot198_zpseda408c4.png

I''ll have to remake it for RSS. I'll edit this out for a slideshow when I do :)

Edited by Sternface
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iVG

iVG

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Posted

With kerbal joint reinforcement - yes. Also add some of the heavy struts from KW rocketry. Connect top to the bottom tank directly, then add some struts between the decoupler and tanks as well. The interstages might look ugly but don't wobble if constructed correctly.

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Sparker

Sparker

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I really love this mod!

I have built a vostok-like R-7 rocket with 2.5 conic fuel tanks from KW rocketry and using kerosene+LOX fuel and I was surprised that the start mass of my rocket was 234 tons. The start mass of the original Vostok rocket is about 280 tons. I think it's quite accurate assuming that we start from the equator.

Is anyone planning to move the KSC off the equator? Is it even possible?

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metaphor

metaphor

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I used sephirotic's brilliant suggestion to include the Planet Factory planets, plus City Lights and Clouds and Universe Replacer:

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I used some slightly different settings:


REALSOLARSYSTEM
{
 // Note, bodies below MUST be in precedence order. Parents before children.
 // So Sun, then the planets, then the moons.
 Sun
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 696342000
  Mass = 1.9891E+30
 }

 // Mercury = Moho
 Moho
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 2439700
  rotationPeriod = 5067031.68
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 2.11
  Mass = 3.3022E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 57909100000
   eccentricity = 0.20563
   inclination = 7.005
   meanAnomaly = 174.796
   period = 7600530.24
   LAN = 48.331
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 29.124
  }
 }

 // Venus = Eve
 Eve
 {
  SSTScale = 0.99868058647931
  Radius = 6051800
  rotationPeriod = 20996798.4
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 177.36
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 15.9
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 220000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 55
  GeeASL = 0.905
  Mass = 4.8676E+24
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 108208000000
   eccentricity = 0.0067
   inclination = 3.39458
   meanAnomaly = 50.115
   period = 19414166.4
   LAN = 76.678
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 55.186
  }
 }

 // Earth = Kerbin
 Kerbin
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 6371000
  rotationPeriod = 86164.1
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 23.44
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 7.5
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 104000
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 149598261000
   eccentricity = 0.01671123
   inclination = 0
   meanAnomaly = 357.51716
   period = 31558149.7635456
   LAN = 348.73936
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 114.20783
  }
  SSFStart = 78000
  SSFEnd = 80000
  PQSfadeStart = 80000
  PQSfadeEnd = 100000
  PQSSecfadeStart = 80000
  PQSSecfadeEnd = 100000
  PQSdeactivateAltitude = 105000
  PQS
  {
	  Kerbin
	  {
		PQSMod_VertexSimplexHeightAbsolute // doubles
		{
			deformity = 1000 // 485
			persistence = 0.7 // 0.60000002384185791
			frequency = 36 //12 // 24
		}
		PQSMod_VertexHeightNoiseVertHeightCurve2 // floats
		{
			deformity = 6000 // 4000
			ridgedAddFrequency = 48 // 48
			ridgedSubFrequency = 32 // 32
			//ridgedAddOctaves = 8 // 6 INT
			simplexHeightStart = 400 // 800
			simplexHeightEnd = 7000 // 4600

		}
		PQSMod_VertexRidgedAltitudeCurve // floats
		{
			deformity = 1800 //1100 // 750
			ridgedAddFrequency = 140 // 25 // 140
			//ridgedAddOctaves = 8 // 3 INT
		}
		PQSMod_VertexHeightMap // doubles
		{
			heightMapDeformity = 7000 // 5000
		}
		PQSMod_AltitudeAlpha // doubles
		{
			atmosphereDepth = 6000 // 4000
		}
		PQSCity
		{
			KEYname = KSC
			repositionRadial = 158200.0, -220.0, -570000.0
			lodvisibleRangeMult = 6
		}
	  }
	  KerbinOcean
	  {
		PQSMod_AerialPerspectiveMaterial // floats
		{
			atmosphereDepth = 7500 // 5000, scale height in m
		}
	  }
	}
	//Export
	//{
		//resolution = 8192
		//maxHeight = 12000
		//oceanColor = 0.1255, 0.22353, 0.35683
	//}
 }

