Shuttle Challenge v5 - The STS thread [Stock and Mod Friendly] - MAJOR CHALLENGE ANNOUNCEMENT! - 30.3.2020

[Ozelui]

58 minutes ago, Kerbolitto said:

Rofl what kind of monstrosity is that ?

  Exactly the reaction i was hoping for!

[Kerbolitto]

Finally finished the design of STS Mun 5 6 7 .. Required a lot of tricks to fit everything in the bay ! I'm currently flying the first shuttle, will probably be over in 2 / 3 days.

[Kerbolitto]

@michal.don

Quick question : at which point is it acceptable to use an ISRU ? Duna missions ? Jool ?

[Kerbolitto]

STS Mun 5

 

Here is the first part of the final challenge of STS Mun Missions :

I went a bit crazy with the propulsion module, because I wanted to get a decent TWR with ion engines and find new ways to pack everything inside the cargo bay.

As usual with my .. contraptions .. I can't resist putting docks everywhere, and make good use of it :p

 

Part 1 : Take off, Mun injection and capture

 

 

Spoiler

Injection maneuver : Nothing special here, capture close to Mun, then raise Ap and Normal to get a nice inclined orbit

 

Part 2 : Unpacking !

 

 

Spoiler

Undocking RoboTug :

First engine's pylon assembly :

Assembly technique : kinda hard to see but I try to align the small bumps between the 2 docking ports. Could have done this more precisely but I forgot to put a probe on the engines module to get a perfect alignment

Last pylon : Engine module is now complete, final TWR will be around 0.14 if I remember

 

Part 3 : Return maneuver, aerobraking, not crashing !

 

 

Spoiler

Return maneuver : bit of radial in after leaving Mun's SOI, inclination is already quite good as I escaped at the very top of the orbit

First pass :

Brutal second pass : I saw that Pe was almost above KSC so I burned radial to lower it in the ocean in front of the buildings, re-entry was agressive (11G peaks) but the shuttle is very heat resistant

Successfull re-entry :

Final approach : had to burn a bit to raise airspeed

Last screen if the shuttle cooling in the shadows of the science department

 

Edited September 16, 2018 by Kerbolitto

[Kerbolitto]

STS Mun 6

 

This time the crew deliver a science module, which will links propulsion and habitats. It also contains a lot of batteries, some monoprop container and docks of every size.

 

Part 1 : Take off, Mun injection and capture

 

 

Spoiler

Injection maneuver : not very effective as I used a ton of anti-normal during the burn. Rendez vous happenned a few days later

 

Part 2 : Unpacking

 

 

Part 3 : Return maneuver, aerobraking, landing

 

STS Mun 5 is still scared of its re-entry

 

Spoiler

Return maneuver after leaving the station : I tried something complicated which did not work much (using second Mun flyby to lower Pe). Return took so much time I landed this shuttle after STS Mun 7

First pass in the atmosphere :

Maneuver following the aerobraking : just had to raise Pe a bit and deorbit a few minutes later.

Since I lowered Pe very early, I had to glide across all the desert :

Last seconds before impact landing :

 

[Kerbolitto]

STS Mun 7

 

The last module to complete Mun's orbital station is a crew quarter. It carry room for 12, a cuppola, a nice antenna and that's about it !

 

Part 1 : Take off, Mun injection and capture

 

 

Spoiler

Injection maneuver : I wanted to try something different so I launched from Woomerang after waiting a good transfer window to Mun. This was quite effective as I only had +/- 20° of inclination arriving at the Mun.

 

Part 2 : Undocking last module

 

 

Part 3 : Return maneuver, aerobraking, landing

 

 

Spoiler

Return maneuver is a lot more simple than STS Mun 6 .. : there was also a correction before or after aerobraking

Post aerobraking maneuver :

Deorbit : I retroburned at Pe to lower Ap instead of using a second aerobraking

Runway approach :

 

Part 4 : Raising orbital station altitude

 

 

Spoiler

Maneuvering the station just below Mun's escape velocity :

The station has around 3250dV left. That's not much for ion engines but the TWR is actually pretty good on this ship. There's also possibility to add more fuel on the sides docking ports, then it could become a very good orbital base to anywhere.

