[0.90] Kerbin Shuttle Orbiter System v4.13

[PineApplePotatoe]

well can someone just gimme a download of just phase 1 and 3 but just phase 1 would be fine also

Edited July 15, 2014 by PineApplePotatoe

[Avalon304]

well can someone just gimme a download of just phase 1 and 3 but just phase 1 would be fine also

People have told you which parts you need to remove to just get phase 1 and have provided lists of the parts for phase 2 and 3 as well... download version 3.09 and remove the correct parts or wait. I believe there are plans to separate all the phases out into their own downloads when Phase 4 comes out.

[enneract]

7 days. Youre telling me that a person couldnt take 5 minutes to check this topic to see if the new version had come out and see that there was an LE skin? Thats all it would have taken to check the OP. Not only that... but even if you werent able to check on the day it came out... you had 6 more days, to take 5 minutes to check this topic to see if the new version was up and see that there was a special skin. Thats more than enough time. I hate missing on on LE goodies (and I have missed out on a lot of them both digital and physical) but thems the breaks...

Yea, actually, I am telling you that.

I could easily make judgements about you and your bizaare disconnected perspective, but I'm going to refrain. What I can say, though, is that checking a random forum topic once a week is a huge assumption to make on someone who works for a living and has a diversity of interests. I work 60-80hrs\wk, and do a multitude of things in my spare time - at the moment, I'm finished with KSP until .24, of course I'm not checking every modding thread in the forum on the offchance that some modder makes a somewhat crazy decision to withdraw the release of a component of their mod.

[qnistNAMEERF]

well can someone just gimme a download of just phase 1 and 3 but just phase 1 would be fine also

People have told you which parts you need to remove to just get phase 1 and have provided lists of the parts for phase 2 and 3 as well... download version 3.09 and remove the correct parts or wait. I believe there are plans to separate all the phases out into their own downloads when Phase 4 comes out.

After phase 4 is done there will be a windows installer that'll allow you to select which parts of the KSOS mod you want installed. I've tried it in WINE as well in Linux and it worked great on my system. I don't have a Mac system so I couldn't test it out in WINE there but one of the testers has a Mac so they may be able to do that if they're willing to install WINE. The phases may also be in separate downloads at that point but I don't know if that's for sure (because there is a bit of overlap between phases 1 through 3: phase 3 requires OMS from phase 1; phase 1 and phase 3 need round docking ports to ease payload installation; phase 1 needs aux fuel tank and stack shroud from phase 2; phase 2 needs right-angle docking mod from phase 1; etc). But you'll just have to be patient for its release. helldiver and Nazari are quite busy trying to get phase 4 done. So you can either remove the parts you want yourself, run the script included with v309 if you have a windows system, or wait until phase 4 is done. It really isn't hard to remove them yourself, especially since I made the phase part lists for you already. See this post for the phase part lists. I am also looking into multi-platform installers, but most of them require Java to be installed so I'm not sure if that's really a practical solution for everybody.

Edited July 15, 2014 by qnistNAMEERF

[helldiver]

I think the two of you (and others) misunderstood the purpose of the Limited Edition texture. I explained in the Stream I did leading up to the release as well as on the thread a few times, but it may have gotten buried and I can understand that not everyone watches the stream.

In short:

-The sole purpose of the LE was to reward the folks that had followed the development of the Super 25 including participation in the twitch stream. This was important to me since I liked the feedback and helped shape changes to it. (Name suggestions, design suggestions and ideas, NASA vs. Buran discussions).

-As a reward for being the first to download what I knew would be a buggy, difficult to fly, and game breaking (which sometimes happens), spacecraft during those release days.

