[WIP] Habitat parts - Development download 0.1 available

[blizzy78]

Development version now available:

Download BlizzWorksHabitat 0.1

This is a development release. Do not use for regular play. You have been warned.

Includes:

• Structural hub
  
• Hub pathway cover plate (regular and decoupler variants)
  
• Rover base for better wheel placement

Lookie:

More shots:

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Comments are most appreciated

Edited May 8, 2014 by blizzy78

[Mach_XXII]

Looks cool, I like it

[Deathsoul097]

Nice, it looks like a Boxy H.O.M.E part.

[MisterFister]

I'm not yet sure what to do with this. Comments are most appreciated

I don't recommend eating it. Or letting Jeb anywhere near it.

[CaptainKipard]

Needs more greebles.

[Helix935]

looks cool, does it have doors?

[MisterFister]

Needs more greebles.

Agreed. Though don't go crazy. I suppose the "useful greeble threshold" would at least partially rest on what exactly this part were intended to do.

looks cool, does it have doors?

The person asks an interesting question.

[bazz]

I'm not yet sure what to do with this. Comments are most appreciated

You could make more like it and make a surface base making mod? Perhaps some walkways, and modules with different Purposes...

E.g. Fuel dump, habitation, power plant, kethane mining or refining, comms array, science lab, rover bay, etc.

[blizzy78]

Needs more greebles.

I not so sure this particular part does, maybe aside from the odd scratch here or some dirtying the overall paint.

Edit: Having had a look at your hubs, I think I'll try going with bolts around the corners and see what it looks like.

looks cool, does it have doors?

This part does not. It's more like a structural hub, hence the "hatch" marks where docking ports or other structural pathways should be attached.

You could make more like it and make a surface base making mod? Perhaps some walkways, and modules with different Purposes...

E.g. Fuel dump, habitation, power plant, kethane mining or refining, comms array, science lab, rover bay, etc.

Yeah, I had something like this in mind. Not that it's entirely a new idea or that there aren't part packs like that

On a more technical side, I noticed that the VAB has a serious limitation in where you can place parts. That is, a part that defines stacking nodes always implicitly restricts which nodes of the next child parts can be used. For example, if a part only has the regular top and bottom stacking nodes, this will restrict the next child parts in that only their top or bottom nodes can be used. You can try that by using a lander can and the stock HubMax 6-way structural part: First place the lander can, then try to use one of the four non-top/bottom nodes of the HubMax to attach it. It will snap into place, but won't connect (stays transparent.)

For my particular part here this poses the problem that it can't be connected multiple times in a sideways fashion. (It also has six stacking nodes like the HubMax.) I wanted to add a 2-way and 4-way interconnect to place between parts, but that is not possible without rotating child parts a certain way. (Depending on the implicit restriction imposed.)

Edited May 2, 2014 by blizzy78

[wasmic]

It looks Bobcat. I like it!

[CaptainKipard]

I not so sure this particular part does, maybe aside from the odd scratch here or some dirtying the overall paint.

Edit: Having had a look at your hubs, I think I'll try going with bolts around the corners and see what it looks like.

Are you sure you understood what I meant? Greebles are 3D details, not texture details.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greeble

[blizzy78]

Are you sure you understood what I meant? Greebles are 3D details, not texture details.

Right, I misunderstood the explanation of the word (that I never heard before) when I looked it up. I got it now I'll see what I'm going to end up with. Thanks!

Nice, it looks like a Boxy H.O.M.E part.

It looks Bobcat. I like it!

Actually, the yellow of the striping is merely a coincidence. There aren't that many useful prime colors that don't look awful.

[blizzy78]

I've updated the part with a few more details here and there that should now hopefully give more of an idea of its dimensions. I've updated the OP accordingly.

[Helix935]

will it include a heat shield?

[Orionkermin]

Looking at it's size vs the fuel tank, I'm wondering, does it fit inside a 3.75m fairing? Just something for to consider for those that play w FAR. Otherwise looking good, I'm interested in seeing what you do with it.

[blizzy78]

will it include a heat shield?

Not sure yet. Considering that a heatshield should not come for free (in terms of mass), and that you don't always need it for your mission, I'd rather do it as a separate part.

Looking at it's size vs the fuel tank, I'm wondering, does it fit inside a 3.75m fairing?

It should - it is a fair bit smaller in diameter than the new NASA 3.75 m tanks.

I'm interested in seeing what you do with it.

Heh, me too

[Talisar]

On a more technical side, I noticed that the VAB has a serious limitation in where you can place parts. That is, a part that defines stacking nodes always implicitly restricts which nodes of the next child parts can be used. For example, if a part only has the regular top and bottom stacking nodes, this will restrict the next child parts in that only their top or bottom nodes can be used. You can try that by using a lander can and the stock HubMax 6-way structural part: First place the lander can, then try to use one of the four non-top/bottom nodes of the HubMax to attach it. It will snap into place, but won't connect (stays transparent.)

