[Discussion] Real spaceship scaling

[Alchemist]

That the question: are there any standards for mods that recreate real spaceships? Or every modder uses his own?

If there\'s no united scale, let\'s discuss and create it.

1. Size

The most notable parameter. What 1 KSP meter equals to?

Rather popular is ~4m size. There are multiple such size crafts:

* Apollo CSM (3.9 m)

* Zenit, Energiya boosters (3.9 m)

* Shuttle SRB (3.7 m)

* Proton (stage 1 central tank, upper stages) (4.1 m)

* Space station modules (ISS Zvezda maximal diameter 4.35 m)

* Similar is the size of Shuttle payload bay

However only the largest crafts exceed this size:

* Energiya 2nd stage - 7.9 m

* Saturn 5 - 10 m

* N-1 - 17 m (1st stage bottom diameter)

* Shuttle ET - 8.4 m

* Shuttle orbiter - 23.8 m wingspan

On the other hand, there are very many crafts that are less than 3 m in diameter:

* Soyuz & Progress ships - 2.2 m (2.7 m bottom skirt)

* Vostok spacecraft - 2.4 m

* R-7 family rockets - upper stage tank about 2.5 m, stage 2 engine just under 2 m

* Most medium and light rockets

So are we keeping it 3.9 m real to 1 m KSP (and having most crafts notably smaller than 1 m) or selecting something other?

2. Mass

Just united scale needed. Idea to keep real density (then the scale is 3.9^3=60) is not so good. Because 60 ton scale seems relatively normal only for the largest launch vehicles, but the payload capacity to LEO even of the heaviest rockets ever built has never exceeded 150 tons. And for the orbital crafts 5 or 10 ton scale could be the best.

3. Thrust

We should keep the original TWR, because there is the same g value.

4. Burn time

The rocket designed to deliver its payload to low orbit shouldn\'t fly out of the star system. Needs some calibration, but could be around 3.5 times. So the fuel capacity and consumption should be scaled according to this.

Capacity/fuel mass ratio should be different for each fuel type (based on ISP), consumption then scaled according the engine\'s parameters. What numbers can you propose?

5. Other parameters

Are there any specific ideas?

So, feel free to propose your ideas! We just need to come to something united. Or we\'ll end up with Soyuz rocket the same size as N-1, that\'s not so good.

[semininja]

For the most part, things are simpler when people don\'t have to worry about scaling their pack of parts (which is unrelated to every other pack of parts that\'s ever been made) to every other pack of parts on the forum, for no reason at all. There\'s really no need for an absolute scale of rocket sizes when they\'re not ever even placed side-by-side. It\'s just extra hassle for modders, especially considering that if any mixing of rocket-parts between models is done, size compatibility would be utterly destroyed by the kind of scaling you\'re looking for. In short, it\'s more problems for the purpose of less fun.

[CardBoardBoxProcessor]

it is nicer when parts from one mod can be used in other mods.

[Huojin]

it is nicer when parts from one mod can be used in other mods.

This. It\'s always disappointing when you see a part you really want to use in your rocket, only to realise it\'s hugely oversized by comparison with the rest of your rocket...

[semininja]

<can\'t tell if agreeing or not...>

[NovaSilisko]

There\'s too many mods, anyway!