 

 

That should be it for STS Mun's Missions

As always comments are welcome

Next stop : Duna !

Edited September 16, 2018 by Kerbolitto

[Kerbolitto]

Duna STS 1

 

After 17h without posting I'm finally about to present you my mission to Duna, hopefully fullfilling all requirements for a gold medal commander achievement.

I'm still flying Artisan v4 Shuttle and it's large cargo bay, as it should be able to cover every missions of this challenge !

 

Part 1 : Take off, Duna's injection

 

 

Spoiler

Here's the shuttle decoupling from the lifter vehicle : I went with complete liquid fuel capacity because I panick when TWR is too high

Duna's maneuver :

 

Part 2 : Duna's capture, deployement

 

 

Spoiler

Duna re-entry speed :

Post aero-capture maneuver, final orbit to deploy DOESS is below 70km as required

 

Part 3 : Rescuiing rescue mission

 

I forgot that there were some ships lying around, so I set a rendez-vous with Cheval 3-5 Rescue D SSTO which was left on Ike for years. It had enough fuel to get back to Kerbin but now I'm able to strand it around Jool which is more fun. (transfered around 2000Lf from the shuttle to this ship)

 

Spoiler

Going to Ike :

 

Part 4 : Getting back to Kerbin, from Ike

 

 

Spoiler

Return maneuver : doesn't cost much from Ike, could have been lower with Duna flyby

Re-entry speed : quite fast but high enough not to fear any heat damage

Second aerobraking maneuver : inclination at 0°

Here I'm trying to deorbit onto KSC by creating lots of drag by pointing the shuttle radial in :

Final approach : crew looks suspicious but the shuttle is now very light and has a huge control

 

Cheval 3-5 D on its way to get stuck somewhere else

Edited September 19, 2018 by Kerbolitto

[michal.don]

On 9/14/2018 at 1:47 PM, Artienia said:

Well i mean slapping itt inside a fairing and either put it on the LV or the shuttle. Both would be fine for me

I'll need to see a screenshot of the proposed design - I'll definitely won't allow anything that just takes the shuttle along for a ride - the shuttle has to remain an important piece of the mission.

On 9/14/2018 at 3:45 PM, Ozelui said:

I've done this for the STS-Test 4 to lift the station to orbit without using a rocket (because this is the shuttle challenge and using rockets feels out of place  ).  It's not part of the actual mission, which is still in progress, therefore the "launch 0" name, but I plan to reuse the design in future missions if it's allowed.

This is properly crazy, and it will certainly be allowed to use in the missions

[michal.don]

On 9/16/2018 at 1:46 PM, Kerbolitto said:

Quick question : at which point is it acceptable to use an ISRU ? Duna missions ? Jool ?

Sure, all the Duna and Jool missions can use ISRU. You probably could use it on the Mun too, but since the d-V requirements are not that high, it would probably be a waste of payload space.

On 9/16/2018 at 10:41 PM, Kerbolitto said:

That should be it for STS Mun's Missions

And it ends with a proper style  Interesting engine configuration, but hey, if it works.....  The remaining d-V of 3000+ m/s may seem kind of low for ions, but on a Munar orbital outpost? More than enough for any orbit corrections, you'd be surprised how cheap they are at this altitude

Great mission and report, here's your badge:

On 9/17/2018 at 4:29 PM, Kerbolitto said:

After 17h without posting I'm finally about to present you my mission to Duna, hopefully fullfilling all requirements for a gold medal commander achievement.

I'm still flying Artisan v4 Shuttle and it's large cargo bay, as it should be able to cover every missions of this challenge !

