pjf

The Comprehensive Kerbal Archive Network (CKAN) Package Manager; v1.18.0 [19 June 2016]

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True, but if you mean modifying the release file, it's not a fix, it's a dirty hack to work around an obvious issue with CKAN.
If you muck with the games release file to say '1.0.4' What happens to mods that are compatible with 1.0.5 only?
How about other things that may expect that file to be correct?
So you're saying that I should screw with the rest of my install to accommodate CKANs bugs, like I have to work around it borking my desktop mime cache?

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[quote name='steve_v']If you muck with the games release file to say '1.0.4' What happens to mods that are compatible with 1.0.5 only?[/QUOTE]

Who knows? A moment ago you wanted this so you could test mods and get their metadata updated, so presumably that wouldn't be a concern.

[QUOTE]So you're saying that I should screw with the rest of my install to accommodate CKANs bugs[/QUOTE]

No, both because the lack of a desired feature is not a bug and because I didn't say you _should_ do anything. I just observed that a user who really does know what they're doing can work around it (in less time than you've spent writing about it here, to boot.)

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[quote name='steve_v']I get his, I really do. But as I understand it, CKAN exists to make life easier - in this scenario it's just getting in my way, and it happens with [I]every[/I] new KSP version.[/quote]
This is really only an issue for a small group of users, those that install a fresh copy of KSP with every version who also use CKAN. Users running Steam get their KSP updated in-place, and CKAN doesn't uninstall their potentially-broken mods. Of the two situations, I think that is a bigger potential problem for CKAN developers to work on than yours.

[quote name='steve_v']If I want to do a Bad Thing, I'll install the mod manually anyway - is it not better to have it handled by ckan, or are we operating under the assumption that Users Are Stupid and making life difficult on purpose? (something that I find [I]extremely[/I] aggravating).
IMO it'd be far better to just provide a --force option with a Big Fat Warning, the number of times this has come up speaks for itself.[/quote]Well, I would counter that the best thing for clever users like you is for this sequence to happen:
* Install desired mods manually
* check that they work
* Report functionality of mods to the mod author's contact option (forum thread, home page, whatever)
* Report functionality of mod to this thread (or by raising an issue on the CKAN Github)
Then, a CKAN contributor (which there is very little preventing you from becoming) does:
* Edit the .netkan file to change the KSP Max Version field.
Then you can manually remove the mod and re-add it through CKAN, with the benefit for all other CKAN users that they can now easily use CKAN to do it.

You doing a --force option to avoid the metadata update is the selfish alternative.

Now, I don't know whether a decision has been made to not include a --force option in order to encourage this cooperative workflow, or whether it is just something that they haven't gotten around to.

Either way, you have two options. You can continue to complain about things not working the way you want them to, or you can be helpful and make CKAN work better for all the users, either by testing, metadata editing, or even contributing code to add a --force option if you really, really want that option.

If you had simply started by providing a list of the mods that you know work and need to be updated, I could have submitted changes by now. Instead, I'm spending my limited time responding to your complaints.

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Hello - I found what may (I don't know enough about CKAN to say for sure) be an issue - the KAX mod ([url]https://kerbalstuff.com/mod/391[/url]) is showing as 1.0.5 on kerbalstuff, but max version is only 1.0.4 on CKAN.

I was unable to update, unless doing an uninstall/reinstall of KAX. This appears to have worked, but the max version still shows 1.0.4...

My understanding was that anything added to kerbalstuff gets its metadata automatically generated from what the mod author submits to kerbalstuff - is there something going wrong here?

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[quote name='S4qFBxkFFg']Hello - I found what may (I don't know enough about CKAN to say for sure) be an issue - the KAX mod ([url]https://kerbalstuff.com/mod/391[/url]) is showing as 1.0.5 on kerbalstuff, but max version is only 1.0.4 on CKAN.

I was unable to update, unless doing an uninstall/reinstall of KAX. This appears to have worked, but the max version still shows 1.0.4...