-I didn't want it to be seen as a normal texture for the orbiter. Not only is it not realistic (painting expensive metallic tiles?), but it just wouldn't make sense that they'd fly up with all those decals stuck to the side of it. Hence once I put it up for a while, I deleted it (I don't have it on my backups or PC anymore as of 3.09). The Limited Edition texture or the Beta tester textures are not part of the mod

-And finally: Limited Edition, special, or what ever textures create a problem for me when it comes to updating. That's why it was limited. If I change UVW coordinates, change the mesh geometry, or do any change that requires a rebake, the LE texture would also have to be updated (the big contention at the time was the addition of the extra front RCS nozzles which were tentative. The plan was to remove them, they've stayed but I'd like to do further tests without them).

It would not apply to you guys now since well, I think most of those glaring bugs have been fixed I hope. In other words, it was a thank you for putting up with what could be a buggy mod those first few days.

It seems a little unfair that the people who actually couldn't get it won't be getting it simply because helldiver decided to do something so stupid that had nothing to be gained from.

Please, stop saying that a week is a long enough time for people to get it.

-This is incorrect. I now have two members of the KSO team that have provided invaluable feedback and one that has done significant improvements to how all of you will be able to receive and install this free content. That includes the splitting up of the mod into separate packs, as well as an intuitive installer. This is coming in Phase IV. Would they have joined otherwise? Who knows. Regardless I think and strongly believe having rewards like that incentivizes the KSOS community to use the mod, discuss it, and help improve it. You don't need the KSOS to play KSP, I don't get paid for you downloading KSOS. My only reward are the fans that use it and want to see more of it. These are the toys I want to play with when playing KSP, and I get some measure of satisfaction knowing others out there are also using it.

Now this may sound a little harsh, but take it in the spirit in which it's intended; I don't particularly care for the bulk of the KSP mod using community that don't use KSOS. I've alluded to it many times so it shouldn't come as a surprise. KSOS has never really been a parts pack, nor is it really what the majority of KSP Mod using players want. As such, I'm not really going to make the general KSP community happy, so I'd rather concentrate on our little community we have here.

The majority of folks that download KSOS install it, try it, and then uninstall it because they can't take the lifter, orbiter, or support pieces apart. KSOS really isn't for them.

Now then, if the KSOS community (you, and the others that download and use KSOS) want the LE texture up again and there is enough demand from everyone, then I'll put it up again and/or have Freeman make it part of the alternate installs. The problem with that, is that it creates a lot of issues for me which I explain above and creates a precedent. Which makes me not want to do any more LE textures since it creates more stuff I have to manage when making changes.

Yea, actually, I am telling you that.

I could easily make judgements about you and your bizaare disconnected perspective, but I'm going to refrain. What I can say, though, is that checking a random forum topic once a week is a huge assumption to make on someone who works for a living and has a diversity of interests. I work 60-80hrs\wk, and do a multitude of things in my spare time - at the moment, I'm finished with KSP until .24, of course I'm not checking every modding thread in the forum on the offchance that some modder makes a somewhat crazy decision to withdraw the release of a component of their mod.

The LE Texture is not a component of my mod, unless it becomes part of it as explained above. If that happens, then I'd rather just stick to the main texture used by the models in the mod.

...and

Every time the term 'license' comes up in the same sentence as 'mod', I have to suppress a snicker of derision. I'm not sure what started this obsession, but it certainly wasn't around when I started modding. I acknowledge that it is something that *can* be done, of course, but I still think it is absolutely ridiculous.

Some of us don't have the luxury of lurking on the forums constantly.

Correct, and it's not meant for you. As I said above, it was a reward for those people following the release that week (which got delayed into another week) and were logging into the stream.

The license we're using started to come up more and more since the DMCA. Before that most modders didn't put a license on their stuff (or were using the old share-alike). However, every mod back then had some form of copyright, particularly any mod for games that were technical (flight simulators or racing simulators).

So here's what would happen; you'd have some magazine that would include a CD with everyone's mods in them. Magazine got to charge, but none of us would get any money for it. Happened with Quake, Microsoft Flight Simulator, and on and on. You had very serious mods that required hours of research, suddenly show up on the back of a magazine CD that would charge. Mod authors got nothing from it.