The Jool mission will really test the capacity of your shuttle, but I think it stands a good chance of succeeding. We'll see soon I guess

Another well executed mission, and even with a detour to Ike. I guess the second vessel can be counted as a "support vehicle", which is allowed by the rules (although it was expected that the support will go the other way  )

Here's your badge, and I'm looking forward to seeing more:

Michal.don

[Kerbolitto]

On 9/19/2018 at 2:31 PM, michal.don said:

And it ends with a proper style  Interesting engine configuration, but hey, if it works.....  The remaining d-V of 3000+ m/s may seem kind of low for ions, but on a Munar orbital outpost? More than enough for any orbit corrections, you'd be surprised how cheap they are at this altitude

Yeah I thought that I'd need little dV at this altitude, but I wanted decent TWR (0.10 ! :D). I tried multiple configurations to get as more engines as possible inside the cargo bay and I had another idea to stuff even more :p It is useless for a space station but this construction is now more related to an explorer ship .

 

On 9/19/2018 at 2:31 PM, michal.don said:

Another well executed mission, and even with a detour to Ike. I guess the second vessel can be counted as a "support vehicle", which is allowed by the rules (although it was expected that the support will go the other way  )

Actually I refuelled the other ship, if you look at fuel levels between Ike's injection and Kerbin's return the shuttle is 2800Lf units lighter !

I also brought back 2 kerbals as I always launch the shuttle with a pilot and an engineer.

 

On 9/19/2018 at 2:31 PM, michal.don said:

The Jool mission will really test the capacity of your shuttle, but I think it stands a good chance of succeeding. We'll see soon I guess

As said before I have almost no experience in Jool's system, I only made my first landing on a moon 2 days ago ! But this shuttle is a solid design and will probably complete Jool's missions with no modifications. I'm actually tempted to try a Jool 5 using a high dV and a high TWR (SSTO) version..!

 

On 9/19/2018 at 2:31 PM, michal.don said:

Here's your badge, and I'm looking forward to seeing more:

Thanks for the badge, I'm planning to run Duna STS 2 and 3 at the same time

Edited September 20, 2018 by Kerbolitto

[Kerbolitto]

edit

Edited September 19, 2018 by Kerbolitto

[michal.don]

16 hours ago, Kerbolitto said:

Thanks for the badge, I'm planning to run Duna STS 2 and 3 at the same time

That's possible, but they have to be two separate missions. So, please, pay attention to the rules of each mission, so I don't have to disqualify it later  

[Kerbolitto]

9 hours ago, michal.don said:

That's possible, but they have to be two separate missions. So, please, pay attention to the rules of each mission, so I don't have to disqualify it later  

So I can't bring a lander in the shuttle (Duna STS 3), land them on Duna / plant a flag / take off (one ship after the other of course, after undocking the lander (STS 2 & 3), then take the shuttle back to Kerbin using Eve slingshot (STS 3) ?

Edited September 20, 2018 by Kerbolitto

[michal.don]

So, after quite a while, I admit, there is a 

NEW MISSION, EVE STS-1!

Eve presents a whole new set of challenges, so this is probably not the last mission dedicated to this new world. And, again we have a race for eternal glory of being the first one to claim the new badges!  

Details in the OP, below the Jool mission.

Enjoy,

Michal.don

[Kerbolitto]

Fantastic !

[zolotiyeruki]

Quick question:  I'm having a really hard time capturing at Eve with pure aerobraking.  Must the braking/capture be done exclusively with aerobraking, or can the engines help out some?  If I get deep enough into the atmosphere to brake, I burn up, and if I stay high enough to not burn up, I can't brake enough to keep myself in Eve's SOI.

 

EDIT: Never mind, I found the perfect aerobraking altitude that *just* barely worked.  Now I'm sitting in a highly elliptical orbit, waiting for the transfer window back to Kerbin...

