The Eve Rocks Challenge (v0.90 only)

[Zipmafia]

One thing I didn't test is the spaceplane's capability to fly around Eve, as-well as it's ability to lift up from it. I guess we'll find out!

Let us know how this goes, I have tried several times and failed each time. In fact there is a thread about if it is even possible with a SSTO spaceplane.

I find that lift surfaces do you no good unless you are gliding in for a landing, or you have oxygen to burn. Otherwise it is probably going to be more efficient to fly straight up, then gravity turn.

You might want to try out multiple stages, or a cargo bay with your return capsule inside.

[2001kraft]

or a cargo bay with your return capsule inside.

if you remember my original idea with a lander inside the cargo bay, well, it failed worse than expected.

attempting to fit in a multiple-stage lifter was painful, and required several launches and docking the lander all over in eve orbit, well...i used KAS to try to attach struts to it in orbit, then added radial parachutes also using KAS. It didn't work or help. The lander broke up in Eve atmosphere, and the parachutes completely tore the remains apart. My only other plan now is to add parachutes to the spaceplane as to save fuel on burning retrograde to stop my steep descend, since I plan on landing close to water. Next up is just the capabilities of the spaceplane. Hopefully it will work.

[hazard-ish]

I've been visiting this thread for a while now just to check on it. I am currently doing a career mode series on my youtube channel wher I also set my self the goal of performing a return mission (and planting a flag) on every object in the game without quicksaves. I have just recnelty completed the jool 5 challenge in my last few videos and all that remains now is an even return mission.

Once my jool 5 challenge is all sorted out on the forums I will turn my attention to recording my entry for this challenge! (Again, without quicksaves). I've already conducted some tests and have got a pretty good eve lander that is definitely over-engineered but one of my favourite things i've every built too! It weighs just over 36 tonnes and the lander itself costs just under 100,000 funds. The lifting stage will require some tweaks but the entire rocket for the mission should cost no more than about 430,000 funds which would make it the lightest one yet

For the mean time I will only be attempting the first level of the challenge but as an added bonus I will also visit gilly in the same mission. I will also be completing the challenge in version 0.24.2.

[Kulebron]

36 tonnes?! Do you use Mk1 lander can? What altitude do you start at, and what are atmo stats? Could you post a couple of screenshots ahead, please? I'm yearning to see it.

[Norcalplanner]

36 tonnes?! Do you use Mk1 lander can? What altitude do you start at, and what are atmo stats? Could you post a couple of screenshots ahead, please? I'm yearning to see it.

Me too. Unless there are mods involved, it would need to have just an external seat and be a massively asparagused lander using nothing but 48-7S engines underneath FLT200s.

[Red Iron Crown]

It is a bit surprising how light a high altitude Eve ascent vehicle can be made, 36t with a Mk1 lander can in stock is certainly possible. Lots of design ideas in that thread for those doing this challenge.

Edit for Norcalplanner's response below: That thread was after the aerospike nerf, same performance as they have now.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Red Iron Crown

[Norcalplanner]

OK Hazard-ish, you definitely know your way around a light lander. I just finished watching your Tylo landing and was impressed at the small size of your craft.

Red Iron Crown, thanks for pointing out that earlier thread. I'm trying to recall if that earlier thread was before or after the aerospikes got nerfed - I know that my first successful Eve ascent used them.

[hazard-ish]

Me too. Unless there are mods involved, it would need to have just an external seat and be a massively asparagused lander using nothing but 48-7S engines underneath FLT200s.

Haha, that pretty much sums it up. I don't use mods in my current career mode series on youtube and I would't consider doing so for (my first time at least) such a grand challenge as this. However, your description of my lander is pretty accurate. I also sadly only use a command seat for the lander (if that's okay?) I hope that isn't cheating in some way. One day I may attempt a the man lander but currently I've never returned from Eve so i'll stick to basics. I also built my design around using a rover to get to the highest point on Eve. However, after the wheels broke I decided to test launching from Eve from my current position and i turns out that my lander can get into an orbit with plenty of fuel to spare from an altitude of about 5100m. (I had aimed at launch from the highest point but more on that later).

36.6 tonnes if I remember correctly is what my lander weighs. It is either 346 or 446 parts (either is quite a lot!) and uses an extensive but simple asparagus system. I cannot post pictures now but I will do in the future! I've gone through many versions of my lander, some using aerospikes but I have since settled for the lightweight appproach (although I though 36 tonnes was a lot). My lightest Eve lander that is capable of orbit weighs 23 tones but requires being launched from the highest point on Eve, about 7500m above sea level. This is very hard to do, however, as I am not an expert in precision landings. I'll continue this mission log/profile/whatever later when I also have screenshots to back everything up and show you what I mean.

