Raptor831

Stockalike RF Engine Configs v3.2.6 [01/20/19][RF v12]

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Can we get engine configs for BoxSat engines by any chance?

Oh and is it intentional that you set upper stage engines from KW, like Vesta VR-1 and Maverick-1D to only a single ignition? I remember them having 4 before.

It's really hard to use them as an upper stage engine if they only have a single ignition.

I can look at BoxSat. Didn't realize they had engines. :)

As for ignitions, the "default" is to have 1 ignitions for non-hypergolic fuels and a set number for hypergolic fuels. Which essentially means that the engines don't have an on-board ignition source. You need hypergolics to relight. That said, there are exceptions (I'm looking at you, J-2 clones) to that rule all over the place. It's an engineering pain to give them multiple ignitions, especially if it's not a pressure-fed engine.

And to be completely honest, I have no idea if the ignitions changed from before. The configs have been changed about 5 times this week alone :wink:, and I never played with EngineIgnitor before RF rolled that feature in. So for now, it's "working as designed". But I'm always open to discussion on these kinds of things.

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I suggest using TL-linked ignitions. That means that 60s era engines can have 1 ignition and modern engines a good few (example, Merlin 1D Vac is pump-fed, kerolox, but still has multiple ignitions).

Though in general, vacuum engines do tend to have multiple ignitions no matter their cycle or propellant type; the S1.5400 from 1960 was staged combustion kerolox and supported multiple ignitions (needed to insert Molniya sats into their orbits), and RL10 had multiple ignitions from the start.

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I suggest using TL-linked ignitions. That means that 60s era engines can have 1 ignition and modern engines a good few (example, Merlin 1D Vac is pump-fed, kerolox, but still has multiple ignitions).

Though in general, vacuum engines do tend to have multiple ignitions no matter their cycle or propellant type; the S1.5400 from 1960 was staged combustion kerolox and supported multiple ignitions (needed to insert Molniya sats into their orbits), and RL10 had multiple ignitions from the start.

There's something about vacuum engines I'm wondering about, specifically hypergolic engines.

I've been trying to get into the details of IRL engine ignitions, and some of it is a little confusing. Some sources simply state that hypergolic engines don't need ignition, but others sources describe hypergolic engines being limited to a rated number of ignitions/restarts. I suppose it makes sense, given that the components can't be expected to work forever, but are there IRL hypergolic engines that are effectively capable of many (>20-30 or 100+) restarts? I remember reading that the Apollo SPS was theoretically rated to 100s of restarts, but I don't know how true that it is.

For monopropellant engines, I'm reading that early hydrazine engines were limited by the number of start slugs they had. For more modern engines using catalyst beds, the number of restarts was "almost unlimited." In the case of these types of engines, maybe # of ignitions could just be set to -1 in the configs.

I'm just trying to get an idea of how many ignitions would make sense for in-game orbital maneuvering or descent engines. I'm still looking for a good summary with this kind of detailed information.

Edited by allenby

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I think this is a stockalike config problem so I'll post this here. I found this popping up in the output log file. Probably the config for this is not set correctly?

(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

For part KWrcsQuad45, Current nodes:


(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

*RFMEC* ERROR Can't find configuration Aerozine50+NTO, falling back to first tech-available config.

(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

*RFMEC* ERROR could not find configuration of name Aerozine50+NTO and could find no fallback config.

Also I don't know what the issue is but I'm not getting sounds for the LV-1 "Ant" engine. Probably this is a different issue but just in case.

This is what I dug out of the output log file that seems related.

(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Can not play a disabled audio source

Edited by ebigunso

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There's something about vacuum engines I'm wondering about, specifically hypergolic engines.

I've been trying to get into the details of IRL engine ignitions, and some of it is a little confusing. Some sources simply state that hypergolic engines don't need ignition, but others sources describe hypergolic engines being limited to a rated number of ignitions/restarts. I suppose it makes sense, given that the components can't be expected to work forever, but are there IRL hypergolic engines that are effectively capable of many (>20-30 or 100+) restarts? I remember reading that the Apollo SPS was theoretically rated to 100s of restarts, but I don't know how true that it is.

For monopropellant engines, I'm reading that early hydrazine engines were limited by the number of start slugs they had. For more modern engines using catalyst beds, the number of restarts was "almost unlimited." In the case of these types of engines, maybe # of ignitions could just be set to -1 in the configs.