Edited September 23, 2018 by zolotiyeruki

[4x4cheesecake]

I got a busy RL last week but now, I finally had the time to actually fly the next mission, so here is:

Mun STS-2-4

I've added a second module to the base in a STS-2b mission so the base can actually do some useful stuff beside providing living space for Kerbals.
In this post, I'll skip most parts of the launch and the landing on the Mun, since it is always the same procedure (the imgur album still contains pircures of every launch and every maneuver).

Mun STS-2a

Spoiler

Contains the required habitat module (Cupola, Science-Lab, Hitchhiker Storage Container, Service Bay and antenna)

Lift-off!

Ditching the boosters...

...and the ET

Setting up the Mun transfer after a circularization burn around Kerbin

Performing the transfer burn

The base will be build close to the south pole so I'll do a little correction burn to reach a polar orbit around the Mun

Crossing the south pole while decelerating to land

The orbiter lands on the edge of a crater. I land the orbiter like a usual lander but just before the orbiter will touch the surface, the engines will trottle up to max thrust for a brief moment and the RCS thrusters are used to tip over the orbiter in the right direction.

Since this spot is so close to the south pole, Kerbin will be visible at every given time

Four engines lift the first module out of the cargo bay. It lands on the landing legs and drives into the correct position (there is a very flat rover placed below the module).

The first module with 3 crew members. 2 more Kerbals will arrive with the next mission.

Using the crater as a ramp to lift off from the surface.

Setting up the return trajectory.

After small correction burn to change the inclination to 0°, the orbiter enters the atmosphere for the first aerobreak.

Third and final aerobreak. The trajectory get some fine tuning by different pitch angles during the descent.

Approaching the runway

Back at the KSC

Album for Mun STS-2a: https://imgur.com/a/2QcvTDC

 

Mun STS-2b (optional)

Spoiler

Contains a science module with ISRU, ore tank, drills (inside the cargo bay) and some science experiments.

[skipping through launch and transfer]

Eyeballing some trajectory adjustments. Using the main engines for brief moments to compensate the low TWR.

Landed close to the base

Lifting the second module out of the cargo bay.

Docking the science module to the habitat module.

Removing the delivery rovers (one crashed into the ground so everything explodes, the other wasn't able to speed up enough so most parts survived and got removed via tracking station)

Transfering two more crew members and deploying the drills, solar panels and radiators.

Jeb needs to return to Kerbin

[skipping through transfer to Kerbin]

After two aerobreaks in the upper atmosphere, a short burn retrograde will set up a landing trajectory

I messed up the landing approach a little bit...I undershot the KSC, boosted the trajectory with the remaining fuel but too much xD

After flying a big curve to bleed of speed and loose altitude, I can go for the final approach.

Now it actually looks like a landing approach ^^

Landed at the KSC.

Album for Mun STS-2b: https://imgur.com/a/A7Bk5cR

 

Mun STS-3

Spoiler

This mission will deliver a rover to the base. The rover provides space for 6 Kerbals (pressurized) and one external command seat for emergency pick ups (Actually, I accidentally left two Kerbals on the Mun during my first attempt to this challenge and thought about rescuring them during the trip with the rover but I send a separate rescue mission instead so the external seat is no longer necessary but I forgot to remove it )

[skipping through launch and transfer to the Mun]

Missed the edge of the crater by a few meters

Driving up the slope with some help of the OMS

The rover got some vernor engines on the bottom to provide some control during jumps and they provide enough thrust to lift the rover out of the cargo bay

The rover doesn't contain a probe core so Jeb has to drive it to the base.

Docked the rover to the base

Jeb, Bob and Val will return to Kerbin

[skipping through transfer to Kerbin]

After two aerobreaks, a small burn will put the orbiter on a landing trajectory

Again, I undershot and had to use some of the remaining fuel to boost the trajectory...I really don't know why this happens so often this time

At least, I got the boost right this time and I can head for the runway without any additional maneuvers

Landed at the KSC

Album for Mun STS-3: https://imgur.com/a/OXUpA3H

 

Mun STS-4

Spoiler

This mission will deliver the EEV to the base. There is a KV-3 'Pomegranate' inside the fairing so the EEV will provide space for 5 Kerbals.