My understanding was that anything added to kerbalstuff gets its metadata automatically generated from what the mod author submits to kerbalstuff - is there something going wrong here?[/QUOTE]

The latest version of KAX is for 1.0.5 as you can see it here: [url]https://github.com/KSP-CKAN/CKAN-meta/blob/master/KerbalAircraftExpansion/KerbalAircraftExpansion-KAX_v2.6.1.0.ckan#L14[/url]

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[quote name='politas']Well, I would counter that the best thing for clever users like you is for this sequence to happen:
...
You doing a --force option to avoid the metadata update is the selfish alternative.[/QUOTE]

My point is, if I have to do manual installs to test compatibility I might as well just do manual installs.

How about:
* Note that mod is marked as incompatible.
* --force install
* Test.
* Dump .ckan | grep <incompatible flag> to generate list of working "incompatible" mods.
* Post said list and/or update metadata.
Once the metadata is updated, mod becomes marked as compatible with no further work, and no manual uninstall/reinstall cycle.
?
Easier, no?

Yes, I'd like it to work "right now" precious metadata or no, and I'd like to be able to e.g. roll back mods or install specific versions on request without digging through the registry for version numbers.
I might even be inclined to help out maintaining the metadata if ckan didn't make the testing process unnecessarily difficult.

Initially I thought this system a great idea, but with the angering of mod authors (e.g. the recent argument with Ferram4), the "maybe sometime next year" response to a "breaks unrelated software" bug and the "nevermind UE, metadata never lies" attitude I'm not so sure any more.

Anyway, feel free to spend your time on something else, it's a moot point anyway.
As it stands ckan screws up my desktop and makes testing mod compatibility difficult, so I'll take the third option, install manually and quit fighting an application that apparently knows what I want better than I do. Edited by steve_v
More asterisk.

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[quote name='steve_v']My point is, if I have to do manual installs to test compatibility I might as well just do manual installs.[/QUOTE]

Or, you know, you could use the ten-second workaround to test compatibility. Your claim that CKAN makes it needlessly difficult just doesn't stand up. Of course, the workaround is only any good if you want to test compatibility and update metadata, but not if you just want to --force install and play on, so one wonders why you find it so unattractive if you supposedly are raring at the bit to do the former.

[QUOTE]Initially I thought this system a great idea, but with the angering of mod authors (e.g. the recent argument with Ferram4)[/QUOTE]

... a situation which would be enormously exacerbated if CKAN were to provide a convenient way to install supposedly-incompatible versions. Hey, how about a --force-win64-hack argument, too?

Indeed, I think the annoyance it would cause mod authors is the primary argument against a way to install mis-versioned mods.

[QUOTE]the "nevermind UE, metadata never lies" attitude[/QUOTE]

Is the exact opposite of the "if the metadata is wrong, fix the metadata" approach. But what do I know? I actually _have_ fixed the metadata for mods I use.

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[quote name='damerell']... a situation which would be enormously exacerbated if CKAN were to provide a convenient way to install supposedly-incompatible versions. Hey, how about a --force-win64-hack argument, too?
Indeed, I think the annoyance it would cause mod authors is the primary argument against a way to install mis-versioned mods.[/QUOTE]
And we're back to this:
[quote name='steve_v']...are we operating under the assumption that Users Are Stupid and making life difficult on purpose?
...
Every package manager I have ever encountered (with one obvious exception) has a non-frustrating, documented way to override such sanity checks...
Why is it such a big deal to include this in ckan?
[/QUOTE]
It's pretty easy to identify that a user has intentionally broken things (as ckan knows the installed mod is marked incompatible), but all the "outdated/broken mod version installed by ckan" issues I have seen are not this at all, rather that your metadata was wrong and ckan installed it without complaining.
I doubt we're going to agree on this, but I'm done repeating myself, and I'm done with ckan. It's more aggravation than it's worth. Edited by steve_v

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[quote name='politas']Open your exported .ckan file in a text editor and change "depends" to "recommends", and you should be able to get just the compatible mods when you install from it.[/QUOTE]
Thanks! That seems to have done the trick.

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I am trying to get my recently updated 2 kerbal command pod onto CKAN, and am curious about something before I send a pull request with the *.netkan 's.

