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[1.2.2] B9 Aerospace | Release 6.2.1 (Old Thread)


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I have noticed a potential issue with HL Cargo Bay

I currently use B9 5.2.1 so i do not know if it has been fixed since.

When I add HL Cargo Bay (think it is 4 or 6 m), after HL fuselage section (i.e. Cockpit, fuselage, cargo bay), I can not later add a Senior Docking port in the inner part of the cargo bay (forward one facing cockpit).

I am basically trying to make an Interstellar version of HDCV Stapleton, so i copied it's back part (the one after cargo bay as subassembly, added to the back of my cargo bay), but as said when trying to add Sr. Docking port in the bay it just wont attach, as of cargo bay did not have "inner" attachment point

I tried workaround where i attach the Sr. Docking port to HL fuselage, and THEN add cargo bay over it, but then i can not attach anything to the Sr Docking port.

Is this a bug, or am i doing something completely wrong :confused:

Also, not sure if it matters, but i replaced the wings of the Stapleton with Type 3 Pwings. Will post picture later today

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Hmm - the Saber M scaled to 3.75 seems pretty reasonable. And it's way easier to fly, given the thrust imbalance when you start running low on air.

Never had that problem, adjust your throttle or shut down engines on the edge of the atmosphere, MJ lets you automatically avoid running out of intake air, and FAR makes differential thrust a lot less of an issue, in reality planes can fly with one or more jets non-functional in an asymmetric fashion without instantly going into a flat spin.

Grunf911: because the HL/S2/S2WB bays don't have end-caps there are no internal nodes, use part clipping to attach to the same mode twice or surface attach something with a node on it.

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...Grunf911: because the HL/S2/S2WB bays don't have end-caps there are no internal nodes, use part clipping to attach to the same mode twice or surface attach something with a node on it.

Actually I am trying to avoid part clipping (gameplay choice), but I guess i might need it. Could you please explain in more detail how to do it in this particular scenario ? (I am ashamed to say, I don't know how to do it :huh:). The goal for this cargo bay is to have 1x docking port SR, and in there attached 1x orange fuel tank with a small tug (2m probe, big RCS tank, and some RCS thrusters, nothing fancy) (so cargo bay-wise i need 1x 4m+ 1x 2m)

Also, why don't they have some nodes ?

I understand it is by design (i guess not to hinder extendability of the cargo bay), but if I am not mistaken in SpacePlane+ mod the Mk2 cargo bay is also extendable meaning no end-caps, yet i could attach things to it without any problem. Perhaps you could check it out and see if it makes sense to add to HL and perhaps some others as well ? Just an idea, anyway :-)

Edited by Grunf911
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Because you can't have 2 nodes that overlap, makes it impossible to tell which node you've connected to.

Get Editor Extensions (very useful mod, lets you toggle surface attachment etc), press Alt-Z

Never used SP+, personally don't like the "stock" look and well frankly B9 has the parts I want/need for planes, Mk2 cargo bays have nodes in them as well but they have endcaps and they have 1m nodes, not 3.75m 3.75m nodes wound need to be offset from each other a lot to be able to tell which you've connected to and connect to one of them on purpose, then again we can toggle nodes now using a plugin, could make the in-cargo bay nodes togglable and off by default perhaps... hmm, attach cargo bay to plane, enable secondary nodes, now only unoccupied nodes are inside the bay, worth experimenting with.

Anyway part clipping isn't really cheating if you're getting around a limitation of KSP's editor, it frequently tells you something is clipping even if it isn't and re-using a open-ended cargo bay's node in 2 directions isn't cheating either.

Yeah clipping a bunch of RTGs into a plane some might consider cheating, but frankly, would a plane have RTGs mounted to the side of the fuselage or would they be inside it? I'd really like the ability to store parts inside other parts if there is enough free room, a bit like MFT/KAS storage except the root part takes on the part-modules of what's inside (not engines obviously) idea being that you basically stuffed the internal volume with RTGs instead of fuel.

Edited by K3|Chris
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Recently I've discovered that size 2 parts (engines in my case) cause pretty high drag when placed on "s2 Wide Universal 4x1.25 Engine Mount"s s2 node like shown in here: http://imgur.com/a/8nK4h

Is that part totally out of option as for attaching non-s2 stuff on s2 node? It looks so good and makes perfect multi engine mount with different sizes :(

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Because you can't have 2 nodes that overlap, makes it impossible to tell which node you've connected to.

Get Editor Extensions (very useful mod, lets you toggle surface attachment etc), press Alt-Z

Never used SP+, personally don't like the "stock" look and well frankly B9 has the parts I want/need for planes, Mk2 cargo bays have nodes in them as well but they have endcaps and they have 1m nodes, not 3.75m 3.75m nodes wound need to be offset from each other a lot to be able to tell which you've connected to and connect to one of them on purpose, then again we can toggle nodes now using a plugin, could make the in-cargo bay nodes togglable and off by default perhaps... hmm, attach cargo bay to plane, enable secondary nodes, now only unoccupied nodes are inside the bay, worth experimenting with.