 // Moon = Mun
 Mun
 {
  SSTScale = 0.9832
  Radius = 1737100
  rotationPeriod = 2360584.68479999
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 1.5424
  GeeASL = 0.1654
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 384399000
   eccentricity = 0.0549
   inclination = 5.145 //5.145 to ecliptic; 23.435 avg to Earth's equator (+-5.145)
   period = 2360584.68479999
  }
  SSFStart = 170000
  SSFEnd = 175000
  PQSfadeStart = 170000
  PQSfadeEnd = 175000
  PQSdeactivateAltitude = 180000
  PQS
  {
	Mun
	{
		PQSMod_VertexHeightMap
		{
			heightMapDeformity = 9500 //7500
		}
		PQSMod_VertexSimplexHeight // doubles
		{
			deformity = 1200 // 400
			persistence = 0.7 //0.5
			frequency = 1 // 12
			//octaves = 10 // 8 // A DOUBLE
		}
		PQSMod_VertexHeightNoiseVertHeight // floats
		{
			deformity = 1200 // 400
			frequency = 12 // 12
			//octaves = 7 // 6 // INT
		}
		PQSMod_VoronoiCraters
		{
			KEYvoronoiSeed = 462
			deformation = 600 //200
			//voronoiFrequency = 100 //50
		}
	  }
	}
 }

 // Mars = Duna
 Duna
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 3396200
  rotationPeriod = 88642.6848
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 25.19
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 11.1
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 154000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 0.02
  GeeASL = 0.379
  Mass = 6.4185E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 227939100000
   eccentricity = 0.093315
   inclination = 1.85
   meanAnomaly = 19.3564
   period = 59354294.4
   LAN = 49.562
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 286.537
  }
 }

 // Phobos = Bop
 Bop
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 6100
  tidallyLocked = true
  Mass = 10720000000000000
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 9377200
   eccentricity = 0.0151
   inclination = 26.04
   period = 27553.843872
   LAN = 0
   referenceBody = Duna
  }
 }

 // Deimos = Gilly
 Gilly
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 4200
  rotationPeriod = 109074.816
  tidallyLocked = false
  Mass = 1480000000000000
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 23460000
   eccentricity = 0.0002
   inclination = 27.58
   period = 109074.816
   LAN = 0
   referenceBody = Duna
  }
 }

 // Vesta = Inaccessable
 Inaccessable
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 223200
  rotationPeriod = 19233
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 3
  Mass = 2.591E+20
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 353268000000
   eccentricity = 0.08862
   inclination = 7.134
   meanAnomaly = 307.8
   period = 114553440
   LAN = 103.91
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 149.84
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
 }

 // Ceres = Minmus
 Minmus
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 487300
  rotationPeriod = 32668
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 3
  Mass = 9.43E+20
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 413690604000
   eccentricity = 0.079138
   inclination = 10.587
   meanAnomaly = 113.410
   period = 145123488
   LAN = 80.3932
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 72.5898
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
 }

 // Jupiter = Jool
 Jool
 {
  SSTScale = 0.9999
  Radius = 69911000
  rotationPeriod = 35730
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 3.13
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 27
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 374000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 0.13
  Mass = 1.8986E+27
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 778547200000
   eccentricity = 0.048775
   inclination = 1.305
   meanAnomaly = 18.818
   period = 374335776
   LAN = 100.492
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 275.066
  }
 }

 // Io = Pol
 Pol
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1821300
  tidallyLocked = true
  Mass = 8.9319E+22
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 421800000
   eccentricity = 0.0041
   inclination = 2.21
   period = 152853.5047104
   referenceBody = Jool
  }
 }

 // Europa = Eeloo
 Eeloo
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1560800
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0.1
  Mass = 4.7998E+22
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 671100000
   eccentricity = 0.009
   inclination = 0.47
   period = 306822.0384
   referenceBody = Jool
  }
 }

 // Ganymede = Tylo
 Tylo
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 2634100
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0.2
  Mass = 1.4819E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 1070400000
   eccentricity = 0.0013
   inclination = 0.2
   period = 618153.375744
   referenceBody = Jool
  }
 }

 // Callisto = Ike
 Ike
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 2410300
  tidallyLocked = true
  Mass = 1.075938E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 1882700000
   eccentricity = 0.0074
   inclination = 0.192
   period = 1441931.18976
   referenceBody = Jool
  }
 }

 // Saturn = Sentar
 Sentar
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 60268000
  rotationPeriod = 38052
  tidallyLocked = false
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 59.5
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 800000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 0.16
  Mass = 5.6846E+26
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 1433449370000
   eccentricity = 0.055723219
   inclination = 2.485
   meanAnomaly = 320.34675
   period = 929596608
   LAN = 113.642811
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 336.013862
  }
 }

 // Mimas = 

 // Enceladus = Vall
 Vall
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 252100
  rotationPeriod = 118386
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  Mass = 1.080E+20
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 237948000
   eccentricity = 0.0047
   inclination = 0.019
   period = 118386
   LAN = 0
   referenceBody = Sentar
  }
 }