[skipping through launch and transfer to the Mun]

This time I landed on the edge of the crater

Also the EEV doesn't contain a probe core, Val has to deliver it to the base.

Two 'Spark' engines lift the EEV out of the cargo bay.

Driving the EEV close to the base

Extending the landing gear and by firing just the engine at the top, the whole craft will raise

Actually, I wanted to crash the delivery rover but after separating it from the EEV, it landed upside down (removed it via tracking station)

Base complete! (I've increased the ambient light for this screenshot)

Exact position of the base

Val returns to Kerbin

[skipping through transfer to Kerbin but I have to say that I forgot to change my inclination around Kerbin so the trajectory is slightly inclined by ~3°]

Got a bad timing this time so after two aerobreaks, I set up a circularization burn around Kerbin.

Setting up a landing trajectory

At least, this time I will not undershoot

Have to wait until the orbiter reaches the dense part of the atmosphere before I start to fly a curve. I have to admit, this approach looks pretty bad but since I forgot to change my inclination, this is perfectly fine and I actually tried to 'overshoot' this time to give me enough time to perform some corrections

Lost more speed than expected but the big wings allow the emtpy orbiter to glide for an eternity

Approaching the runway

Landed at the KSC

Album for Mun STS-4: https://imgur.com/a/JuO2apA

 

Rover excursion and evacuation via EEV

Spoiler

Since the base is placed on the edge of a crater, let's go for a drive down into the crater
(I forgot to start the recording so I already drove ~100m, sorry )

Well, it's a crater...no really exciting xD

After ~1.8km, I got bored my Kerbals decided that there is nothing interesting to find down the crater and started to return

I'm a little bit impressed that the rover can drive up this steep slope

Back at the base

Redocked the rover

 

Evacuating the base

All Kerbals are on board, let's bring them back to Kerbin

Did you already notice that all Kerbals related to the base are wearing the alternative space suit?

No aerobreaking or powered breaking this time, just going straight for a landing

Ditch the tanks and engine

The capsule is not perfect regarding aerodynamics but the heatshield and the fairing protect the crew anyway

The capsule is going to land close to the KSC but this is a lucky accident

Touch down at Kerbin and all Kerbals are still alive. Mission complete

Album for rover excursion and evacuation via EEV: https://imgur.com/a/qHieWJf

This was a really tough, huge and exhausting challenge, I guess I'll take a little break before I attempt the next one   (But luckily, I don't have to assemble stuff on a surface for some time^^)

[Kerbolitto]

@4x4cheesecake

Very nice mission ! I like how you detach your stuff from the cargo bay with more engines :p And the Concorde style !

Also depending on what your re-entry looks like, you can sometimes use aerobraking to orientate the shuttle north or south and minimize the final inclination maneuver !
 

[4x4cheesecake]

Just now, Kerbolitto said:

@4x4cheesecake

Very nice mission ! I like how you detach your stuff from the cargo bay with more engines :p And the Concorde style !

Also depending on what your re-entry looks like, you can sometimes use aerobraking to orientate the shuttle north or south and minimize the final inclination maneuver !
 

Thanks

Well, It's a simple equation: More engines = more helpful And a surface attached stack separator will remove anything that looks ugly after delivery and also sometimes you accidentally build a spinner:

I know that it is possible to do some inclination changes while aerobreaking but I tend to make it even worst when I try it so flying a big curve was the save option

[Kerbolitto]

STS Duna 2

 

Here is my attempt at bringing an optionnal module to Duna's orbital space station, landing a shuttle on Duna and recover it safely. I threw this mission quickly because I wrongly understood that the rules would allow me to compress Duna 2 and Duna 3 mission. Having already landed Duna 3 I thought that it would be cool to bring a cargo inside Duna 2 instead of just rush the objective.

