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[1.8+] Real Fuels


NathanKell

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1-Procedural fuel tanks: There is a tank type selection such as fuselage, default, baloon..etc. Could you please tell me which tanks are for which fuel? Because when comparing delta v, default tank seems to get 200-300 m/s more with a default tank than cyro..etc and I see no difference in operating. However, sometimes by J2 engines wont ignite in space, so I am sure its about selecting a proper tank for the fuels. So please guide me which tanks I should be using for vacuum, fuel type and surface.

The service module and fuselage tank types are pressurized, which lets you put hypergolic fuels (Aerozine 50, MMH, etc) in them*. Cryogenic and cryo balloon tanks have reduced boiloff of cryogenic fuels such as liquid hydrogen, at a mass penalty. Balloon tanks are much lighter than normal tanks, but with less structural strength.

*Only necessary if using Engine Ignitor. Otherwise, use whatever ridiculous tank type you want.

2-I am using Engine Ignitors: I still couldnt figure out how to take extra electrical ignitions with the tool box. It doesnt add additional electrical ignitons no matter where I place it.

First off, these questions really should be asked in the Engine Ignitor thread, not the Real Fuels thread. You need a Kerbal to EVA, right-click the box, move to the engine, right-click, and add an ignitor. Also, you may be running into lag issues for large rockets with a large number of tanks and engines: something about Engine Ignitor's calculations takes a huge amount of time with RealFuels.

3- "Need settling down": I am using ullage to get some g before ignitions but sometimes they work sometimes they dont. I think related with question 1.

As I understand (I deleted Engine Ignitor for aforementioned lag issues), ullage is to settle liquid fuels to the bottom of the tank before ignition so they properly flow to the engine without air bubbles. Not sure what to say.

4-Which type of fuels should I be using for most efficient 1st and 2nd stage with TWR around 1.25-13.0 at take off (to get around 4000-5000 delta v). Generally kerosene and LOX at main stage and lox and lh2 at second stage?

Kerosene-LOX is a favorite for first stages. It tends to produce good sea-level thrust with reasonable Isp. LH2/LOX is the most efficient chemical rocket fuel by miles, but has a couple problems. First off, it is very low-density: you need huge fuel tanks to store it. It has issues with low sea-level thrust and Isp, and is cryogenic: LH2 boils off even at -200C (LOX does so at -180C), so cannot be stored long. Hypergolic fuels like Aerozine50/NTO can be stored basically indefinitely, but require pressurized fuel tanks (service module or fuselage), and generally have relatively mediocre thrust/Isp performance.

5-No matter what I try, I cannot get pass 16k delta v at RSS and RO with a payload of 12tonnes. So I think its impossible to have a manned flight to mars in rss/ro with saturn v type rockets.

Moar staging. If you have payload issues, do in-space assembly, potentially incorporating nuclear rockets (I would suggest liquid ammonia if you are concerned about boil-off: it has a very high boiling point). Also, strongly consider a Mars rendezvous mission profile (lander rendezvous with return stage in orbit, so you don't have to lug the return fuel down to the ground and back up).

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You asked if KSP-Interstellar had radiators- I answered your question, and then went on to point out that they don't work with RealFuels. I missed nothing. Why are you being so abrasive/critical lately?

Because I'm spending my own damned time trying to help you and you basically just brush it off in an evasive and snarky manner.

You've completely confused me by writing there would be no fix, and then crossing that out without a real clarification. Are there going to be any fixes to the Thermal Fins in the base RealFuels mod or not?

The radiator (more properly ModuleHeatPump) code fixes weren't going to go in for RF because it was going to be migrated to another mod but the situation changed. So there will be a fix coming.

The current Thermal Fins are far from usable/acceptable (besides being too small, thus requiring part-spam; and too blunt- thus ripping off with FAR; they also aren't nearly powerful enough compared to real-life active-cooling systems, and *in aggregate* are heavier and more expensive when you're using dozens of fins for the same effect a single device would accomplish in real life, *especially* for the larger fuel tanks, which benefit heavily from not having to miniaturize cooling technology as much...)

Regards,

Northstar

I can't repro what your're saying

I can't rip the fins off with FAR. I made sure failures were on.

And I can cool my tank down to the boiling point of hydrogen on two fins.

Modified using the same module mananger fix that I provided.

