[BDA] [1.1.3] Airborne Heavy Weapons Platform Challenge- Battles Begin Soon

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

@Adelaar Hey. i reduced the weight down to 168t and the situation is much improved it can take off quite smartly but still not quite enough grunt, so i swapped out two of the wheeslys for a couple of panthers which also help with ctrl authority.  @drtricky a little weight reduction for Civilizer too, and in the process moved the com half a meter further fwd which eased the stall, and added a row of those tiny basic fins along the tails trailing edge, sorted.  Both craft ended up within 5 tons of each other and with Civilizer being the heavier

So with 4/5 going to Civilizer   Preliminary round one goes to Civilizer

90% of which is likely caused by the still lack lustre combat performance of Liberator, make it faster!!!  Though not a video the gif below accurately represents the combat

 

1 hour ago, drtricky said:

It shot itself down with its own missiles?

yup but in truth at the time it wasn't really flying, more falling with style

 

[drtricky]

Well, glad my two entries are combat-competent.

And thanks @SpannerMonkey(smce) for running our entries!

[RocketSquid]

Now working on the Bulletizer FST (Flying shooty thing). 8 helicopter chainguns, 2 lasers, 1 nuclear reactor, 8 overburdened turbojets, and four Minigun-Miniguns.

Maneuvers like a brick. Takes off like a brick. Designed as if by a mad scientist. Armed like a tank built by a mad scientist who is also a member of the "MOAR DAKKA!!" school of warfare.

[ScriptKitt3h]

Still a major WIP, but the AHWP Olympus Mons is coming along nicely...
Fuel systems need to be  completed, but I ran a short-duration test flight to check the fire-control systems on its dual PAC-3 interceptor launchers (target was a high-speed, supermaneuverable drone) .

The test was a resounding success, and once the armored hull and fuel systems are completed I'll start polishing off the weapon loadout with some smaller turrets and such.
(I'm tempted to sneak in infantry drop-pods inside the hull, but I still need to budget room for backup fuel storage and structural reinforcement girders/struts.)

 

EDIT: And yes, this is totally stock save for BDA.

Edited October 4, 2016 by ScriptKitt3h

[njmksr]

8 hours ago, ScriptKitt3h said:

Stuff

That's pretty awesome! One of the cooler stock crafts I've seen  

Keep up the good work everyone! And remember, competition (i.e. stuff for the battles) aircraft must be capable of forward flight in the absence of powered lift!

Also, I have a working title for the winner's prize: The Bulletzer Prize.

(get it?)

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

3 hours ago, njmksr said:

aircraft must be capable of forward flight in the absence of powered lift!

Or be able like the Liberator to use the Vtol as Stol  without the craft heading for the stars, however you do it, it MUST be capable of level ish fwd flight without things like TAC,  If it i isn't then the Ai will not be able to fly it in combat. . In the interests of fairness the only interventions i decided that are acceptable are minor performance enhancements to ensure that the AI has full and proper control. and definitely no interference in any setting or function once the craft is under AI control

Some rough guide parameters for the combat craft, based on the results of last nights destruction fest.

ONLY 1 Weapon Manager and 1 AI module per craft please, having more does not make your craft more durable, only 1 AI and 1WM can be active per vessel per combat, that's the way the code works. ( oh and a PS it would be nice if they are placed in a easily located position, some are a bit tricky to get at should a launch go amiss)

  To beat the current provisional leader ( i say provisional as its a terribly one sided comp at present)

Ideally, your craft needs to be able to fly at around  a minimum of 100 ms. 

Ideally, It needs to be able to take off well before the end of the runway. 

Once airborne it should be able to climb to altitude in a reasonable time frame,  the current leader reaches combat height quite quickly, and it's your call of course but if your leviathan switches into combat mode at less than the minimum combat altitude there is a very good chance of unwanted and sudden ground contact.  Leading to the loss of the match.

PLEASE set all your AI autopilot units to a minimum height of 1000 mtrs ish, this allows the craft space to maneuver safely under AI control and without being babysat until it reaches a safe altitude.

Please be aware and cautious when placing turrets, try to avoid placing turrets in positions that are occluded by wings structures or other turrets, several times last night the combat craft shot themselves more times than the enemy. Getting shot down by your own guns still counts as a loss in my book, especially as I'm running the fights best of 5 giving plenty of time for each craft to show it's merits or lack thereof.