 

Part 1 : Take off, injection and capturing around Duna

 

 

Spoiler

Here's the injection maneuver split into 2x 6minutes burn :

I forgot to take a screenshot during re-entry but it was a regular injection with nothing special and very little heat, (I got one for Duna 3 mission) this is post aerocapture maneuver, I managed to almost circularize during the aerobraking phase :

 

Part 2 : Meeting with the orbital space station, landing on the surface

 

As you can see, Duna explorer vehicle is already there (I flew the 3rd mission before the 2nd). The new module

is a Poodle engine with lots of fuel, and 3 docking ports. I did not do the math but I'd guess it can speed the

station up to 2k m/s maybe.

 

Spoiler

Passing above Duna 3 flags : his part of the planet is very flat and easy to land

Using the shuttle high pitch authority + its RCS I was able to flare at very low speed :

Landing :

 

Part 3 : Take off from Duna, returning on Kerbin

 

STS Duna 3 already landed.

 

Spoiler

Because I had a ton of Oxidizer, I just brute force the take off profile pitching very high :

Return maneuver, again this is very standard : final altitude was set at 40 000m.

Aerocapture speed :

Post aerocapture maneuver : deorbiting directly on the KSC

Approaching runway at high speed :

Flare right in front of the runway, stall speed is very low which is really comfortable :

 

That should be it for this mission

Edited September 25, 2018 by Kerbolitto

[4x4cheesecake]

@Kerbolitto

Good job

Everytime I see you shuttle I think about adding some colorful lights to mine as well^^

Pretty impressive you flared the orbiter in such a thin atmosphere. Did you do it because you like it or because you cannot glide for a long distance in the thin atmosphere of Duna?

[Kerbolitto]

STS Duna 3

 

Last part of Duna's adventures

As said on the previous post, I wanted to fly Duna 2 and 3 at the same time so I also landed the shuttle during this one, after deploying a lander, and before bringing a television com-sat network around Eve. It was really cool to find a good packaging solutions between the lander, 2 com-sat, a fuel-tank probe and a large dish in the cargo bay

I did not put every screen regarding the shuttle's landing as I had to scrap this part of the mission but I got some if precisions are needed !

 

Part 1 : Take off from Kerbin, burn to Duna, aerocapturing

 

 

Spoiler

Duna first maneuver : (it was improved a bit later during the fly) burn is again split in two

During the flight I noticed that Ike was almost on the way of the shuttle so I rearranged a bit the approach to lower its speed. I'd say that re-entry was at least 100m/s slower than usual which is something !

Post aerocapture maneuver :

 

Part 2 : Space station encounter, undocking a fuel tank and Duna lander

 

 

Spoiler

Artisan's stats after undocking all that stuff :

 

Part 3 : Landing on Duna !

 

 

Spoiler

Deorbiting the lander next to the shuttle :

Close enough !

 

Part 4 : Getting into orbit safely

 

 

Spoiler

Closing the gap with the station during the ascent :

Lander and space station :

Shuttle take off : ascent profile is less agressive that Duna 2 because I wanted to extract as much speed as possible of the rocket engines.

Shuttle encounter with space station :

Redocking the tiny fuel tanker into the shuttle : because I had some space left inside the cargo bay I figured it could be a good idea to bring extra fuel ! I just docked it to the station to lower the weight of the shuttle during the Duna's surface intermede.

 

Part 5 : Now the fun begins (kind of) ! EVE !

 

I deployed this big dish as an intermediate relay. I feared that the 2 small RA-2 would be to weak to keep

contact with the shuttle during all the time needed to lower orbit around Eve. It's ugly design was dictated

by the room available in the cargo bay after putting the 2 com-sats !

