Brethern Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I am a bit disappointed you guys condone physical violence, anyone that chooses to continue or end a conversation that way loses instantly. Though I must admit the guy was annoying as anything and the impulse is very human. Guess astronauts are not super human either I never saw a conversation, I saw a man harassing an 80 year old man and got exactly what he deserved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PakledHostage Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I never saw a conversation, I saw a man harassing an 80 year old man and got exactly what he deserved.I have to agree. Think of it as slapstick comedy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I never saw a conversationThe guy was not getting physical, so a physical response should be out of the question. If you respond to words with violence, you are the instant loser. It means you exhausted every verbal or alternative response and had nothing left but plain violence. You should not give such an annoying hoaxer the satisfaction of such a response, because you are only validating his actions.I am not commenting on whether he got what he deserved. Like I said, the impulse is very understandable, but people are expected to act beyond their basic impulses. Astronauts probably even more so than the general public.I have to agree. Think of it as slapstick comedy.Although somewhat satisfying to see, it is still assault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 If you can't get out of the way of an 80 year old fist, you should be in a gym, not harassing an astronaut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brethern Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 The guy was not getting physical, so a physical response should be out of the question. If you respond to words with violence, you are the instant loser. It means you exhausted every verbal or alternative response and had nothing left but plain violence. You should not give such an annoying hoaxer the satisfaction of such a response, because you are only validating his actions.I am not commenting on whether he got what he deserved. Like I said, the impulse is very understandable, but people are expected to act beyond their basic impulses. Astronauts probably even more so than the general public.Although somewhat satisfying to see, it is still assault.In case you're forgetting the judge ruled that Buzz Aldrin acted in self defense. Also it's hard to say you won a fight when your jaw is broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) In case you're forgetting the judge ruled that Buzz Aldrin acted in self defense.No, they never filed charges. That is very different, and not surprising, considering who we are dealing with and the circumstances. That does not mean it does not constitute assault. It just means the police felt no urge to pursue Aldrin.Self defence claims are obviously flawed. Self defence means you had to actually defend yourself from something. Sibrel was annoying, but not a threat. Also it's hard to say you won a fight when your jaw is broken.Sibrel received no real injury, but that is a fallacy in any case. Hurting your opponent does not make you a winner, and hurting someone that did not physically threaten you makes you a loser. It shows you belong on the lowest rung of society, between the other apes that cannot express themselves through words.It really disappoints me I have to argue about this. I mean, Aldrin seems like a great fellow, has achieved things that most can only dream about and, indeed, got harassed by some annoying guy that is pretty much the opposite. But we should all recognize this is not the proper response. I am sure you know it; it is just that this is an astronaut and a hero to many, which makes it a bit hard to admit. But astronauts are people too, so that is okay. I would even argue that is what makes them great - despite having their shortcomings too, they managed to shine like no others. Edited March 18, 2015 by Camacha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r4pt0r Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 Hurting your opponent does not make you a winner, and hurting someone that did not physically threaten you makes you a loser. It shows you belong on the lowest rung of society, between the other apes that cannot express themselves through words.I disagree. People need to learn that being a belligerent, deliberately antagonistic jerk will get the crap kicked out of you. There was no room for diplomacy with that guy, you cant negotiate with morons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) I disagree. People need to learn that being a belligerent, deliberately antagonistic jerk will get the crap kicked out of you. There was no room for diplomacy with that guy, you cant negotiate with morons.LET ME PUNCH YOU IN THE MOUTH FOR THAT OPINION!!!See why that does not work out too well? Keep your hands to yourself. Negotiation is optional, yet there are more ways of dealing with people like this. A single, spot-on snarky remark lets you exit a clear winner. Just ignoring the fellow would do nicely too. Shouting back at him - not the best response, but viable. But losing your temper is losing the whole thing. Edited March 18, 2015 by Camacha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brethern Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 No, they never filed charges. That is very different, and not surprising, considering who we are dealing with and the circumstances. That does not mean it does not constitute assault. It just means the police felt no urge to pursue Aldrin.Self defence claims are obviously flawed. Self defence means you had to actually defend yourself from something. Sibrel was annoying, but not a threat. Sibrel received no real injury, but that is a fallacy in any case. Hurting your opponent does not make you a winner, and hurting someone that did not physically threaten you makes you a loser. It shows you belong on the lowest rung of society, between the other apes that cannot express themselves through words.It really disappoints me I have to argue about this. I mean, Aldrin seems like a great fellow, has achieved things that most can only dream about and, indeed, got harassed by some annoying guy that is pretty much the opposite. But we should all recognize this is not the proper response. I am sure you know it; it is just that this is an astronaut and a hero to many, which makes it a bit hard to admit. But astronauts are people too, so that is okay. I would even argue that is what makes them great - despite having their shortcomings too, they managed to shine like no others.Uh no, the guy who got punched tried to file charges, The DA decided not to. Since they ruled it was self defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r4pt0r Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) "I don't even call it violence when it's in self defense; I call it intelligence."  Malcolm XAnd yes, despite the nigh thousands of quotes you could throw back, I posted one anyway. In cases like this I feel might makes right. plus by calling him a coward, he was trying to tarnish his name. And as John Proctor knows names are important Edited March 18, 2015 by r4pt0r Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Uh no, the guy who got punched tried to file charges, The DA decided not to. Since they ruled it was self defense.That is exactly what I said. That is not a judge at all. Let us not pretend that a non-astronaut would have gotten off that easily.Again, claiming self defence is silly, considering there was nothing to defend against. Being annoying does not constitute being a threat. It is an easy way of putting the issue to rest though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brethern Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 LET ME PUNCH YOU IN THE MOUTH FOR THAT OPINION!!!See why that does not work out too well? Keep your hands to yourself. Negotiation is optional, yet there are more ways of dealing with people like this. A single, spot-on snarky remark lets you exit a clear winner. Just ignoring the fellow would do nicely too. Shouting back at him - not the best response, but viable. But losing your temper is losing the whole thing.Sure kiddo, keep thinking that while the rest of us live in the real world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) "I don't even call it violence when it's in self defense; I call it intelligence."  