Finally as a point of interest to all competitors, the weapons causing the most damage/kills so far. First the BDAc PAC 3 intercept missile (no real surprise there though, they are nasty) , and the biggest surprise, the Airborne Laser System. The least used so far are any of the projectile weapons, close combat with these things is very unlikely and all fights start at the max default distance, so maybe a reduction in guns over an increase in countermeasures is in order, I'll leave that for you to decide.  

Please note these are not competition rules or instructions, purely information to be acted upon or not as is your choice

Looking forward to the next episode

 

 

[drtricky]

@SpannerMonkey(smce) I've noticed that the problem of a craft's non-missile turret hitting itself is a problem with BDA not properly detecting whether the turret is pointing at the craft itself. The only thing that can be done is to hope the enemy is not in a position that makes the turret point close to a part of the craft its on.

It's for this reason I initially didn't consider adding any turreted guns to my entries, as my testing found they can cause a lot of self-damage if they accidentally shoot themselves. The reason I added guns in the end was simply to provide a back up if the batteries run out...and because guns are awesome.

Edited October 4, 2016 by drtricky

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

34 minutes ago, drtricky said:

@SpannerMonkey(smce) I've noticed that the problem of a craft's non-missile turret hitting itself is a problem with BDA not properly detecting whether the turret is pointing at the craft itself. The only thing that can be done is to hope the enemy is not in a position that makes the turret point close to a part of the craft its on.

It's for this reason I initially didn't consider adding any turreted guns to my entries, as my testing found they can cause a lot of self-damage if they accidentally shoot themselves. The reason I added guns in the end was simply to provide a back up if the batteries run out...and because guns are awesome.

The real issue here though and something that could be MM cfg'd away,  is most if not all turret mounted weapons have a minimum pitch that is usually a couple of degrees below zero and up to ten below in some cases, one thing that should be common to all turreted airborne weapons is that they are restrained to a smaller safer arc of movement in which it's impossible or extremely difficult for self assassination to occur ,   simply restricting the depression or setting it to zero would alleviate the primary reason turrets can shoot the craft they are  mounted on, it wont stop the detection issues but render it less of an issue. 

With all the development taking place on BDAc I'd imagine that even this will get better over time. 

I'd often wondered about some smaller radial mount type Gatlings etc  but apart from curiosity value i could never really see a use for them, but with HWP's a prickly pear with radial turrets scattered around  and only able to shoot outward from the craft would be quite entertaining i feel

[ScriptKitt3h]

Heads up- as I'm within a city that's under mandatory evacuation order due to Hurricane Matthew, I'll be unable to complete AHWP Olympus Mons until some point down the line when it's safe to return after the storm has passed (and likely for a while after then, if the storm's a direct hit on my city and knocks out the grid).

[drtricky]

48 minutes ago, ScriptKitt3h said:

Heads up- as I'm within a city that's under mandatory evacuation order due to Hurricane Matthew, I'll be unable to complete AHWP Olympus Mons until some point down the line when it's safe to return after the storm has passed (and likely for a while after then, if the storm's a direct hit on my city and knocks out the grid).

Mother nature...the most powerful AHWP of them all.

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

2 hours ago, ScriptKitt3h said:

Heads up- as I'm within a city that's under mandatory evacuation order due to Hurricane Matthew, I'll be unable to complete AHWP Olympus Mons until some point down the line when it's safe to return after the storm has passed (and likely for a while after then, if the storm's a direct hit on my city and knocks out the grid).

Best of luck and we''l keep a hangar spot warm for you.

[V7 Aerospace]

Im guessing North-Kerbin dynamics isn't allowed. Explosions are too op with that mod?

(Imagine strapping a Karl Gerat onto a VTOL)

 

[njmksr]

21 hours ago, ScriptKitt3h said:

Heads up- as I'm within a city that's under mandatory evacuation order due to Hurricane Matthew, I'll be unable to complete AHWP Olympus Mons until some point down the line when it's safe to return after the storm has passed (and likely for a while after then, if the storm's a direct hit on my city and knocks out the grid).