 // Tethys = 

 // Dione = 

 // Rhea = 

 // Titan = Erin
 Erin
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 2576000
  rotationPeriod = 1377648
  tidallyLocked = true
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 40
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 520000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 4.5
  Mass = 1.3452E+23
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 1221870000
   eccentricity = 0.0288
   inclination = 0.34854
   period = 1377648
   referenceBody = Sentar
  }
 }

 // Iapetus = Ringle
 Ringle
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1492000
  rotationPeriod = 6853334.4
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  Mass = 1.8056E+21
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 3560820000
   eccentricity = 0.028612
   inclination = 15.47
   meanAnomaly = 90
   period = 6853334.4
   LAN = 0
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 179
   referenceBody = Sentar
  }
 }

 // Uranus = Skelton
 Skelton
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 25559000
  rotationPeriod = 62063.712
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 97.77
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 27.7
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 390000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 0.34
  Mass = 8.681E+25
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 2876679082000
   eccentricity = 0.04440558
   inclination = 0.772556
   meanAnomaly = 142.955717
   period = 2661041808
   LAN = 73.989821
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 96.541318
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
 }

 // Puck = 

 // Miranda = Ablate
 Ablate
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 235800
  rotationPeriod = 122125
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  Mass = 6.59E+19
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 129390000
   eccentricity = 0.0013
   inclination = 93.5
   meanAnomaly = 90
   period = 122125
   LAN = 0
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 179
   referenceBody = Skelton
  }
 }

 // Ariel = 

 // Umbriel = 

 // Titania = Thud
 Thud
 {
  Radius = 788400
  rotationPeriod = 752218
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  Mass = 3.527E+21
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 435910000
   eccentricity = 0.0011
   inclination = 97.4
   meanAnomaly = 0
   period = 752218
   LAN = 0
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 0
   referenceBody = Skelton
  }
 }

 // Oberon = 

 // Neptune = Laythe
 Laythe
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 24764000
  rotationPeriod = 58000.3
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 28.32
  atmosphereScaleHeight = 19.7
  maxAtmosphereAltitude = 260000
  atmosphereMultiplier = 0.37
  Mass = 1.0243E+26
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 4553946490000
   eccentricity = 0.011214269
   inclination = 1.767975
   meanAnomaly = 267.767281
   period = 5200418592
   LAN = 131.794310
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 265.646853
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
 }

 // Triton = Ascension
 Ascension
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1353400
  rotationPeriod = 507760
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 0
  Mass = 2.14E+22
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 354759000
   eccentricity = 0.000016
   inclination = 129.812
   meanAnomaly = 156.885
   period = 507760
   LAN = 73.989821
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 96.541318
   referenceBody = Laythe
  }
 }

 // Pluto = Dres
 Dres
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 1153000
  rotationPeriod = 551856.672
  tidallyLocked = false
  axialTilt = 119.591
  Mass = 1.305E+22
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 5874000000000
   eccentricity = 0.244671664
   inclination = 17.151394
   meanAnomaly = 14.86012204
   period = 7816176000
   LAN = 110.28683
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 113.76349
   referenceBody = Sun
  }
 }

 // Charon = Pock
 Pock
 {
  SSTScale = 1
  Radius = 603500
  rotationPeriod = 551856.672
  tidallyLocked = true
  axialTilt = 119.591
  Mass = 1.52E+21
  Orbit
  {
   semiMajorAxis = 17536000
   eccentricity = 0.00
   inclination = 112.783
   meanAnomaly = 0
   period = 551856.672
   LAN = 223
   argumentOfPeriapsis = 0
   referenceBody = Dres
  }
 }




}

I couldn't find the J2000 mean anomalies of Ceres and Vesta but I imagine they're around somewhere. Also the J2000 mean anomalies, LAN and ArP of most of the moons are hard to find.

All the real planets with atmospheres are replaced by KSP planets with atmospheres, so you can use aerocapture/aerobraking anywhere you could in reality. I got a lot of textures from here.

It's too bad the Universe Replacer mod doesn't work with Planet Factory. Also, adding bump maps to planets seems to mess up their lighting (the planet day/night sides are at 90 degrees to the Sun). There seems to be a bug where if you look at a planet with clouds from far away, you see flickering black specks in its atmosphere. I'm not sure if that's because the cloud textures are too low resolution (1024x512) or something else.