Anyway part clipping isn't really cheating if you're getting around a limitation of KSP's editor, it frequently tells you something is clipping even if it isn't and re-using a open-ended cargo bay's node in 2 directions isn't cheating either.

Yeah clipping a bunch of RTGs into a plane some might consider cheating, but frankly, would a plane have RTGs mounted to the side of the fuselage or would they be inside it? I'd really like the ability to store parts inside other parts if there is enough free room, a bit like MFT/KAS storage except the root part takes on the part-modules of what's inside (not engines obviously) idea being that you basically stuffed the internal volume with RTGs instead of fuel.

- Thx for the tips. I have Editor Extensions, did not know about Alt-Z, thx

- Just for clarity. Love the B9 as is, no ambition to make it stock-a-like. I was just referring with the approach (open cargobay without endcaps but yet attachable). If you find another way that works for you even better. It's more of a convenience thing, given HL is so freakin beautiful, that it would be shame of having the need to use workarounds to put (docked) stuff in the cargo bay :wink:

- Regarding Clipping, i agree with you. I also put RTGs in the plane, I just use unoccupied space in the cargo bay. The decision not to use part clipping came from pre 0.23.5 when clipping would sometimes cause crazy wobble issues that even Joint Reinforcement could not fix. Besides, it is easier to see all the parts in case you need to fix them. So i do not consider it cheating as much as inconvenience in my particular case. The only clipping i do not like is 20x intakes for an SSTO, but then again it is up to designer :-)

Thx for the tips, will try them out

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Because of my disappearing ships:

i looked in the debug console and found the following errors:

3 times:

[Exception]: NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

and one time:

[Log]: SmokeScreenConfig could not load config

It is definitely Smokescreen that is causing my invisible ship problem. if i remove the smokescreen folder everything works fine.

But i don´t know what type of problems could occur without SmokeScreen.

I hope someone can help me.

Edited by tetryds
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Because of my disappearing ships:

i looked in the debug console and found the following errors:

3 times:

[Exception]: NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

and one time:

[Log]: SmokeScreenConfig could not load config

It is definitely Smokescreen that is causing my invisible ship problem. if i remove the smokescreen folder everything works fine.

But i don´t know what type of problems could occur without SmokeScreen.

I hope someone can help me.

Check what exceptions those are in the output_log.txt - that has more info.

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i found this:

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at SmokeScreen.SmokeScreenUI.OnDestroy () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

and:

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at ModelMultiParticlePersistFX.OnSave (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at EffectList.OnSave (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part.SaveEffects (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at ProtoPartSnapshot.Load (.Vessel vesselRef, Boolean loadAsRootPart) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at ProtoVessel.LoadObjects () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Vessel.Load () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Vessel.MakeActive () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at FlightGlobals.setActiveVessel (.Vessel v, Boolean force) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at FlightGlobals.SetActiveVessel (.Vessel v) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at FlightDriver.Start () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

i uploaded the complete log here:

http://www.file-upload.net/download-9582014/output_log.txt.html

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i found this:

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at SmokeScreen.SmokeScreenUI.OnDestroy () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

and:

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at ModelMultiParticlePersistFX.OnSave (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at EffectList.OnSave (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part.SaveEffects (.ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at ProtoPartSnapshot.Load (.Vessel vesselRef, Boolean loadAsRootPart) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at ProtoVessel.LoadObjects () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Vessel.Load () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Vessel.MakeActive () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at FlightGlobals.setActiveVessel (.Vessel v, Boolean force) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at FlightGlobals.SetActiveVessel (.Vessel v) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at FlightDriver.Start () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

i uploaded the complete log here:

http://www.file-upload.net/download-9582014/output_log.txt.html

You should probably post that in the smokescreen thread! I get that NRE as well btw :(

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Hey all,

I searched for subtypes in this thread and only found hits on the first post about the release. I'm loving a lot about this awesomely complete mod, but I'm having issues with the part subtype switching. The right click menu only has one button - "next part" or something to that effect - and clicking it does nothing. I tried doing this with MJ showing me deltaV stats, figuring that value would change if the part went from being structural to LFO-containing. Also, the multiple subtype parts - all of them - appear to have texture overlaps, as if each part is all of the subtypes displayed simultaneously.

No crashes, I would just really like to use one of the best features of this mod! I'm enjoying how de-cluttered the parts list is now. I'm running with all the recommended mods, including ATM, Firespitter, the latest version of MM, etc. I have a few other parts packs installed too; I tried removing Skillful, since it was on list of mods that cause brain pain, but to no avail.

Any help would be hugely appreciated! Otherwise I'm doing a full reinstall after work today to try to fix this.

Thanks to the whole B9 team! I really really really hope your work is incorporated in release versions of KSP!!!!

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The atlas engines are awesome not only for landing craft but for mid / end stage rockets but the problem is when you try to lift something massive into space they stop being useful due to there size and lack of thrust a 3.75m version would be awesome for a low profile mid / end stage with just a little fuel just to kick you into orbit when using in conjunction with fairings.

