girka2k

[1.4.*] [2.5.3] (2018-04-06) UbioZur Welding Ltd. Continued

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Problem:

I have a plane that is perfectly balanced fore / aft. I placed wings in such a way so that the COL and COM wet and dry are almost perfectly centered. COM DOES NOT move in the SPH, when I edit the fuel amount of the tank, whci again, is located at the COM. There is no other fuel on the CRAFT I have triple checked.

When I takeoff, pitch response is good / as expected. As I burn off fuel, the craft becomes nose heavy to the point I cannot control it.

Suspicion:

COM is not accurately reflected in the SPH, when Welded parts are attached.

It's as if there IS fuel located in the aft welded engines, that is burning off.

CRAFT and CFG

Edited by Space Cowboy

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I just noticed that back in October the method for calculating crash tolerance and stuff was changed to be much more in line with stock, very happy to see that! That was my biggest problem with the mod. You guys are my heroes :)

Question: if you weld physicsless parts, do their masses get added to the weldment as their listed masses or actual masses? (Ladders, small batteries and such)

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If it calculates the mass based on the "mass" parameter then the new part would have a mass value equal to however mass is calculated. Whether or not the physics-less parameter would be carried over is another question entirely, and I would venture that it is not. This shouldn't present much of an issue because the change to physics-less for those specific parts was due to the fact that you would not normally attach them in a symmetrical manner, but would expect the craft to behave as if there was little to no effect from them being present. When welded to a part that does have mass being applied in the game, you would expect the part to gain a minimal amount of mass, but the part in which mass would be ignored no longer has the same effect since it's now a part of the other part and won't be causing any extra pull to one side during flight due to it's asymmetrical position.

I have no idea how it would work if you welded a bunch of physics-less parts together without a physical part acting as the base. My guess is you'd get a physical part, and not a physics-less one.

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I just noticed that back in October the method for calculating crash tolerance and stuff was changed to be much more in line with stock, very happy to see that! That was my biggest problem with the mod. You guys are my heroes :)

Question: if you weld physicsless parts, do their masses get added to the weldment as their listed masses or actual masses? (Ladders, small batteries and such)

There is a switch for this in the config so that you can decide this for yourself if you want them added with weight or not.

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Problem:

I have a plane that is perfectly balanced fore / aft. I placed wings in such a way so that the COL and COM wet and dry are almost perfectly centered. COM DOES NOT move in the SPH, when I edit the fuel amount of the tank, whci again, is located at the COM. There is no other fuel on the CRAFT I have triple checked.

When I takeoff, pitch response is good / as expected. As I burn off fuel, the craft becomes nose heavy to the point I cannot control it.

Suspicion:

COM is not accurately reflected in the SPH, when Welded parts are attached.

It's as if there IS fuel located in the aft welded engines, that is burning off.

CRAFT and CFG

So did the edit of the cfg for the engine part solve your problem, or is it still persistent?

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Still a problem Alewx.

The CFG edit SEEMED in all respects to solve my problem, but as I burn off fuel, which is perfectly centered, the craft becomes nose heavy. I am GUESSING it's related to the Welded parts, but then again, maybe it's the KSP engine. Did not have the problem before welding though.

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Still a problem Alewx.

The CFG edit SEEMED in all respects to solve my problem, but as I burn off fuel, which is perfectly centered, the craft becomes nose heavy. I am GUESSING it's related to the Welded parts, but then again, maybe it's the KSP engine. Did not have the problem before welding though.

Hmm that is not easy, maybe I can take a look at it this evening.

Girka fixed the CoM pretty well during the past versions, and it is quite reliable.

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I am beginning to believe the problem is KSP related. The problem seems to happen with an increase in altitude, I actually descended back to thicker air and regained pitch control. I am looking into wing panel orientation. Sorry I did not notice this before with the unwelded engines.

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You are using stock aero I'm guessing? Also I would recommend instead of setting the values to zero just remove the fuel resource definitions entirely, unless you are using them as trim tanks and pumping fuel into them to adjust balance.

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I am beginning to believe the problem is KSP related. The problem seems to happen with an increase in altitude, I actually descended back to thicker air and regained pitch control. I am looking into wing panel orientation. Sorry I did not notice this before with the unwelded engines.

:) good to hear it was altitude.

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Question: if you weld physicsless parts, do their masses get added to the weldment as their listed masses or actual masses? (Ladders, small batteries and such)

I don't know about the particulars, but I've had no issue welding the ladders.

