Evacuate Earth

[Kryten]

Because it's not factual. That's a very common misconception. It takes what's not standard and calls it abnormal, or corrupted, just because it's not what most people want. You're talking to someone who's had far more experience with than she cares to admit to.

Have you ever met a profoundly autistic person? Somebody entirely non-verbal?

[Xannari Ferrows]

Have you ever met a profoundly autistic person? Somebody entirely non-verbal?

I've met someone who doesn't speak, yes. Talks through Morse code.

[SargeRho]

You're talking to a high-functioning autist, I think that gives me experience enough. Let's take the social problems it gives me aside, like the aforementioned speech problem and prosopagnosia. I have pretty much daily migraines, I can't function in large crowds at all, my eyes and ears are oversensitive to the extent where I have to wear sunglasses and ear plugs or headphones outside during the day to avoid going completely bananas, which as you might imagine, can be quite a problem in Spain, being very bright, and everyone wanting to talk to you all the time.

[Xannari Ferrows]

I can't second you with that, but I have experienced it first hand. To admit to corruption is the only corruption about you, I've realized. I've known this ever since dropping out of school. To believe that you are a limited being makes you one. You are the wall that you cannot overcome. A destroy spell against an indestructible creature.

To experience physical pain is unrelated. To believe in something greater solves your problem.

[Kryten]

I've met someone who doesn't speak, yes. Talks through Morse code.

Would you say then that this person is, using the medical use of the term, diseased?

[SargeRho]

It's hardly limiting, if anything, it drives me to try even harder. Everyone has their limits, and I want to know where my limits are, That's why I continue to push them.

Something higher, such as?

[Xannari Ferrows]

Would you say then that this person is, using the medical use of the term, diseased?

Don't use that word lightly. Diseased is practically and antonym. We aren't all built to talk with voices, you know.

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It's hardly limiting, if anything, it drives me to try even harder. Everyone has their limits, and I want to know where my limits are, that why I continue to push them.

Something higher, such as?

My point exactly. You are always out of the reach of your expectations, for your limits move with your achievements. It is one of the wonder of the mind. It reminds me of a quote from Voyager. "I wish all of her wishes to come true, except for one, so she'll always have something to strive for." Not exactly sure word for word, but that's the general gist.

Something higher, you ask? That's up to you.

[SargeRho]

Our verbal abilities are a major part of being human. Someone who lacks verbal communication is by the very definition of the word, diseased.

On certain things, my limits are still inherently lower than those of other people. Sensory overload is a thing, and it's ....ing terrible.

[Xannari Ferrows]

Our verbal abilities are a major part of being human. Someone who lacks verbal communication is by the very definition of the word, diseased.

On certain things, my limits are still inherently lower than those of other people. Sensory overload is a thing, and it's ....ing terrible.

And who invented that definition? Someone with a voice? Everyone who doesn't have one would disagree. There is no one definition for Diseased. It changes for everyone.

Sensory overload? Like, random visual acuteness, sensitive hearing, cellular stimulation, ect? I've seen things like that be tamed, and Collin, whom is one such example, loves the feeling.

[SargeRho]

There is a definition of disease, I posted it above: "a disorder of structure or function in a human, animal, or plant, especially one that produces specific symptoms or that affects a specific location and is not simply a direct result of physical injury."

If one lacks any specific mental abilities, such as verbal communication, they're diseased. I don't understand the negative connotation of the word.

In my case, I usually become extremely irritable and irritated, and have to close my eyes and sometimes cover my ears to bring myself back down to bearable levels. And the "easiness" varies from day to day, some days I get lucky, and can keep myself in check. Others, not so much. "Others", unfortunately, are the vast majority of days.

Something higher, you ask? That's up to you.

Yeah, I'm going to need more than that.

[Kryten]

Sensory overload? Like, random visual acuteness, sensitive hearing, cellular stimulation, ect? I've seen things like that be tamed, and Collin, whom is one such example, loves the feeling.

It's more like a panic attack, brought about by sustained exposure to unpleasant sensory stimuli. The humming of florescent lamps is a common trigger, as are crowd noises.

There is no one definition for Diseased. It changes for everyone.

This would be entirely true, if we were all hermits. A disability is an impairment in a person's ability to function in society: it's a definition set by consenus, not individually.

[Xannari Ferrows]

Who's to say me and you aren't diseased? Someone with no voice could say that they're normal, we're not supposed to have voices, and we're all diseased. Anything that can be put in two ways is not a disease.

If one lacks verbal communication, then they are different. Unlike the general majority or people and humans alike.

I truly do feel sympathy for you, and although you may disagree with my saying this, it is possible to overcome your defined flaws. I'm not saying it will change overnight. It could take years potentially, but you must discipline yourself, not anyone else.

What do you need more of? I don't share a consciousness with you.

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It's more like a panic attack, brought about by sustained exposure to unpleasant sensory stimuli. The humming of florescent lamps is a common trigger, as are crowd noises.

So akin to a phobia? As far as I know, phobias can only be explained by the one who experiences the feeling.

This would be entirely true, if we were all hermits. A disability is an impairment in a person's ability to function in society: it's a definition set by consenus, not individually.

My point still stands.

Why not define "diseased" in your own words? Try to imagine you are inventing the word, and you must write in the dictionary of what it means. What are those words?

[SargeRho]

"Who's to say me and you aren't diseased?"

A doctor, for example. It feels like you're simply being overly politically correct, avoiding the word "disease" like the plague.

If one lacks verbal communication, they're diseased. It's that simple. They lack a normal human function, that pretty much defines them as diseased. I lack the ability to read faces, my ability to speak is considerably impaired, and my social functions are pretty much absent.