Do you think that's fair?

Anyhow, after a few lawsuits (I can't be bothered to look it up at the moment), this all started to change. I believe these lawsuits also covered things like volunteer moderators or game guides. Mods have also significantly improved since then. Take a look at KSOS. Would you consider that the quality I put into it is on par with a DLC Squad would put out, or some indie company's game? The reason for that quality and effort in my part is the protections provided by the Creative Commons license.

And you're right I don't get paid, meaning the only cookies I get is the thank you from you guys, the support, and the donations.

[edit]Regarding sharing of textures

I think there's been some confusion regarding that as well.

-I've never said you can't share resources, what I asked earlier in the thread was that it be taken to PMs. This is because at the time, the KSOS was just phase 1, we had bugs to sort out, and numerous reports on things working or not. Suddenly you had a bunch of folks posting their alternate textures and other folks asking where to download and so forth. In the interest of keeping the thread relevant to bug reports, config file improvement sharing, usage sharing (which has been priority for me), I asked to take such threads to private messages. The core textures were also being changed and updated, hence why I discouraged it (see license details regarding no derivatives).

-The license does not allow you to make changes to any KSOS resource (it's art, 3D models, and now sounds) and share publicly. That is different than you wanting to share an unmodified LE texture with Enneract or TheSonicGalaxy. I'm fine with that, just ask that it be taken to PMs in the interest of reducing confusion or spam on the main thread.

-And finally (in the interest of reducing the PM spam I get). If you make a change to one of my textures and you want to share it with a friend(s), I'm ok with that. But keep it in PMs

Edited July 15, 2014 by helldiver

[Thesonicgalaxy]

I think the two of you (and others) misunderstood the purpose of the Limited Edition texture. I explained in the Stream I did leading up to the release as well as on the thread a few times, but it may have gotten buried and I can understand that not everyone watches the stream.

In short:

-The sole purpose of the LE was to reward the folks that had followed the development of the Super 25 including participation in the twitch stream. This was important to me since I liked the feedback and helped shape changes to it. (Name suggestions, design suggestions and ideas, NASA vs. Buran discussions).

-As a reward for being the first to download what I knew would be a buggy, difficult to fly, and game breaking (which sometimes happens), spacecraft during those release days.

-I didn't want it to be seen as a normal texture for the orbiter. Not only is it not realistic (painting expensive metallic tiles?), but it just wouldn't make sense that they'd fly up with all those decals stuck to the side of it. Hence once I put it up for a while, I deleted it (I don't have it on my backups or PC anymore as of 3.09). The Limited Edition texture or the Beta tester textures are not part of the mod

-And finally: Limited Edition, special, or what ever textures create a problem for me when it comes to updating. That's why it was limited. If I change UVW coordinates, change the mesh geometry, or do any change that requires a rebake, the LE texture would also have to be updated (the big contention at the time was the addition of the extra front RCS nozzles which were tentative. The plan was to remove them, they've stayed but I'd like to do further tests without them).

It would not apply to you guys now since well, I think most of those glaring bugs have been fixed I hope. In other words, it was a thank you for putting up with what could be a buggy mod those first few days.

-This is incorrect. I now have two members of the KSO team that have provided invaluable feedback and one that has done significant improvements to how all of you will be able to receive and install this free content. That includes the splitting up of the mod into separate packs, as well as an intuitive installer. This is coming in Phase IV. Would they have joined otherwise? Who knows. Regardless I think and strongly believe having rewards like that incentivizes the KSOS community to use the mod, discuss it, and help improve it. You don't need the KSOS to play KSP, I don't get paid for you downloading KSOS. My only reward are the fans that use it and want to see more of it. These are the toys I want to play with when playing KSP, and I get some measure of satisfaction knowing others out there are also using it.