I'm just trying to get an idea of how many ignitions would make sense for in-game orbital maneuvering or descent engines. I'm still looking for a good summary with this kind of detailed information.

I'd go with something similar to what NK said above. Early orbital engines probably 8-12 ignitions. Later engines, might as well do unlimited. Same with descent engines, really, because it's pretty much the same engine.

I'm probably going to re-balance these ignitions in Stockalike now that it really matters to baseline Real Fuels.

I think this is a stockalike config problem so I'll post this here. I found this popping up in the output log file. Probably the config for this is not set correctly?

(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

For part KWrcsQuad45, Current nodes:


(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

*RFMEC* ERROR Can't find configuration Aerozine50+NTO, falling back to first tech-available config.

(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

*RFMEC* ERROR could not find configuration of name Aerozine50+NTO and could find no fallback config.

Also I don't know what the issue is but I'm not getting sounds for the LV-1 "Ant" engine. Probably this is a different issue but just in case.

This is what I dug out of the output log file that seems related.

(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 56)

Can not play a disabled audio source

The audio issue is probably not Stockalike, since it doesn't mess with any EFFECTS nodes or anything like that.

Something is obviously off with the first issue though. I'll check the config later on today, but can you grab the final PART node from your MM cache and post it? Would be curious to see what the final result is.

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*RFMEC* ERROR could not find configuration of name Aerozine50+NTO and could find no fallback config.

I might have seen this one already, with the OMS/RCS combos from SpaceY, which I may or may not have set up myself. I found that the thrusters are still usable in all configurations, but it takes a lot of fiddling around (attaching, reattaching, reselecting config - after some time it usually works) to get it to work.

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The audio issue is probably not Stockalike, since it doesn't mess with any EFFECTS nodes or anything like that.

Something is obviously off with the first issue though. I'll check the config later on today, but can you grab the final PART node from your MM cache and post it? Would be curious to see what the final result is.

I don't quite get what file you are referencing by MM cache, but I assume you mean the ModuleManager.ConfigCache file?

This would be the last PART node if that is correct. I really doubt this is anything related though so I'm probably wrong :S

UrlConfig
{
name = C3_Tank_03
type = PART
parentUrl = UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Tank_03
url = UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Tank_03/C3_Tank_03
PART
{
name = C3_Tank_03
module = Part
author = RoverDude
rescaleFactor = 3
node_stack_side = 0,0,-0.6,0,0,-1,3
node_attach = 0,0,-0.6,0,0,1,3
node_stack_top = 0.0, 1, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 3
node_stack_bottom = 0, -1, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 3
breakingForce = 2072
breakingTorque = 2072
TechRequired = advLogistics
entryCost = 7600
cost = 3800
category = Utility
subcategory = 0
title = Kontainer Tank (3.75m)
manufacturer = USI - Freight Division
description = Shipping container for transporting various goods
attachRules = 1,1,1,1,0
mass = 10.4
dragModelType = default
maximum_drag = 0.20
minimum_drag = 0.15
angularDrag = 2
crashTolerance = 45
maxTemp = 2000
bulkheadProfiles = size3,srf
emissiveConstant = 0.2
MODEL
{
model = UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank
texture = Tank_00, UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_02
}
MODULE
{
name = FStextureSwitch2
textureNames = UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_00;UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_01;UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_02;UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_03;UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_04;UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_05;UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_06;;UmbraSpaceIndustries/Kontainers/Assets/Tank_07
objectNames = Tank
textureDisplayNames = LFO;Water;Chemicals;Organics;Mulch;LH2;LiqudFuel;MonoPropellant
useFuelSwitchModule = true
fuelTankSetups = 0;1;2;3;4;5;6;7
}
MODULE
{
name = FSfuelSwitch
resourceNames = LiquidFuel,Oxidizer;Water;Chemicals;Organics;Mulch;LqdHydrogen;LiquidFuel;MonoPropellant
resourceAmounts = 5850,7150;65000;65000;65000;65000;65000;13000;13000
initialResourceAmounts = 0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0
tankCost = 13000;13000;1052000;44000;13000;15000;13000;19500
basePartMass = 10.4
tankMass = 0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0
hasGUI = false
}
MODULE
{
name = USI_ModuleResourceWarehouse
}
MODULE
{
name = BBModule
}
MODULE
{
name = FMRS_PM
parent_vessel = 0
}
MODULE
{
name = ModuleThermometer
}
MODULE
{
name = USI_ModuleRecycleablePart
Menu = Scrap Part
ResourceName = Recyclables
Efficiency = .8
}
MODULE
{
name = USI_ModuleRecycleablePart
Menu = Salvage Part
ResourceName = SpecializedParts
Efficiency = .4
}
MODULE
{
name = GeometryPartModule
}
MODULE
{
name = FARAeroPartModule
}
MODULE
{
name = FARPartModule
}
MODULE
{
name = KOSNameTag
}
}
}

