Beale

[1.8.X] Tantares - Stockalike Soyuz and MIR [19.0][20/10/2019][Getting weird with it]

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Dragon01 said:

N1 would be hit especially hard by this, since it ends at 2.5m or so.

N1 wouldn't be hit at all by this, as it's already at the texel density being proposed?

3 hours ago, Beale said:

A good example of this reduced texture density is the current N1, which uses around 100px per m

1 pixel per centimeter... Reading it like that makes it sound too big, too noticeable, but the part looks just fine when seen at the kind of resolution you'd normally play at.

I'm sure that @Beale wouldn't release anything that didn't still look great, and the thought of what extras we might gain from the redistribution of available modelling time is very tempting. I say do what you think is best; perhaps Tantares Now In Color could also include higher-res textures for those that need them?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, JH4C said:

N1 wouldn't be hit at all by this, as it's already at the texel density being proposed?

Read his post again, he's thinking of remaking it. Since the Energia is done, there are no other Russian rockets that exceed 2.5m (well, other than UR-700M, but see a few posts back with regards to that).

And no, the improvement from having a higher texel density is not insignificant (especially in a mod already lacking in detailing compared to, say, BDB). The current N1 does look out of date, consistent texel density is a must.

Edited by Dragon01

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, JH4C said:

N1 wouldn't be hit at all by this, as it's already at the texel density being proposed?

1 pixel per centimeter... Reading it like that makes it sound too big, too noticeable, but the part looks just fine when seen at the kind of resolution you'd normally play at.
perhaps Tantares Now In Color could also include higher-res textures for those that need them?

Yes exactly correct, any revamp of the N1 would be at the same density. :)

So for a more visual example, a lot of the advantages of 200px/m are lost at 5m, eg:


RNyZHCm.png 
XTfD1MP.png

Pretty I guess, but I actually don't think  have noticed them in-game.
I would compare this to the LCA project, which is at 100px/m and has a lot of nice big details:

lw6dnunvuh.png

If scaling a current 2.5m 200px/m to 5m it can give a general idea of what a 5m tank at 100px/m may look like. Not bad really

7h0NBa8.png

 

Anyway, thoughts to mull over at least.

 

Some more work on crew cabins:
The window-less version requires some additional surface greebles, or some kind of detail.

NFz4qIS.png

 

Edited by Beale

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The semi-old TKS and its new engines. Am I correct to assume that with the Twin-snakes marked as "rusty", the ship's new engine will be the Spion?

ACiEF8V.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, TK-313 said:

The semi-old TKS and its new engines. Am I correct to assume that with the Twin-snakes marked as "rusty", the ship's new engine will be the Spion?

ACiEF8V.jpg

I LOVE the housing you made for the engine there!

As far as I could see, the new engines will be very similar to the Spion (But, with the housing case).
The IRL engines are I11F77 for the TKS and 11D24 for Salyut, but I cannot find much information - they have very similar statistics, so it seems likely they are in the same family.

wrd0225.jpg

I don't see if the hardware on MIR used the same designs, I suppose so though. It could be a smaller nozzle, because it is really difficult to fit the current Spion in the fairing, in that position.

0uLwvOY.png

 

 

More paints.

CMy4LT0.png

Edited by Beale

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The cutest little biconic capsule:

A2S3ec2.png

Of course not! This is the Kvant-2 airlock, which will have a window and non-window version.

JPEAj40.png

vQC3U6P.png

I chose the option 2 from earlier, this just allows you more uses. You can use it as a surface habitat exit, etc.

ra9odXw.png

So what about railings?

I decided not to bake them in the part, and would better be additional parts.

Edited by Beale

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Beale said:

So what about railings?

I decided not to bake them in the part, and would better be additional parts.

I like this idea. There's a severe shortage of greeblies in this game, and I do love the twiddly bits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1kVSFOr.png
11tmdbv.png

24 minutes ago, JH4C said:

I like this idea. There's a severe shortage of greeblies in this game, and I do love the twiddly bits.

I agree, my plans for this are:

  • straight ladder .25m
  • straight ladder .75m
  • radial ladder for .9375m cylinder 1/4 circumfrence
  • radial ladder for 1.25m cylinder 1/4 circumfrence
  • And so on for 1.875m, 2.5m cylinders

That should really cover most things.