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Good evening gentlemodders,

Just been setting up a Munar refinery and got myself some lovely NRE spam:

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at RealFuels.ModuleEngineConfigs.SetThrust () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RealFuels.ModuleEngineConfigs.FixedUpdate () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

I'm running KSP 32-bit on OS X Yosemite with a heavily modded install. AFAIK all mods are up to date, but it's not out of the realm of possibility that I've borked something. I've added an RF config for Nertea's Mk IV Spaceplane parts, which I don't *think* has broken anything, but I've uploaded it here just in case.

Player log is HERE.

As far as I can see the error hasn't 'broken' anything yet, but spam is never a good sign, and I quite like my Munar refinery.

Any help would be appreciated, and if you need anything else from me, let me know what.

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Because I'm spending my own damned time trying to help you and you basically just brush it off in an evasive and snarky manner.

Please calm down. I don't know where you're sensing evasion or snarkiness, but it's not coming from me.

The radiator (more properly ModuleHeatPump) code fixes weren't going to go in for RF because it was going to be migrated to another mod but the situation changed. So there will be a fix coming.

I see. Thanks for the clarification. Do you know precisely which fixes will be coming?

I can't repro what your're saying

I can't rip the fins off with FAR. I made sure failures were on.

And I can cool my tank down to the boiling point of hydrogen on two fins.

Modified using the same module mananger fix that I provided.

First of all, you modified the thermal fins. That *entirel*y circumvents the problem- I was clear that the fins ripped off when *unmodified*. If you made their attachment point stronger, of course they won't rip off... (although I would question the realism- and this still does nothing about the poor aerodyanmics generating excessive drag or the need for part-spam to cool large tanks...)

Further, you need to provide more info on how you tried to replicate. What was the liftoff TWR of the rocket? The maximum TWR during ascent? What was the highest speed accomplished? Was it a large rocket with a higher ballistic coefficient, or a smaller rocket that was less aerodynamic? These factors are all INCREDIBLY important to whether the thermal fins will rip off...

You also didn't provide much information on how you were trying to replicate the problem. What size tank were you using? When I talk about needing to use 12 or 16 fins, I'm referring to the larger fuel tanks in the game- Rockomax-64 and the SLS-style 3.75 meter tanks... If you were using ProceduralParts mod instead, what tank types were you using? Cryogenic? Balloon? Service? (with Hydrogen, you should probably be using CryogenicBalloon- standard Cryogenic tanks being too heavy for the volume...) Obviously a 1.25 meter fuel tank won't require a boatload of thermal fins...

Like I said, longer thermal fins can be more powerful, more aerodynamic (and less prone to rip off, with stronger surface-attachments), and more cost-effective (while also requiring less part-spam). Why are you so resistant to the idea?

Regards,

Northstar

Edited by Northstar1989
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Hancer: First, no need to apologize! :)

(Highly) pressurized tanks aren't required for storable propellants per se; there have been plenty of pump-fed storable stages (Agena, everything Glushko/Chelomei ever made [Proton etc], and so forth) and there have been pressure-fed kerolox stage proposed, and even flown now and then. It is true, however, that most pressure-fed engines run off storables.

(Note: not all storable propellants are hypergolic, and not all hypergolics are storable...)

As to what tank type to use:

Default is your average not-highly-pressurized tank type. Use it for pump-fed stages that don't need long term insulation (i.e. S-IVB, despite being a hydrolox stage, should be modeled as this.)

Cryogenic: A modern highly-insulated tank, like Delta IV core and DCSS use.

Balloon: The type of tank Atlas used. The tank *is* the structure, and for that reason must always be kept under pressure. It's more fragile (this isn't really modeled in KSP, though it should have a higher failure chance [in Dangit] and take muuuuch longer to roll out [in KCT]) but much more mass-efficient.

BalloonCryo: What Centaur uses. Same as Balloon, but with heavy insulation.

ServiceModule: Highly-pressurized (can be used with pressure-fed engines). It also lets you store life support supplies and ElectricCharge. Includes the same level of insulation as a cryo tank. Use this for RCS tanks.

Fuselage: Like the above, but heavier. Used for planes.

Structural: Like Default, but heavier. Used for planes.

Xenon (I think this is still a type?): used for Xenon (surprise).

If you mouse over your engine, EI will tell you if it's pressure-fed, by the way, in case the part description does not.

So generally you will want Default (or Cryogenic if your lower stage is hydrolox), followed by either default or cryo if your upper stage is pump-fed, or SM if it's pressure-fed. The tanks you use for your spacecraft should probably be all SM (since it'll need RCS, batteries, and possibly a some large pressure-fed tankage for an orbital maneuvering engine).

