Resources - postponed, cancelled or reserved for a DLC?

[czokletmuss]

So yes, we won't see stock resource mining, but that really doesn't matter, and we will see multiplayer, not from a plugin but from stable and fast internal code, and that does matter.

So don't worry, KSP is still and will be a great game, so have fun, and I'll see you in space

It's not a big deal, to be honest - there will be mods for resource system (I'm looking at you, Kethane). What I don't understand is why Squad decided to ignore this issue for months until the number of people asking for it was so big that they finally took 5 minutes and said something.

I think there are more elegant ways to announce this than in the last moments of the last Kerbalkon video. The fact that this thread has 28 pages is caused directly by Squad not willing to share information with their players in a more clear way. I hope they will improve this - there is no community without good communication. KSP is a great game and our devs are great guys but really, how much effort does one post per month reviewing what's going on and what their plans are could take?

[PDCWolf]

IThe fact that this thread has 28 pages is caused directly by Squad not willing to share information with their players in a more clear way. I hope they will improve this - there is no community without good communication. KSP is a great game and our devs are great guys but really, how much effort does one post per month reviewing what's going on and what their plans are take?

I have to correct you on this one. The fact this thread is 28 pages is because resources was cancelled. The rage is what is -indirectly- caused by the lack of communication.

[czokletmuss]

I guess you are right. But my point stands: more transparency -> less rage -> better community.

[sal_vager]

Communication has never been Squads strongest point :/ but that should change now there's a new CM and we still have Maxmaps, there's the weekly as well now at least.

[TMS]

What exactly is the process for appointing a community manager?

Is it standard practice for random people to be parachuted into the position?

[sal_vager]

You didn't see the job application TMS?

[satcharna]

What exactly is the process for appointing a community manager?

Is it standard practice for random people to be parachuted into the position?

Pleasant though Rows is, he doesn't actually do a lot of community management from what I can see, and it isn't excusable either since being active and visible is actually his job.

[sal_vager]

He'll get better Satcharna, he's still new to the position, give him time

[Alguien]

we still have Maxmaps

the same Max who didnt say anything about resources but "is in the backlog/roadmap/maybe"? and the "dev day/weekly" doesnt mention stuff like that

[I_Killed_Jeb]

So yes, we won't see stock resource mining, but that really doesn't matter, and we will see multiplayer, not from a plugin but from stable and fast internal code, and that does matter.

Que? So resource mining doesn't really matter while multiplayer does matter because.... you think so?

Edited December 14, 2013 by purpletarget
fixing tags

[czokletmuss]

the "dev day/weekly" doesnt mention stuff like that

'

Yeah, big thing like this are beyond the scope of dev's posts in Kerbal Daily, which BTW usually aren't very detailed anyways. Maybe there should be like Kerbal Monthly - summary of the dev's brainstorms about the KSP or something like this?

[sal_vager]

Stock resource mining, no, we can make that ourselves

Satcharna, we're going off topic, we all have to wait and see how Rowsdower does in time.

[TMS]

Pleasant though Rows is, he doesn't actually do a lot of community management from what I can see, and it isn't excusable either since being active and visible is actually his job.

That's kinda why I asked... because I'd never heard of the guy or seen him on the forum - unlike the very active fellas who he replaced - so I assumed he'd been appointed internally or something.

There was an application process?

[satcharna]

'

Yeah, big thing like this are beyond the scope of dev's posts in Kerbal Daily, which BTW usually aren't very detailed anyways. Maybe there should be like Kerbal Monthly - summary of the dev's brainstorms about the KSP or something like this?

The amount of work the devs SHOULD be doing during a week would already be enough for such a blog post. Then again, something planned to take an afternoon ended up taking a week of dev time, and it's something that practically nobody will be using anyway.

[Majiir]

Stock resource mining, no, we can make that ourselves

The community is rightfully upset that it took this long for Squad to come to this conclusion. When the resource mining plans were first announced, I asked Squad to leave that feature as the purview of modders, since it's a feature the community can build and Squad should focus on more difficult things. This year-long charade has done nothing but give the game undeserved attention.