For my particular part here this poses the problem that it can't be connected multiple times in a sideways fashion. (It also has six stacking nodes like the HubMax.) I wanted to add a 2-way and 4-way interconnect to place between parts, but that is not possible without rotating child parts a certain way. (Depending on the implicit restriction imposed.)

I know the behavior you are speaking of here, but I believe that you are incorrect as to the reason behind it. From what I understand, the only nodes that can be used in order to attach a part when placing it are the last two node_stack_xxx (and a node_attach if defined at all). Any nodes defined before those two will allow you to attach other parts to them (albeit without symmetry), but you will not be able to use them when attaching that part itself.

For example, I assume your current setup looks similar to this:

node_stack_front =   0.00, 0.00,  0.40, 0.0, 0.0,  1.0, 1
node_stack_back =    0.00, 0.00, -0.40, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 1

node_stack_left =    0.40, 0.00, 0.00,  1.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1
node_stack_right =  -0.40, 0.00, 0.00, -1.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1

node_stack_top =     0.00,  0.40, 0.00, 0.0,  1.0, 0.0, 1
node_stack_bottom =  0.00, -0.40, 0.00, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 1

but if you change it to this:

node_stack_front =   0.00, 0.00,  0.40, 0.0, 0.0,  1.0, 1
node_stack_back =    0.00, 0.00, -0.40, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 1

node_stack_top =     0.00,  0.40, 0.00, 0.0,  1.0, 0.0, 1
node_stack_bottom =  0.00, -0.40, 0.00, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 1

node_stack_left =    0.40, 0.00, 0.00,  1.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1
node_stack_right =  -0.40, 0.00, 0.00, -1.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1

You'd be able to place it to the sides, but not the front, back, top or bottom.

[blizzy78]

From what I understand, the only nodes that can be used in order to attach a part when placing it are the last two node_stack_xxx (and a node_attach if defined at all). Any nodes defined before those two will allow you to attach other parts to them (albeit without symmetry), but you will not be able to use them when attaching that part itself.

Your observation is perfectly correct. I must have drawn the wrong conclusions from my testing.

My statement still stands, though, that is, it's a serious limitation of the editor.

For example, I assume your current setup looks similar to this:

but if you change it to this:

You'd be able to place it to the sides, but not the front, back, top or bottom.

Yes, indeed this does work as you describe it. Unfortunately this workaround is not a good one because you can't use the top/bottom any longer to connect the parts.

[Talisar]

Unfortunately this workaround is not a good one because you can't use the top/bottom any longer to connect the parts.

True, this limitation has bothered me quite often. The only viable workaround I have thought of that would be working within this limitation, I am personally unable to implement due to lack of the particular skill. However, you are likely more than capable if you wanted to try it. My thought is a plugin that gave a right-click option that would either directly change which 2 attach nodes were available, or cycle through 3 separate (identical other than where the nodes were placed in the config file) parts.

-edit: Bah, nevermind. For some reason it never occurred to me until I actually re-read my post that the part would have to be placed (incorrectly) before you could right click it.

[CaptainKipard]

You can get around this limitation by using Select Root. I link to it in my release thread because it's pretty much necessary if you want to use my T hubs

[blizzy78]

Added some more parts - a rover base so that you can place wheels better, and a cover plate to cover up unused hub pathways:

Cover plate put in place. As you can see, it fits snugly.

Edited May 4, 2014 by blizzy78

[AntiMatter001]

just want to know but since this has come so far... do you have any ETA? or could i posibly just uhm get it to mess around with?... maybe... (was thinking of cargo box inside B9 cargobay with parachute so i could air drop supplies to my mineing base on eve.... (i have 3 bases one of which is in dire need of food)

[blizzy78]

just want to know but since this has come so far... do you have any ETA?

No ETA yet, I'm sorry. I'm not even 100% sure of the general direction this will go, hence the posting in Addon Development rather than Addon Releases. For the time being, I won't even promise this will ever make it to release. If it will, I'd like it to be more complete than just the three parts I have now. Please note though that I really appreciate all the comments about the development so far, so please keep those coming

About the B9 cargo bay, I haven't checked if this will fit. Even if it doesn't, I kind of like the scale of the parts right now, so I don't think that will change.

[blizzy78]

I've noticed that when I set the new rover base "cap" to also allowing radial attachment, it is easily possible to place multiple of those hubs laterally:

Edited May 5, 2014 by blizzy78

[CaptainKipard]

I like that pipe. It's the best pipe on that whole hub