Regarding settling propellants, you need to first provide some acceleration, then wait a bit for things to settle if they haven't yet. If you use solids to ullage, you probably can light your engine while the solids are burning; if you use RCS, you might have to wait a bit.

Regarding what propellants to choose, Starman4308 already covered it pretty well. Just to add, a very efficient combination is a decently-efficient core with some solid boosters. The boosters will give you high thrust down low (when it matters most) and if they burn out fast you won't over-G later. The thing to remember is that it might well be worth trading a lower-efficiency (in terms of Isp) first minute for minimizing gravity losses. Barring that (where it might make sense to use a hydrolox core), kerolox is pretty much always going to be your best choice; it's more efficient than storables without the density or thrust limitations of hydrolox. For upper stages, however, hydrolox rules. For orbital stages, by contrast, pressure-fed storables are the way to go, since you don't have to worry about boiloff or a low limit to restarts.

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I am not new to KSP, but I am new to Real Fuels. So, this may be a Newb question:

1st - I don't know how to create a log, or where to find it if it is created.

2nd - The real problem, every part in the game disappears. Even stock command pods, batteries, etc. This is def something with Real Fuels. I delete the real fuels folder from GameData and everything is fine.

Any ideas on why Real Fuels would cause every part to disappear, but reappear when Real Fuels is removed?

Real Fuels is installed with the StockAlike Engine Config.

The Newb.

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@NathanKell

Hi Nathan. Glad to see you posting as always.

Any news on integrating the KSP-Interstellar integration config Dreadicon said you and releasing the updated version? Dreadicon said he sent you the latest version some time ago, and though there were a few odds and ends left to fix, I haven't heard anything from him since- so I doubt any more progress will be made in the near future on that. As such, it would seem prudent to integrate the latest config and release it with 8.2 quickly.

Regards,

Northstar

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First of all, you modified the thermal fins. That *entirel*y circumvents the problem- I was clear that the fins ripped off when *unmodified*. If you made their attachment point stronger, of course they won't rip off... (although I would question the realism- and this still does nothing about the poor aerodyanmics generating excessive drag or the need for part-spam to cool large tanks...)

That's what you do when you're fixing things. You test the fixes. So basically you're complaining that I tested my solution?

Further, you need to provide more info on how you tried to replicate. What was the liftoff TWR of the rocket? The maximum TWR during ascent? What was the highest speed accomplished? Was it a large rocket with a higher ballistic coefficient, or a smaller rocket that was less aerodynamic? These factors are all INCREDIBLY important to whether the thermal fins will rip off...

You also didn't provide much information on how you were trying to replicate the problem. What size tank were you using? When I talk about needing to use 12 or 16 fins, I'm referring to the larger fuel tanks in the game- Rockomax-64 and the SLS-style 3.75 meter tanks... If you were using ProceduralParts mod instead, what tank types were you using? Cryogenic? Balloon? Service? (with Hydrogen, you should probably be using CryogenicBalloon- standard Cryogenic tanks being too heavy for the volume...) Obviously a 1.25 meter fuel tank won't require a boatload of thermal fins...

*I have to provide information on replication?* You were the one with the complaint about the part in the first place so that's your job. Not mine. Unbelievable.

Why are you so resistant to the idea?

That's so incredibly off-base that I don't even know where to start with that? Why should I care what radiator you use or whether or not you get to have a new one? I'd ask where you're even coming from with that accusation but forget it. I'm done with you. I'm sorry I said anything at all to you. I apologize for that profusely.

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Here is the output log you requested.

I am pretty sure Real Fuels is installed correctly. I have lots of experience using mods and altering them to suite my own tastes. None have ever presented me this problem before. However, none rely on so many Module Manger changes either. Let me know what you think.

The only sure thing I know is that if I delete the Real Fuels folder from Game Data the problem goes away and all the parts appear in the game again. And I mean really gone, not in the R&D building, not in the VAB, not in the SPH.

Thanks for taking the time to help.

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Just to clarify, I may have made it sound like I modified Real Fuels. I did not.

Also, to replicate this I just need to turn on KSP. It loads fine and I can start a new game. If I click on the VAB, SPH, or R&D building there are no parts, except some procedural fairings textures from blackheart. Not even stock parts. I delete Real Fuels, everything is there to build with as I please. Put Real Fuels back, they are all gone again. The output log is from my last attempt at deleting and reinstalling Real Fuels.

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Here is the output log you requested.