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Ha! Sorry, bad explanation on my part. I meant the KWrcsQuad45 part. I used "final" as in the "end result of all the config edits". I haven't mucked around in there much, but that should be available in the ModuleManager.ConfigCache.

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Here's the part on the subject matter. It's strange as I see the AZ50+NTO config in here...

UrlConfig
{
name = KWrcsQuad45
type = PART
parentUrl = KWRocketry/Parts/RCS/KWrcsQuad45/part
url = KWRocketry/Parts/RCS/KWrcsQuad45/part/KWrcsQuad45
PART
{
name = KWrcsQuad45
module = Part
author = KW Rocketry
scale = 1.0
node_attach = 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0
TechRequired = advFlightControl
entryCost = 3400
cost = 450
category = Control
subcategory = 0
title = MK1-45 RCS Quad
manufacturer = KW Rocketry
description = A set of hypergolic reaction control thrusters for attitude control and translation in space. This version is angled at 45 degrees for better translation on a angled surface.
attachRules = 0,1,0,0,0
mass = 0.0146
dragModelType = default
maximum_drag = 0.001
minimum_drag = 0.001
angularDrag = 2
crashTolerance = 15
maxTemp = 3600
emissiveConstant = 0.2
MODEL
{
model = KWRocketry/Parts/RCS/KWrcsQuad45/KW_RCS_1mBlock45
scale = 1,1,1
}
MODULE
{
name = ModuleRCSFX
thrusterTransformName = RCSthruster
thrusterPower = 0.231
atmosphereCurve
{
key = 0 281
key = 1 101
}
PROPELLANT
{
name = Hydrazine
ratio = 100
}
}
MODULE
{
name = BBModule
}
MODULE
{
name = FMRS_PM
parent_vessel = 0
}
MODULE
{
name = ModuleThermometer
}
MODULE
{
name = TweakScale
type = free
TWEAKSCALEEXPONENTS
{
mass = 2.5
}
}
MODULE
{
name = USI_ModuleRecycleablePart
Menu = Scrap Part
ResourceName = Recyclables
Efficiency = .8
}
MODULE
{
name = USI_ModuleRecycleablePart
Menu = Salvage Part
ResourceName = SpecializedParts
Efficiency = .4
}
MODULE
{
name = GeometryPartModule
}
MODULE
{
name = FARAeroPartModule
}
MODULE
{
name = FARPartModule
}
MODULE
{
name = KOSNameTag
}
MODULE
{
name = ModuleEngineConfigs
type = ModuleRCSFX
techLevel = 1
origTechLevel = 1
engineType = L
origMass = 0.0146
configuration = Hydrazine
modded = false
CONFIG
{
name = MMH+NTO
thrusterPower = 0.4
IspSL = 0.4
IspV = 0.952
PROPELLANT
{
name = MMH
ratio = 0.51135562
}
PROPELLANT
{
name = NTO
ratio = 0.48864438
}
}
CONFIG
{
name = Hydrazine
thrusterPower = 0.231
IspSL = 0.23
IspV = 0.72
PROPELLANT
{
name = Hydrazine
ratio = 1
}
}
CONFIG
{
name = HTP
thrusterPower = 0.096
IspSL = 0.2
IspV = 0.465
PROPELLANT
{
name = HTP
ratio = 1
}
}
CONFIG
{
name = Nitrogen
thrusterPower = 0.09
IspSL = 0.1
IspV = 0.195
PROPELLANT
{
name = Nitrogen
ratio = 1
}
}
CONFIG
{
name = NitrousOxide
thrusterPower = 0.09
IspSL = 0.253
IspV = 0.5
PROPELLANT
{
name = NitrousOxide
ratio = 1
}
}
CONFIG
{
name = UDMH+NTO
thrusterPower = 0.397
IspSL = 0.396
IspV = 0.943
PROPELLANT
{
name = UDMH
ratio = 0.47823219
}
PROPELLANT
{
name = NTO
ratio = 0.52176781
}
}
CONFIG
{
name = MonoPropellant
thrusterPower = 0.231
IspSL = 0.243
IspV = 0.64
PROPELLANT
{
name = MonoPropellant
ratio = 1
}
}
CONFIG
{
name = Aerozine50+NTO
thrusterPower = 0.4
IspSL = 0.403
IspV = 0.955
PROPELLANT
{
name = Aerozine50
ratio = 0.48657718
}
PROPELLANT
{
name = NTO
ratio = 0.51342282
}
}
}
}
}