For ref, the IRL kvant-2 mockup:

GOZ8OKC.jpg

Edited by Beale

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello there. First, congratulations to every single one of the people working on this magnificent mod for us who pay attention to more than what NASA does. This mod has been serving me for quite some time (even tho this is my first post, I have played for years) to replicate Soviet spacecraft, and, as I also love Energia, I wanted to download the launchers mod mostly for the beautiful tank textures. Upon seeing the engines, I built Zenit (as I already had the parts unlocked in the career savegame I was playing atm) and noticed it was way overpowered in relation to stock game (or so it seems to me). Especially ISP were realistic, but way higher than normal "nerfed" ISP in KSP. Maybe they are indeed stock-balanced, but it didn't quite seem to me, as just changing the engines from a craft I was working on to some of this mod's engines inmediately raised my deltaV.

I've seen in this thread and other reddit threads that this parts are intended to be balanced for the "2.5x Stock Scale RSS" mod, but, as this mod has not been updated for versions higher than the not-so-ancient but not-quite-new KSP 1.2.2, I wonder if the part balance has been changed. It certainly appears to fall short of normal 10x RSS.

Obviously, I know the mod description still says "Q. Why are the rockets overpowered? My Soyuz can put 15 tons into low orbit? A. They are balanced against stock parts, as to not be intentionally useless.[LINK TO 2.5x RSS]", but it doesn't make all that much sense to me in the current state of the game. Obviously, I know updating and rebalancing so many parts would be really hard, if not impossible.

I do not want to sound over-critizising, as I really love your mod and will keep using all of the little bits and spacecraft parts of your mod, my favourite parts mod so far.

Sorry for the inconvenience as I would really hate to have created my account to ask this honest question and find out that it has already been answered in a clearly visible place, but I haven't been able to find the answer.

 

Cheers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/24/2018 at 10:26 PM, Beale said:

*snip

Is it possible to get these stuffs somewhere? Or they not finished just yet?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, lrd.Helmet said:

Is it possible to get these stuffs somewhere? Or they not finished just yet?

The parts haven't been released yet, but there is a github WIP download somewhere on the last page.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, lrd.Helmet said:

Is it possible to get these stuffs somewhere? Or they not finished just yet?

I have put the latest on github with the kvant-2 airlock:

github

TFSvg53.png

21 hours ago, Skyflyer70 said:

Hello there. First, congratulations to every single one of the people working on this magnificent mod for us who pay attention to more than what NASA does. This mod has been serving me for quite some time (even tho this is my first post, I have played for years) to replicate Soviet spacecraft, and, as I also love Energia, I wanted to download the launchers mod mostly for the beautiful tank textures. Upon seeing the engines, I built Zenit (as I already had the parts unlocked in the career savegame I was playing atm) and noticed it was way overpowered in relation to stock game (or so it seems to me). Especially ISP were realistic, but way higher than normal "nerfed" ISP in KSP. Maybe they are indeed stock-balanced, but it didn't quite seem to me, as just changing the engines from a craft I was working on to some of this mod's engines inmediately raised my deltaV.

I've seen in this thread and other reddit threads that this parts are intended to be balanced for the "2.5x Stock Scale RSS" mod, but, as this mod has not been updated for versions higher than the not-so-ancient but not-quite-new KSP 1.2.2, I wonder if the part balance has been changed. It certainly appears to fall short of normal 10x RSS.

Obviously, I know the mod description still says "Q. Why are the rockets overpowered? My Soyuz can put 15 tons into low orbit? A. They are balanced against stock parts, as to not be intentionally useless.[LINK TO 2.5x RSS]", but it doesn't make all that much sense to me in the current state of the game. Obviously, I know updating and rebalancing so many parts would be really hard, if not impossible.

Thanks for the feedback!

Actually yes, the Zenit engines do look to be a little overpowered. I will take a look at that.
The rest of the parts should be balanced similar to the stock parts though (In most cases they are actually a tiny bit inferior! :D)  -  I think talking of 2.5x rescales etc. can muddy the waters a little bit.  The parts are balanced against the vanilla parts in the game, and this coincidentally just happens to work very well at around a 2.5x scale.

