magico13

[1.4] StageRecovery - Recover Funds+ from Dropped Stages - v1.8.0 (March 11, 2018)

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work with both realchute and FAR installed, so not realchute or FAR themselves problems

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If memory serves, can't this be used to recover unfocused probes if they're on an atmospheric re-entry course? I recently had a Mun probe pass through Kerbin's atmosphere with a minimum periapsis of 25km, but it carried on going straight back out into space. I could swear that Stage Recovery used to recover anything, so long is it had a parachute.

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Now that I read the description, definitely gonna install and try this!

Question: what about "debris" that is in orbital flight?

I'm guessing this mod does not exactly allow for "salvaging" or recovery of stages (or derelict vessels) that are in orbit or adrift in space?

Is there a mod that does allow for that functionality?

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1 hour ago, gerishnakov said:

If memory serves, can't this be used to recover unfocused probes if they're on an atmospheric re-entry course? I recently had a Mun probe pass through Kerbin's atmosphere with a minimum periapsis of 25km, but it carried on going straight back out into space. I could swear that Stage Recovery used to recover anything, so long is it had a parachute.

That's what it does, but you gotta get below 20 or 21 km altitude (whatever the height is that KSP deletes the craft). You were ALMOST there.

Almost forgot to mention - you'll need heat shields if you're going orbital velocity or faster, or SR will decide you've burned up instead of being recovered.

Edited by Gryphon
SPEED = HEAT

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58 minutes ago, Diche Bach said:

Now that I read the description, definitely gonna install and try this!

Question: what about "debris" that is in orbital flight?

I'm guessing this mod does not exactly allow for "salvaging" or recovery of stages (or derelict vessels) that are in orbit or adrift in space?

Is there a mod that does allow for that functionality?

It's not on Kerbin, how would you recover it?  Such a mod would break the spirit of the game.

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28 minutes ago, Loren Pechtel said:

It's not on Kerbin, how would you recover it?  Such a mod would break the spirit of the game.

Eh? How would recovering debris from past missions "break the spirit of the game?" Rendezvousing, docking with, else "grasping" space debris and recovering it for salvage or reuse would seem to be very much in the spirit of the game, no?

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1 hour ago, Diche Bach said:

Eh? How would recovering debris from past missions "break the spirit of the game?" Rendezvousing, docking with, else "grasping" space debris and recovering it for salvage or reuse would seem to be very much in the spirit of the game, no?

Sending a bird up to go get it would cost a lot more than it's worth, at least with current game economics.  (In reality the cost of fuel should be much lower and the recovery percentages should be much higher.  Really now--100% if I recover my rover on the runway, but 98% if I recover it parked next to the SPH???  I'm being charged 2% to make their job easier??)

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1 hour ago, Loren Pechtel said:

Sending a bird up to go get it would cost a lot more than it's worth, at least with current game economics.  (In reality the cost of fuel should be much lower and the recovery percentages should be much higher.  Really now--100% if I recover my rover on the runway, but 98% if I recover it parked next to the SPH???  I'm being charged 2% to make their job easier??)

Good points, sending up a vessel with the expectation that another vessel will need to discarded pieces from it doesn't seem economical on the face of it.

But lets imagine two scenarios:

1. Accidents/mishaps

2. Future scenarios of "extreme" orbital development

As an example of scenario type 1: we send an expensive unmanned probe to a remote celestial body, that includes two or more sub-modules. Completion of the overall mission requires both modules, but one breaks at some point. Now there is an incentive to be able to "recover" the surviving module which may or may not outweigh economics (sure sending a second mission might be preferable, but it might not depending on various factors). A rescue mission (which I get the impression IS already possible with stock?) would be one example that would fit here.

For number two: lets say we are getting a large quantity of stuff assembled in orbit and for some reason, we want/need numerous pieces to be in nearby orbits. A part gets loose/breaks and is now a threat to other parts in its vicinity. Even if we don't care about getting the part/module back itself, it might be prudent if not economical to take care of the stray part/module.

I know that the Tracking Center allows debris to be magically "deleted" but what I have in mind here is a more naturalistic playstyle in which debris CANNOT be so deleted without somehow interacting with it (shooting it with a ground based repulser beam, a "laser broom" to vaporize it, grappling it and tossing it into a burnup trajectory, etc.