Now this may sound a little harsh, but take it in the spirit in which it's intended; I don't particularly care for the bulk of the KSP mod using community that don't use KSOS. I've alluded to it many times so it shouldn't come as a surprise. KSOS has never really been a parts pack, nor is it really what the majority of KSP Mod using players want. As such, I'm not really going to make the general KSP community happy, so I'd rather concentrate on our little community we have here.

The majority of folks that download KSOS install it, try it, and then uninstall it because they can't take the lifter, orbiter, or support pieces apart. KSOS really isn't for them.

Now then, if the KSOS community (you, and the others that download and use KSOS) want the LE texture up again and there is enough demand from everyone, then I'll put it up again and/or have Freeman make it part of the alternate installs. The problem with that, is that it creates a lot of issues for me which I explain above and creates a precedent. Which makes me not want to do any more LE textures since it creates more stuff I have to manage when making changes.

The LE Texture is not a component of my mod, unless it becomes part of it as explained above. If that happens, then I'd rather just stick to the main texture used by the models in the mod.

Ah, here we go.

First off, I'd like to say that I wasn't talking about the KSO in general where you said what I said was incorrect, I was talking about making the Livery texture a LE.

Secondly, It makes a little more sense now that you explained why you made it a LE. I think your statement about not wanting to make it available to the public because it would mean more work kinda doesn't make sense because if there is an update to the S25, and people who did get the LE texture won't actually be able to use it anymore because it doesn't work. So even the special people will lose their gift. I will just assume you know that and are going with that.

Thanks for not turning into an arse about this whole ordeal, and instead responded pleasantly and nicely. Thanks for the wonderful mod, LE texture or not.

[helldiver]

Ah, here we go.

Thanks for the wonderful mod, LE texture or not.

Quite simply, ask someone who has a copy of it via PM to send it to you

And regarding the later. I assumed people would only use it for a limited time and then just revert to the normal one. I never thought it'd be that popular. It's like real aircraft; you don't see them at the airport in the Boeing promotional liveries...

[Woodstar]

We the players just can't handle not having ALL the great and cool stuff you create helldiver, I still don't see why squad hasn't offered you a job yet. Great work on all the mods you've made.

[sharpspoonful]

Am I the only one who is confused as to why people are getting worked up over not getting the Limited Edition texture? I mean, it was stated for weeks that he was going to pull it after some amount of time.

[enneract]

I think the two of you (and others) misunderstood the purpose of the Limited Edition texture. I explained in the Stream I did leading up to the release as well as on the thread a few times, but it may have gotten buried and I can understand that not everyone watches the stream.

..snip..

Correct, and it's not meant for you. As I said above, it was a reward for those people following the release that week (which got delayed into another week) and were logging into the stream.

Fair enough! I'll mention that I'm following you on twitch, and have been since the second day you were streaming. I even caught many of them, because watching the modelling process was interesting during downtime at work. I'll admit that I wasn't listening, though, and as such seem to have missed quite a bit. I would have been a bleeding-edge user if I had known the mod was out, without question. The only reason I'm holding off right now is because I know .24 is going to show up any time now, and I don't want to get started with something only to reset it in a few days.

The license we're using started to come up more and more since the DMCA. Before that most modders didn't put a license on their stuff (or were using the old share-alike). However, every mod back then had some form of copyright, particularly any mod for games that were technical (flight simulators or racing simulators).

So here's what would happen; you'd have some magazine that would include a CD with everyone's mods in them. Magazine got to charge, but none of us would get any money for it. Happened with Quake, Microsoft Flight Simulator, and on and on. You had very serious mods that required hours of research, suddenly show up on the back of a magazine CD that would charge. Mod authors got nothing from it.

Do you think that's fair?

Anyhow, after a few lawsuits (I can't be bothered to look it up at the moment), this all started to change. I believe these lawsuits also covered things like volunteer moderators or game guides. Mods have also significantly improved since then. Take a look at KSOS. Would you consider that the quality I put into it is on par with a DLC Squad would put out, or some indie company's game? The reason for that quality and effort in my part is the protections provided by the Creative Commons license.