I've generated the ckan data and tried installing it through CKAN; however, I am getting a "too many mods provide..." error. I am using a system similar to RSS and RFs to install textures (multiple choice textures). I have noticed that others have had an issue with this in the past, and am wondering a couple things:
-if the issue was resolved and I am doing something wrong on my end
-will installing it in this fashion (multiple "provides") even work by merely 'opening' the ckan file
-is it just a bug and that when I send in the data everything will work properly through the GUI?

I noticed that RSS and RFs is still using this method to select multiple dependent choices, so I am unsure what to do about it. Any advice/answers would be greatly appreciated..

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[quote name='Yarbrough08']I am trying to get my recently updated 2 kerbal command pod onto CKAN, and am curious about something before I send a pull request with the *.netkan 's.

I've generated the ckan data and tried installing it through CKAN; however, I am getting a "too many mods provide..." error. I am using a system similar to RSS and RFs to install textures (multiple choice textures). I have noticed that others have had an issue with this in the past, and am wondering a couple things:
-if the issue was resolved and I am doing something wrong on my end
-will installing it in this fashion (multiple "provides") even work by merely 'opening' the ckan file
-is it just a bug and that when I send in the data everything will work properly through the GUI?

I noticed that RSS and RFs is still using this method to select multiple dependent choices, so I am unsure what to do about it. Any advice/answers would be greatly appreciated..[/QUOTE]Can you post a link to your Github fork with the .netkan files you've created? Then we can have a look at them.

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I do not have a fork on Github, and I am not that familiar with using it. I do know how to send pull requests, but that's the limit of my knowledge - I've never had a reason to learn more lol.

I can do this (PasteAll):

[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62395"]Core Mod[/URL]

[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62396"]4096[/URL]
[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62397"]2048[/URL]
[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62398"]1024[/URL]
[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62399"]Low[/URL]

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[quote name='steve_v']It's pretty easy to identify that a user has intentionally broken things (as ckan knows the installed mod is marked incompatible), but all the "outdated/broken mod version installed by ckan" issues I have seen are not this at all, rather that your metadata was wrong and ckan installed it without complaining.[/QUOTE]

The issues you have seen were not caused by a CKAN feature that doesn't exist? You astound me.

If the metadata is wrong, fix the metadata. That seems entirely consistent with what I have been saying.

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[quote name='Yarbrough08']I do not have a fork on Github, and I am not that familiar with using it. I do know how to send pull requests, but that's the limit of my knowledge - I've never had a reason to learn more lol.[/quote]If you want to keep maintaining your mod's metadata (and CKAN is very, very happy for mod authors to do so!), it's probably worth learning the fairly minimal amount needed to use the github web site to modify files and generate pull requests from there.

[quote name='Yarbrough08']I can do this (PasteAll):

[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62395"]Core Mod[/URL]

[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62396"]4096[/URL]
[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62397"]2048[/URL]
[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62398"]1024[/URL]
[URL="http://www.pasteall.org/62399"]Low[/URL][/QUOTE]You'll need to bump the spec_version to "v1.4" in order to use "find", but otherwise, that looks like it ought to work to me. Obviously, if you're doing install from .ckan, you'll need to completely uninstall (parts+texture) between trying each texture file.

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@politas: Thank you for your assistance. I'll swap the spec_version over and send the pull request.
Also considering I been reading code off of GitHub for a while, I suppose I do need to learn a bit more about using the website.

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When I tick the mods I want to install and go to install them, everything works normally until the final mod is installed. Then I get an error and find out that CKAN has downloaded all the mods to the cache successfully, but nothing is in my Gamedata folder. It does this every. Single. Time. After spending almost an hour checkmarking mods I'm done. Any help? They are all still in my cache waiting to be extracted..