Sorry, I've been trying to respond to this for a while; phone's post composer wasn't working.

But good luck; stay safe. We'll be awaiting your return.

[drtricky]

@SpannerMonkey(smce) What procedural wing mods do you have installed right now?

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

20 minutes ago, drtricky said:

What procedural wing mods do you have installed right now?

[njmksr]

I am initiating Project TALON (AKA the FAV-X Program), or development of my next (and first competition-worthy) AHWP this weekend... I already have some preliminary design ideas to dominate the sky  

[drtricky]

@SpannerMonkey(smce) Are you willing to allow the usage of KJR in battles?

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

Just now, drtricky said:

@SpannerMonkey(smce) Are you willing to allow the usage of KJR in battles?

As it is a default install for any of my 1.1.3 test installs, so  it's there anyway I've never noticed it having any affect on combat be it aircraft ships or whatever,  If force was taken into the damage equation then perhaps it could be an issue, but at this point BDAc's damage is all heat based so no issue.    As an interesting point of note come 1.2 competitions, having rigid joints or autostrut active makes no difference either, things get smashed up at just the same rate as 1.1.3

[drtricky]

Just now, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

As it is a default install for any of my 1.1.3 test installs, so  it's there anyway I've never noticed it having any affect on combat be it aircraft ships or whatever,  If force was taken into the damage equation then perhaps it could be an issue, but at this point BDAc's damage is all heat based so no issue.    As an interesting point of note come 1.2 competitions, having rigid joints or autostrut active makes no difference either, things get smashed up at just the same rate as 1.1.3

Okay. It's simply that I'm building something with gargantuanly sized wings, and not even njmksr's super strong struts mod is able to keep them on. I'll be a little honest, however, while KJR does keep the wings on, it behaves weirdly as a result, so there's a chance it'll never see the light of day.

[nascarlaser1]

can someone make a video of the battles? They would be fun to watch. The bigger things would probably fail in a video due to lag, but the small ones would be fun to watch them tear each other apart .

[njmksr]

20 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

can someone make a video of the battles? They would be fun to watch. The bigger things would probably fail in a video due to lag, but the small ones would be fun to watch them tear each other apart .

That's something we're going for. Due to the preliminary nature of the battles I doubt @SpannerMonkey(smce) has any video footage yet.

24 minutes ago, drtricky said:

not even njmksr's super strong struts mod is able to keep them on. 

Dear Lord, do we need something stronger than the HyperStrut? I never thought this day would come...

I'll keep that in mind for Reforged-- add extra zeroes.

Edited October 6, 2016 by njmksr

[nascarlaser1]

Just now, njmksr said:

That's something we're going for. Due to the preliminary nature of the battles I doubt @SpannerMonkey(smce) has any video footage yet.

Also, can I make stock weapons for this?? I can't get mods right now, but I am getting better with making land to air (and back to land lol) missile out of SRB and probe cores. If not, would you guys care if I borrowed your idea, and just change it to stock weapons? (I will not do it if you do not want me too).

[njmksr]

3 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

I can't get mods right now

What? That's possible?

3 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

Also, can I make stock weapons for this??

I wouldn't recommend entering a pure stock craft into a BDA competition, but if you have the guts to do it, go right ahead. Don't bring a booster to a missile fight.

IDK how we would do competitions with it though.

Edited October 6, 2016 by njmksr

[DoctorDavinci]

For a BDAc competition, one needs BDAc

Edited October 6, 2016 by DoctorDavinci

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

23 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

but the small ones would be fun to watch them tear each other apart .

 

6 minutes ago, njmksr said:

I doubt @SpannerMonkey(smce) has any video footage yet.

If you're expecting the usual type BDA dogfight, you'll be disappointed,  the combat goes like this,

climb to altitude,

yawn really exiting video this, 

travel to combat start distance, gosh this video is so exciting,  

roll to the attack once combat starts, oh look somethings happening,

switch between aircraft at around 7km separation,  note missiles being targeted, oo drama, 

swap back to first ship just in time for it to be destroyed. 

actual combat time, no more than 2 minutes, climb out to position about 2 mins  SO even with creative editing which I've never needed to do they are not exactly spectator sport, the gif i posted after the first round was about the high points of the whole thing, so what 20 seconds lols..