I've been away from the game for 3 years, so I'm not clear on how much of this is "doable" with either stock or existing mods.

ADDIT: I suppose it might be helpful to post my current mod list. Game initializes trouble free though I haven't played with it yet (still putting the "finishing" touches on it). Sorry this is just a screen cap not a string list of the mods. I have CKAN but find it more trouble to use for installing than manual, and I'm not aware of any other method to generate the list of mods (not to mention that I prefer to unpack redundant copies of things, which often leads to the individuals "pieces" of a mod getting dispersed into sub-directories that may not be recognized as the mod in question).

0v8CV.gif

Edited by Diche Bach
ADDIT of modlist

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39 minutes ago, Diche Bach said:

Good points, sending up a vessel with the expectation that another vessel will need to discarded pieces from it doesn't seem economical on the face of it.

But lets imagine two scenarios:

1. Accidents/mishaps

2. Future scenarios of "extreme" orbital development

As an example of scenario type 1: we send an expensive unmanned probe to a remote celestial body, that includes two or more sub-modules. Completion of the overall mission requires both modules, but one breaks at some point. Now there is an incentive to be able to "recover" the surviving module which may or may not outweigh economics (sure sending a second mission might be preferable, but it might not depending on various factors). A rescue mission (which I get the impression IS already possible with stock?) would be one example that would fit here.

For number two: lets say we are getting a large quantity of stuff assembled in orbit and for some reason, we want/need numerous pieces to be in nearby orbits. A part gets loose/breaks and is now a threat to other parts in its vicinity. Even if we don't care about getting the part/module back itself, it might be prudent if not economical to take care of the stray part/module.

I know that the Tracking Center allows debris to be magically "deleted" but what I have in mind here is a more naturalistic playstyle in which debris CANNOT be so deleted without somehow interacting with it (shooting it with a ground based repulser beam, a "laser broom" to vaporize it, grappling it and tossing it into a burnup trajectory, etc.

I've been away from the game for 3 years, so I'm not clear on how much of this is "doable" with either stock or existing mods.

I have sent up rescue craft multiple times when something went wrong with a mission.  It's a case-by-case situation, though, not something you would have a mod for.  There's a part specifically meant for grabbing stuff in space, I don't know what more you would need.

As for deleting the debris--the game doesn't really have a choice in that.  Not deleting it would result in too much workload.

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15 minutes ago, Loren Pechtel said:

I have sent up rescue craft multiple times when something went wrong with a mission.  It's a case-by-case situation, though, not something you would have a mod for.  There's a part specifically meant for grabbing stuff in space, I don't know what more you would need.

As for deleting the debris--the game doesn't really have a choice in that.  Not deleting it would result in too much workload.

Very good, this answers my question!

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Does anyone know if Stage Recovery can be tweaked to play nicer with RSS in 1.1.3? It's working OK right now, but all my stages are stated as being recovered more than 3000 km from KSC (the real one), with a corresponding reduction in recovery value percentage. Is this a diameter of the planet issue?

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3 hours ago, Norcalplanner said:

Does anyone know if Stage Recovery can be tweaked to play nicer with RSS in 1.1.3? It's working OK right now, but all my stages are stated as being recovered more than 3000 km from KSC (the real one), with a corresponding reduction in recovery value percentage. Is this a diameter of the planet issue?

I raised this issue before, but I think it has to do with KSC (the not real one) and KSC (the real one) being on different coordinates on the map.  The KSP's KSC would be near the Ecuadorian/Columbian border, which is about 3000 km away.

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7 hours ago, Gryphon said:

 

That's what it does, but you gotta get below 20 or 21 km altitude (whatever the height is that KSP deletes the craft). You were ALMOST there.

Almost forgot to mention - you'll need heat shields if you're going orbital velocity or faster, or SR will decide you've burned up instead of being recovered.

Damnit, I knew I was close! The probe did have a heat shield - I'm running Deadly Reentry, which also means though I tend not to put periapses below 25km.

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So, how do I get those "Stage Recovery GUI" things that magico shows pictures of in the first few posts to show up in game?

