Please explain the science lab...

[Smallish]

I'm confused, does the lab store data and you can use the science instruments, goo and what not, again and then re store the data and land with it in the lab? Or must you analyse it and then transmit the data from the lab to be able to add a second use of the instruments to the science total?

I know that sounds all messed up, but if you know, I think you'll know what I mean : )

thanks o/

[michaelhester07]

The science lab does 2 things:

1. Reset experiments on the ship it is attached to which are not resettable otherwise (goo, materials kit).

2. Increases the transmit value of experiments processed in it.

Part 2 applies to all experiments other than crew reports and eva reports, which get 100% transmit value.

IMO the science lab should be able to increase transmit value up to 70% or more. Otherwise it is only really good for resetting the goo and material experiments. That makes it useful to have 1 lander on a ship with those experiments that you can reset for trips to other planets or biomes. You'll have to return data to Kerbin to get full value off it. I haven't finished planning my first Jool mission but it will probably have a science lab and lander probes for the experiments. Lets me save fuel for manned landings.

[Smallish]

ok thanks, so, if I want to re use the experiments, you have have to transmit the data of the previous experiments ? In which case you need to do a lot of re using to make it worth while as , like you say, the % increase isn't that great..

I was hoping that it could store the data from previous experiments... it seems that's not the case, ie from multiple re uses of the experiments...

[Roastduck]

You can store experiment data in your command pod. Just EVA out to the experiment, right click, and hit "collect data." You can only hold the results from one experiment in each biome, though.

[gilflo]

Hi

I launched a ship with a science Lab and a lander with all the stuff for science experiments. The lab with a rockomax tank orbited over Minmus, while I undocked the lander to land to Minmus, making experiments, with the Mysterious Goo, the lab bay, I got also temperature and seismic data. I made an EVA once on ground to take a sample and proceed to an EVA report. Then I flew back to the mastership, docked to it, refueled and used the Lab to process experiments I made with the lander.

Then when you click to the lab, you can click "Process lab data" and review all the datas of your experiment: then you have 4 choices:

-Keep data

-Reset data

-Process to lab, that adds you a percentage to your science points.

-discard data

Except you cannot process EVA report and Sample

I understand that if you keep data,The experiment still remains in the lander where you made it and if you reset it, you loose it.

What I do not understand is what happened when you "process data": once it is done, the lab icon disappears and I thought that means it was stored in the Lab, but it s not the case, because I did that for all my experiments, except sample and EVA report, and when I landed my Lab on Kerbin I got only 20 points science for 1 experiment and I had processed 9 experiments.

So could somebody tell me how to use this lab ? How to use those 4 icons when your ship s docked to the lab with its experiments and you click process Lab data? See the picture, please.

I tried also and EVA, the Kerbal from the lander with its sample and its EVA report was exchanged with a Kerbal from the Lab, the Lab Kerbal going to the lander for a new mission and the Kerbal from the lander being in the Lab to bring down EVA report and sample.

The result is that I din not bring anything on Kerbin with the Lab, except 1 experiment and the lander made a 2nd mission to Minmus but the new Kerbal was not able to bring in it any sample nor EVA report, he had to leave them behind to embark.

Is the Lab only able to transmit data, not to store them and bring them back to Kerbin??

Edited January 8, 2014 by gilflo

[Panzerbeard]

ok thanks, so, if I want to re use the experiments, you have have to transmit the data of the previous experiments ? In which case you need to do a lot of re using to make it worth while as , like you say, the % increase isn't that great..

I was hoping that it could store the data from previous experiments... it seems that's not the case, ie from multiple re uses of the experiments...

As Roastduck said, you can transfer experiment data from the experiment module to a command capsule. The way I'm using it is to have it on a station in low Mun orbit, with some spare fuel. I have a reusable lander docked to the station that undocks, lands on a biome, then brings all the science back to the station and stores it in the Kerbin return vehicle, and then uses the lab to reset the experiments. I repeat this for as many biomes as I can, then send all the science back home with the return vehicle. It means you don't have to launch an entire rocket+lander for every individual biome, and saves you a lot of fuel, since the only thing that you need to return to kerbin is a pod + parachute. This will be much more useful when other planets get biomes, since you don't want to have to launch a new mission for every biome, you only need to send in fuel resupply tanks occasionally, or use Kethane. You could also just integrate the lab into the lander, but that's unneccesarily heavy and bulky (and looks silly, in my opinion)

Just to clarify, you can hold as many experiments as you like in a single command pod, as long as they aren't repeats; if you have, say, a Mystery Goo Container, a Science Jr, and a Gravioli Detector on your lander, you can get data for every single biome with each experiment, and store it in a single command pod. You can't, however, store the same experiment from the same location twice; you can have a Goo reading from the Farside Crater, and a Goo reading from the Polar Lowlands, both stored in the same pod, but you can't have 2 Goo readings from the same biome.

