[1.4.1] Kerbal Construction Time 1.4.0.69 (2018-03-24) - Unrapid Planned Assembly

[magico13]

I've run into a situation for which I have a workaround, but thought you may have addressed already. The situation I find myself in with KCT is reusable SPH builds ... planes. If I build a plane and land *safely* I should be able to reuse that same craft again. As it is, I have to wait for a new craft because KCT requires a complete rebuild.

As forsaken pointed out, KCT already has this taken care of. The whole point of the part inventory is reusable spacecraft/planes take virtually no time to "rebuild" since they just need a little bit of repair.

I do plan on taking this one step further and give the option to put the same craft out there with a further reduction in build time when you recover. I have some logistical issues with how editing a vessel works to figure out, otherwise I may disable editing the ship if you do that (since in some cases it recalculates the build time, which wouldn't be right given those parts with the further reduction in time). Note that this would put the EXACT same craft you recover, but with fuel filled up. If you break a part off, you'd have to go into the editor to launch a new one. Same with adding a payload.

Awe, that sounds like a GREAT idea. Now, gimme gimme gimme.

It'll be a while, but I should be able to get it done for the next release. I've got some time this weekend, but I'm also going to be working with SiriusSam on a shared inventory system for Kerbal 4X and KCT (and hopefully more mods in the future).

How does launchpad reconditioning work with multiple KerbTown launchpads?

I think you should make more of the simulation feature - I'd use that on it's own even if the rest wasn't to my taste. It makes a 'no revert' gamestyle feasible.

Launchpad reconditioning won't really work with KerbTown. I'm not sure that KCT's Launch function works with KerbTown either. I do plan on trying to support it in the future, but I can't make any promises on that being any time soon.

I do want to take some time to do a bit more with simulations. In the near future I plan on making it so you can start them at any in-game time. So if you want to test your interplanetary stage on a Duna transfer, you can set the time to when the Duna transfer window is open and do the test directly. Want to test around the time the vessel will actually be finished? You could do that then (in fact, I plan on setting the default when changing the time to when the vessel will finish. Otherwise the default will be "Now").

I'd also like to make it so you can start landed on any body you've landed on. Ideally you'd go into map mode and click on the location and then it'd start you there. That won't be easy and will probably take me quite some time to get working properly, so that might be a whole update by itself.

[Empiro]

Even further reductions for space planes would be great. I hope you're able to still let us make modifications to the ship though -- a common use of space planes for me is to use the same design but swap out the payload.

Like I said, though, I'm loving the mod. I'm playing at 6x part and resource costs, and things take forever to build (I thought of upping the construction rate, but ultimately decided against it). I hope in .25 they add other ways to spend money. The game right now is really balanced on a knife edge -- be good at building things and money is never an issue. If you're not, then you'll always be short.

[magico13]

Even further reductions for space planes would be great. I hope you're able to still let us make modifications to the ship though -- a common use of space planes for me is to use the same design but swap out the payload.

I'm using a 5x overall modifier and the inventory effect raised up to 1600 (so a 40x reduction in build time for a fully reused craft), so that has a similar effect for me. My SSTO, the Sirius C, is a god send. I also just swap out payloads (like a minmus probe or an ion engine to test in orbit. It's also great for the "Rescue a Kerbal" missions). Reusing just the craft itself takes only 2 days to build. A brand new one takes over 80. I end up spending about 30 days just adding a payload. Honestly, reducing the time for the vessel itself while adding a payload makes almost no difference. It might shorten the time by a day at most in this instance. With the defaults I'll have to do some testing. It may just be that when you want to add a payload you have to send it back to the SPH and "build" it but if you want to send it out as-is you can do so very quickly (literally no repairs will be done. For instance, parachutes may not be repacked). I'm not sure how easy that will actually be to do, but I'm going to try.

BTW, if you decide you want to balance out the cost increase to get "default" build times, it's probably best to set the overall multiplier to 0.41 since the 6x cost means your build times are 2.45 times longer than "normal".

[Noio]

Thanks very much for all your hard work, and a great mod.

Unfortunately, I've found a bug:

When launching from the tracking station, my vessels get slapped around by the kraken the moment the physics engine starts.