 

The satellites are very simple design. As you can see on the screen I used a large heatshield and all the hardware was protected behind it (except the tip of the antennas !) Engines are facing opposite of the probe so I controlled the ship with a tiny docking port, holding the shield. Those things had around 2000dV +/-

 

Spoiler

Eve's encounter trajectory reworked some days after injection : I actually tried many various maneuvers to get an Eve's flyby with a direct return to Kerbin but this was not possible .. Instead I ended with this flightpath. As you can see I'm coming at Eve at an angle which lower Kerbin's inclination before zeroiing it between Kerbin and Duna's orbits. 2 or 3 orbits later I retroburned at Pe to lower Ap almost on Kerbin height, and despite all the precautions I knew that aerocapture would be very tricky .. !

Eve's network before aerobraking the 2 sats : I retroburned the polar one to get more time with the equatorial sat

Aerocapturing the first sat : I did not predict that a 1.875m. heatshield would have so much cross section that its ablator would burn really quick even with a low weight satellite but despite a useless shield things went smooth. Just had to roll-lock the sat to avoid heating the antennas which were not quite aligned.

Final network : I had to aerobrake 7 times the equatorial relay at 80km to lower its Ap !

 

Part 6 : Aerocapturing at Kerbin, landing

 

 

Spoiler

Re-entry was really tough on the shuttle : I had to loose 1k m/s just to capture and tried various things to do this. In the end I just put the shuttle sideways and rolled a bit to dissipate heat.

Post aerocapture maneuver : Ap is still as high as Mun !!

I directly deorbited after the second aerobraking, right on top of KSC without circularizing :

KSC approach : quite fast but its okay, flare happenned at 45 m/s

 

This was a really interresting mission, with multiple objectives I'm glad I could have survived Kerbin's re-entry with this thing !

30 minutes ago, 4x4cheesecake said:

@Kerbolitto

Good job

Everytime I see you shuttle I think about adding some colorful lights to mine as well^^

Pretty impressive you flared the orbiter in such a thin atmosphere. Did you do it because you like it or because you cannot glide for a long distance in the thin atmosphere of Duna?

Thank you :p Lights are useless, so I can't do without ...

Actually the shuttle glides really well at +/- 8-10000m. and that's part of the problem. I was happy to stall it as such a low speed because touchdown at more than 200m/s are scary. I had many troubles with my various SSTOs so that's why I largely boosted up pitch elevons on this design. On this landing version I also put 2 chutes, and vernors engines facing left and right to get yaw authority (I almost got none with the 2 small ailerons).

Edited September 25, 2018 by Kerbolitto

[4x4cheesecake]

Just now, Kerbolitto said:

Actually the shuttle glides really well at +/- 8-10000m. and that's part of the problem. I was happy to stall it as such a low speed because touchdown at more than 200m/s are scary.

I just did some tests with an empty orbiter and I start to understand the problem here. My best attempt left some debris spread across 4km, the worst didn't even left anything behind...this is going to be interesting.

[Kerbolitto]

1 minute ago, 4x4cheesecake said:

I just did some tests with an empty orbiter and I start to understand the problem here. My best attempt left some debris spread across 4km, the worst didn't even left anything behind...this is going to be interesting.

The main problem is that the ground is bumpy so that throw the ship anywhere, most of the time rolling on its side .. And as the atmosphere is so thin, you get very little control at landing speed to readjust for the next touchdown =/ With some tests you can also force things by deploying parachutes at very low altitude before touchdown but it's kind of limited..

I tried to fly this mission using my regular shuttle and failed during 1h30 to land it, and after little modifications (parachutes, vernors, more monoprop tanks just in case, also optionnal landing gear at the very back of the shuttle) I just put it on the ground at the first try.

[4x4cheesecake]

Just now, Kerbolitto said:

The main problem is that the ground is bumpy so that throw the ship anywhere, most of the time rolling on its side .. And as the atmosphere is so thin, you get very little control at landing speed to readjust for the next touchdown

I didn't even manage to touch the ground without crashing (but I know the bumpy grounds from SSTOs). Right now, I would say that the poor controls are the biggest issue and RCS is almost required...I was just hoping that my big wings will help me more in this situation.

Not quiet sure how I'm going to solve these issues but there are two more missions before I have to care about it and you already provided some good ideas