Hopefully using a command seat and lots of asparagus has't made my attempt seem less impressive

If it's any consolation, one of my initial concepts has a 54 stage asparagus system that took my about 90 minutes to get my head around and build at 2fps

[astrobond]

Hi All

Here is my Eve Rocks Challenge (Eve sample + Eve sea sample) "without Kethane" no refueling one shot last try

The Craft file of "Eve Jeb Landing AR 9"

379526$ ( - 279124$ reuseable SSTO Lifter - final kerbin lander = less than 100000$ final cost ) less than 99 Tons at launch from Kerbin, and less than 20 Tons ready to Launch at 7500m on Eve.

553 parts full stock + MechJeb2.

KSP 0.25.

I found this 7500m landing site some month ago with SCANsat.v6.1 mod and some hours of testing.... xD

You have to reach Eve with about 24° inclined orbit and wait to be above to reach the landing site without burning to much fuel.

Also wait to be in the plane of the orbiter waiting for you before to leave Eve...

I had to reload several times to undock the glider without breaking it...

AND MechJeb2 Helped me a lot

Also Thank You very much for the other players posts who helped me a lot, and mostly Tavert in "Lightest Eve Lander"

The Odyssey Album:

Javascript is disabled. View full album

3 Hours of rover to return 7500m was the hardest part... xD

Hope you will love it ^^

Edited November 11, 2014 by astrobond

[Kulebron]

^^ Wow. I'd make you the winner if I were a referee in this challenge. You really did the smartest thing. Really, why are we trying to land these cans at sea level when we care about science. There's no need to haul a hell lot of iron when you can get there by land at much lower cost.

I wanted to make something as compact as possible, but you outperformed by far any expectations.

[James_Eh]

Talking about refueling: in LKO, I will be content if you showcase your solution once. After that, you may resort to magic. No need to actually fly a dozen boring milk runs. However, I do want to see a solution that seems halfways adequate. Don't tell me you'd deliver the fuel a spoonful at a time. (more)

Phew. I refer you to the only KSP sin I ever confessed. Time for some magic !!

[Norcalplanner]

I also sadly only use a command seat for the lander (if that's okay?) I hope that isn't cheating in some way.

At the risk of being Debbie Downer, the rules for the challenge include a requirement that the kerbal be inside a pod or capsule. Sorry. :-(

[MAV3RICK]

My Level 1 mission (apologies to Laie, this was from a few months ago - I recreated as much as I could of the mission, but some stuff will be missing).

Version: 0.24

Mods: Kerbal Engineer Redux during design, otherwise stock.

Overview:

A multi-launch mission, including reconnaissance and marking of chosen landing site, refueling of main lander craft, interplanetary transfer, landing, ascent and return to Kerbin.

The landing site:

Chosen using http://www.kerbalmaps.com/, at [spoiler, white text] 28^o 54' 20" S, 147^o 54' 39" W. The site is over 6500m in elevation and relatively flat at the top, although surrounded by steep slopes. [end spoiler]. The site was marked using the rover (below), which itself used the unmanned plane in the same launch as its own marker for rough location.

Landing site marker:

Parts: 250

Weight: 334.56t in 11 stages

Cost: 240151 Funds

Lander launch:

Parts: 495

Weight: 544.07t in 20 stages

Cost: 512257 Funds

Refueller:

Parts: 158

Weight: 608.05t in 4 stages

Cost: 326753 Funds (though the mission did require this to be launched around 4 times to refuel the lander and interplanetary craft once docked).

Interplanetary transfer:

Parts: 197

Weight: 71.01t in 4 stages

Cost: 368982 Funds

SSTO

Parts: 97

Weight: 11.24t in 1 stage (I used action groups to control the engines)

Cost: 28586 Funds

Process:

Launch marker rovers, place at landing site.

Launch lander (it will get into orbit... with just fumes remaining).

Launch refuelling ship(s) - around 4 of these if memory serves.

Launch interplanerary ship to dock with lander

Go to Eve

Land at site - very much trial and error here, though some of the charts I've found on the forums for equatorial landing heights and angles helped as well.

Collect science

Launch from Eve

Get into LKO

Launch SSTO rescue plane.

Land at KSC for tea and medals.

Total missions cost (approx)

2.8M Funds

Image gallery:

http://imgur.com/a/zjuyh

[2001kraft]

Failed completely. Just..

it went awful.

It made it to orbit super well, it was all fine and dandy. Then, I docked, re-fueled, and set out to Eve.

It barely made it into orbit, had 11 units of fuel left. I docked with my station, re-fueled, and when I was getting out of orbit...guess what happened..my fuel was at 9 units of fuel.

I skipped across the atmosphere, did another orbit, and then re-entered again. Parachutes opened, 2/6 tore off. I landed on the ocean instead of coast, my spaceplane broke up into cockpit and rest of the body. When I set out to take a surface sample from the ocean, a kraken occurred and everything on the surface exploded.