Here's what it looks like:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B-8cKOlqLStFSzdNUXdwUXlwZkE/edit?usp=sharing

[magico13]

Thank you for that report. It looks like it will be easy enough to reproduce on my end, so I should be able to fix it (hopefully). For now, I'd highly suggest that people don't launch from the Tracking Station. The Space Center is definitely safe, flight should be ok too.

[westamastaflash]

I just wanted to say, I love this mod. I'm having a great time working to reduce the size of my rockets, since it's not just $ I lose, but precious days of launchpad recovery, especially when my 6-kerbal station around minmus needs a life support resupply ASAP!

[magico13]

When launching from the tracking station, my vessels get slapped around by the kraken the moment the physics engine starts.

So I've seen other people report this and have now seen it on video from two different people, but I can't for the life of me get it to happen. I don't know if it's totally random, or requires some other mod. I tried adding Kerbal Joint Reinforcement since it appears to happen on physics load, but it still won't happen. I may not be able to fix it for next version :/

[Noio]

I'll do some experimentation to see if I can find the culprit. Since the test case is so easy to reproduce it shouldn't take long.

Stand by...

[Noio]

Well, bad news:

I'm able to do it with exactly two mods installed:

KCT

Blizzy's Toolbar (without which I can't get to the KCT dialog from the tracking station to trigger the launch)

It's exactly the behavior I demonstrated in the earlier video, unfortunately.

Please do let me know if there are any specific tests you'd like me to run, since it seems to be so easy for me to reproduce this.

Here's the relevant bit from the output log, although it doesn't tell us much we couldn't have already guessed:

[FLIGHT GLOBALS]: Switching To Vessel Kraken Bait ----------------------

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

setting new dominant body: Kerbin

FlightGlobals.mainBody: Kerbin

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Reference Frame: Rotating

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

stage manager resuming...

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Vessel assembly complete!

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

stage manager starting...

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

all systems started

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

[VesselSpawner]: No new objects this time. (Odds are 1:2)

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

[Progress Node Reached]: AltitudeRecord

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

[PlanetariumCamera]: Focus: Kraken Bait

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Flight State Captured

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Saving Achievements Tree...

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Game State Saved as persistent

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

[Kraken Bait]: ground contact! - error: -5.873m

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

Unpacking Kraken Bait

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

solidBooster collided into Launch Pad Grate - relative velocity: 12.78931 - no impact momentum (no RB)

(Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d63dfc6385190b60/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 49)

solidBooster Exploded!! - blast awesomeness: 0.5

[Noio]

More test results:

If I:

- enter the tracking station,

- press 'warp to complete',

- press 'vab storage',

- press 'launch'...

...the ship is destroyed.

If I instead:

- enter the tracking station,

- press 'warp to complete',

- LEAVE the tracking station (back to the space center),

- REENTER the tracking station,

- press 'vab storage',

- press 'launch'....

...the ship is fine.

It looks like something's changing in the game state during those scene transitions which scares the demons away.

[magico13]

Alright, thank you! I'll do some more testing and see what I can find out. You theoretically can make the KCT window be open in the TS without Blizzy if you open it in the space center first, so I should be able to narrow it down more. I wasn't warping in the TS so that was probably why I didn't get the bug.

Edit: I seem to be able to avoid the issue by making it load the Space Center very quickly before launching the vessel. Hopefully that's a good enough fix for the time being, but it unfortunately causes the loading times to be longer.

Edited September 13, 2014 by magico13

[TranceaddicT]

magico,

I just realize that it would be nice to be able to access the list of build and storage items from inside VAB/SPH. It gets kind of cumbersome having to switch scenes just to verify what craft you have in the queues.

[Athlonic]

Hi,

I just started a new career with this mod, and I just wanted to say :

- a big thank you !!!

This mod just makes time and funds matters, and this means a lot.

Keep up the good work

[magico13]

magico,

I just realize that it would be nice to be able to access the list of build and storage items from inside VAB/SPH. It gets kind of cumbersome having to switch scenes just to verify what craft you have in the queues.

Already got it implemented into the next version. You can't launch or do anything in the little side window (through the * button) but you can rearrange and view vessel names/times.

Speaking of things I'm working on, can you all figure out the significance of this?

[Bothersome]

Just a quick look, it looks as though you've made it so we can simulate launches from other planets/moons.

[MisterFister]

magico,

I just realize that it would be nice to be able to access the list of build and storage items from inside VAB/SPH. It gets kind of cumbersome having to switch scenes just to verify what craft you have in the queues.

