Finally, some news from Star Theory!

[KSACheese]

If you guys haven't seen yet, two new videos were uploaded on the KerbalSpaceProgram YouTube channel, one being a studio update, and the second being a (dope as hell, in my opinion) video about near-future tech that will be available in KSP2!

 

Check it out:

Next-Gen Tech

Studio Update

 

Let me know what you guys think!

 

[Guest]

A new studio and an increase in funding apparently, that's what happened.

[Guest]

Huh, yeah. Something happened to Star Theory. Would be nice to get the inside dope on that story.

In any case it doesn't look like KSP2 is going to be here any time soon. 

[shdwlrd]

39 minutes ago, Master39 said:

A new studio and an increase in funding apparently, that's what happened.

A couple good reasons for a delay and radio silence.

[mcwaffles2003]

Torchship Confirmed

[dnbattley]

9 hours ago, Brikoleur said:

Something happened to Star Theory. Would be nice to get the inside dope on that story.

Hyped as I am for this sequel, I am reading pretty serious issues into this, and some high level corporate attention being involved. That can be a good thing (extra resources) or a bad thing (c.f. Disney and Star Wars). My theory (stated elsewhere in this forum) is that the team have been struggling to develop the core physics engine without falling back on the patchwork of sticking plasters that is the KSP1 we all know and love (but which is limited and has never been able to support multiplayer or the planned binary planet system), and this is now creating more serious internal issues, not to mention timing concerns.

That we are now shown videos focusing on explosion types and rocket exhaust plumes is cool, but it is "just" graphics, which honestly could be knocked up in an afternoon on Blender. I hesitate to bring up a comparison with Star Citizen, but you undoubtedly catch my drift.

I hope I'm very wrong, but that's how I interpret this circumstantial evidence...

[MechBFP]

33 minutes ago, dnbattley said:

Hyped as I am for this sequel, I am reading pretty serious issues into this, and some high level corporate attention being involved. That can be a good thing (extra resources) or a bad thing (c.f. Disney and Star Wars). My theory (stated elsewhere in this forum) is that the team have been struggling to develop the core physics engine without falling back on the patchwork of sticking plasters that is the KSP1 we all know and love (but which is limited and has never been able to support multiplayer or the planned binary planet system), and this is now creating more serious internal issues, not to mention timing concerns.

That we are now shown videos focusing on explosion types and rocket exhaust plumes is cool, but it is "just" graphics, which honestly could be knocked up in an afternoon on Blender. I hesitate to bring up a comparison with Star Citizen, but you undoubtedly catch my drift.

I hope I'm very wrong, but that's how I interpret this circumstantial evidence...

I hope you are right actually. That means they are willing to commit instead of just canning the project, AND before it is too late to fix the problem no less. 

[mcwaffles2003]

37 minutes ago, dnbattley said:

Hyped as I am for this sequel, I am reading pretty serious issues into this, and some high level corporate attention being involved. That can be a good thing (extra resources) or a bad thing (c.f. Disney and Star Wars). My theory (stated elsewhere in this forum) is that the team have been struggling to develop the core physics engine without falling back on the patchwork of sticking plasters that is the KSP1 we all know and love (but which is limited and has never been able to support multiplayer or the planned binary planet system), and this is now creating more serious internal issues, not to mention timing concerns.

That we are now shown videos focusing on explosion types and rocket exhaust plumes is cool, but it is "just" graphics, which honestly could be knocked up in an afternoon on Blender. I hesitate to bring up a comparison with Star Citizen, but you undoubtedly catch my drift.

I hope I'm very wrong, but that's how I interpret this circumstantial evidence...

Multiplayer, I believe, has been confirmed as at least functional in the interview with @ShadowZone. The exact remarks being "I've never heard people laugh so hard"

They've had at least 5 months since then to refine it.

[shdwlrd]

1 hour ago, dnbattley said:

Hyped as I am for this sequel, I am reading pretty serious issues into this, and some high level corporate attention being involved

Something was going on within star theory, they aren't listed with private division anymore. Private division created a new studio, so who knows.  

I'm thinking it was some inter-company issues. Things like that usually don't make into the public eye unless someone is livid enough not to care about a NDA or working conditions are that bad.

1 hour ago, dnbattley said:

My theory (stated elsewhere in this forum) is that the team have been struggling to develop the core physics engine without falling back on the patchwork of sticking plasters that is the KSP1 we all know and love (but which is limited and has never been able to support multiplayer or the planned binary planet system), and this is now creating more serious internal issues, not to mention timing concerns.

I doubt that's the case. KSP2 has been in production for seemingly before the poodle engine was revamped. If the physics engine was that problematic, they would of shut the project down or replaced it with a 3rd part suite by now. If KSP2 is going to be featured at PAX east, I'm hoping what they have a playable demo to prove that the physics is as solid as we hope.

1 hour ago, dnbattley said:

That we are now shown videos focusing on explosion types and rocket exhaust plumes is cool, but it is "just" graphics, which honestly could be knocked up in an afternoon on Blender.

They are probably moving on with the planned info release schedule. The topic of the next-gen tech video does fall inline with the previous videos last year. 

[mcwaffles2003]

Just now, shdwlrd said:

Something was going on within star theory, they aren't listed with private division anymore. Private division created a new studio, so who knows.  

I'm thinking it was some inter-company issues. Things like that usually don't make into the public eye unless someone is livid enough not to care about a NDA or working conditions are that bad.

Can you clarify?

Are you saying Star Theory is on its own now? Or has Private Division re-worked their relationship but Star Theory but Star Theory is still its subsidiary?

Sorry, I'm just a bit confused with the wording. 

[shdwlrd]

10 minutes ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

Can you clarify?

Are you saying Star Theory is on its own now? Or has Private Division re-worked their relationship but Star Theory but Star Theory is still its subsidiary?

Sorry, I'm just a bit confused with the wording. 

I'm just reporting what I've seen on private divisions website, and what was in TTI's quarterly earnings report.

Edited February 21, 2020 by shdwlrd

[mcwaffles2003]

Just now, shdwlrd said:

I just reporting what I've seen on private divisions website, and what was in their quarterly earnings report.

Care to give  a link? I dont see this on their website nor on Take-two's Q2 or Q3 2020 earnings

[Superfluous J]

38 minutes ago, shdwlrd said:

If KSP2 is going to be featured at PAX east

That is an "if" that I'm personally doubting is true, as much as I'd like it to be.

[shdwlrd]

19 minutes ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

Care to give  a link? I dont see this on their website nor on Take-two's Q2 or Q3 2020 earnings

Sure,

https://ir.take2games.com/news-releases/news-release-details/private-division-announces-new-seattle-area-development-studio?field_nir_news_date_value[min]=

https://ir.take2games.com/news-releases/news-release-details/take-two-interactive-software-inc-reports-results-fiscal-third-0?field_nir_news_date_value[min]=

[shdwlrd]

13 minutes ago, 5thHorseman said:

That is an "if" that I'm personally doubting is true, as much as I'd like it to be.

I agree, I'm just stating the possibility. With a couple games up for release, it could be one of those. It's always a gambit with these cons.

[Guest]

It’s fairly obvious that something went wrong. You don’t poach a studio’s core people and quietly start a new one if everything is going great. It’s a big disruption even in the best case.

 If Private Division had bought Star Theory it would be a different matter.

I expect everybody’s under NDA so I doubt we’ll hear the real story any time soon.

It’s good the project is alive and Private Division is committed to it but I expect quite a long delay. Other than that this is not good news.

[mcwaffles2003]

Found more info on the subject, or at least clearer info.

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/take-two-forms-new-studio-for-ksp2-with-original-developers-role-unclear/

PD spokesperson (unnamed):

Quote

“The decision to open our own studio and move development in-house allows us to provide the development team with the necessary time and resources to complete development of KSP 2 at the quality level we all want to deliver our players.

“Our goal – and the goal of our developers – is to provide our community with the highest level gaming experience with Kerbal Space Program 2.”

PD Boss, Michael Worosz:

Quote

“Since we acquired Kerbal Space Program in 2017, we have consistently produced, high-quality content for our community, which in turn has resulted in strong growth, both in terms of new players engaging with the franchise, and our ambitions to take it to the next level.

“The opening of this new studio, whose purpose is dedicated solely to the ongoing development of KSP, is a reinforcement of our promise to bring the best experiences to our fans and players for Kerbal Space Program 2 and beyond.”

At worst it sounds like the entire dev team with the exception of Nate and one other have been exchanged and the game is now being made directly by private division. Perhaps someone with experience in this world can further elaborate what this all means. To me, a layman, this sounds like an entirely new team has been forged to take on the project and Nate and friend have been catching them up to speed. The release of this info coming at the same time as the update says to me we haven't been given info based on some NDA and company switch over. I hope some progress has been made over the course of the transition.

Maybe ST wasn't up to the task at hand and private division wanted to make sure it gets done right (optomism), but I sure hope this isn't due to something like creative differences and I hope the new team is made of fans of the series since we can't be "sure" of that now as nearly the whole new teams identity is unknown...

Edited February 21, 2020 by mcwaffles2003

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

Maybe ST wasn't up to the task at hand and private division wanted to make sure it gets done right (optomism), but I sure hope this isn't due to something like creative differences and I hope the new team is made of fans of the series since we can't be "sure" of that now as nearly the whole new teams identity is unknown...

The excited nerd with the beard gave me hope. He’s just the kind of guy I’d hope to see developing this.

But yeah this does dampen my hopes for a well designed, well engineered sequel. Handing a codebase over to a new team is messy even in the best case, and I doubt this was the best case.

[Incarnation of Chaos]

16 minutes ago, Brikoleur said:

The excited nerd with the beard gave me hope. He’s just the kind of guy I’d hope to see developing this.

But yeah this does dampen my hopes for a well designed, well engineered sequel. Handing a codebase over to a new team is messy even in the best case, and I doubt this was the best case.

You're assuming there WAS a codebase to hand over; any number of things could've happened to source files in the transition. For all we know what we're seeing is the few working demos they cobbled togther into something presentable; though i do doubt that personally.

But all of the assumptions we've made should go straight out the window until this new team gives us more context on what the hell is going on.

Edited February 21, 2020 by Incarnation of Chaos
-Typo

[mcwaffles2003]

Just now, Incarnation of Chaos said:

You're assuming there WAS a codebase to hand over; any number of this could've happened to source files in the transition. For all we know what we're seeing is the few working demos they cobbled togther into something presentable; though i do doubt that personally.

But all of the assumptions we've made should go straight out the window until this new team gives us more context on what the hell is going on.

If that were the case then how did they have demos before the transition? It looks fairly similar to the first pre-alpha gameplay we saw 5 months ago.

[Teek]

Obviously, this is all speculation and I know as much, if not less, than anyone else, but I don’t get quite the sense of gloom and doom from this as others.  I’m guessing this is more a question of different levels of commitment between ST and PD, and a change in scope on the project than any major development crisis or corporate flashpoint.  I’m guessing that, perhaps as a result of greater public reception than originally anticipated, KSP2 may be ramping up it’s launch scope, and/or laying out more long-term plans for post-launch support, both of which could possibly exceed ST’s current capabilities.  Far easier to scale up and plan out long term development when everything is under your own umbrella.  We know that the project leads have all made it over, and it wasn’t likely a large team to begin with (LinkedIn has 29 employees associated with their page.  Could be more than that but no more than 50.) It’s entirely possible that most, if not all, of the KSP2 team has also left, and the additional hiring at PD is mostly for scaling up the team.  I’m also assuming that not all of Star Theory was working on KSP, it’s possible they had other projects under way or waiting in the wings, and simply couldn’t commit to long term development.

Either way, they are currently still saying that the game is set to come out in FY 2021, so basically any time before April 2021, which is still more or less what our window was before this all came about.  Of course, things could still be pushed back, but I just don’t think they’d be simultaneously publishing videos about the game and studio update if they hadn’t been planning this for at least some time.  Also, now that KSP2 is 100% in house at Private Division, this could potentially increase the chances of it being at the Pax East booth.  I just think the timing of this release is very convenient.

Also, if they had been planning to transition this back into PD for a while, that would provide a pretty decent explanation for the sudden comm silence after the E3 announcement.  Again, totally my own theory, nothing substantial supporting this, but I could see it turning out as:

1. PD contracts Star Theory to do conceptual work, maybe originally envisioning it as a KSP remaster with a few bells and whistles;
2. Star Theory builds out a pre-alpha prototype, starts building out more advanced features
3. PD/ST announce KSP2 at E3
4. Fan/public response greater than anticipated, or at least exceeding a certain threshold where PD decides it can invest more in KSP2 project.
5. Star Theory (again, very small and independent developer) is not able to scale up to requirements or not willing to commit long term, transitions KSP2 team over to PD, goes into comm silence as restructuring begins

Edited February 21, 2020 by Teek

[Incarnation of Chaos]

2 minutes ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

If that were the case then how did they have demos before the transition? It looks fairly similar to the first pre-alpha gameplay we saw 5 months ago.

Demos are often self-contained "Vertical Slices" that don't depend on other code/assets to run, so they'd still work if they lost the source files.

[Guest]

Yes I’m assuming there is a code base. It’s possible that things went so badly wrong that there isn’t but that’s unlikely. So the null hypothesis should be that there was a code base and it was handed over to the new studio in whatever shape it is.

What that means we can’t know. Maybe it is a total loss, maybe it’s fine and the reasons for the change were organizational or business related, most likely it’s somewhere in between. But this is not a decision that was taken lightly and the project will have suffered.

[kerbiloid]

About the studio.

Too much room in the room.

The cramped 2x2x2 m MOL-style cubicles and a cooler with limited water supply would be more atmospheric and inspiring.

Spoiler

Though, maybe they imagine they are in a Martian glass dome with terraformed garden out of the window.

[Incarnation of Chaos]

Just now, Brikoleur said:

Yes I’m assuming there is a code base. It’s possible that things went so badly wrong that there isn’t but that’s unlikely. So the null hypothesis should be that there was a code base and it was handed over to the new studio in whatever shape it is.

What that means we can’t know. Maybe it is a total loss, maybe it’s fine and the reasons for the change were organizational or business related, most likely it’s somewhere in between. But this is not a decision that was taken lightly and the project will have suffered.

I'm actually agreed here, but just wanted to play the Devil's Advocate for a moment xD