I will be trying again later, now with an even more-staged process.

It's actually my first interplanetary attempt like that, the only other thing I flew to was the Mun, so I guess not that bad for a first try

I guess the main problem with this is that it doesn't have enough fuel. At all.

Oh and by the way, remember that rover? Lol, I didn't rotate my cargo bay the right way, so when I dropped it in hope of it getting to the coast since it's lighter, it just tore off my tail. I re-tested the rover on Eve this time, and guess what..it just doesn't drive. So, I guess no rovers.

Edited November 12, 2014 by 2001kraft

[James_Eh]

Failed completely. Just..

it went awful.

It made it to orbit super well, it was all fine and dandy. Then, I docked, re-fueled, and set out to Eve.

It barely made it into orbit, had 11 units of fuel left. I docked with my station, re-fueled, and when I was getting out of orbit...guess what happened..my fuel was at 9 units of fuel.

I skipped across the atmosphere, did another orbit, and then re-entered again. Parachutes opened, 2/6 tore off. I landed on the ocean instead of coast, my spaceplane broke up into cockpit and rest of the body. When I set out to take a surface sample from the ocean, a kraken occurred and everything on the surface exploded.

I will be trying again later, now with an even more-staged process.

It's actually my first interplanetary attempt like that, the only other thing I flew to was the Mun, so I guess not that bad for a first try

I guess the main problem with this is that it doesn't have enough fuel. At all.

Oh and by the way, remember that rover? Lol, I didn't rotate my cargo bay the right way, so when I dropped it in hope of it getting to the coast since it's lighter, it just tore off my tail. I re-tested the rover on Eve this time, and guess what..it just doesn't drive. So, I guess no rovers.

Eve's gravity used to be 1.3G until we all dropped such a mass of rocket bits onto it. I'll bet if I opened up previous versions of the game and tallied up I have 5000T of stuff strewn across the surface all on my own. The seas are purple because that's the colour into which Kerbin metal and rocket doodads bio-degrade.

[hazard-ish]

At the risk of being Debbie Downer, the rules for the challenge include a requirement that the kerbal be inside a pod or capsule. Sorry. :-(

Haha, damn. That has certainly put a spanner in the works but is certainly something I can fix. My current design is capable of getting into orbit with quite a bit of fuel left from much lower on Ev'es surface than I expected so by adding only an extra 0.66 tonnes I might still be okay!

Thanks for letting me know, at least I know now rather than after I've done the entire mission

[NQMT]

Look where Norcalplanner got to!

[Norcalplanner]

Look where Norcalplanner got to!

Well, dang! I had no idea that Squad had posted that until just a few minutes ago. Thanks for the shout out!

[Laie]

Here is my Eve Rocks Challenge (Eve sample + Eve sea sample) "without Kethane" no refueling one shot last try

^^ Wow. I'd make you the winner if I were a referee in this challenge.

Whoa. This is not the kind of challenge where there can be a "winner", but... wow.

The only downside is that you turned off the interface most off the time. This is not only about me being able to verify that you didn't cheat -- although that's a consideration, too: lacking any data to go by I will have to download and fly that craft myself. I don't doubt the outcome, not in this case, which makes this a pointless exercise and a waste of time. Yet I feel obliged to show a certain degree of diligence, and it may be a day or two until I get around to do it. You could save me the hassle, and yourself the wait, if you just showed some data.

The other reason is that in preparing my own mission, I was looking at the galleries I could find, and actively trying to make sense of the data that was available in the pictures: "so he took off at mission time X, and the next pic shows him N seconds later at an alitude of Y... Mechjeb has throttled down, so this must be terminal velocity..." I understand that cluttering the screen with info panels doesn't make for exceptionally nice screenshots, and there can certainly be too much data, but Navball and altimeter aren't too much, and the data is vital. Toss in the resource panel as a basic cheat-proofing measure and I'm happy.

All that nastiness for a missions that is, in essence, beautiful. I'm sorry.

It makes me wonder if I put up the right challenge in the first place. The levels 1-4 mostly deal with bringing ever more powerful ships... as it has turned out, this doesn't add very much to the challenge. It also serves no real purpose, while this mission certainly does. Ideas, anyone?

[Signo]

Hi all, my beta mission is almost done. Just a few steps left. ATM I need to collect the ocean sample and I am omw with the rover.

Here are a few pics. I did not drop the rover on Gilly cause it could be a) boring useless c) you might go to orbit with an easy jump. The ion lander performed as expected, it will be left in Eve's orbit with the mothership core (kinda like an escape boat for the unlucky one who will crew the refuelling station).

The new descent module I used for the main lander (D-Block/LK inspired) performed really well, however there is still room for improvements. I tried a new landing spot around 2600m.