ADDIT: so I deleted the StageRecovery directory, redownloaded it to make sure I had 1.64, and reinstalled it, and I'm still not seeing anything like a "Stage Recovery" icon in the toolbar.

Here is what my Space Center pane looks like:

1-4WJ.gif

You think it might be another I have running? I'd be particularly suspicious of "Orbital Decay" fighting with SR in terms of game mechanics, though I don't see why it would cause the GUI for SR to not show up

My mod list:

Gt0Bz.gif

Edited by Diche Bach
clarification

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9 hours ago, Diche Bach said:

Here is what my Space Center pane looks like:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

1-4WJ.gif

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Gt0Bz.gif

 

I could be wrong, but I think that stage recovery will try to display on blitzzy's toolbar if you have it installed (which you do). That little icon above and to the left of the SCANsat icon, if clicked, should give you the option to select which tabs you want to display. By default, everything is de-selected, selecting stage recovery will make the tab visible. 

Hope this helps!

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Ah THAT is "blizzy's icon" is it? It appeared when I installed Kerbal Interstellar Extended and I hadn't really puzzled through it. Thanks!

Est voila!

 

Xur86.gif]/spoiler]

Thank you Merkov! :D

One really shouldn't try to get "caught up" on three years of game and mod development in a complicated, and wonderful game like KSP in a mere week or two. Hard work!

Edited by Diche Bach
ADDIT

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On 09/07/2016 at 0:23 AM, minepagan said:

Yes I am

Problem is, I don't have Realchute, and if I uninstall Realchute Lite in FAR then my parachutes don't work normally. Like, at all.

I'm having this issue also,did you find a solution?

 

If I delete Realchute Lite, Stage Recovery works fine but my parachutes don't slow the craft down and I lithobrake at 160m/s :D.  If I have Realchute Lite the parachtues slow me to 4m/s but Stage Recovery always fails.

 

I've replaced the existing .dll file with the recompiled one and it's still happening.  Should I install the full realchute mod?

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Man I am depressed now. I finally got CKAN to work on my 1.1.13 and went ahead and installed a ton of new mods as well as a few favs such as stage-rec. I have been using that for a few versions and it makes career mode feel slightly cheaty lol.

Anyway it worked perfectly fine on 1.1.13 until I played with CKAN, now it keeps uninstalling it on me saying it is only good for 1.1.12 etc. I know it works fine but I don't know how to get CKAN et al to ignore it. Anyone?

Or is there a new ver on the horizon? Thanks for a fantastically useful mod!

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On 8/15/2016 at 1:18 AM, Wragie said:

Man I am depressed now. I finally got CKAN to work on my 1.1.13 and went ahead and installed a ton of new mods as well as a few favs such as stage-rec. I have been using that for a few versions and it makes career mode feel slightly cheaty lol.

Anyway it worked perfectly fine on 1.1.13 until I played with CKAN, now it keeps uninstalling it on me saying it is only good for 1.1.12 etc. I know it works fine but I don't know how to get CKAN et al to ignore it. Anyone?

Or is there a new ver on the horizon? Thanks for a fantastically useful mod!

There is a config file in which you can disable the plugin's reference to the plugin that checks for compatibility. I cannot remember the details off the top of my head, but I used that to disable those alerts at one point and it might work for your purpose.

I gave CKAN a whirl, but decided against using it to install my heavily modded build (like ~60+ mods) for exactly the sort of reasons you describe. Plus, it doesn't seem to always know how to install things properly.

Re: the topic of "how high can jettisoned stages be recovered:"

Communotron 16 + Launcher Ship

I've basically configured that ship so that two lowest stages are consistently recovered.

0 = probe with RCS thrusters (not intended for recovery, but does have a docking port for maintenance/retrieval long term)

2 = orbital completion/encounter booster (enough to achieve orbit at Mun/Minmus or to put into a highly eccentric/inclined Kerbin orbit)

Of course neither of the above is recoverable when the ship is used as intended.

4 = upper atmosphere module / suborbital extension  --> generally achieves ~75 to 90k plus a bit of prograde burn toward orbital and also (surprisingly given how high it is being jettisoned) is well recovered.