One thing were the balance in general is a little off is probably the RCS capacity among parts - I still need to rebalance these.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Beale said:

The rest of the parts should be balanced similar to the stock parts though (In most cases they are actually a tiny bit inferior! :D)

Ahem-Kosmos-3-ahem. Most. Wasteful. Engines. Ever. I once tried using the Soyuz or stock engines on the same tanks. I was very surprised by how much the rocket's dV went through the roof.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, TK-313 said:

Ahem-Kosmos-3-ahem. Most. Wasteful. Engines. Ever. I once tried using the Soyuz or stock engines on the same tanks. I was very surprised by how much the rocket's dV went through the roof.

Oh... Oh dear...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Beale said:

I have put the latest on github with the kvant-2 airlock:

github

Thanks! Have been silently using your parts since your first soyuz. Great work!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just want to say, I love this mod so much. something about these soviet rockets. And I'm currently doing a career mode game where I'm challenging myself to make only real life(or concept) rockets. and let me tell you, this mod is amazing for my manned space missions, as well as early moon probes. But I have a question, will do you have plans to add the Voskhod capsule with the inflatable airlock?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is truly an awesome mod, I was wondering if you would willing to post the desired dimensions of the IVAs for modules that don't have IVAs.
Mabye some of us in the community can make some IVAs and give them to the project, if you want them.

I am sure others like myself are good with Blender.
As I said, your mod is truly awesome, thank you for all the work you do on it.

We could even use the IVA models and textures you have in the mod for inspiration and try to make them look similar, or we could look at the historical ones and model after them if you wanted.

Edited by Electr0ninja

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, kopapaka said:

Low tech space station...LTSS.jpg?ver=0

The igla alignment! I like it a lot :D

Soon I would also like to make service bays like those in this image.

10 hours ago, williamhall531@gmail.com said:

I just want to say, I love this mod so much. something about these soviet rockets. And I'm currently doing a career mode game where I'm challenging myself to make only real life(or concept) rockets. and let me tell you, this mod is amazing for my manned space missions, as well as early moon probes. But I have a question, will do you have plans to add the Voskhod capsule with the inflatable airlock?

Many thanks!

Yes, I have some models for Voskhod capsule, engine and airlock, though I think perhaps they need to be rethought a little to be useful in-gameplay. A good micro-project, updates sometime soon maybe.

9 hours ago, Electr0ninja said:

This is truly an awesome mod, I was wondering if you would willing to post the desired dimensions of the IVAs for modules that don't have IVAs.
Mabye some of us in the community can make some IVAs and give them to the project, if you want them.

I am sure others like myself are good with Blender.
As I said, your mod is truly awesome, thank you for all the work you do on it.

We could even use the IVA models and textures you have in the mod for inspiration and try to make them look similar, or we could look at the historical ones and model after them if you wanted.

All source assets (3d models / Photoshop texture files) can be freely used, just ask by PM if you want the source files. :) 

General IVA layout is the external model, bring the walls inwards 0.0125m, bring the ceiling or floor to match the airlock position on the external side (If that makes sense?).
For example, the new TKS core cylinder interior would be 1.85m wide x 1.85m deep x 1.75 tall.

Some of the station IVAs I don't find too bad, considering they are quite box-shaped. Capsules can be quite miserable to produce though.

I am currently thinking how to do the FGB efficiently, as of course those parts are quite modular. It could be possible to have an IVA for every part. I know the large docking section in particular is often wanted.

Anyway I love to see what people come up with, as long as they have fun.

Edited by Beale

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...thought. Likely a stupid one, but still.

I remember a mod that simulated IVA movement of kerbonauts by moving the camera around and, IIRC, making part ends transparent on click. That last part got me thinking about what if ends of station parts were transparent by default and the part-end internal surfaces were placed on the structural end-caps... Unfortunately I know too little about IVAs to properly understand whether it can work or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, TK-313 said:

...thought. Likely a stupid one, but still.

I remember a mod that simulated IVA movement of kerbonauts by moving the camera around and, IIRC, making part ends transparent on click. That last part got me thinking about what if ends of station parts were transparent by default and the part-end internal surfaces were placed on the structural end-caps... Unfortunately I know too little about IVAs to properly understand whether it can work or not.

I know the mode you mean, but now I cannot find it myself :huh: - but, this is an interesting idea - and maybe easily possible with depth-masking or something like that.

Speaking of IVAs... The airlock.

rFg9PTZ.png

 

 

Dear thanks to @CobaltWolf, who has donated his time to fix some engine balance issues highlighted from some othersm they will be integrated in the next patch. :)
I'm sure you are all aware, but if not Bluedog Design Bureau

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.