Just a little request, considering all you would have to do is resize the current model and collision meshes and scale the thrust maybe change the ISP a little, I could do it my self for my self but I think its something that a lot of other people would enjoy and find useful.

Like I made a 50% larger HL cargo bay and adapter to carry 3.75m parts plus a little wiggle room for side attachments basically how the regular HL cargo bay works for 2.5m parts, but that isn't so simple to do for you because I assume you would want to create a hole new model for that also its a little ridiculous to have a plane that can fit 3.75m parts further more without using a 64 bit client "which is still a little buggy" or the active compression mod B9 has enough models to try and load into a limited space as is without adding a new cargo bay adapters and fuel tanks.

Edited by etheoma
EXTRA
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Hey all,

I searched for subtypes in this thread and only found hits on the first post about the release. I'm loving a lot about this awesomely complete mod, but I'm having issues with the part subtype switching. The right click menu only has one button - "next part" or something to that effect - and clicking it does nothing. I tried doing this with MJ showing me deltaV stats, figuring that value would change if the part went from being structural to LFO-containing. Also, the multiple subtype parts - all of them - appear to have texture overlaps, as if each part is all of the subtypes displayed simultaneously.

No crashes, I would just really like to use one of the best features of this mod! I'm enjoying how de-cluttered the parts list is now. I'm running with all the recommended mods, including ATM, Firespitter, the latest version of MM, etc. I have a few other parts packs installed too; I tried removing Skillful, since it was on list of mods that cause brain pain, but to no avail.

Any help would be hugely appreciated! Otherwise I'm doing a full reinstall after work today to try to fix this.

Thanks to the whole B9 team! I really really really hope your work is incorporated in release versions of KSP!!!!

You messed up something with your install. Try KSP 0.24.2, 32 bits if you're on windows, with only B9 installed.

The atlas engines are awesome not only for landing craft but for mid / end stage rockets but the problem is when you try to lift something massive into space they stop being useful due to there size and lack of thrust a 3.75m version would be awesome for a low profile mid / end stage with just a little fuel just to kick you into orbit when using in conjunction with fairings.

Just a little request, considering all you would have to do is resize the current model and collision meshes and scale the thrust maybe change the ISP a little, I could do it my self for my self but I think its something that a lot of other people would enjoy and find useful.

Like I made a 50% larger HL cargo bay and adapter to carry 3.75m parts plus a little wiggle room for side attachments basically how the regular HL cargo bay works for 2.5m parts, but that isn't so simple to do for you because I assume you would want to create a hole new model for that also its a little ridiculous to have a plane that can fit 3.75m parts further more without using a 64 bit client "which is still a little buggy" or the active compression mod B9 has enough models to try and load into a limited space as is without adding a new cargo bay adapters and fuel tanks.

We don't do rescales, and the Altas is there only because Stock and KW don't have a truly low-profile 2.5m lander engine.

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I'll just bump it cause it got buried :P

Recently I've discovered that size 2 parts (engines in my case) cause pretty high drag when placed on "s2 Wide Universal 4x1.25 Engine Mount"s s2 node like shown in here: http://imgur.com/a/8nK4h

Is that part totally out of option as for attaching non-s2 stuff on s2 node? It looks so good and makes perfect multi engine mount with different sizes :(

Is it an issue with FAR?

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I was wondering where people normally put ladders on the M27 cabin? I'm using it in an airship with Hooligan Labs to mess around on Kerbin (because it looks cool, fits a Karbonite intake for extended range, and it's got good views for IVA flying)

It's just I can't seem to find a good solution that doesn't obscure windows. And whenever I use any of the none-fixed ladders my kerbals get thrown off when they reach the top to get back in ):

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Yeah clipping a bunch of RTGs into a plane some might consider cheating, but frankly, would a plane have RTGs mounted to the side of the fuselage or would they be inside it? I'd really like the ability to store parts inside other parts if there is enough free room, a bit like MFT/KAS storage except the root part takes on the part-modules of what's inside (not engines obviously) idea being that you basically stuffed the internal volume with RTGs instead of fuel.

The fins on RTGs are heat radiators, and need to be able to "see" the outside (there must be an unobstructed sightline from the flat side of the fin to, preferably, deep space, or somewhere else that's not producing much thermal radiation) in order to function properly, as they expel heat in the form of black-body radiation. You could, however, stuff a bunch of RTG cores into the fuselage and then set up some heat pipes/coolant plumbing to larger external radiators.

I'm not quite sure why stock RTGs (or even real-life RTGs used in the Apollo missions) have so many fins, though. The way they're built, it looks like a lot of the area just radiates heat from one fin to another fin, which accomplishes absolutely nothing in terms of heat rejection.

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I'm aware of the cooling needs, you get my point, the KSP model of all parts being solid with no interior and each part being it's own distinct thing (fuel tank, battery cockpit etc) isn't an accurate depiction of how planes and rockets are made in reality, they have an outer shell with all that stuff inside.

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