8 = initial SRB boosters + main engine --> generally achieves ~47,000 m and always well recovered (both SRBs and the main engine)

I've found that the trick to successfully recovering stage 4 is, when that stage is depleted of fuel, to point the ship RADIAL normal (or very close anyway), turn throttle to 100%, engage stage 3 and then immediately stage 2. The thrust from 2 pushing the debris of stage 4 toward Kerbin seems to change the angle of reentry (and the radiators probably help too) so that it doesn't burn up and the chutes are still "counted" by Stage Recovery as functioning.

Edited by Diche Bach
typos; radial confused as normal again

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I am also having issues with StageRecovery in 1.1.3; I have FAR Lancaster installed and I've replaced the SR dll file with the recompiled one from a few posts up. Still have not successfully recovered a stage in 1.1.3, despite having multiple armed chutes on the boosters.

Curious if a control point on the booster is now a requirement for successful SR operation - if so, that would explain a great many things. It would also suck a tad.

What information would help the powers that be diagnose the underlying issue? I'm not the only person who has had problems with SR and 1.1.3, looks like.

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On 8/19/2016 at 6:00 PM, capi3101 said:

I am also having issues with StageRecovery in 1.1.3; I have FAR Lancaster installed and I've replaced the SR dll file with the recompiled one from a few posts up. Still have not successfully recovered a stage in 1.1.3, despite having multiple armed chutes on the boosters.

Curious if a control point on the booster is now a requirement for successful SR operation - if so, that would explain a great many things. It would also suck a tad.

What information would help the powers that be diagnose the underlying issue? I'm not the only person who has had problems with SR and 1.1.3, looks like.

I'm also having this same issue. Hopefully @magico13 is seeing this...

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I will note that I'm using both FAR and KIS; I vaguely recall seeing something about the two of them not getting completely along a few pages back (something about the way the two mods handle chutes) and that being the root cause of SR's issues, and that it's something that needs to be fixed in KIS. I might try uninstalling KIS temporarily and seeing what that does. If it makes SR work, I might go pester them instead.

@aluc24, what mods are you using; do you also use a combination of FAR and KIS?

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I have KIS and KAS but no FAR and haven't seen any issues like you describe.

When I looked at FAR, it looked like it might conflict with quite a few other things and it is one of the few that I was interested in but declined to use for that reason.

Do you find it really adds to the game a lot?

Just as a comparison, I would say KCT adds to the game immensely. Indeed, to play Kerbal career without KCT would almost seem silly to me now.

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8 minutes ago, Diche Bach said:

I have KIS and KAS but no FAR and haven't seen any issues like you describe.

When I looked at FAR, it looked like it might conflict with quite a few other things and it is one of the few that I was interested in but declined to use for that reason.

Do you find it really adds to the game a lot?

Just as a comparison, I would say KCT adds to the game immensely. Indeed, to play Kerbal career without KCT would almost seem silly to me now.

Did you find it necessary to install the recompiled DLL, or did SR work for you from the get-go? Again, I've slept since I read it, but I think the recompiled DLL was to correct for something FAR did with RealChutes or some such, something that conflicts with KIS in some way shape or form. I should go read through the last few pages of this thread again - it's what I get for being lazy...

As far as FAR adding to the game, I like the analysis tools it provides; they come in real handy when I've got a plane that I think should behave and doesn't. In particular, it's good about showing me why it doesn't behave like I think it should. Doesn't add much to the rocket game; adds quite a bit to the spaceplane game, IMHO.

I've thought about giving KCT a go one of these years; my box would probably (finally) be up for it.

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56 minutes ago, capi3101 said:

Did you find it necessary to install the recompiled DLL, or did SR work for you from the get-go?

Hmmm, trying to remember. My mod installation process was about a week of pain and some playing, and I wound up having to not use half the ones I was interested in. But I do not recall specifically any issues with SR. If memory serves, I downloaded it, made what it had in its directories, put them in the correct places (and/or avoiding overwriting if a copy of something  had already been installed [e.g., ModuleManager, used in many mods, many of which include a copy of it, but of course one only needs one copy in the GameData directory . . . but not certain that example applies in the instance of SR], and played it. The first time you install it, it will prompt you to input the settings, and it took a while longer to figure out what to use there. I think I posted the settings I'm playing with a page or three back (if not let me know and I'll post the txt).

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