"What do you need more of?"

Information. I don't know what you mean by "something greater".

"So akin to a phobia?"

I suppose you can compare it, but not exactly. It's more like going into a state of shock in response to over-stimulation of one or multiple senses, I'm most susceptible to auditory over-stimulation.

"Why not define "diseased" in your own words?"

In my own words, a disease is any impairment or lack of normal functions of an organism that isn't caused by physical injury.

[Xannari Ferrows]

"A doctor, for example. It feels like you're simply being overly politically correct, avoiding the word "disease" like the plague."

A doctor cannot see into your phaneron, therefore cannot define you as diseased with geniune accuracy.

"If one lacks verbal communication, they're diseased. It's that simple. They lack a normal human function, that pretty much defines them as diseased. I lack the ability to read faces, my ability to speak is considerably impaired, and my social functions are pretty much absent."

If only it were indeed that simple. Functionalities by person or human is not defined by a scale or normality, but popularity. It may be uncommon for someone to not be able to speak with a voice, that doesn't make them in any way impaired. Usually it merits another sense being developed in extra statements for compensation. Is that a disease as well?

"Information. I don't know what you mean by "something greater"."

You're the one defining the greater concept. I cannot give you information about yourself.

"I suppose you can compare it, but not exactly. It's more like going into a state of shock in response to over-stimulation of one or multiple senses, I'm most susceptible to auditory over-stimulation."

So like a combination of the two guesses I had? That makes some sense. Like a third stage...

"In my own words, a disease is any impairment or lack of normal functions of an organism that isn't caused by physical injury."

Alright, fair enough. That's how you think. My definition is: Any physiological, or psychological impairments not part of the natural development of a being.

[Kryten]

I truly do feel sympathy for you, and although you may disagree with my saying this, it is possible to overcome your defined flaws. I'm not saying it will change overnight. It could take years potentially, but you must discipline yourself, not anyone else.

Go say that to somebody with a physical disability and see what kind of response you get. That we don't yet have a full understanding of the physical mechanism doesn't mean one can just will away autism or it's symptoms; it's a brain structural issue, not an attitude problem.

So akin to a phobia? As far as I know, phobias can only be explained by the one who experiences the feeling.

The trigger is much more specific than a phobia, and the resulting feeling, while hard to describe, is not fear. More a mixture of extreme irritation and anxiety.

[Xannari Ferrows]

Go say that to somebody with a physical disability and see what kind of response you get. That we don't yet have a full understanding of the physical mechanism doesn't mean one can just will away autism or it's symptoms; it's a brain structural issue, not an attitude problem.

You really think I would have said this if I didn't know it worked, or has value of some sort? You're a person, so it's much harder to understand.

The trigger is much more specific than a phobia, and the resulting feeling, while hard to describe, is not fear. More a mixture of extreme irritation and anxiety.

It is a third stage, one where fear becomes small, and the void is filled with raw data.

[Kryten]

If only it were indeed that simple. Functionalities by person or human is not defined by a scale or normality, but popularity. It may be uncommon for someone to not be able to speak with a voice, that doesn't make them in any way impaired.

In this society, it does. Most communication is verbal, and anyone without verbal communication skills will have great difficulty accessing vital services without help, that's unquestionably an impairment.

[Xannari Ferrows]

In this society, it does. Most communication is verbal, and anyone without verbal communication skills will have great difficulty accessing vital services without help, that's unquestionably an impairment.

Is it an impairment, or are we privileged? It is convenient, but a challenge for others. To make challenge of something we consider easy is a superior trait.

[SargeRho]

Alright, fair enough. That's how you think. My definition is: Any physiological, or psychological impairments not part of the natural development of a being.

By that definition, Cancer is not a disease, as it's part of the natural development of every animal. Verbal communication is part of the natural development of a human being. If it's absent or impaired, that qualifies as a disease.

[Xannari Ferrows]

By that definition, Cancer is not a disease, ...

You are correct. By technicality, not definition, it is a mutation.

[Kryten]

Is it an impairment, or are we privileged?

Privilege is the absence of impairment, so this is meaningless.

Edit:

You are correct. By technicality, not definition, it is a mutation.

Cancer is a disease resulting from uncontrolled cellular replication; mutation is a cause, and only one possible cause.

Edited May 28, 2015 by Kryten

[Xannari Ferrows]

Privilege is the absence of impairment, so this is meaningless.

Does 1/2 = 2/4? 2 is greater than 1, yet when compared and scaled proportionally and dynamically across capabilities of everyone who's alive right now, 1 impairment to no impairments is the same is 2 impairments to a privilege. It has more meaning than you realize, person.

Cancer is a disease resulting from uncontrolled cellular replication; mutation is a cause, and only one possible cause.

Not all mutations entail evolution, or change. Some are destructive, and this is one such case.

[Kryten]

Not all mutations entail evolution, or change. Some are destructive, and this is one such case.

Carcinogenesis can be caused by epigenetic changes, not just genetic ones. But the point was that even a cancer caused by a genetic mutation is not merely 'a mutation'; it's the results on the body of the cellular proliferation, which is the result of the mutation.

[Xannari Ferrows]

Carcinogenesis can be caused by epigenetic changes, not just genetic ones. But the point was that even a cancer caused by a genetic mutation is not merely 'a mutation'; it's the results on the body of the cellular proliferation, which is the result of the mutation.

It is an amplification, yes? Whatever action is the root of why cancer exists is the cause, not the one directly under it.

[Kryten]

No, because the cellular proliferation has to have negative effects on bodily functions to be cancer. Otherwise it's merely a benign tumour.