[Rosarium]

wow, no resources, well i belive even no food or oxigen either... but FTL engines. Even no inflatables.... may we know squad plans? multiplayer? are you seriuos?? Squad have hard times coding and facing bugs and think can provide a stable multiplayer???? good luck luck Squad you have my money already but i don't really think you'll be able to magan'e' such a think.777

[czokletmuss]

The community is rightfully upset that it took this long for Squad to come to this conclusion. When the resource mining plans were first announced, I asked Squad to leave that feature as the purview of modders, since it's a feature the community can build and Squad should focus on more difficult things. This year-long charade has done nothing but give the game undeserved attention.

Exactly. Plus I feel really sorry for you, Majir - you had to wait expecting Kethane to become useless for a whole year, not knowing that you may have actually create fantastic things with your plugin for these what, 6 months? It's a shame, really. I can imagine how dissapointed you feel.

[Galileo Kerbonaut]

A lot of players have put Squad on a high pedestal, and much is wanted from KSP, but we all have to remember that they are a small number of normal people, not world class games designers and only a few of the people at Squad even code.

Squad is a normal company, they have deadlines, meetings, they work 9 to 5 and sometimes have to work after hours to meet those deadlines.

There's a LOT that devs like Felipe want to add to KSP, but they have to find a balance between what they want and what is realistic, and what fits in with the vision for KSP.

They do their best, and often fans expect more than they can provide, Felipe and other want you all to have the best game KSP can be, and sometimes that means scrapping things that seemed like a good idea at one time, but ended up taking the focus of the game away from it's roots.

KSP started out as a game about launching a little rocket in a 2D world, with little green men at the controls screaming, and has developed into a game of discovery, of other planets and moons, of science, and most of all of the players and their forays into space.

No one knew mining was coming, it was revealed out of the blue and while interesting, multiplayer was, is and will remain the number one most wanted feature in KSP by the majority of players, even I'll give it a go as KMP is a lot of fun

Don't forget that Squad have deliberately opened up KSP to modders, and will open up even more aspects of the game to the modding community as time passes, everything we could possibly want in KSP can be ours if someone, or ourselves, makes it for the game.

Mining resources, robotics, aerodynamics, autopilots and parts for any situation we could possibly be faced with already exist, and new ones come all the time, expecting all this from a handful of coders will end in disappointment though, there are just too many things KSP can be than a small team can hope to give us.

So yes, we won't see stock resource mining, but that really doesn't matter, and we will see multiplayer, not from a plugin but from stable and fast internal code, and that does matter.

So don't worry, KSP is still and will be a great game, so have fun, and I'll see you in space

Thank you... although most people could have come up with this reply, it is nice to have someone "official" actually posting it; I really appreciate that. However, it isn't really an answer. It still doesn't explain why the focus has turned from resources (that were more or less promised) to MP (that was more or less a no go zone). I really would like Harvester to comment on this. And please... don't insult your players by saying it would be too complicated to be fun. (That's what aggravates me the most about the whole situation.)

As for the resources, I'll take my "loss" and keep an eye out for MODS like Kethane and TAC; I really hope, now more then ever, that these mods will get fully blown and offer us an ever growing more interesting way to play KSP.

Squad still is a company which I will love to death (with or without resources ), what you guys pulled off (are pulling off) is amazing! But please give a more satisfying reason why you are doing things. IMO, that is just as important as making a really cool game.

Edited December 14, 2013 by Galileo Kerbonaut

[Stargate525]

Stock resource mining, no, we can make that ourselves

Excuse me? We did MULTIPLAYER ourselves too! If they can co-opt that, why can't they co-opt Kethane and give it solid integrated code too?