I am pretty sure Real Fuels is installed correctly. I have lots of experience using mods and altering them to suite my own tastes. None have ever presented me this problem before. However, none rely on so many Module Manger changes either. Let me know what you think.

The only sure thing I know is that if I delete the Real Fuels folder from Game Data the problem goes away and all the parts appear in the game again. And I mean really gone, not in the R&D building, not in the VAB, not in the SPH.

Thanks for taking the time to help.

Edit: Your RealFuels is out of date and you need to redownload. Delete the existing folder and then reinstall the latest version

https://github.com/NathanKell/ModularFuelSystem/releases/tag/rf-v8.1

Edited by Starwaster
Simplified reply to remove extraneous text
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Hey, just wanted to drop by and mention a couple things:

First, thanks for accepting my pull request. I am happy that my work seems to have been of use!

Second, take your time with the next update; I would like to state that I noticed some of the configs I submitted could use some tweaking. They are definitely much better than nothing, or even the previous configs, but MM is displaying (far as I can tell harmless) errors on them; specifically the config for KSPI, and a couple engine configs got added to Raptor's configs appropriately, and should probably be removed from the KSPI-RF config. Which leads me to...

Third, between an upswing in work and recent oral surgery, I have been out of development for a few weeks, and do not know when I will be able to continue updating the configs. I have not had the time to find the problems in the configs mostly; if someone could identify where they error or at least which part fails to be updated in the game (for those who don't know MM), and let me know in my thread or via PM, I will be much more likely to find enough time to fix the configs. I apologize for the lack of support for the configs I provided.

Finally, Northstar, while I appreciated the feedback provided at times for my modding endeavors, please do not push an issue with mod devs. This is our hobby, not our obligation. If a modder don't answer your post regarding a change to their mod, it's likely not because they missed your comment, but because they are either undecided on the subject and want to think it over, or are too busy spending their free time modding to engage in debate and discussion when the decision is ultimately theirs how they build and manage their mod. Once you have added your voice, give the modder a few months if they don't respond before following up. I do not speak for any other modders, but having been a part of several modding communities for some time, this is how they tend to feel. I apologize if I have offended you or any other modders in this statement; if so, please accept my humblest apologies.

-Dreadicon

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@Starwaster,

Thanks for replying. I already have RealFuels_v8.1.zip installed. However, I will attempt to redownload it and delete the folder that is already there if you really think it is that. Can't do it just yet though, no time for KSP right now. I will come back to report after I can do it.

JRA

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Change of plans. There was time for KSP after all. But, it did me no good. Still no parts except a couple proc fairing textures from blackheart. Here are a couple screenshots.

Empty VAB

Proc Fairings

Not sure why these 5 fairings from blackheart escaped but they did.

Here is a new output log.

Out of curiosity, what made you think the install was outdated?

JRA

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Change of plans. There was time for KSP after all. But, it did me no good. Still no parts except a couple proc fairing textures from blackheart. Here are a couple screenshots.

Empty VAB

Proc Fairings

Not sure why these 5 fairings from blackheart escaped but they did.

Here is a new output log.

Out of curiosity, what made you think the install was outdated?

JRA

Because the file BobCat_RealEngines_kerofix.cfg is configuring the NK33 engine with LiquidOxygen. That resource name was deprecated and should not be used anywhere. However the aforementioned file was not updated until RF 8.1

NK33 was the sixth part to be processed in your log file and the first engine file processed. That's why you have five fairing parts and nothing else. It's plain as day in your log. It's not possible that you have RF 8.1 installed. Or you don't have it installed properly, which means deleting the existing RealFuels folder and installing from the 8.1 zip file.

(I'd actually already mentioned this but then decided that the reply was too lengthy which is why you may notice it was edited and the edit reply was that I trimmed out the extraneous bits. Sigh. So much for extraneous)

Edit: Excerpt from your log. Each part compilation is boldfaced. Notice 5 fairing parts are compiled. Then the NK33 Then a nullref exception. Basically the stock KSP at that point is doing a for or foreach loop as it iterates over every single part. It gets to the NK33 and BOOM! NULLREF! That stops the loop in its tracks and it is no longer compiling parts. If Squad were to encapsulate that part of their code in a TRY/CATCH construct then it would allow the loop to continue. Silently or with the error logged depending on what they did with the catch segment.