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Here's the part on the subject matter. It's strange as I see the AZ50+NTO config in here...

That is odd. It would imply to me that the config is set up properly. There's MRCSFX node, the MEC node references the right RCS node, the configs are all there. :confused: Does the AZ50/NTO configuration actually work in-game? And when exactly in-game do you get the errors?

Also, maybe pastebin-ing your full log might help. I'm beginning to suspect something's going on within RF and not specifically Stockalike... But as always, I could be totally wrong.

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KER is showing the maximum thrust and TWR properly, but is showing the current thrust and TWR as zero using the latest configs. Not sure whose bug this is

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That is odd. It would imply to me that the config is set up properly. There's MRCSFX node, the MEC node references the right RCS node, the configs are all there. :confused: Does the AZ50/NTO configuration actually work in-game? And when exactly in-game do you get the errors?

Also, maybe pastebin-ing your full log might help. I'm beginning to suspect something's going on within RF and not specifically Stockalike... But as always, I could be totally wrong.

Sorry, I wasn't being clear enough too. As I mentioned in the previous post, I had the sound issue (also effects for the LV-1 were missing too, same with RCS I used) and that was the reason I went to dig inside the output log.

The config error line was just something I found while I was at it.

In game, I seemed to be getting thrust from the RCS thrusters and it did have fuel drain so I guess it was working. Just that it didn't have any effects associated with it, which probably is a whole different issue as you said.

As for the full log, the file is so large that it's taking so long to upload (360MB gees), so I'll get that link posted once that's complete.

Please bare with the DRE error spam inside, that was due to me using an old version of DRE. Just delete all to make it easier to read.

EDIT: Here's the download link for that log file.

http://www./download/2xpqv1jcq8gj0ah/output_log.txt

KER is showing the maximum thrust and TWR properly, but is showing the current thrust and TWR as zero using the latest configs. Not sure whose bug this is

I also had this issue with KER, in my case the current stage's Dv and stage remaining time reads 0 while the stage is burning. Every other reading has no problem.

I'll try testing if it's actually a RF or StockAlike problem later.

Edited by ebigunso

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Sorry, I wasn't being clear enough too. As I mentioned in the previous post, I had the sound issue (also effects for the LV-1 were missing too, same with RCS I used) and that was the reason I went to dig inside the output log.

The config error line was just something I found while I was at it.

In game, I seemed to be getting thrust from the RCS thrusters and it did have fuel drain so I guess it was working. Just that it didn't have any effects associated with it, which probably is a whole different issue as you said.

As for the full log, the file is so large that it's taking so long to upload (360MB gees), so I'll get that link posted once that's complete.

Please bare with the DRE error spam inside, that was due to me using an old version of DRE. Just delete all to make it easier to read.

EDIT: Here's the download link for that log file.

http://www./download/2xpqv1jcq8gj0ah/output_log.txt

I also had this issue with KER, in my case the current stage's Dv and stage remaining time reads 0 while the stage is burning. Every other reading has no problem.

I'll try testing if it's actually a RF or StockAlike problem later.

I guess unless the parts just don't work, I wouldn't worry about it. :shrug: Might need to ask on the RF thread as well, because I just don't think the configs specifically would cause that error. I really should dig around in the RF code to see what goes on with these things! :wink: Oh, and that logfile! Wow! Never seen one that large before!

As for KER, that's also more than likely a RF-KER interaction issue. My bet is that because RF now uses a different engine module (ModuleEnginesRF) KER might not know what to do with it. But with it working on other stages, I'm not sure...