Edited by metaphor
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Starwaster

Starwaster

Posted
Posted

Here is a pictorial record of my attempt to launch an old reliable lifter in RSS+FAR+DR. To be honest, I didn't expect much here. I felt for sure that FAR would take one look at it, laugh hysterically and then contemptuously backhand it into a pile of 'Unplanned Disassembly'. To say nothing of launching it on an RSS-sized Kerbin.

So in that regard, it exceeded my expectations. Unfortunately it was a little short on DV and the ascent profile possibly a little too cautious for the amount of DV. Also, towards the end of its flight it experienced some strange torque and bending of the craft. Maybe because I only strutted the lifter and not the payload (a space station), which was fine as long as it was contained within its PF shell. As soon as the shell was jettisoned the station began pitching wildly and the attached crew pod threatened to snap off. I suspect also that maybe I shouldn't have had so many FAR controls enabled once it left orbit? Maybe some conflict there with MJ's SmartASS? Ah well, it's back to the drawing board.

Oh, and to give an idea as to scale, those are 3.75m tanks and engines on the side.

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ferram4

ferram4

Posted
Posted

Part of the reason that things feel apart when you jettisoned the fairing is that procedural fairings autostruts the fairing bases and walls to each other, so basically the fairing was carrying the majority of the load. Ultimately, for what you're trying to launch here it would make more sense to keep the payload in the fairing until you're raising the periapsis from ~30km up to 250km, which you use a much weaker orbital engine for.

The main reason it seems to have been successful is the very low TWR at launch (it looks like it's around ~1.2, based on the g-Force meter) and the fact that you took such a steep ascent, which meant that you minimized Max Q as much as possible, so... good work I guess? Honestly, if you just flip the station around the other way it will be vastly better aerodynamic-wise, even though something that wide for how tall it is is kind of... bad. Honestly, FAR should backhand it into pieces, but Kerbals are very good structural engineers; their stuff holds together through things that real life rockets can't handle, though it fails more spectacularly.

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Starwaster

Starwaster

Posted
Posted (edited)
Part of the reason that things feel apart when you jettisoned the fairing is that procedural fairings autostruts the fairing bases and walls to each other, so basically the fairing was carrying the majority of the load. Ultimately, for what you're trying to launch here it would make more sense to keep the payload in the fairing until you're raising the periapsis from ~30km up to 250km, which you use a much weaker orbital engine for.

The main reason it seems to have been successful is the very low TWR at launch (it looks like it's around ~1.2, based on the g-Force meter) and the fact that you took such a steep ascent, which meant that you minimized Max Q as much as possible, so... good work I guess? Honestly, if you just flip the station around the other way it will be vastly better aerodynamic-wise, even though something that wide for how tall it is is kind of... bad. Honestly, FAR should backhand it into pieces, but Kerbals are very good structural engineers; their stuff holds together through things that real life rockets can't handle, though it fails more spectacularly.

Yes, the autostrutting is why this design evolved. As long as the four engines are properly strutted to each other it's pretty stable. If not, they tend to flop around and spray rocket exhaust about the landscape at bad angles until an incident occurs.

On stock-sized Kerbin I typically filled those tanks with LH2/LOX, Put throttle limits into place and let it and it was pretty sufficient to get it into orbit.

That won't work here of course; not enough DV.

But anyway, FAR will actually properly detect the shape if I invert it? (I see what you're getting at, it's not so blunt at the tail end because it doesn't have the Hab sitting up top)

Also, let me bounce the ascent profile off of you. Shape was 100% because I wasn't sure how much I could get away with so I didn't want to treat it like I would a traditionally designed rocket. I forget exactly what altitude I started it at, maybe 10k...ish?

I suddenly experiencing explosions on switch to another vessel. Never had this problem before O.o

Well, what does Mission Report say? If the explosion doesn't destroy the ship outright, you can access it by pressing F3. It will tell you about structural failures and part overheating. I've heard about that sort of thing happening with Deadly Re-entry, but I think that was awhile ago - older versions. Debug log or output_log.txt might tell you something too.

Edited by Starwaster
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iVG

iVG

Posted
Posted

Haven't changed DRE since the last update. Yesterday everything was fine. Today was sending a probe to Mars, while orienting the satellites got dem explozionsz. Was hurry to perform the rage-quit manoeuvre though.

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ferram4

ferram4

Posted
Posted

@StarWaster: FAR should detect the orientation of the shape; if nothing else it will put the higher drag part near the bottom which is less bad than what you had going on.

I admit to not knowing anything about MechJeb ascent profiles, especially since I run mine based on velocity targets rather than altitude targets until I'm already above the atmosphere and at about 4 km/s. Odds are that starting at 10 km is too high; try instead around ~1 km and see if that helps.

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