And you're right I don't get paid, meaning the only cookies I get is the thank you from you guys, the support, and the donations.

Again, fair enough - and in a context like this, it actually makes sense, as this is wholly and objectively an original creation. My sniggering is reflexive, and mostly born of the MC modding community, where attempting to put a license which includes the terms 'do not decompile' on mods which are made by decompiling copyrighted commercial software is commonplace.

And regarding the later. I assumed people would only use it for a limited time and then just revert to the normal one. I never thought it'd be that popular. It's like real aircraft; you don't see them at the airport in the Boeing promotional liveries...

I imagine the LE and beta tester skins (though I imagine those will be much harder to 'leak'), will remain popular in the same way that alternate christenings are popular. It is also a way to differentiate multiple launches if one has the RAM to spare.

Am I the only one who is confused as to why people are getting worked up over not getting the Limited Edition texture? I mean, it was stated for weeks that he was going to pull it after some amount of time.

You miss the point, bro. Those of us with lives can't necessarily stay on top of this thread, or even the release non-schedule of this mod. Don't get me wrong, I'm not criticising said 'non-schedule', just pointing out that going from a daily check-in when actively playing KSP, to a weekly check-in when busy irl, to a bimonthly check-in when busy and not playing KSP is not exactly uncommon.

[Westi29]

The 75th of my STS KSO Shuttle Missions! STS 175 is the fifth flight of the Super 25! Ascension files again wearing the Limited Edition Corporate Livery Paint Scheme! STS 175's objective is to deploy the Colony Tug & Airlock Module on Asteroid Kerpophis. Due to corporate sponsorship, the Loyalists have changed their name to the Corporatists! No comment yet from the Rebels on this new, more profitable name.

STS 176 will deploy the Kerpophis Colony Habitat Module #1!

[Thesonicgalaxy]

The first STS mission of the U.K.A sitting on the launchpad ready to begin it's 5 day mission in space.

[Spartan-S63]

The first STS mission of the U.K.A sitting on the launchpad ready to begin it's 5 day mission in space.

What kind of launch tower/contraption is that over the top of the EFT? I've never seen anything like it. I do recognize the rest as FASA parts though.

[Railgunner2160]

The first STS mission of the U.K.A sitting on the launchpad ready to begin it's 5 day mission in space.

Are those caps you used to cover the texture where the V-tail is supposed to go included in the KSOS download or some other mod??

[Avalon304]

Are those caps you used to cover the texture where the V-tail is supposed to go included in the KSOS download or some other mod??

I do believe they are separate. I have not seen any parts like that in the KSO pack

[Chadley123]

It's like real aircraft; you don't see them at the airport in the Boeing promotional liveries...

[qnistNAMEERF]

The first STS mission of the U.K.A sitting on the launchpad ready to begin it's 5 day mission in space.

http://i.imgur.com/wdfsQgN.png?1

I'm curious how your RCS handles with just the single tail. Did you add more RCS nozzles to compensate for your configuration? Also, are you missing the OMS engines?

Edited July 15, 2014 by qnistNAMEERF

[Thesonicgalaxy]

What kind of launch tower/contraption is that over the top of the EFT? I've never seen anything like it. I do recognize the rest as FASA parts though.

It's a very wip Beanie Cap.

(The gif makes it look faster than it actually is.)

Are those caps you used to cover the texture where the V-tail is supposed to go included in the KSOS download or some other mod??

They were made with Proc. Parts.

I'm curious how your RCS handles with just the single tail. Did you add more RCS nozzles to compensate for your configuration? Also, are you missing the OMS engines?

TBH, I haven't even gotten this thing to orbit yet. I didn't like the models/textures of the ET and LRB of the s25, so I used proc. parts to make an ET and 2 SRB's. Now upon SRB sep I lose control of the S25. I'm still trying to fix that part. I'm sure though that if I put a few extra RCS nozzles it should work fine...right?

