[1.10.x] Mark IV Spaceplane System (August 3)

[Starbuckminsterfullerton]

Does it work if you remove the new ATM? I'm still using the older one and it works fine.

Doesn't look like it, which is weird because v1.0 definitely did. I'll try the old version next chance I get, if that doesn't work either something else is afoot.

[Nertea]

Doesn't look like it, which is weird because v1.0 definitely did. I'll try the old version next chance I get, if that doesn't work either something else is afoot.

Pretty strange. Let me know what happens.

[Starbuckminsterfullerton]

So I put in version 1.0, and reverted to the version of ATM I've been using since October, but no dice. I'd try a redownload of mkIV, but as you saw it is loading.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Starbuckminsterfullerton

[Nertea]

v1.1.1 is up

This has a bit more than I thought it would in it, I got a small VTOL jet based off of the TB2 thrusters in. It's calibrated so that 4 of them will be enough to lift an approx. TB2-sized plane. Also TB2-esque SFX for the SCIMITARs . Other than that, not much.

Changes:

• Fixed DRE patch for SCIMITARs being wrong
  
• Changed how MM patches for mod compatability are applied for easier end-user tweaking
  
• Increased area of Heavy Structural Intakes slightly (about 1.25x as effective)
  
• Increased strength of Cargo Bay connections
  
• Added intakes to the Mk4 Cockpit (~1 Shock Cone intake effectiveness)
  
• Added custom SFX to the SCIMITAR
  
• Added Yellowjacket VTOL jet engine - high thrust, overheats easily
  

Edited December 11, 2014 by Nertea

[Kebra]

The Heavy Structural Intakes are very powerfull arent' they?

It feels a lot easier to get a big Mk4 SSTO into orbit than a Mk2. I can easily cruise to about 40km with Mark IV parts, leaving just a few hundred m/s of actual rocket burn to complete a 100km orbit.

With Mk2 i usually struggle and have to be carefull in order to reach 30kilometers before toggling engine modes on the Rapiers.

Is this by design or are there some tweaks still in the pipeline waiting to be done?

[Nertea]

What version are you using? The newest? There was a serious imbalance in the v1.0 cfgs that made them about 400x as powerful as they should have been.

[sidfu]

haveing some problems with tweakscale on the cockpit, and intakes when i resize them i start getting null erros spamed in log. its just those 3 parts ive noticed. also the node for the vtol engine is to much to the side its not centered.

i tested on all the parts and was onnly those 3 would give errors when i resized.

[EXC 17:15:58.566] NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

BaseFieldList.get_Item (System.String fieldName)

TweakScale.MemberUpdater.Create (System.Object obj, System.String name)

TweakScale.ScaleExponents.UpdateFields (System.Object obj, System.Object baseObj, ScalingFactor factor, .Part part)

TweakScale.ScaleExponents.UpdateObject (.Part part, .Part prefabObj, System.Collections.Generic.Dictionary`2 exponents, ScalingFactor factor)

TweakScale.TSGenericUpdater.OnRescale (ScalingFactor factor)

TweakScale.TweakScale.OnTweakScaleChanged ()

TweakScale.TweakScale.Update ()

this is the error im getting

[Basilo1146]

This is really awesome and I like it a lot. My only thought is that it would be nice for there to be a completely symmetrical version of this, as that would fix some issues with the angle snap in the editor and would allow people to make rocket type vehicles using these parts.

[blowfish]

How come the 3x length fuselage only weighs 2x as much?

[blowfish]

Also, FYI, the intakes and engine pods need to be added to the FAR cfg. Though intake area functions differently in FAR (I don't think you need modify the area based on the mass). The engines should also have their default drag parameters set to zero like other parts.

The Yellow Jacket's stack node will also cause lots of drag with FAR when it's surface attached. I'm not sure how to fix this though, at least not without a plugin like NodeToggle.

EDIT: These are the changes that need to be made I think. I'm pretty sure NEEDS and FOR are the same as far as MM is concerned:

{
@maximum_drag = 0
@minimum_drag = 0
@angularDrag = 0
}

@PART[mk4yellowjacket]:NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch|NEAR]
{
@maximum_drag = 0
@minimum_drag = 0
@angularDrag = 0
}

@PART[mk4pod-1]:NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch|NEAR]
{
@maximum_drag = 0
@minimum_drag = 0
@angularDrag = 0
}

@PART[mk4pod-2]:NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch|NEAR]
{
@maximum_drag = 0
@minimum_drag = 0
@angularDrag = 0
}

@PART[mk4intake-radial-1]:NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch|NEAR]
{
@maximum_drag = 0
@minimum_drag = 0
@angularDrag = 0

@MODULE[ModuleResourceIntake]
{
@area = 0.015
}
}

@PART[mk4intake-radial-2]:NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch|NEAR]
{
@maximum_drag = 0
@minimum_drag = 0
@angularDrag = 0

@MODULE[ModuleResourceIntake]
{
@area = 0.015
}
}

@PART[mk4cockpit]:NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch|NEAR]
{
@MODULE[ModuleResourceIntake]
{
@area = 0.01
}
}

@PART[mk4scimitar]:NEEDS[FerramAerospaceResearch|NEAR]

Edited December 12, 2014 by blowfish

[herpderpmcderp]

Can we get a cargo tail section that has an editable opening to it? I love this mod so far for making bases and transporting things across terrain using Tohou's wheels and even made a boat version, but for the boat, the stock cargo tail tends to give me issues when on and off loading rovers.

