Pilot Controls or How one can watch their munar lander turn into a lawn dart.

[samstarman5]

The new pilot controls are great. They are so great we can get spoiled by them, and completely forget what we last had set after landing.

Today I used the retrograde setting to land on the Mun, and boy, did that make that so much easier. Landing somewhere flat helped, as well. Got my science done, planted a flag, went to check out the cool crater nearby. You know, the usual things you do upon landing on the Mun. After getting some choice screenshots and getting back on board, I was set to take off. Decided to shed my landing stage as it performed above specifications, and then launched. The nose immediately took a turn for the ground, which immediately got my adrenaline up and fought to correct it to stop it from being a lawn dart. That was when I realized I still had pilot control set to head for retrograde. After fixing that to stability assist and getting the ship back on course, I was able to get my breathing and pulse under control. I do have to say, managing to correct that without crashing was a true rush.

Using the pilot controls to help land is a real boost, unless you are coming down on challenging terrain which can require overrides. But once you have landed, don't forget to switch back to stability assist. Unless you want to go for that adrenaline rush, yourself. It helped that my return stage was so small and light(I am not up to all Mk2 parts, yet), but anything heavier would have ramped the difficulty for certain.

Definitely a word of caution for you pilots out there. Fly safe!

[sal_vager]

Yeah definitely a usability issue here, it may be better if disabling SAS reset the hold modes to Stability Assist automatically :/

[samstarman5]

Nah, I like toggling SAS to refresh it now and then. Better to keep people on their toes, especially when it comes to spaceflight.

[Starhawk]

Today I used the retrograde setting to land on the Mun, and boy, did that make that so much easier.

I, too, find the hold retrograde pilot skill very convenient for landings. There is one caveat, though. I was coming down on Minmus and hit a bit hard and bounced. 'Well isn't that cute.' I thought as Jeb flipped the lander over just in time for it to end up on it's back.

[Rithsom]

Yeah definitely a usability issue here, it may be better if disabling SAS reset the hold modes to Stability Assist automatically :/

Maybe the SAS could switch to Stability Assist once the ship lands, too.

[Starhawk]

Maybe the SAS could switch to Stability Assist once the ship lands, too.

Perhaps a Level 4 Pilot Skill - automatically switch to stability assist once the landing legs make contact.

[samstarman5]

Perhaps a Level 4 Pilot Skill - automatically switch to stability assist once the landing legs make contact.

Now that does work for me.

[Wallygator]

Yeah definitely a usability issue here, it may be better if disabling SAS reset the hold modes to Stability Assist automatically :/

Next thing and some one will suggest this be some kind of unlockable capability. Arrggghhhh!!!!!

[Stubby]

I remember one time when I was landing a probe on the Mun, I had retrograde SAS enabled, and when the landing legs made contact with the surface, the whole ship spun wildly around on the ground and tore itself apart. It turns out the retrograde marker goes crazy when you land, and the reaction wheels were too strong. It was hilarious looking though, definitely a kerbal moment.

[Merinsan]

Sadly I have had this happen multiple times - it seems I don't learn. Fortunately though, never crashed.

My most recent Mun landing was for Base construction, and the ship was wobbly and I used the hold retrograde for the landing. I was very careful to switch to stability assist before the landing legs touched the ground, because the amount of torque it had would have ripped it apart once it landed (and the retrograde moved).

[SpacedCowboy]

I remember one time when I was landing a probe on the Mun, I had retrograde SAS enabled, and when the landing legs made contact with the surface, the whole ship spun wildly around on the ground and tore itself apart. It turns out the retrograde marker goes crazy when you land, and the reaction wheels were too strong. It was hilarious looking though, definitely a kerbal moment.

*And that's why till this day, they still call me "Stubby"* ... Just kiddin' Oh' man I have been there! Ashamed to say, "Iv'e got the T-Shirt"!

[Kerano]

Perhaps a Level 4 Pilot Skill - automatically switch to stability assist once the landing legs make contact.

I'll definitely second that. Would be very handy not to have to do it manually once you have an experienced pilot.

[aleis]

Done this. It is really useful for the majority of the landing. Just have to make sure to switch it to standard hold heading. Or not going to zero velocity

[numerobis]

Perhaps a Level 4 Pilot Skill - automatically switch to stability assist once the landing legs make contact.

I like this idea. What could go wrong?

(No, seriously, I really do like the idea.)

[Alchemist]

I've got something fun as well. I was driving a large rover on Minmus using the prograde setting for SAS to increase the stability. It was going perfect until I decided to stop it. I enabled bakes, ensured it is stable and decelerating and went away for a bit... only to find the rover belly up! Looks like when it stopped it suddenly decided to point the craft in opposite direction and pitch down was the best idea it came with. Fortunately, the only damage was one of the solar panels andthe rover could be easily turned properly.

As for landings... my first attempt to do this ended in broken engine. Attitude control worked fine, but the engine was turned on a bit too late. I blame Jeb - he was piloting.

[merendel]

As someone who has used Mech Jeb's smartASS in the past I can say useing it to hold retrograde is a horrible idea for landing. Overthrust just a bit during final decent and start traveling up can cause your craft to flip out and you may not recover and get pointed in the right direction before gravity makes you its ..... The new controls do basically the same thing and I wouldn't trust them for landing anyway. I do think toggling SAS on and off should default to stability only however.

[gtmattz]

As someone who has used Mech Jeb's smartASS in the past I can say useing it to hold retrograde is a horrible idea for landing. Overthrust just a bit during final decent and start traveling up can cause your craft to flip out and you may not recover and get pointed in the right direction before gravity makes you its ..... The new controls do basically the same thing and I wouldn't trust them for landing anyway. I do think toggling SAS on and off should default to stability only however.

I second this. After my first few landing attempts using MJ smartASS, I started using the retrograde setting just long enough to get the ship established in a bottom-down attitude, then switch back to stability (actually kill-rot for MJ) and manually adjust as needed. Much safer in the long run, and with the addition of the pilot skills in beta, I have simply continued the same procedure.

[StrandedonEarth]

With the Lvl 3 pilots maybe setting to radial would be a good choice, once you've killed most of the horizontal velocity. You could still twitch it to the sides or use RCS to kill the rest of the horizontal velocity, and it should always stay or return to pointing straight up.

[Freshmeat]

I use retrograde stability for landing, and kill the engine just before touchdown. Using a throttle, I usually descend at about 1-3 m/s at that time, so the fall at the end is of little consequence.