I had an issue with the rover (flat tyre @ landing), tbh my landing speed was 5.9 m/s, I do not think this should happen. The ocean is +/- 80 Km eastbound

I plan to find the time to finish the mission in a couple of days.

Of course if you have any question just ask.

I will not bother you with 40000000000 slides, so if there is anything you want to have a closer look at just let me know. I've got all that 4000000000 slides.

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[astrobond]

Whoa. This is not the kind of challenge where there can be a "winner", but... wow.

The only downside is that you turned off the interface most off the time. This is not only about me being able to verify that you didn't cheat -- although that's a consideration, too: lacking any data to go by I will have to download and fly that craft myself. I don't doubt the outcome, not in this case, which makes this a pointless exercise and a waste of time. Yet I feel obliged to show a certain degree of diligence, and it may be a day or two until I get around to do it. You could save me the hassle, and yourself the wait, if you just showed some data.

...

Thank you for the "wow" Laie

I made a save of the game before lift off on Eve, do you need only the detailed screen of this chapter or all the mission ?

If you need only the Eve lift off to orbit, I can do that quickly, or even a video if you want

BTW, I'm also working on a Jebediah's Level version so I will make a fully detailed album this time... xD

[Laie]

Thank you for the "wow" Laie

I made a save of the game before lift off on Eve, do you need only the detailed screen of this chapter or all the mission ?

If you need only the Eve lift off to orbit, I can do that quickly, or even a video if you want

That wow is heartfelt.

As far as rulemongering is concerned, the Eve ascent will do. No need to replay the entire mission. Though I'm curious about how that glider did in Eve's atmosphere, too: it looks like a swift descent, but without navball and mission time that's hard to tell. If you could add a few comments to that effect while updating the gallery, that would be most kind.

And about going for Jebediah's level: You just did a wonderful Eve Exploration Mission and tell me that you're not happy with it and want to come back for Jebediah's level -- which would, at best, be just more of the same, and at worst would make you compromise on everything that is nice and beautiful, just for the sake of landing a bigger ship at lower altitude. I take this as a sign that I've got the incentives all wrong.

@everybody:

I'd like to change the levels of achievement so that a good mission will be ranked higher than one that is merely big.

Main problem: is that even an option? There's at least three missions in the making, and possibly quite a few more of which I haven't heard yet. Changing the rules on them in mid-flight doesn't seem fair.

Second problem: what constitutes a good mission, anyway? Returning a full set of science reports?

Edited November 12, 2014 by Laie

[Ziv]

@Laie: I had the same problem at JOOL-5 at the beginning and there were two ways ahead of me: introducing some kind of point system to get rid off the subjective judgement but this will change the motivation from doing an Eve-return to be the first on the list and will hold back many "less-interesting" attempts (as we discussed before), or just add detailed comments in the notes so the readers can see and distinct the missions on their own. I decided on the second way.

There might be a list order so the better/complex/more elegant mission goes first in the lists but that would be subjective too. I decided to just note the details of the missions which will indicate how it was built up. Sometimes I used bold text, and when himynameisjake made a JOOL-5 Grand Tour he got a whole new level.

[Emod]

Ah, Eve my favourite purple planet! Thank you.

Here's my contribution: Eve Concept V5

1375 ton and 616 parts in 25 stages for the price of 790000 funds.

It has a comfy 113-ton 145-part sea level lander, rover and a scout rover to send down.

Landing sites are usually shores near the equator, found with the tiny scout rover. Landing in water (or whatever it is) works too.

However, with all the failed attemps and totally misplaced landings I've found that Eve's mountains are really beautiful sometimes.

I'm a little proud of the horizontal staging system, it's odd but works. Also the rover throw-off from the lander looks kind of cool when you see it from inside the lander.

Main thing with this ship is to make it user friendly, for you guys

MechJeb is the only mod used.

I guess I'm in for level 3 then.

Tried to make it rocket-like too..

It's made for 0.23.5 version but still works, just with smaller margins. Thread and download here:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/84643-Eve-Concept-Single-launch-Eve-sea-level-can-lander-and-rover

Earlier version flown here:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/78841-Single-Launch-to-Eve-and-return-Challenge?p=1141156&viewfull=1#post1141156

Have fun!

[astrobond]

That wow is heartfelt.

As far as rulemongering is concerned, the Eve ascent will do. No need to replay the entire mission. Though I'm curious about how that glider did in Eve's atmosphere, too: it looks like a swift descent, but without navball and mission time that's hard to tell. If you could add a few comments to that effect while updating the gallery, that would be most kind.

Hi Laie and All

Not so good at speaking English, but hopefully I had also the idea to backup a save with the glider ready to takeoff too !!! so here are the two "new datas albums" ^^

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Hope this help

Oh and I love this challenge, that's why I also want to test the "big ship" version ^^ just for fun.. I think it's the best way to play... for fun !