[Nertea]

haveing some problems with tweakscale on the cockpit, and intakes when i resize them i start getting null erros spamed in log. its just those 3 parts ive noticed. also the node for the vtol engine is to much to the side its not centered.

i tested on all the parts and was onnly those 3 would give errors when i resized.

[EXC 17:15:58.566] NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

BaseFieldList.get_Item (System.String fieldName)

TweakScale.MemberUpdater.Create (System.Object obj, System.String name)

TweakScale.ScaleExponents.UpdateFields (System.Object obj, System.Object baseObj, ScalingFactor factor, .Part part)

TweakScale.ScaleExponents.UpdateObject (.Part part, .Part prefabObj, System.Collections.Generic.Dictionary`2 exponents, ScalingFactor factor)

TweakScale.TSGenericUpdater.OnRescale (ScalingFactor factor)

TweakScale.TweakScale.OnTweakScaleChanged ()

TweakScale.TweakScale.Update ()

this is the error im getting

Suggest you take that over to the TweakScale thread. I don't know what that might be.

This is really awesome and I like it a lot. My only thought is that it would be nice for there to be a completely symmetrical version of this, as that would fix some issues with the angle snap in the editor and would allow people to make rocket type vehicles using these parts.

That would involve redoing all the parts completely . So I don't think I'll be doing that...

How come the 3x length fuselage only weighs 2x as much?

Well, if it's completely illogical, I'm pretty sure it's a bug.

Also, FYI, the intakes and engine pods need to be added to the FAR cfg. Though intake area functions differently in FAR (I don't think you need modify the area based on the mass). The engines should also have their default drag parameters set to zero like other parts.

The Yellow Jacket's stack node will also cause lots of drag with FAR when it's surface attached. I'm not sure how to fix this though, at least not without a plugin like NodeToggle.

Ok so for once and for all: FAR support needs the following:

• All parts' minDrag, maxDrag and angularDrag needs to be zeroed
  
• ModuleLiftingSurface should be removed for any parts that have it
  
• All extra nodes possible need to be removed
  
• Jet engines may or may not need thrust nerfed
  
• Jet engines need velocity curve adjustments
  
• Intake area is plainly logical
  

Is there anything else I need to know to make sure I don't keep releasing tiny patches and missing something?

Can we get a cargo tail section that has an editable opening to it? I love this mod so far for making bases and transporting things across terrain using Tohou's wheels and even made a boat version, but for the boat, the stock cargo tail tends to give me issues when on and off loading rovers.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v715/Farmer_Griff/screenshot31_zps9b60f168.pnghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v715/Farmer_Griff/screenshot35_zpsb7d7e4e1.pnghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v715/Farmer_Griff/screenshot29_zpsb7c5081d.png

So are you saying variable height ramp? I'm not sure what else you would mean. I am not really sure how I would accomplish that, particularly without a plugin. Sweet boat though.

[Horrigan]

Still not working on this new version (1.1.1) with DMP (DarkMultiplayer). Some parts are not shown in editor

Edited December 12, 2014 by Horrigan

[ultrasquid]

Is there anything else I need to know to make sure I don't keep releasing tiny patches and missing something?

I'm having trouble using symmetry to attach to the two smaller nodes on the 3-way endcap. Anything I try to stick there either tries to go radial or only a single one sticks. This makes it hard to attach tail booms for further symmetric winglets and such.

Also I'm having trouble attaching some jet intakes to the engine pods, notably those from the RetroFuture mod.

About those upper-hull wingmounts I suggested earlier. Rather than whole hull pieces, some radial-mount hardpoint bump would do. I tried it with your large jet intakes and that almost has the right look, and wings attach to them, so something similar like that maybe?

Edited December 12, 2014 by ultrasquid

[Nertea]

I'm having trouble using symmetry to attach to the two smaller nodes on the 3-way endcap. Anything I try to stick there either tries to go radial or only a single one sticks. This makes it hard to attach tail booms for further symmetric winglets and such.

Also I'm having trouble attaching some jet intakes to the engine pods, notably those from the RetroFuture mod.

About those upper-hull wingmounts I suggested earlier. Rather than whole hull pieces, some radial-mount hardpoint bump would do. I tried it with your large jet intakes and that almost has the right look, and wings attach to them, so something similar like that maybe?

About the first, cool good to know. I'll try to figure out what's wrong, probably incorrect symmetry setting.

Have trouble... what does this mean? Can't attach them, collides? Can they attach individually? Is it only when you have many together that it doesn't work?

Hardpoint bump: Raptor9 demonstrated that it's really easy to do this with Mk2 fuselages. Unless I can think of something that isn't just essentially replicating that, it's not really worth doing.