And that is officially more time than I wanted to spend on this. Bottom line is that the NK33 is being configured with an outdated resource name and that's happening in a file from a version older than Real Fuels 8.1

PartLoader: Compiling Part 'blackheart/ProceduralFairings/AtlasFairing/atlasfairing/KzProcFairingAtlas'

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

EffectList: Created 11 effect types

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

PartLoader: Compiling Part 'blackheart/ProceduralFairings/ChinaFairing/chinafairing/KzProcFairingChina'

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

PartLoader: Compiling Part 'blackheart/ProceduralFairings/ConeggFairing/coneggfairing/KzProcFairingConegg'

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

PartLoader: Compiling Part 'blackheart/ProceduralFairings/JupiterFairing/Jupiterfairing/KzProcFairingJupiter'

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

PartLoader: Compiling Part 'blackheart/ProceduralFairings/TitanFairing/titanfairing/KzProcFairingTitan'

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

PartLoader: Compiling Part 'BobCatind/Sovietengines/NK33/part/NK33' <-- THIS

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Added sound_rocket_hard to FXGroup running

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Added sound_explosion_low to FXGroup flameout

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

*MFS* Loading Engine Settings!

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

LiquidOxygen not found in resource database. Propellant Setup has failed.

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at ModuleEngines.SetupPropellant () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at ModuleEngines.OnLoad (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at PartModule.Load (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RealFuels.ModuleEngineConfigs.SetConfiguration (System.String newConfiguration) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RealFuels.ModuleEngineConfigs.OnLoad (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at PartModule.Load (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part.AddModule (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at PartLoader.ParsePart (.UrlConfig urlConfig, .ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at PartLoader+.MoveNext () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

UnityEngine.MonoBehaviour:StartCoroutine_Auto(IEnumerator)

UnityEngine.MonoBehaviour:StartCoroutine(IEnumerator)

:MoveNext()

UnityEngine.MonoBehaviour:StartCoroutine_Auto(IEnumerator)

UnityEngine.MonoBehaviour:StartCoroutine(IEnumerator)

PartLoader:StartLoad()

:MoveNext()

(Filename: Line: -1)

LiquidOxygen not found in resource database. Propellant Setup has failed.

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at ModuleEngines.SetupPropellant () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at ModuleEngines.OnLoad (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at PartModule.Load (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RealFuels.ModuleEngineConfigs.SetConfiguration (System.String newConfiguration) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RealFuels.ModuleEngineConfigs.OnStart (StartState state) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part.ModulesOnStart () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part+

.MoveNext () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

(Filename: Line: -1)

PartLoader: Compiling Internal Space 'HGR/Props/BigBook/prop/BigBook'

Config(@PART[NK33]:FOR[RealFuels]) RealFuels/BobCat_RealEngines_kerofix/@PART[NK33]:FOR[RealFuels]

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Here, use this to replace your BobCat_RealEngines_kerofix.cfg file. That should do it.

@PART[NK33]:FOR[RealFuels]

{

@MODULE[ModuleEngines]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

@ratio = 33.2

}

@PROPELLANT[Oxidizer]

{

@name = LqdOxygen

@ratio = 66.8

}

}

@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]

{

@CONFIG[DefaultConfig]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

}

}

}

}

@PART[NK43]:FOR[RealFuels]

{

@MODULE[ModuleEngines]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

@ratio = 33.2

}

@PROPELLANT[Oxidizer]

{

@name = LqdOxygen

@ratio = 66.8

}

}

@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]

{

@CONFIG[DefaultConfig]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

}

}

}

}

@PART[RD0124]:FOR[RealFuels]

{

@MODULE[ModuleEngines]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

@ratio = 34.6

}

@PROPELLANT[Oxidizer]

{

@name = LqdOxygen

@ratio = 65.4

}

}

@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]

{

@CONFIG[DefaultConfig]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

}

}

}

}

@PART[RD171]:FOR[RealFuels]

{

@MODULE[ModuleEngines]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

@ratio = 34.6

}

@PROPELLANT[Oxidizer]

{

@name = LqdOxygen

@ratio = 65.4

}

}

@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]

{

@CONFIG[DefaultConfig]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

}

}

}

}

@PART[RD180]:FOR[RealFuels]

{

@MODULE[ModuleEngines]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

@ratio = 33.9

}

@PROPELLANT[Oxidizer]

{

@name = LqdOxygen

@ratio = 66.1

}

}

@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]

{

@CONFIG[DefaultConfig]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

}

}

}

}

@PART[RD191]:FOR[RealFuels]

{

@MODULE[ModuleEngines]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

@ratio = 34.9

}

@PROPELLANT[Oxidizer]

{

@name = LqdOxygen

@ratio = 65.1

}

}

@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]

{

@CONFIG[DefaultConfig]

{

@PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel]

{

@name = Kerosene

}

}

}

}

Edited by Starwaster
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I have a feature request. Would that be possible to enable RF to change particle effects as well as configs? Currently, attempting to set this up via config change results in all the effects running constantly, except the one currently assigned to the engine.