[gilflo]

Ashflare

So how do you transmit your experiments from your lander to your return vehicle, once they are docked together? Do this vehicle have to had a command pod with a Kerbal, like any lander or can it be just a command pod with a remote control?

I suppose you cannot store EVA and sample or can you transmit them from a Kerbal to another while they are making EVA outside the ships?

[Smallish]

@gilflo I too had the same experience as you, I did "a lot of science" from a lander docking with an orbiter of Mun that also had an operational science lab, I did 2 trips to Mun and took 2 complete sets of data/experiments, I then went to orbiter/lab, saved the data (not sure where it was saved) then returned to Kerbin with the command pod and the science lab. Everything landed perfectly and I got 2 science notes from what should have been around 10 or 12 I'm guessing... i'm really confused about this. Maybe the science data got saved to the Lander?

[KerbMav]

I too lost experiments several times in a row until I was able to return them to Kerbin savely - but I noticed this in Munar orbit already after a few runs to the surface. What buggers me is that I cannot tell what I did differently when it finally worked.

Ideas:

Did not (uselessly because the data was to be returned) process the data before I went to the Munar surface again (thereby putting the mothership outside of physics range).

Did not make use of the Data Transfer mod to empty out the thermometers around the lander pod.

[Tokay Gris]

Ashflare

So how do you transmit your experiments from your lander to your return vehicle, once they are docked together?

You have to extract them by hand (i.e. by EVA). You can also store experiments in the lander by right-click on the experiment (f.e. Goocontainer) and extract the data, then enter the lander. Then, the data gets transferred from the experiment to the command capsule.

Later, when you are docked, you can go EVA, right click the lander capsule, take the data from there and then enter (or right click) the orbiter capsule.

You have to be close, though.

Then, if you have the laboratory somewhere in this assembly, you can right click on it and clean out the experiments.

And then, you can use the same lander again, say, land in another biome.

Thats what I did on Minimus and am doing now on Mun.

Then, I left the lander as well as the laboratory in orbit around Minimus (or Mun) and returned the orbiter capsule with - in one case - 40 data packs in it.

So, basically, all I use the laboratory for is cleaning out the experiments. The data I get back to Kerbin. But not the lander.

Works like a charm and - if 0.24 doesn't put an abrupt halt to this safe - will be my method of operation for a Jool mission. Ideally, there will be about three vessels to Jool, but only one back.

[gilflo]

Thanks for the answer, but

Once you have transferred the data from the lander to your orbiter, then you undock and go to land again, the Goo experiment f.e, you can reset the Goo on your lander, you do not need the lab.

Same thing for temperature, gravity, etc... you can always reset them and discard them.

So that is why I don't really understand the utility of the Lab

[Smallish]

You have to extract them by hand (i.e. by EVA). You can also store experiments in the lander by right-click on the experiment (f.e. Goocontainer) and extract the data, then enter the lander. Then, the data gets transferred from the experiment to the command capsule.

Later, when you are docked, you can go EVA, right click the lander capsule, take the data from there and then enter (or right click) the orbiter capsule.

You have to be close, though.

Then, if you have the laboratory somewhere in this assembly, you can right click on it and clean out the experiments.

And then, you can use the same lander again, say, land in another biome.

Thats what I did on Minimus and am doing now on Mun.

Then, I left the lander as well as the laboratory in orbit around Minimus (or Mun) and returned the orbiter capsule with - in one case - 40 data packs in it.

So, basically, all I use the laboratory for is cleaning out the experiments. The data I get back to Kerbin. But not the lander.

Works like a charm and - if 0.24 doesn't put an abrupt halt to this safe - will be my method of operation for a Jool mission. Ideally, there will be about three vessels to Jool, but only one back.

Thank you for the description of process!

KSP keeps surprising, I never expected it to have this level of involvement. This explains why I returned with nothing after my last trip!

Thank you

[AnalogAddict]

How does one maximise the gain on returning science containers.

Take note of the Recovery value: 50 - yet the bar is approximately 75% full. Is there a way to up the value of returning science to its full potential?

Edited January 8, 2014 by AnalogAddict

[Smallish]

@ Analog, maybe that's a second goo experiment, they deplete in value.

@ Tokay, I just played around with my taking and storing data, it works great, thank you very much, it has made everything much clearer. I notice you can't re set the experiments though, so obviously this is the science lab's job...

[Tokay Gris]

@ Tokay, I just played around with my taking and storing data, it works great, thank you very much, it has made everything much clearer. I notice you can't re set the experiments though, so obviously this is the science lab's job...

Once you extract the data from the experiment (i.e. Goocontainer or Science Jr.) it gets "blocked". The data is no longer there and right clicking doesn't do anything anymore.

You need - so far with my testing - the laboratory to clean it out.

And keep in mind the laboratory actually needs two kerbals to operate.

[AnalogAddict]

@ Analog, maybe that's a second goo experiment, they deplete in value.

It was the first run, look through your Science Archives and you'll see where some experiments (not limited to the Goo Canister) do not have a full return value. Its interesting to say the least.