Still not working on this new version (1.1.1) with DMP (DarkMultiplayer). Some parts are not shown in editor

What's "some parts"? The usual cause of that is improper installation location. Other than that, I really am not sure if I can help because I have no idea how DMP works.

[Arsonik]

Been having a lot of fun with this for the past week. I've got a few of the fuel tanks modified to hold Liquid Hydrogen so they can run NFT engines/fuel in orbit.

I've had some pretty cool designs and I'm still coming up with new ideas every time I load up kerbal. Perhaps you could add Liquid Hydrogen/Argon/Xenon tanks into the next update, or simply make them toggleable between Lf/LfO/LH/Ar/Xe. Some cross-mod love for your growing lineup .

Hopefully you can get the FAR issues sorted out, and this will be a perfect package for me. Thank you for delivering on another great mod! I've been meaning to post some pictures of some of the designs I've done to inspire some people perhaps, but I am a huge procrastinator. Maybe this weekend...

[herpderpmcderp]

So are you saying variable height ramp? I'm not sure what else you would mean. I am not really sure how I would accomplish that, particularly without a plugin. Sweet boat though.

Maybe talk with the damned robotics guys. Because I was thinking after posting, that a two position system would be ideal. Similar to how a C-130 doesn't open its door all the way while doing air drops because of the fact that doing so could send the plane into a nose dive. Picture related.

Also, thanks for liking the boat.

[blowfish]

Ok so for once and for all: FAR support needs the following:

• All parts' minDrag, maxDrag and angularDrag needs to be zeroed
  
• ModuleLiftingSurface should be removed for any parts that have it
  
• All extra nodes possible need to be removed
  
• Jet engines may or may not need thrust nerfed
  
• Jet engines need velocity curve adjustments
  
• Intake area is plainly logical
  

That looks complete. Occasionally you'll run into a part that needs custom drag parameters but hopefully that won't be the case here.

[Starbuckminsterfullerton]

Still not working on this new version (1.1.1) with DMP (DarkMultiplayer). Some parts are not shown in editor

Look carefully at which parts they are, I'm currently struggling with a bug that makes any part that leverages another part's texture unload. If, for example, you have the short fuselages but not the 3x versions, the double engine pod but not the triple, or only a couple of the tail adapters, we might have the same problem. Or it could just be the usual multiplayer shenanigans. DMP/KMP add a whole new level of weirdness.

[ultrasquid]

…

Have trouble... what does this mean? Can't attach them, collides? Can they attach individually? Is it only when you have many together that it doesn't work?

It seems to be with the triple jet pod, if I try to connect intakes to the outer two with symmetry they show up green but won't connect. Also if I have a fuselage section or cockpit attached to the one in the middle, the intakes won't connect. However if the pod is empty, intakes will connect singly.

I was able to do what I'm describing eventually, but I had to come up with a workaround with temporarily having the triple pod connected to another part, but symmetry still didn't work.

Edited December 12, 2014 by ultrasquid
pic added

[Raptor9]

Hardpoint bump: Raptor9 demonstrated that it's really easy to do this with Mk2 fuselages. Unless I can think of something that isn't just essentially replicating that, it's not really worth doing.

Nertea, you really can't see it from the photo, but the Mk2 fuselage tanks do pinch the upper inside cargo space slightly. Wouldn't be a problem with low-profile rovers, but full 2.5M parts might clip/collide with the Mk2 parts in that configuration. It's up to you of course if you want to make the dorsal wing root, but I wanted to make sure you were aware.

[Aivoh]

Greetings,

After multiple installs, eliminating ATM, MM and several other mods I have found that there seems to be some sort of conflict between MSS 1.1.1 and NearFutureSolar when using ModuleManager.

Playing a career game and for testing purposes with all research complete.

Clean install, all mods except M4SS and NO MM and the NFS parts show in the VAB.

Clean install, all mods except M4SS with MM 2.5.1 and the NFS parts show in the VAB. (I have a log)

Clean install, all mods except M4SS with MM 2.5.3 and the NFS parts show in the VAB. (I have a log)

Clean install, all mods including M4SS with no MM and the NFS parts show in the VAB. (I have a log)

Clean install, all mods including M4SS with MM 2.5.1 and the NFS parts do not show in the VAB. (I have a log)

Remove MM and the NFS parts once again show in the VAB.

Clean install, all mods including M4SS v1.0 with MM 2.5.1 and the NFS parts show in the VAB. (I have a log)

If you would like to see the logs I just need a suggestion on how to make them available, though it seems rather easy to duplicate now.

MM is doing something when M4SS 1.1.1 is installed that keeps the NSF parts from showing in the VAB.

Take the MM .dll out and they show, put it back and they do not. Install v1.0 of M4SS and they show either way.

Thank you

[switchON]

My SSO can't go in space anymore since the last update

Is someone who knows what it could be?

[Guest]

Intakes got nerfed, by a large amount. If you use them, chances are you'll need more of them than before.

[drtedastro]

H'mmm, sounds like WAY too many snacks have been consumed....