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[quote name='CrazedGunman502']When I tick the mods I want to install and go to install them, everything works normally until the final mod is installed. Then I get an error and find out that CKAN has downloaded all the mods to the cache successfully, but nothing is in my Gamedata folder. It does this every. Single. Time. After spending almost an hour checkmarking mods I'm done. Any help? They are all still in my cache waiting to be extracted..[/QUOTE]

If you could give us the error it would help us a lot.
As for the cache, the zip files are used to install the mods but they don't get deleted, that is the purpose of a cache :P

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[quote name='Olympic1']If you could give us the error it would help us a lot.
As for the cache, the zip files are used to install the mods but they don't get deleted, that is the purpose of a cache :P[/QUOTE]

Yep, sure.

"Unhanded exception has occurred in your application. If you click Continue, the application will ignore this error and attempt to continue. If you click Quit, the application will close immediately.

Transaction timeout."

This happens every time the mods are finished being downloaded. CKAN freezes and I am a sad person. Everything is ready to be extracted from the downloads folder but CKAN is super stubborn and doesn't want to do it. It's either manually install all of those .zip folders (which is going to take a really long time) or try again until it works (unlikely).

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[quote name='CrazedGunman502']Yep, sure.

"Unhanded exception has occurred in your application. If you click Continue, the application will ignore this error and attempt to continue. If you click Quit, the application will close immediately.

Transaction timeout."

This happens every time the mods are finished being downloaded. CKAN freezes and I am a sad person. Everything is ready to be extracted from the downloads folder but CKAN is super stubborn and doesn't want to do it. It's either manually install all of those .zip folders (which is going to take a really long time) or try again until it works (unlikely).[/QUOTE]
A few questions to try to pin down the problem:
Is this your first time using CKAN? If not, when were you last able to successfully install mods using it?
What version of .net/Mono do you have installed?
What operating system are you using? Edited by politas

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[quote name='politas']A few questions to try to pin down the problem:
Is this your first time using CKAN? If not, when were you last able to successfully install mods using it?
What version of .net/Mono do you have installed?
What operating system are you using?[/QUOTE]

I found out what the issue was.

It turns out that installing 200+ mods in one go with CKAN is not recommended. One mod in particular was causing the program to freeze each time it was downloading. Luckily though, I found out you can sort by cache and I could extract the rest of the mods properly. All is well now.

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[quote name='CrazedGunman502']It turns out that installing 200+ mods in one go with CKAN is not recommended. One mod in particular was causing the program to freeze each time it was downloading. Luckily though, I found out you can sort by cache and I could extract the rest of the mods properly. All is well now.[/QUOTE]

Although it would be nice if CKAN did not promptly forget the user-desired state when this sort of thing happens.

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@pjf This isn't directly related to CKAN as an app, but thought you'd like to know (just in case you weren't aware ) that the forum migration seems to have messed up the stickied link to this thread.

I don't know if this is something you can fix yourself, but considering how busy it usually is in here, I can imagine there being a few support requests ending up without a home. 

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On 25-11-2015 21:35:49, S4qFBxkFFg said:

Hello - I found what may (I don't know enough about CKAN to say for sure) be an issue - the KAX mod (https://kerbalstuff.com/mod/391) is showing as 1.0.5 on kerbalstuff, but max version is only 1.0.4 on CKAN.

I was unable to update, unless doing an uninstall/reinstall of KAX. This appears to have worked, but the max version still shows 1.0.4...

My understanding was that anything added to kerbalstuff gets its metadata automatically generated from what the mod author submits to kerbalstuff - is there something going wrong here?

The latest version of KAX is for 1.0.5 as you can see it here: https://github.com/KSP-CKAN/CKAN-meta/blob/master/KerbalAircraftExpansion/KerbalAircraftExpansion-KAX_v2.6.1.0.ckan#L14

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Any chance CKAN will add that allegedly updated MechJeb again?? Or am I missing something on the MJ front?

Or what about KER?? Would be nice to get dV and TWR numbers again, I´m in the dark since 1.0.5

I never installed any mods outside of CKAN and would like to keep it that way, afraid I screw up my files otherwise.

Thanks for reading

 

Daf

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Having a small problem with the CKAN client. Planetshine just posted an update this week, and the client is crashing as soon as I click the checkmarks to update the two mod listings. Other mods update fine, and I'm only seeing this problem with these. Running under Windows 10. Screenshot:

 

ckan-planetshine-crash.jpg

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