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@Starwaster

Thanks again. Very informative. I am pretty certain it is installed correctly. I already had the zip you linked to, but for testing purposes I downloaded it again and used that.

The file path for BobCat_RealEngines_kerofix.cfg is:

D:\Games\Steam\steamapps\common\Kerbal Space Program\GameData\RealFuels

Here is a screenshot of my own BobCat_RealEngines_kerofix.cfg.

I think it says exactly what you copied into the forum. Though I admit I didn't verify more than the NK33. I don't think I have anything else that would modify this, but I will check into it.

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@Starwaster and @NathanKell,

With the bit of education I received I was 100% positive that RealFuels was installed correctly, with version 8.1. So, I concluded that there must not be a problem with RealFuels.

Since the offending part was part of the Soviet Engine pack I decided to test this by removing the engine pack and seeing if KSP loaded fine.

It did.

Now: It seems there is a conflict with the part mod and RealFuels. So, how to get the Soviet Engine Pack to work with Real Fuels?

1st: I have the version that is available from the Realism Overhaul thread (I am not running RO but got the parts from there).

I noticed that in the bobcat_kerofix patch under:

@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]

It addresses the propellant "LiquidFuel" and changes it to kerosene, yes???

But, in the Soviet Engine pack there is also a listing for a second propellant, just below Liquid Fuel, "LiquidOxygen". See here.

I am assuming this second propellant is the problem? The kero_fix patch doesnt seem to address this 2nd propellant. Therefore it would try to load that propellant from the Soviet Engines .cfg, yes? Then that would cause the problem???

TL;DR - As far as I can tell all the engines in this pack still call LiquidOxygen under ModuleEngineConfigs. Could I just amend the kerofix to also change liquidoxygen to lqdoxygen the same way?

Edited by JRA
didn't realize what tl:dr would do
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@Starwaster and @NathanKell,

I fixed this problem by altering your bobcatkerofix.cfg. It now also renames LiquidOxygen, lqdoxygen along with what you had, renaming liquidfuel kerosene.

I also added the RD0120 and RD0146 to the patch since they use LqdHydrogen and LqdOxygen. They were causing problems and it took me a bit to realize the problem was caused by the hydrogen being renamed as well.

Now RealFuels works with the Soviet Engine pack. I have a ? though. I used bobcats ration of 72.7 H2 to 27.3 O2. Is that correct? I assumed I should just go with what he did.

I also want to know if you want this patch? It allows me to use my game and I am happy to share it, if you want.

JRA

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Yes, the part.cfg of all the soviet engines include references to LiquidOxygen and LiquidH2. Yes, it was annoying. I got it from the Realism Overhaul thread. There is a link to it by mediafire(?) in the first post. I don't know if it is Dragon01's or just an archive that has been hanging around. I can tell you though that Dragon01's thread doesn't contain the soviet engines as far as I could tell. Perhaps I was on the wrong thread?

Thanks to you helping me decipher the log I think this file will fix it. I just took the kero_fix file and expanded to deal with all the issues (I think). I renamed it too, since it is no longer just dealing with kerosene.

If you see any problems with it let me know.

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dreadicon: thanks, and you too take your time! Surgery is never fun...

I'll take a peek at the configs in case I can discern the issue.

JRA, thanks for catching that. I had thought I had all the old-names fixed, but had not counted on other mods doing that. Yes, that is a truly ancient link btw. I'll cook up a patch to run on FINAL to try to fix that sort of thing though.

Dragon01: Indeed yes. It's planned, I've just been super busy. But since I saw you had the FX nearly done, I'll speed it up. :)

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Nathan, what do you think about something like this for RCS / RCSFX in Real Fuels?

It will make all RCS units behave like stock RCS treating their resources as STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW (overriding the resource definition)


@PART
[*]:NEEDS[RealFuels]:HAS[@MODULE[ModuleRCS*]]:Final
{
@MODULE[ModuleRCS*],*
{
%resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
@PROPELLANT
[*],*
{
%resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
}
}
@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs],*
{
@CONFIG
[*],*
{
@PROPELLANT
[*],*
{
%resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
}
}
}
}

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