[zarniw00p]

I already thought that the focus on career mode was a mistake, but now this change from resources to multiplayer is probably the worst decision that has happened in KSP development ever. It seems that for 2014 mods are the only hope for KSP. Just compare the gameplay that Kethane adds to KSP to the boring "science"-text gathering of career mode. So much potential being wasted...it's frustrating to watch.

[bowdlerize]

I am disappointed about resources being dropped. This game forces people to learn orbital mechanics to play, but managing resources is to hard for beginners? When it was written off as feature creep I wondered why as it seemed most of the hard work was done. Now with multiplayer being implemented after it has been stated time and again it will be a post v1.0 feature it makes people worry what squad planed for the future.

I have got hundreds of hours out of a game I paid $15 for, it is the cheapest entertainment I have ever had. I am planing to buy it again at full price once v1.0 is released, I only hope that game is a great as KSP 0.11 through 0.19 showed it can be.

(EDIT:typo)

Edited December 14, 2013 by bowdlerize

[PDCWolf]

A lot of players have put Squad on a high pedestal, and much is wanted from KSP, but we all have to remember that they are a small number of normal people, not world class games designers and only a few of the people at Squad even code.

In this case, resources was a wanted feature because of kethane and it grew even more after the official announcement (back in between 0.18/0.19)

Squad is a normal company, they have deadlines, meetings, they work 9 to 5 and sometimes have to work after hours to meet those deadlines.

Nobody is really discussing this. Not on this thread at least.

There's a LOT that devs like Felipe want to add to KSP, but they have to find a balance between what they want and what is realistic, and what fits in with the vision for KSP.

This is something to fix on squad's side. They should evaluate all of this before announcing stuff.

They do their best, and often fans expect more than they can provide, Felipe and other want you all to have the best game KSP can be, and sometimes that means scrapping things that seemed like a good idea at one time, but ended up taking the focus of the game away from it's roots.

Multiplayer deviates the game from it's roots even more than resources.

KSP started out as a game about launching a little rocket in a 2D world, with little green men at the controls screaming, and has developed into a game of discovery, of other planets and moons, of science, and most of all of the players and their forays into space.

Yes, KSP was born like that, but harvester had different stuff in mind, and I'm basing myself on his own posts on orbiter forums and texts that are both on the official KSP page and different distribution media.

No one knew mining was coming, it was revealed out of the blue and while interesting, multiplayer was, is and will remain the number one most wanted feature in KSP by the majority of players, even I'll give it a go as KMP is a lot of fun

Not really, you just have to check metrics between Kethane and KMP, they are really close. Once you compared that, add the fact that Kethane is more true to the game than multiplayer is and then add this thread to the mix.

Don't forget that Squad have deliberately opened up KSP to modders, and will open up even more aspects of the game to the modding community as time passes, everything we could possibly want in KSP can be ours if someone, or ourselves, makes it for the game.

Then why not leave multiplayer to a mod like they do with resources?

So yes, we won't see stock resource mining, but that really doesn't matter, and we will see multiplayer, not from a plugin but from stable and fast internal code, and that does matter.

Pure opinion, and not only that, but you come and say this on a 30 page thread complaining about resources being cancelled.

(Re-opening as PDCWolf asked in a very kind manner, please be civil and mindful of peoples feeling, thank you)

Thank you for re-opening it.

[I_Killed_Jeb]

Stock resource mining, no, we can make that ourselves

Not sure if srs, in that vein pretty much anything can be made "ourselves."

[OtherDalfite]

Stock resource mining, no, we can make that ourselves

Know what we can also make ourselves? Multiplayer, Docking, A one resource system, guns, proper atmosphere, more interesting planets, satellite relays, rovers, boats, and entire solar systems.

Does that mean that SQUAD should just call KSP finished and let the community keep pulling the weight of KSP?

[Themohawkninja]

I'd be okay if they released it as a DLC. At least then I could get it without dealing with mods (by "dealing with", I am referring to having to hope/wait for an update each time the game itself updates, which is what keeps me away from mods a lot of times).