Already got it implemented into the next version. You can't launch or do anything in the little side window (through the * button) but you can rearrange and view vessel names/times.

This is awesome, as I'd intended to ask.

Also, I like playing with Final Frontier http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/67246-0-23-5-Final-Frontier-kerbal-individual-merits-0-3-15. For those unfamiliar, it's a per-kerbal achievement tracker, most notably tracking "firsts" (first launch, first orbit, first SOI change, first landing on X / Y / Z, etc.) I noticed today in a relatively new save that the ribbon window (where it tracks the achievements for my kerbonauts) keeps getting reset. I have more troubleshooting to do, as I do have a metric butt-ton of mods active, but the Simulate option from KCT seems like it might be a culprit. Is there any known interactivity issue between these two mods?

Related: For StageRecovery, is there any desire to allow the SR module in the VAB to be able to give recovery readouts on a per-stage basis? As it is, I need to use subassemblies and probe cores, else I need to weight different stages' ratings on the fly.

[magico13]

I also play with final frontier and have noticed that the mission counter isn't increasing (for rescued kerbals at least) but haven't had my ribbons reset before. Could be related since KCT uses a super-hack to revert from simulations (it copies the backed up save file over the persistence right before the game reads the persistence file). It's likely safer to use the revert buttons (stock or KCT) than exiting to Space Center since then FF will know to revert.

As for SR and per-stage info. I'd love to do that, but it's not super easy to determine what exactly is a stage. I may be able to figure out the total mass and parachute info for each stage in the staging info, but no promises. StageRecovery is currently on the back burner as I work on the shared inventory back end with SiriusSam and the next KCT update. I might have a beta up in the next few days, if I can get the back end how I need it for KCT.

RealChute really helps with that, BTW. As long as you know the dry mass and set the parachutes to work with that then you're golden. With Stock it's harder.

[Jacke]

I've discovered a bug that affects the VOID stock toolbar icon in the VAB when also using Kerbal Construction Time (KCT). Posting to both mods' threads.

After first entering KCT launch simulation, exiting back to the VAB reveals an extra VOID icon in the stock toolbar. Only the leftmost one works, the others doesn't. After going to simulation at least once, every time the VAB is exited and then re-entered, whether to the Space Centre or to another simulation, there will be another extra dummy VOID icon in the stock tool bar. I've had as many as eight or nine.

If I exit KSP, remove the KCT mod, and restart KSP, the bug is gone. Exit KSP, reinstall KCT, and restart KSP and the bug will appear again.

Output_log.txt here.

[TDW]

Absolutely loving this mod. Just started a new career mode and it is maddeningly frustrating (in a good way), forcing me to do things like start building a rocket before i have finished researching the tech for all the parts then add them in half way through the build.

May I be so bold as to make a feature request?

This is probably most useful for space planes / reusable rockets but there may be other uses:

A recover to storage button so where the vessel is recovered but no funds are received / player charged an amount by distance and the vessel moved to the relevant storage. The player would still need to edit the craft in the vab/sph to refuel etc.

I know the build times get faster as i use parts more often and if i already have the parts. But doing it this way seems more like i am re-using the same vessel as opposed to stripping it down for parts every time (and accidentally using those parts in another vessel).

Another useful feature would be the ability to build something as a sub-assembly so that you can start building the payload for your space planes next mission before it returns giving you a faster turn around (only needing to refuel, replace damaged parts and fit the new payload)

Its quite alright if the answer is no:P on reflection those could be very hard to implement and i don't know if it is possible to retain damage states in the hanger.

[magico13]

I've discovered a bug that affects the VOID stock toolbar icon in the VAB when also using Kerbal Construction Time (KCT). Posting to both mods' threads.

Thank you for including the log file! I have seen this before and have meant to bring it up in the VOID thread since I'm not entirely sure what exactly KCT is doing that causes VOID to do that. I think the fix is likely within VOID and should be simple: just check if there is already a toolbar icon for VOID before adding a new one. Unfortunately I can't do that on my end but it should be simple for the VOID developer to fix. Until then, using Blizzy's toolbar and telling VOID to use that (in the settings) should hopefully get around that issue.

A recover to storage button so where the vessel is recovered but no funds are received / player charged an amount by distance and the vessel moved to the relevant storage. The player would still need to edit the craft in the vab/sph to refuel etc.