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If you have updated to the latest realfuels - the way engineconfigs has to be written seems to have changed. basically, all instances of ModuleEnginesFX and ModuleEngines have to be changed to ModuleEnginesRF (both the actual engine module and the engine type thing on moduleengineconfigs) to work properly. Also, the ullage thing is now a single line in the config itself - not through engineignitor

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If you have updated to the latest realfuels - the way engineconfigs has to be written seems to have changed. basically, all instances of ModuleEnginesFX and ModuleEngines have to be changed to ModuleEnginesRF (both the actual engine module and the engine type thing on moduleengineconfigs) to work properly. Also, the ullage thing is now a single line in the config itself - not through engineignitor

The configs are updated if you grab the dev version from the repo. They aren't quite "release"-ready, but they shouldn't cause any issues. I have a few more additions I wanted to get in before there's an official release. But, the new stuff for RF (like ModuleEnginesRF) is updated there. That said, if you've found errors in the dev version, please let me know specifics so I can fix them. :)

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The configs are updated if you grab the dev version from the repo. They aren't quite "release"-ready, but they shouldn't cause any issues. I have a few more additions I wanted to get in before there's an official release. But, the new stuff for RF (like ModuleEnginesRF) is updated there. That said, if you've found errors in the dev version, please let me know specifics so I can fix them. :)

The Github dev version has ullage simulation set to true for SRBs.

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The Github dev version has ullage simulation set to true for SRBs.

See, I told you they weren't ready. :wink: That one is "fixed" in the webapp, but it hasn't filtered down to the configs yet. In the meantime you can drop this in a config to stop ullage:


@PART[*]:HAS[@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]:HAS[#engineType[S]]]
{
@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]
{
@CONFIG,*
{
@ModuleEngineIgnitor
{
@useUllageSimulation = false
}
}
}
}

@PART[*]:HAS[@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]:HAS[#engineType[S+]]]
{
@MODULE[ModuleEngineConfigs]
{
@CONFIG,*
{
@ModuleEngineIgnitor
{
@useUllageSimulation = false
}
}
}
}

Note, this is untested, but it should work.

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You said you want to add some new part configs into the release and that's taking time, so is it possible to push a fix/compatibility release first and then work on adding new configs for the feature release after that?

I don't want to play KSP without RF anymore :P

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You said you want to add some new part configs into the release and that's taking time, so is it possible to push a fix/compatibility release first and then work on adding new configs for the feature release after that?

I don't want to play KSP without RF anymore :P

Yeah, I can do that. :) I'll get the SRB ullage fixed in the configs and push a proper release. That way CKAN will update as well. I'll shoot for tonight (UTC -4), but no promises on that.

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Pushed a release with the ullage fixed. I should be getting down to just the feature additions at this point. There are still a few configs that aren't fully updated (SpaceY for example) since they're not quite as cut-and-dried as the others. But, they'll get done as always. Oh, and Cryo Engines snuck into this release!

Download the release from the OP, or use CKAN once it picks up the latest release.

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Thank you for the update. Your work is really appreciated.

Possible bug:

Having a strange issue where RLA-Stockalike engines are simply not showing up in the VAB. RLA parts show up again when the corresponding Stockalike RF cfg is removed. Only tested with RLA-Stockalike 12.1. Testing with the experimental version of RLA is slower as they've changed all the PART names, but seems to be the same issue with that version as well.

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Hm, why do I need ullage even though I have a ProcPart ServiceModule tank? Same thing for stock pressurized tanks.

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Thank you for the update. Your work is really appreciated.

Possible bug:

Having a strange issue where RLA-Stockalike engines are simply not showing up in the VAB. RLA parts show up again when the corresponding Stockalike RF cfg is removed. Only tested with RLA-Stockalike 12.1. Testing with the experimental version of RLA is slower as they've changed all the PART names, but seems to be the same issue with that version as well.

Dunno about that one. Can you post a log with that error? Stockalike shouldn't be nuking parts off the list...

Hm, why do I need ullage even though I have a ProcPart ServiceModule tank? Same thing for stock pressurized tanks.

See here for explanation: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/81239-Stockalike-RF-Engine-Configs-v2-1-8-7-22-15?p=2060370&viewfull=1#post2060370

TL;DR: Because they're supposed to.

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