Seriously, No Heatshield?

[Red Shirt]

Today I went into my persistence file and 'repaired' the solar panels that the game broke while applying physics during vessel switching. I figure it is not cheating since 1. It wasn't my fault. 2. In real life the guys would have used duct tape and whatever they could find to put it back together. Having justified my edit, I loaded the stranded guys on Duna into the rescue ship. Lift off, orbit, transfer, all went according to plan. As I was preparing to lower the Pe into the atmosphere, I realized I forgot to install a heatshield. sigh. Rookie mistake and I've been playing for a year. d'oh. Having experienced the wrath of the reentry heat in previous attempts with 1.04, I was not optimistic. I've read on the forum that many claimed to not need a heatshield. I wasn't sure I believed you. Decided to go for it. I had enough Dv to circularize at 55k. From there I watched as the orbit slowly decayed. The heat gauges never popped up even once. I for one am amazed. Interestingly, the expression on the guys faces during reentry was one of concern. When it became apparent they might actually make it, I swear they all started grinning.

[jaredkzr]

The only time I've needed a heatshield is when I've aerobraked into Jool or Eve's atmosphere. It's difficult to make reentries feel like those on earth when the entire system is scaled down so much.

[Finndibaenn]

At least for LKO reentries, I found you do fine by facing backward (engine first, it can take a lot a heat), if your reentry is not too steep

[Red Shirt]

Guess I should add, I used 6 twitch engines attached radially on a Rockomax X200-16 tank with an unprotected exposed bottom. My TWR was only around .80, so engines didn't help much in atmosphere. I am pleased to have made it.

[juanml82]

I had exposed Gigantors (max temp 1200° K) while attempting to aerocapture at Duna and none survived the experience

[AbacusWizard]

I think solar panel arrays automatically snap off if they're extended while moving at any reasonable speed in an atmosphere, regardless of the temperature. (I learned this the hard way when I tried to use solar panels as airbrakes on a probe without a parachute that accidentally de-orbited on Eve.)

[nigelvn]

Don't forget the thickness of the air on Duna is simply less:

[regex]

I had enough Dv to circularize at 55k.

That's why you didn't need a heat shield. Had you simply dropped into the atmosphere from Duna transfer, you likely would have needed a heatshield. If it still bothers you, crank up the heating index through the cheat menu.

[Red Shirt]

The solar panels were retracted and inside a service bay while the ship was moving. It was only after landing that the bay doors were opened and panels extended. Everything was fine when I switched to the space center to change ships. The panels were laying on the ground when the rescued arrived.

As for the heat index bothering me, No Way! Feeling real good about this landing. When I first started playing 1.04, the ship blew up every time. I had to forget everything I thought I knew about reentry.

[Sharpy]

When reentering Kerbin, I found some 300m/s worth of dV left in the tanks more than adequately substitutes for a heatshield.

[keeper]

i'm messing around with re-entry, with large stupid shaped payloads :/

Edit: Seems with tweakscale I can get the heatshields up to crazy sizes

Look! 14 meters wide LOL

weighs 21 tonnes, the fairing only gets about 10 meters wide or there abouts Cant launch like that. Will have to change game plan.

Edited July 23, 2015 by keeper

[Hagen von Tronje]

I backed a 1000 ton lander into Eve's atmosphere at over 3000m/s, no drogue chutes, and only six nose chutes. Retracted solar panels overheated on one attempt but a reattempt resulted in everything staying attached and a successful landing.

No heat shields, just six Rhinos. Nothing even showed bars - the solar panels that exploded on the one attempt glowed red then exploded spontaneously, presumably they were acting as heatsinks, not generating heat themselves from drag.

I've also entered Kerbin atmosphere going 3km/s+ using a spaceplane and braked using just drag on the dorsal side of the craft (i.e. I went in belly-first), again nothing showed bars (except some static solar panels mounted on the top of the fuselage, once - they survived fine, I just didn't pull my nose up soon enough so they showed bars). Monoprop tanks and all other stuff under my wings were fine.

Basically it seems to me that unless you're doing a reentry that would burn up much of the ablator on a heat shield, you likely don't truly need one. Now I kinda want to try to see how fast you can enter an atmosphere with the large shield and still survive fine.

[PanzerAce]

It depends on how deep you get into the atmo as well I've noticed. I've dropped spaceplanes into Kerbin, and as long as I let them "skip" across that atmo at ~30k, I can go all day without blowing anything. Drop below 20 at 1500m/s though and you're starting to ask for trouble if you can't drop speed fast enough.

[lost_in_space]

Seriously, No Heatshield?

I don't use heat shields, I use Service Bays. Less weight and higher impact tolerance. The lower max temp has never been a problem.

[samstarman5]

I think solar panel arrays automatically snap off if they're extended while moving at any reasonable speed in an atmosphere, regardless of the temperature. (I learned this the hard way when I tried to use solar panels as airbrakes on a probe without a parachute that accidentally de-orbited on Eve.)

Actually I have seen mention of this happening before with craft that are left on the ground with solar panels extended and then returned to later, finding the panels busted. It reeks of a hiccup in how the craft reacts coming back out of "locked mode" (when you are at a certain distance from other craft. I can't brain today to remember the term.)

It is something that needs further scrutiny, to be sure.

[Captain Sierra]

i'm messing around with re-entry, with large stupid shaped payloads :/

Edit: Seems with tweakscale I can get the heatshields up to crazy sizes

Look! 14 meters wide LOL

http://i.imgur.com/McyuaYz.jpg

weighs 21 tonnes, the fairing only gets about 10 meters wide or there abouts Cant launch like that. Will have to change game plan.

lol 11 FPS. Can you tweakscale the fairing?

[Sharpy]

You can tweakscale a decoupler and a nose cone, I think. (probably will need the tweakscaled Kerbodyne adapter as well).

[Prasiatko]

I've noticed it is near impossible to burn up heat shields too. once they reach about 1 unit left it depletes really slowly. Also the heat tolerance of the heat-shield without ablator is high enough for all but direct interplanetary re-entry.

[Captain H@dock]

Basically it seems to me that unless you're doing a reentry that would burn up much of the ablator on a heat shield, you likely don't truly need one. Now I kinda want to try to see how fast you can enter an atmosphere with the large shield and still survive fine.

What they really improved in 1.0.4 is how steep re-rentry now lead you to burn-up. That was the biggest problem with 1.0.2, you could re-enter radially into kerbin and be fine. In 1.0.4, no more.

But shallow Kerbin re-entry are quite forgiving as long as you've slowed down enough by the time you get to 10,000m. Which is to be expected if you want bigger/denser atmospheres to be playable.

Edited July 24, 2015 by Captain H@dock

[juanml82]

lol 11 FPS. Can you tweakscale the fairing?

You have to edit the part.cfg. I don't remember the exact entries you have to look for, but IIRC, they are rather self explanatory.

[keeper]

You have to edit the part.cfg. I don't remember the exact entries you have to look for, but IIRC, they are rather self explanatory.

I have never edited a part .cfg but on this occasion for the first time I have done, and thank you for that!

MaxRadius from 6 to 18 Happy days this is perfect LMAO

Yes 11fps and strangely exhaust fumes coming from under my desk after time spent in VAB :/ U think that VAB works the computer much??? Or is that just me ha

This will get to space now, so i can see if it lands without exploding first This heatshield will probably spin out anyway

EDIt: Probably worth noting the fairing protects from re-entry heat, eliminating the need for a heatshield, if theres just some way now to move this behemoth around

Edited July 25, 2015 by keeper