Is there an updated map for the new Delta V's?

[LadyAthena]

I'm pretty sure with the new Aerodynamics and tweaks to the engines the Delta V's are now different, at least for atmospheric planets right?

[Kosmo-not]

It's going to vary based on rocket design. Tall thin rockets are now better than short stubby ones. Also, a heavier rocket will lose less speed to the atmosphere than a lighter one in the event that both rockets are at the same speed and altitude with the same cross sectional area with respect to the relative airflow.

But who knows. Maybe we can determine a reasonable range of values for different setups. My first rocket launch in 1.0 used up 3438 m/s. It was a simple rocket SSTO.

[LadyAthena]

It's going to vary based on rocket design. Tall thin rockets are now better than short stubby ones. Also, a heavier rocket will lose less speed to the atmosphere than a lighter one in the event that both rockets are at the same speed and altitude with the same cross sectional area with respect to the relative airflow.

But who knows. Maybe we can determine a reasonable range of values for different setups. My first rocket launch in 1.0 used up 3438 m/s. It was a simple rocket SSTO.

The current setup is no different than FAR in all honesty. I've been using FAR for a long time, but going off of the stock delta V's still worked.

[garwel]

I'm getting my rockets into orbit (well, when I manage not to tip over) with about 2500 delta V, according to Engingeer Redux.

[Streetwind]

One thing you have to keep in mind is that "only" the atmosphere model changed. This means that on a typical dV map for the Kerbin system, there are only three four numbers that need updating. These numbers are:

1.) Ascent from Kerbin surface to low Kerbin orbit

2.) Ascent from Eve surface to low Eve orbit

3.) Ascent from Laythe surface to low Laythe orbit

4.) Ascent from Duna surface to low Duna orbit

All other numbers stay exactly the same. There's nothing that changed about dV costs in empty space.

As a rule of the thumb, reasonably well executed launches from Kerbin now appear to require around 3,400 dV, or in other words, about 25% less than the old value of 4,500 m/s. Not sure if that holds over exactly for the other atmospheres, but it probably holds up well enough that you can get a ballpark estimate figure. For instance, an Eve ascent used to require (from sea level) 11,500 to 12,000 m/s dV. Now, you can expect it to be more in the realm of 8,700 to 9,000 m/s.

Edited April 28, 2015 by Streetwind
Derp!

[KerikBalm]

I think Eve will be dramatically less, whereas Duna will be basically the same.

There are 3 things you need to consider:

* Absolute dV requirement: This would be for a ship with a drag coefficient of zero, and an infinite TWR->

Tylo orbit is 2,200 m/s - you have to spend at least that much to get to orbit.

Laythe orbit is 1850m/s - you have to spend at least that much to get to orbit.

Duna orbit is what... 950 m/s? - you have to spend at least that much to get to orbit. (also, you have to add a bit extra to get to a certain height above the planet/moon)

* Gravity drag - Because you don't have an infinite TWR, and even if you did, you don't want to exceed terminal velocity on airless worlds, and your timng is not perfect (and using an infinite TWR drive would be as bad as lithobraking on tylo)

* Aerodynamic drag - this is the main thing that changes in this update, but this should also affect gravity drag on worlds with atmosphere.

The aerodynamic drag on Duna was always a small portion of the dV costs. If you have a 50% reduction in something that accounts for 20% of the dV cost, its only a 10% reduction to the total dV.

For Kerbin, we were spending 4,500 dV to get to a 2,300 m/s orbit (ignoring increased altitude, coupling it with terminal elocity/gravity drag ascents, ignoring equatorial velocity)... we spent about 2 km/sec fighting aerodynamic drag and associate gravity drag... Now... its about half that.

Duna ascents took... what? 1,300 m/s... call it 350 m/s due to drag. Lets assume that is reduced to 175... It may now take 1,125 instead of 1,300... a 15% change... meanwhile Going from 4,500 to 3,400 is a 32% change.

The cost of a duna ascent from high altitude will see even less of a change, because the atmosphere was even less relevant....

Eve on the other hand... Eve we were spending 12,000 m/s to achieve an orbit of less than 3,500 m/s... 8.5 km/sec lost to gravity drag and aerodynamic drag.

In terms of raw dV, it should be much easier... but the atmospheric thrust nerfs to engines, and Isp continuing to decrease as pressure goes above 1 atm should make it quite the challenge.

I think Aerospikes will be in order (they were previous contenders, but the 48-7s was still better, as was one of the ARM pack engines IIRC... because aerospike TWR was too low)

[Kelderek]

It just cost me between 1200-1300 DV to go from the surface to a mostly circular orbit of about 60km at Duna - I should have made a more precise notation of the DV I used. Duna's atmosphere stops at 50km now.

[funk]

For now my best result is 3050m/s to 71,8km LKO - measured by mechjeb -. The ascending curve depends on TWR of the stages (especially first stage) and leads to different dv amounts needed, same as FAR. I think with a little tweaking, it's possible to use less than 3000m/s.

This was the used craft:

The initial TWR was 1.72 (with unused Monopropellant onboard). In FAR I´m used to start with 1.57 TWR.

[FlyingPete]

One thing you have to keep in mind is that "only" the atmosphere model changed. This means that on a typical dV map for the Kerbin system, there are only three four numbers that need updating. These numbers are:

1.) Ascent from Kerbin surface to low Kerbin orbit

2.) Ascent from Eve surface to low Eve orbit

3.) Ascent from Laythe surface to low Laythe orbit

4.) Ascent from Duna surface to low Duna orbit

5.) Ascent from Jool surface to low Jool orbit.... just in case someone decides to give that a go

[LadyAthena]

Thanks for the answer guys. I know non atmosphere stuff hasn't changed. I just wanted to get an idea of the Dv's for atmosphere planets.