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Stockalike RF Engine Configs v3.2.6 [01/20/19][RF v12]


Raptor831
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46 minutes ago, SirusKing said:

That's the one, yes.  I definitely see some odd things going on, I'll test with RF Stockalike and AJE when I get home to see if I can replicate.

BTW, I think your copies of Kopernicus and Interstellar Fuel Switch are outdated.  Not related to this, but they appear to be throwing some exceptions and might cause other unexpected things to happen.

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5 hours ago, Errol said:

So I've been trying to learn MM by doing trying to modify behaviour of these mods for my career save. I haven't started a save or anything yet, just setting up still. Basically I only want the engine ignitor functionality. I managed to revert all the tanks to using their stock fuels only by deleted the appropriate modular tank .cfgs

In experimenting with removing different parts of the engine .cfgs included with this though have not yet yeilded any stock engines running their old stock resources or requiring engine ignitor (did see ignitions show up after installing everything before I started mucking about).

I've been noodling around the MM thread, but that is all way above my head. Can anyone help me out?

If you just want ignitions on a stock engine, you'd almost be better off writing a plugin specifically for that. Or you could fork HoneyFox's code (like RF did) and go that route.

There's too much going on in RF to undo everything to get down to ignitions. At least in a reasonable fashion. You could just remove the Stockalike configs and roll your own ignition configs. Just take the parts and add ignitions as desired. It'd look like this:

@PART[partName]
{
	@MODULE[ModuleEngine*]
	{
		@name = ModuleEnginesRF
		%ignitions = 4
		IGNITOR_RESOURCE
		{
			name = ElectricCharge
			amount = 0.5
		}
	}
}

But you'd need one for each engine. And I'm also not sure of any other "side effects" that would cause, so use at your own risk. :wink:

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@SirusKing Figured it out, can't believe I neglected to check this.  The config I added to RF Stockalike to adjust the SABRE was added after the last release of RF Stockalike.  So if you go to the main Github page and click 
"Download Zip" (on the right near the top) and install RF Stockalike from there you will get the corrected patches.

@Raptor831 Maybe it's time to release a new version?  Not much has changed since the last but those fixes might be important to some people.

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2 hours ago, JtHermit said:

@Raptor831 Could you please change two lines in Stockalike_Tantares.cfg?

There are wrong types of internal tanks for Tantares_Engine_A and Tantares_Engine_B: "Service" instead of "ServiceModule".

Thank you for your configs. :rolleyes:

@JtHermit Yes, I can swap those. And it also looks like the Tantares configs that used to be in their download are gone. Welp. Looks like I need to add those in ASAP.

EDIT: Updated the repo with this fix. Download from there if you need this.

Edited by Raptor831
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Hello Raptor831, it is planned to add Blue Dog Rockets to your mod? I wish i knew how to do it... :(

It's the US Stockalike "Tantares", but the RFuels give the rocket a HUGE deltaV taking out the challenge.

Kind regards.

 

Edited by RickKermen
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@RickKermen It is on my list of ones to add. Unfortunately, I haven't had a good block of time to get the newer mods into the system. There is a link to a config generator in the OP, which you can try and make some configs yourself. It takes care of the writing for you and you can just play with the stats. To make them work well with the other RF, you'll need to set the thrust as it is in the original part and adjust the other stats around it.

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Thank you very much, I appreciate it. :D

If I posted the patch I made, would you be able to tell me what I did wrong? I calculated the correct (I think) numbers for the size of the tanks working backwards from the real shuttle and scaling down the volumes appropriately, and altered the RCS/OMS bits to use RF in the correct ratios, but it didn't work right - partly because dedicated tanks are unavailable, I think?

Edited by MelancholyFlapper
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1 hour ago, MelancholyFlapper said:

Thank you very much, I appreciate it. :D

If I posted the patch I made, would you be able to tell me what I did wrong? I calculated the correct (I think) numbers for the size of the tanks working backwards from the real shuttle and scaling down the volumes appropriately, and altered the RCS/OMS bits to use RF in the correct ratios, but it didn't work right - partly because dedicated tanks are unavailable, I think?