Malcolm X"People are like bananas. When you eat them, they die." Camacha VISure kiddo, keep thinking that while the rest of us live in the real world.As everyone seems to have run out of real counterarguments, it appears you all agree with me. I am glad we worked that one out. Edited March 18, 2015 by Camacha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brethern Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 "People are like bananas. When you eat them, they die." Camacha VIAs everyone seems to have run out of real counterarguments, it appears you all agree with me. I am glad we worked that one out.The internet had a code you know, rules of etiquette those rules state that when a person has to type a sentence in all caps believing it to be a valid argument the discussion is over, they're a n00b and are to be treated as such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 plus by calling him a coward, he was trying to tarnish his name. And as John Proctor knows names are importantIf your name is so easily tarnished that some random troll guy calling you a coward will do, I regret to inform you your name was not worth much to begin with Also, hitting people for mere words might tarnish your name just a tad more, though opinions on that obviously differ.The internet had a code you know, rules of etiquette those rules state that when a person has to type a sentence in all caps believing it to be a valid argument the discussion is over, they're a n00b and are to be treated as such.If that is what it takes for you to be the moral victor of this conversation, go for it. I will even state it for you: I am a n00b and am to be treated as such. Brethern is completely right and I am totally wrong, as using caps in a discussion is against internet code and I thereby forfeited my right to the discussion.See? Much easier than picking a fight over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RainDreamer Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 While I agree that punching people is wrong, I can sympathize with the old man for punching someone who basically discredit all the things he did and insult him in his face. Doing that to people in a bar would also result in the same thing.That said, can we get back to the idea of getting to mars? I doubt buzz will be on a trip to mars anytime soon. Wonder if he wants his remains (likely cremated to save mass) after he die to get shot on a one way trip to mars orbit though. Would be a hell of a way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 While I agree that punching people is wrong, I can sympathize with the old man for punching someone who basically discredit all the things he did and insult him in his face. Doing that to people in a bar would also result in the same thing.Let me be very clear on that - I think the guy was highly annoying and had it coming. Do I condone of dealing with it that way? No, obviously not at all, but those are two different things.That said, can we get back to the idea of getting to mars? I doubt buzz will be on a trip to mars anytime soon. Wonder if he wants his remains (likely cremated to save mass) after he die to get shot on a one way trip to mars orbit though. Would be a hell of a way to go.I think the main problem with Mars is that there is no political reason to be interested in it. With current funding you can do nice research and build rovers, but to really launch such a major flagship mission, you will probably need some additional political motivation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kibble Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Buzz Aldrin is my hero <3<3He figured out orbital rendezvous, invented the neutral buoyancy lab, proved manual labour in micro-gee environments was possible, invented the free-return trajectory, and walked on the woofing Moon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r4pt0r Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 ^That was really nice of Buzz to show up for the moons school picture day like that^ :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vger Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I think the main problem with Mars is that there is no political reason to be interested in it. With current funding you can do nice research and build rovers, but to really launch such a major flagship mission, you will probably need some additional political motivation.The political motivation is making the world realize that humanity can still, in fact, move forward.The feeling of stagnation that civilization is currently in is almost claustrophobic, and it can't be having a good impact on the mental state of our "collective unconscious." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 The political motivation is making the world realize that humanity can still, in fact, move forward.I am afraid that is all a bit unspecific. You need a good common cause - or threat - to make those huge investments politically viable. Otherwise you will get those many years of not really doing much and spending money on other things we see now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I'm pretty sure the nut who "got punched" didn't have a leg to stand on, really. I mean it's pretty obvious that the video posted was fake. One of those shadows looks wrong. It was an obvious hoax to discredit the Apollo hoaxer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vger Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 You need a good common cause - or threat - to make those huge investments politically viable.What is China's investment in developing a manned moon program?As far as the U.S. is concerned, if you're looking for a "common cause," you can't even get half of the country to agree on whether or not being nuked by Iran is bad or good (judging by how the representatives have been behaving lately).NASA might as well just go for Mars if they can afford it. The sun will burn out before America unanimously agrees on anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacha Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) What is China's investment in developing a manned moon program?The short answer is: the Asian space race. A common enemy makes for a united country.NASA might as well just go for Mars if they can afford it.That is the whole issue. Without funding, the process will be long and painful or not possible at all. Edited March 18, 2015 by Camacha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vger Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 A common enemy makes for a united country.Impossible in America.If Martians invaded tomorrow - even if the technology was eons beyond anything humans could develop, here's what the opinions would be.Red: It's the end of the world. We must fight, Fight, FIGHT!!!Blue: The Martian invasion is clearly government propaganda, surgically-planned to rally us behind a meaningless war against a technologically inferior race, to acquire Martian (insert valuable resource here) reserves.And those two opinions, if surveyed, would end up being somewhere around 51-49% of the population. It never fails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts