[1.0.5] TAC Life Support v0.11.2.1 [12Dec]

[tomf]

How can you change the amount of electricity the recyclers use to process?

Find the cfg file for the recycler you want to edit e.g. yourKspDir/GameData/TacLifeSupportRecyclers/Recycler_CarbonExtractor.cfg.

Towards the bottom you will find the the list of imput resources, CarbonDioxide and ElectricCharge in this case. You can edit the numbers to change the rate at which resources are used.

[Drew Kerman]

anyone else seeing remaining electrical charge decreasing at a rate higher than normal? For example, it told me I had 2:15:17 of power remaining, and yet I was almost out of power 20 minutes later

[RainDreamer]

anyone else seeing remaining electrical charge decreasing at a rate higher than normal? For example, it told me I had 2:15:17 of power remaining, and yet I was almost out of power 20 minutes later

It only account for the consumption for keeping kerbal alive. If you have other stuff that drains electrical charge, it will drain much faster, and not accounted for.

[Kerbas_ad_astra]

Alternate Resource Panel will track the total rate of consumption and production of all resources (and can also show a time-until-empty/time-until-full), so that will also account for recyclers, producers (e.g. USI), and so on (which I don't think TAC-LS does).

[Goddess Bhavani]

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/3emtoeyky6c3w8v/AACeKCYqv4NGnloOUMrl-kZla/TacLifeSupport_0.10.1.1320.zip?dl=0 is the fix for 0.90

Got it ! Thanks a ton

[Drew Kerman]

It only account for the consumption for keeping kerbal alive. If you have other stuff that drains electrical charge, it will drain much faster, and not accounted for.

Alternate Resource Panel will track the total rate of consumption and production of all resources (and can also show a time-until-empty/time-until-full), so that will also account for recyclers, producers (e.g. USI), and so on (which I don't think TAC-LS does).

Will keep these in mind next time but it still seemed to be off even considering extra power drain from RT antennas and omni lights

[Aedile]

Will keep these in mind next time but it still seemed to be off even considering extra power drain from RT antennas and omni lights

There is also this

[Drew Kerman]

There is also this

it's been having trouble keeping up to date with RT changes so at the time I was playing, it wasn't reporting proper EC consumption for me to judge anything by

[doglatine]

Love the mod, but one question. For my bases, if I'm in map view, all's fine, resources, seem to be ticking down normally. But if I leave map view and go there and time warp forward, they run out of electricity and asphyxiate (they have solar panels, about 2000 units of battery power, and 5 kerbals per base). Is this a known issue? Do I really need ~10,000 units of electric charge to get my bases through the night? If so, I hope I unlock RTGs soon!

[TaranisElsu]

Changes

• Updated for KSP 0.90
  
• Removed the "Allow Respawn" setting because it is available in the game settings now.
  
• Used new Module Manager syntax to simplify the MM configs.
  
• Added part tests for command pods. It makes sense to test life support systems in a variety of situations.
  
• Added an MM compatibility config for the Community Tech Tree -- by Kerbas-ad-astra
  
• Fixed the node sizes -- by NoMrBond
  
• Fixed the node sizes for the MFT containers.
  

Warning: has not been tested with ModularFuelTanks. Recent changes to MFT conflict with compatibility configs in this mod, so they will probably not work together. This is being worked on.

- - - Updated - - -

Love the mod, but one question. For my bases, if I'm in map view, all's fine, resources, seem to be ticking down normally. But if I leave map view and go there and time warp forward, they run out of electricity and asphyxiate (they have solar panels, about 2000 units of battery power, and 5 kerbals per base). Is this a known issue? Do I really need ~10,000 units of electric charge to get my bases through the night? If so, I hope I unlock RTGs soon!

This mod does not display anything in map view yet...........

It will catch up when you next load the ship, so it is as if it was running the entire time that you are in the map view -- but the Life Support Monitoring Window does not work in the map view yet. I am working on a new version that will fix that.

[Goddess Bhavani]

Love the mod, but one question. For my bases, if I'm in map view, all's fine, resources, seem to be ticking down normally. But if I leave map view and go there and time warp forward, they run out of electricity and asphyxiate (they have solar panels, about 2000 units of battery power, and 5 kerbals per base). Is this a known issue? Do I really need ~10,000 units of electric charge to get my bases through the night? If so, I hope I unlock RTGs soon!

I have a observation along the lines of this although I have not installed TAC for my .90

What would happen if a real manned spacecraft loses all power? Pretty sure the endurance of the crew would exceed more than 2-3 hours. They will lose heat and ventilation but observing the events of Apollo 13, our Kerbonauts would survive more than the 2-3 hours depicted in TAC's stock settings.

Unless of course the Kerbonauts just sit there and let themselves perish from hypothermia or something.

Anyone have any opinion of this?

[doglatine]

Awesome news on the update! Excited to try this.

Regarding my question above, I phrased it badly. What I mean to say is that day/night solar charge-discharge cycles that *would* result in Kerbal deaths when run in-game don't happen when I'm at the Space Center. So if I play through the night, Kerbals die. If I just let the night happen, and I'm on another mission, they live. Does that make sense? Am I doing something wrong, or is this just because it's understandably hard to implement a mechanism whereby the game constantly monitors whether a given ship's solar panels are being illuminated?

Changes

• Updated for KSP 0.90
  
• Removed the "Allow Respawn" setting because it is available in the game settings now.
  
• Used new Module Manager syntax to simplify the MM configs.
  
• Added part tests for command pods. It makes sense to test life support systems in a variety of situations.
  
• Added an MM compatibility config for the Community Tech Tree -- by Kerbas-ad-astra
  
• Fixed the node sizes -- by NoMrBond
  
• Fixed the node sizes for the MFT containers.
  

Warning: has not been tested with ModularFuelTanks. Recent changes to MFT conflict with compatibility configs in this mod, so they will probably not work together. This is being worked on.

- - - Updated - - -

This mod does not display anything in map view yet...........

It will catch up when you next load the ship, so it is as if it was running the entire time that you are in the map view -- but the Life Support Monitoring Window does not work in the map view yet. I am working on a new version that will fix that.

[JordanL]

Alright, so I spent some time testing with RealFuels/MFT and though by default TACLS doesn't work with them, you can get it to work with some small changes.

WARNING: I'm just a random dude, this is just a report of what I found acceptable on my own install. This is not "how to make it work".

• Go to GameData/ThunderAerospace/TacLifeSupport folder and open the MM_AddResources.cfg file.
  
• Near the top of the file, remove the :NEEDS[!modularFuelTanks&!realFuels]
  
• Go to GameData/ThunderAerospace folder and delete/remove the TacLifeSupportMFT folder
  

This will make it fall back on all the non-MFT/RF configs for everything. It works the way you'd expect it to in a vanilla install. However:

• If you do this, no part which is marked as a MFT will be able to use anything from TACLS. This essentially deletes all compatibility with the two mods.
  
• Instead of the nice, configurable, one part per size that can be configured to any ratio you want, you get one version for each "configuration" in your parts list. That feature took advantage of MFT to manage the configured ratios.
  

This means you'll have to use TAC's provided containers for ALL of your life support needs, and I'm pretty sure that any command modules which ALSO have MFT configs on them (some of the spaceplane parts I think do this) will probably not work for EITHER (although this is just my hunch, I haven't tested it yet).

As was mentioned by the mod author, I'm sure this compatibility quirk is something that's being worked on. In the meantime, I personally was willing to sacrifice clutter in my parts list for a working TACLS and keeping RF.

[rabidninjawombat]

Changes

• Updated for KSP 0.90
  
• Removed the "Allow Respawn" setting because it is available in the game settings now.
  
• Used new Module Manager syntax to simplify the MM configs.
  
• Added part tests for command pods. It makes sense to test life support systems in a variety of situations.
  
• Added an MM compatibility config for the Community Tech Tree -- by Kerbas-ad-astra
  
• Fixed the node sizes -- by NoMrBond
  
• Fixed the node sizes for the MFT containers.
  

Warning: has not been tested with ModularFuelTanks. Recent changes to MFT conflict with compatibility configs in this mod, so they will probably not work together. This is being worked on.

- - - Updated - - -

This mod does not display anything in map view yet...........

It will catch up when you next load the ship, so it is as if it was running the entire time that you are in the map view -- but the Life Support Monitoring Window does not work in the map view yet. I am working on a new version that will fix that.

Thanks for the update and CTT integration! You rock!

[TaranisElsu]

I have a observation along the lines of this although I have not installed TAC for my .90

What would happen if a real manned spacecraft loses all power? Pretty sure the endurance of the crew would exceed more than 2-3 hours. They will lose heat and ventilation but observing the events of Apollo 13, our Kerbonauts would survive more than the 2-3 hours depicted in TAC's stock settings.

Unless of course the Kerbonauts just sit there and let themselves perish from hypothermia or something.

Anyone have any opinion of this?

A complete loss of power also means the carbon dioxide scrubbers are not working, so the air becomes toxic from the Kerbals exhaling. That is in addition to any heat issues they might face.

The Apollo 13 spacecraft never completely lost power. They were running on batteries in the Lunar Module, with most things turned off or on minimal settings.

Addendum: did you know that candles cannot stay lit in 0g even with plenty of oxygen in the area (assuming no air circulation)? The candle burns all the oxygen immediately around it, and there is no convection to move the air away so it burns itself out. The same thing would happen to humans if they had no air circulation and staying in one spot too much. Ref: http://io9.com/5779127/how-does-fire-behave-in-zero-gravity and

Alright, so I spent some time testing with RealFuels/MFT and though by default TACLS doesn't work with them, you can get it to work with some small changes.

WARNING: I'm just a random dude, this is just a report of what I found acceptable on my own install. This is not "how to make it work".

• Go to GameData/ThunderAerospace/TacLifeSupport folder and open the MM_AddResources.cfg file.
  
• Near the top of the file, remove the :NEEDS[!modularFuelTanks&!realFuels]
  
• Go to GameData/ThunderAerospace folder and delete/remove the TacLifeSupportMFT folder
  

This will make it fall back on all the non-MFT/RF configs for everything. It works the way you'd expect it to in a vanilla install. However:

• If you do this, no part which is marked as a MFT will be able to use anything from TACLS. This essentially deletes all compatibility with the two mods.
  
• Instead of the nice, configurable, one part per size that can be configured to any ratio you want, you get one version for each "configuration" in your parts list. That feature took advantage of MFT to manage the configured ratios.
  

This means you'll have to use TAC's provided containers for ALL of your life support needs, and I'm pretty sure that any command modules which ALSO have MFT configs on them (some of the spaceplane parts I think do this) will probably not work for EITHER (although this is just my hunch, I haven't tested it yet).

As was mentioned by the mod author, I'm sure this compatibility quirk is something that's being worked on. In the meantime, I personally was willing to sacrifice clutter in my parts list for a working TACLS and keeping RF.

If you only delete the MM_AddResourcesMFT.cfg file instead of the whole TacLifeSupportMFT directory, then you can keep using the MFT containers. It just won't change the command pods to use MFT tanks.

Thanks for the update and CTT integration! You rock!

Kerbas-ad-astra added the CTT integration, so he/she also rocks

[Kerbas_ad_astra]

Kerbas-ad-astra added the CTT integration, so he/she also rocks

"He", and I'm happy to help! There was honestly less thinking and sorting involved than I had expected. I figured that the storage containers could stay with their respective "size classes" of rockets, so that left the recyclers and processors. CTT had a node called "Recyclers", so that was an easy choice, and therefore the Sabatier Recycler, Water Splitter, and Carbon Extractor went into the other added node, Enhanced Survivability. And I still managed to goof the config when I posted it heer, so thanks to DaveS for correcting me before I made the GitHub commit...lots of thanks to go around!

[Azimech]

I'm having trouble with the main window, can't find it anywhere. I have Blizzy's toolbar installed but on the space center screen, no button or anything else, shows up. And I can't find which file to delete.

[hoylemd]

Is this on CKAN? I can't find it.

[TaranisElsu]

Is this on CKAN? I can't find it.

I am mixed on the whole CKAN thing. When it works, it is great. When it doesn't.... it is annoying, frustrating, and occasionally infuriating. If you want CKAN support, then you need to go contribute to the project. Help finish it, add better error handling, and add a little polish.

CKAN Links: forum and Github.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm having trouble with the main window, can't find it anywhere. I have Blizzy's toolbar installed but on the space center screen, no button or anything else, shows up. And I can't find which file to delete.

Check to make sure that you have the toolbar installed, and that you have added the TACLS button to the toolbar. See the toolbar's thread for help on those steps.

Otherwise, log file? Not much I can do without it. See my signature for instructions.

[goldenpsp]

I am mixed on the whole CKAN thing. When it works, it is great. When it doesn't.... it is annoying, frustrating, and occasionally infuriating. If you want CKAN support, then you need to go contribute to the project. Help finish it, add better error handling, and add a little polish.

CKAN Links: forum and Github.

CKAN is an abomination at the moment as far as I'm concerned. It causes the same amount of wasted support posts as 64bit did.

[Azimech]

Check to make sure that you have the toolbar installed, and that you have added the TACLS button to the toolbar. See the toolbar's thread for help on those steps.

Otherwise, log file? Not much I can do without it. See my signature for instructions.

What I meant that toolbar didn't show in the space center scene, but does elsewhere. It still might be a Toolbar problem.

I installed the previous version of TACLS but decided to wait to switch it on because I wanted to get my kerbals back. Resources were visible, etc. Today I installed the new version.

But, no problem, I'll just backup my persistence file, edit and change IsNewSave = True and Enabled = True.

Update: I deleted the toolbar settings, it worked. Sorry to have bothered you.

Edited January 27, 2015 by Azimech

[hoylemd]

I'm surprised there's so much ire towards CKAN. it's always worked great for me. Occasionally there are network issues, but other than that it's fine. Maybe I'll see if there are any bugs I can fix with it.

[goldenpsp]

I'm surprised there's so much ire towards CKAN. it's always worked great for me. Occasionally there are network issues, but other than that it's fine. Maybe I'll see if there are any bugs I can fix with it.

Much of the ire revolves around your post, at least IMO. It isn't so much how CKAN works but how it has been implemented. The vast majority of mods have been added to CKAN by other people without the mod developers knowledge. So then when there is a CKAN issue people post in the mods thread, when really they should probably be bugging the CKAN thread. In many cases the actual mod dev's answer is "I have no idea I didn't add my mod to CKAN". It is much like the whole 64bit mess where people muck up the mod threads about crashes when they have nothing to do with the mod but due to the 64 bit instability.

[AccidentalDisassembly]

I'm surprised there's so much ire towards CKAN. it's always worked great for me. Occasionally there are network issues, but other than that it's fine. Maybe I'll see if there are any bugs I can fix with it.

Not being functional in any way (for me) is probably its principal downside. It doesn't detect versions of installed mods and therefore can't tell me if there are updates.

[eightiesboi]

Is this on CKAN? I can't find it.

Yes, but it is bugged right now. If you try to install TAC-LS, it will make you choose one of the two config files to go with it, and then it errors out. If you choose a config file without TAC-LS, it automatically attempts to install TAC-LS as well and errors out. Errors submitted to CKAN Github.

As an aside, I believe the problem is that the core TAC-LS file has a config in it, and the two other configs are attempting to override it. I know there's a way to make this work, as DRE and Distant Object Enhancement both work fine with their respective configs in CKAN.

Love this mod. I keep KSP-Admin around merely for this mod and nothing else.