Post away. Dropbox link or other fileshare service would be best.

For tanks: usually you can just multiply the current amount of LF/O/Monoprop by 5 to get the volume. Then just picking the right tank type. Ideally, you'd measure the actual volume of the parts, but if the parts are done well originally and scale with stock, x5 is close enough.

Engines are a bit trickier, since there's more going on. The generator is meant to be used within some guidelines, which aren't always obvious. I need to write better instructions on the page itself, but I never seem to get around to it. So:

Start with the thrust. Keep that the same. Pick the right engine type, so for the OMS you'd choose Orbital. Pick the tech level next, which for shuttle-era is the 6th level (Start = 0). (Descriptions of types and TLs are on the Real Fuels thread) Then scale the mass so the TWR is in the green. If the part is also a tank, put the volume from above in the right place. Then decide the fuel/propellant. For a shuttle, probably MMH/N2O4. Then edit that first config node to use that mixture. Then set the ratio. It's the mass ratio, so like hydrolox gets around 5-6, kerolox gets like 2ish, and hydrazine (and derivatives) plus N2O4 get like 1.6ish. Once that's set up, alter any of the other options to your liking. Adjust the Isp if you want to make it more efficient or less, and scale the mass to match, or leave the mass and the cost will adjust. Then you can copy the config out and try it. Tweak the settings as needed.

The TWR is kind of a sanity check on the generator. If you're way in the red, your engine is way off the curve of real engines and probably will be overpowered or underpowered. Some engines are a little above or below, so don't be afraid to experiment, but I generally tweak them until they're close. Also, I generally assign a mod a "personality", so that engines of a single mod use similar fuels at similar ratios. Which means if you try and swap out a KW engine with a NovaPunch one, you need to double check your tanks to make sure you've got the right fuel/propellant and/or the right ratios. It's a bit arbitrary, true, but it allows for some variety.

Also, the XLS in the download has a page that describes most of the options in the generator. The generator was based on that XLS, so it's mostly still accurate. Some of the numbers are hidden behind labels now, though. The XLS is a bit dated now, so I would only use it as a reference.

Anyway, sorry for the wall o' text, but that should help anyone writing their own stuff. :wink:

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On 01.05.2016 at 7:27 PM, Raptor831 said:

Initial tests for me indicate everything should be working fine

Not exactly. KER suddenly lost working LF engines after stage activation:

 


P.S. It's definitely due to engine configs. With RftS (instead of Stockalaike) configs KER works like a clockwork, without zeroing of Delta-V and engine thrust after launch or staging.

P.P.S. Mandatory logs:

KSP.log

output.log

 

Edited by Canis Dirus Leidy
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@Canis Dirus Leidy Thank you for the notice, and the logs! Looks like it's an incompatibility with KER and RF. See here: 

What I'm betting is that KER has an issue with ModuleEnginesRF and SolverEngines being used instead of ModuleEnginesFX or ModuleEngines. Which, bottom line, is something KER has to "fix". Unfortunately, these configs are simply building on others' mods so if they don't play nice together we're a bit stuck.

So as to not be completely unhelpful, I'm fairly certain MechJeb plays nice with RF, and can give you similar data to KER. I know switching isn't the best option (especially between those two), but it's at least something. Or you could chime in at the KER thread. Or lend a hand coding, if that's something you do.

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1 hour ago, NathanKell said:

I find that hard to believe because I've seen people using KER quite recently with RO, and we certainly do use ModuleEnginesRF.

Unless KER just broke its engine handling recently?

No idea. I've always used MechJeb. Guess I'll test KER. Then there's the possibility my configs are just wrong.

@Canis Dirus Leidy Are there any engines that do work in Stockalike?

UPDATE: Did some testing with KER within my main install. Any engine that was properly configured with Stockalike didn't work. Engines that were not configured worked. I'm working through logs right now, but we'll see if it's my configs or not. :huh:

Edited by Raptor831
Testing
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So, I ran some more tests on MechJeb and KER with RF/Stockalike. Results were... interesting.