Another useful feature would be the ability to build something as a sub-assembly so that you can start building the payload for your space planes next mission before it returns giving you a faster turn around (only needing to refuel, replace damaged parts and fit the new payload)

For the first suggestion: I am planning on adding something like that in a future update since I've had so many people request it. You'll be able to recover and refuel, but likely won't be able to add any parts to the vessel (so no new payloads). I haven't finalized anything on it though, so I may be able to come up with something that allows you to add parts as well. I had originally planned on making the EXACT vessel (plus fuel) be put out immediately, but I might be able to force you into the SPH/VAB to make any changes and forbid editing afterward.

Speaking of funds, with the next update there will be a radical change to how funds work (as a result of integration into the Scrapyard API/developing a common base with Kerbal 4X). You no longer will receive funds for recovering vessels but only pay once for a part. Once it's in the inventory you never have to pay for it again. You'll also be able to sell parts. Oh, this also includes Fuel and other resources. So basically we (SiriusSam and I) are rewriting how Stock does recovery.

As for the second suggestion: Just prebuild your subassemblies, then Scrap them or edit them to add the payload/launcher. I do this all the time. Just build your payload (you can load subassemblies in the editor), scrap it so the parts are in the inventory, and then add that subassembly to whatever rocket/plane you want. Especially now that editing supports using inventory parts (until the 1.0 release you had to use exclusively brand new parts). People always ask for this because they don't realize that the inventory system was designed around doing this

Just remember that it's always more efficient to build everything at once (because of the square root in the BP calculation), so you shouldn't build the plane and the payload separately (exception: if you have two build rates and aren't using them for anything else, then building them separately is actually faster). If your plane is out doing other missions though, building the payload is worth it if it's gonna be a while before it's back (or if you need to use the plane for something else while the payload builds, like a "Rescue a Kerbal" contract or another payload that's finished).

[Jacke]

And toadicus already has a fix out.

Give this development DLL a try and see if it solves the problem. I think the editor was not always disposing of the button when necessary.

Thanks for the report!

That development VOID.dll version 0.14.1.36692 fixed the bug; no more duplicate VOID stock toolbar icons. Thanks for the quick response, toadicus!

[joebopie]

Id like to start saying thanks for creating this incredible mod. but Ive been having a problem with the game locking up when I simulate a craft. the game doesn't stop running it just seems that it ignores the input from my mouse(partly) it puts the craft on the pad everything still works but I cant click on anything or move the view, nothing except the debug menu works if I bring that up. I can use the toolbar button to revert to the editor but that's where im stuck I cant do anything and I have to shut the game down. it did this once or twice with only some parts packs installed but now its doing it worse. im now using Tack life support remote tech and a few others . sorry if this has already been mentioned but ive looked for an hour or so and found nothing. il try to reproduce it and post a video if you need more info I really want to keep using this mod but atm its unplayable for me.

Thanks Joseph

I found the bug in one of my live streams so I highlighted it. Warning! I do swear a few times and its got my ugly face in it also I just found somebody else saying the same thing and you mentioned input locks Il check to see if that's the case if it happens again as ive been trying to reproduce it without luck. what do you mean by look at the OP for the log whats OP?

http://www.twitch.tv/joebopie/c/5153094

Edited September 20, 2014 by joebopie
aditional information

[magico13]

OP stands for Original Post (or Original Poster, if talking about the poster). If you've got an output_log.txt file from after that happening (note that the log gets overwritten every time you start KSP) I can take a look and see if there's a lock active or something. Alternatively if you open up the debug menu there's a button that says "Show Input Locks" (or similar). There shouldn't be any active, but that does look like there is.

Are you playing with reverting disabled? When you pressed "Escape" the options for reverting weren't presented, which would be weird if you didn't have those disabled.

Edited September 20, 2014 by magico13

[joebopie]

figured it out the culprit - recorded a quick video of me inducing the glitch.

http://youtu.be/x9c5AFSu_CU

or

[magico13]

figured it out the culprit - recorded a quick video of me inducing the glitch.

Awesome! Others had reported similar issues in the past now that I think of it, and I was always suspicious that mechjeb was possibly at fault since everyone who reported it was using mechjeb. Until now no one had figured it out. I'll report this on the mechjeb thread if you haven't already, since it's up to the mechjeb developers to fix, but it should be a quick fix.