A very common use case for me is to take a part (like a fuel tank), add batteries and the Pegasus 3-rung ladders on it, then weld it into a single part. I've had no issues and the 3-rung ladders are still usable after welding. I've even done very long runs of the 3-rung ladders down the side of a large fuel tank and it functions fine as a ladder after welding.

For example:

http://imgur.com/a/b7Mo3#9

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It seems that in KSP there is a lift degradation curve programmed into the control surfaces as you climb, a different curve than the normal lifting surfaces... Since I had so very few pitch control surfaces on such a large craft (and not evenly distributed fore and aft), it became an issue very soon after takeoff!

You learn something new. Sorry for the trouble!

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Hi everyone,

I've installed the welding plugin on my Ubuntu 14.04 installation running the x64 version of KSP. The game is stored on a NTFS-formatted partition of my SSD drive, if that could matter. Everything else is working great.

Now the welding interface shows up fine, I can edit those informations and save the welded part, which gives the successful delivery popup, but the parts never show up. There isn't even a GameData/UbioWeldingLtd/Parts folder showing up on the drive. I'm using version 2.1.1. Please tell me if I can provide further information.

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I don't know what I am doing wrong. I have tried installing this twice and neither times it loads. Anyone know how I can fix this

Could you post your output_log.txt from your ksp_data folder here and describe in detail what u did when u tried to install the mod?

Tell us also which mods u also have installed in your gamedata folder, because it might be conflicting with another mod or something....

Edited by renejant
fixed a typo

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Hi everyone,

I've installed the welding plugin on my Ubuntu 14.04 installation running the x64 version of KSP. The game is stored on a NTFS-formatted partition of my SSD drive, if that could matter. Everything else is working great.

Now the welding interface shows up fine, I can edit those informations and save the welded part, which gives the successful delivery popup, but the parts never show up. There isn't even a GameData/UbioWeldingLtd/Parts folder showing up on the drive. I'm using version 2.1.1. Please tell me if I can provide further information.

It might be a file permissions thing. Unfortunately, I don't know Linux from spinach. But perhaps if you move /KSP to some other area... well that works in W land.

Edited by Zephram Kerman
because I'm a slow old kerbasaur

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It might be a file permissions thing. Unfortunately, I don't know Linux from spinach. But perhaps if you move /KSP to some other area... well that works in W land.

You never know, but I would be surprised if it really was something like that, because I've collected quite some plugins right now and every one of them saves their stuff just fine. Also, I'm no Linux expert, but I couldn't think about anything that might be wrong with my file permissions in that case.

I'd really be glad to help find the issue if I can, because with my somewhat weak machine I'd benefit greatly from welding some stuff. If you need some logfile or want me to join IRC or anything, I'd have some minutes to spare right now!

Edit: Okay, it's got to be something with Linux at least, because I put a Windows KSP install onto the very same SSD partition and ran it from inside Windows using a copy of the exact same GameData folder I used for Linux. I guess I could weld stuff and then copy it back to the Linux install, at least.

Edited by Krankonian
knowledge!

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You never know, but I would be surprised if it really was something like that, because I've collected quite some plugins right now and every one of them saves their stuff just fine. Also, I'm no Linux expert, but I couldn't think about anything that might be wrong with my file permissions in that case.

I'd really be glad to help find the issue if I can, because with my somewhat weak machine I'd benefit greatly from welding some stuff. If you need some logfile or want me to join IRC or anything, I'd have some minutes to spare right now!

Edit: Okay, it's got to be something with Linux at least, because I put a Windows KSP install onto the very same SSD partition and ran it from inside Windows using a copy of the exact same GameData folder I used for Linux. I guess I could weld stuff and then copy it back to the Linux install, at least.

It might be the common problem with "/" and "\" from Windows and Linux.

I think we only integrated the solution for the config not for the saved parts. I will check that.

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How does FAR react with UbioZur welding? For example welding parts of wings to make one big wing? Or multiple fuselage parts into one?

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How does FAR react with UbioZur welding? For example welding parts of wings to make one big wing? Or multiple fuselage parts into one?

Hi, well it is very likely that the welded parts will not have the correct values for FAR, and require manual correction afterwards.

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Suggestion - the unlock cost of the welded part should be the sum of unique parts within the construction, not the sum of all parts.

For example: Welding 8 batteries of the same type together should result in a tech tree unlock cost equivalent to a single battery.

Better might be that each additional identical part adds 5% to the unlock cost. So if it costs 1000 to unlock a single part, welding together 10 of them should cost 1000 for the first part plus (9 * 50) for the 2nd through 10th part. Thus giving a total unlock cost of 1450 instead of 10,000.

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