[qnistNAMEERF]

...

I imagine the LE and beta tester skins (though I imagine those will be much harder to 'leak'), will remain popular in the same way that alternate christenings are popular. It is also a way to differentiate multiple launches if one has the RAM to spare.

...

Haha, if you got RAM to spare and want to differentiate launches you should check out this.

...

TBH, I haven't even gotten this thing to orbit yet. I didn't like the models/textures of the ET and LRB of the s25, so I used proc. parts to make an ET and 2 SRB's. Now upon SRB sep I lose control of the S25. I'm still trying to fix that part. I'm sure though that if I put a few extra RCS nozzles it should work fine...right?

Well, you can use hyperedit to plant it in orbit and test out the RCS that way. I believe there is also an RCS balancer mod I've seen someone else talk about on here. It'll give a visual indicator in the VAB how your RCS handles while you construct it.

[Avalon304]

... beta tester skins (though I imagine those will be much harder to 'leak')...

That skin will likely never be released, as it was (and could possibly be again in the future) a way for helldiver to tell when screenshots were taken with prerelease builds.

It's a very wip Beanie Cap.

TBH, I haven't even gotten this thing to orbit yet. I didn't like the models/textures of the ET and LRB of the s25, so I used proc. parts to make an ET and 2 SRB's. Now upon SRB sep I lose control of the S25. I'm still trying to fix that part. I'm sure though that if I put a few extra RCS nozzles it should work fine...right?

How are you losing control? Front flipping? Back flipping? Just general acting crazy?

Also, yes, you seem to be missing the OMS engines in your shot... you'll want those... they have higher ISP in vacuum than the SSMEs.

And with a single tail, RCS is likely to be very difficult to use.

[Thesonicgalaxy]

That skin will likely never be released, as it was (and could possibly be again in the future) a way for helldiver to tell when screenshots were taken with prerelease builds.

How are you losing control? Front flipping? Back flipping? Just general acting crazy?

Also, yes, you seem to be missing the OMS engines in your shot... you'll want those... they have higher ISP in vacuum than the SSMEs.

And with a single tail, RCS is likely to be very difficult to use.

I had gotten way too distracted with the ET and SRBs that I had forgotten about the OMS engines, they have been put back on for a while now.

Front flipping.

[Avalon304]

Front flipping.

Your ET is too heavy. When you lose the thrust from the SRBs, your center of Mass is too far from your center of thrust.. I dunno if you launch with SAS, but you should be. If you are, then you need to lighten your ET, so the the SSMEs can thrust through the CoM.

[enneract]

Haha, if you got RAM to spare and want to differentiate launches you should check out this.

That was pretty much exactly what I was planning to do, yep.

Is that 'Serenity' christening one of the 'stock' options, or something you made, and\or something that has been otherwise released?

[Avalon304]

That was pretty much exactly what I was planning to do, yep.

Is that 'Serenity' christening one of the 'stock' options, or something you made, and\or something that has been otherwise released?

Its a custom name. The "official" (as in released by helldiver) names of the Super 25 are Ascension, Reliant, Providence and Steadfast.

[helldiver]

Walk around, Kerbodyne Gyronautics Kerbostar

-Tail will be separate.

-Tail Rotor separate part.

-Turbax Turboshaft and Main Rotor all one part.

-Fuselage separate part.

-Skids separate part.

-Not shown: Spotlight and Dome Camera.

Javascript is disabled. View full album

and introducing K-SEE News reporter and model, Kim Kerman:

-Kim K. will be released as a PSD kit similar to the KSO Patch Kit allowing folks to recolor, repost, change her hair, use her as pinup art for the side of their aircraft, etcetera. In the meantime you are free to use the above png in your signatures, edit it, repost it, do as you wish

The pinup artwork on the side of the fuse was inspired by the "Lilymarie"; http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/5222039501.jpg

Edited July 16, 2014 by helldiver