It seems MechJeb is perfectly fine with Stockalike as it is right now. Didn't notice any issues in delta-V calculations. Ran it side-by-side with KER, and all the calcs in the VAB lined up, even as I built the crafts. Atmo numbers and vac numbers. In flight, MechJeb didn't miss a beat.

KER, on the other hand, doesn't seem to like Stockalike. But only under certain conditions. For example, if you have your engines staged before your launch clamps, it reads the dV just fine. Even on MERF engines. That is until you release the clamps and "launch". Then everything zeros out. There's nothing in the logs to suggest an error at all, so I'm not even sure where to give a "bug" report.

If I had to guess (again), it's something to do with SolverEngine and KER. It seems to read MERF engines just fine, even alongside MEFX engines. But as soon as the vessel state becomes "launched", it breaks down. I checked the logs side-by-side with Canis' and we have the same versions of the relevant mods (RF, SolverEngines, KER, Stockalike).

But I don't know what else I can tweak in my configs to help.

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2 hours ago, vandenberg said:

I can't get ksp to load past the afterburning jet. It just stops loading, even if i leave it load for half an hour. Tnx for your help.

Welcome to the forums! Please read "how to get support" in my signature. We will need logs to know what is wrong here.

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6 hours ago, vandenberg said:

I can't get ksp to load past the afterburning jet. It just stops loading, even if i leave it load for half an hour. Tnx for your help.

As blowfish said, we'd need logs. I can say that on my install with 50+ mods, it doesn't break there. Most likely it's a mod conflict or something similar.

4 hours ago, lakilakigant said:

Just added the FASA Apollo engines to the config, and a NovaPunch engine I missed. As always, let me know if I missed anything else.

o.png

Not sure what this is. Sounds like you intended to quote me on something, but something got lost.

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1 hour ago, vandenberg said:

Never mind. Didn't read the install section very well. All is working great now. Great mod.

Glad it's working. :)

 

Also, there's a few things coming in future updates:

1) Finally adding ullage/ignitions to all engines and tagging engines as pressure fed or not.
2) Bringing the ullage/ignitions/pressure fed syntax in line with current RF
3) Fixing engine bugs or re-adding engines that have changed out from under the configs
4) Adding new engines from new mods

These aren't in any particular order, but I do need some feedback on #1 and #3. So, if anyone has engines that aren't working that should (i.e. there's 2 in KW that mysteriously don't work now), please post them here or open an issue on the repo. Also, please discuss what engines I should be setting as pressure fed. Number of ignitions for engines are up for debate as well. Just be aware that hypergolic <> infinite ignitions.

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On 5/14/2016 at 7:58 PM, Raptor831 said:

So, I ran some more tests on MechJeb and KER with RF/Stockalike. Results were... interesting.

It seems MechJeb is perfectly fine with Stockalike as it is right now. Didn't notice any issues in delta-V calculations. Ran it side-by-side with KER, and all the calcs in the VAB lined up, even as I built the crafts. Atmo numbers and vac numbers. In flight, MechJeb didn't miss a beat.

KER, on the other hand, doesn't seem to like Stockalike. But only under certain conditions. For example, if you have your engines staged before your launch clamps, it reads the dV just fine. Even on MERF engines. That is until you release the clamps and "launch". Then everything zeros out. There's nothing in the logs to suggest an error at all, so I'm not even sure where to give a "bug" report.

If I had to guess (again), it's something to do with SolverEngine and KER. It seems to read MERF engines just fine, even alongside MEFX engines. But as soon as the vessel state becomes "launched", it breaks down. I checked the logs side-by-side with Canis' and we have the same versions of the relevant mods (RF, SolverEngines, KER, Stockalike).

But I don't know what else I can tweak in my configs to help.

I don't think it's your configs. Without your stuff and just RF/SolverEngines/CRP with this one config I get the same behavior from KER.

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10 hours ago, Jso said:

I don't think it's your configs. Without your stuff and just RF/SolverEngines/CRP with this one config I get the same behavior from KER.

Well, I'm glad we can at least narrow it down. Thanks for the report.

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