MK16 Chute overheating in 1.0.2

[Kaiz0r]

I don't have drogue chutes unlocked yet.

Again thank you all for the advice (specially you, Renegrade). If you had a 1.0 craft that has a parachute activated, change the opening pressure, the chute will survive that. The cheaty Alt-F4, restart the game, load last autosave brought back Jeb on the surface of the mun. I also did some tests in a sandbox game (Using Inf fuel and no heat) I checked, the altitude were the chute broke was indead the altitude the chute should have opened. By opening the chute very late I also noticed that the drag on re-entry means you slow down a lot better than before. Also the Ablator of the heatshield now drains a bit better (I think), I tried a 4000m/s re-entry in 1.0 and the ablator only dropped about 20%, now the moon re-entry almost took half.

Sorry for last nights negativity, I did the checks, tested some stuff in sandbox, Duna mission is still OK, Jeb is still alive (by cheating a little). It just takes a little more getting used to, and yes, I think this is a bit better balanced now. I just kept playing it to much like I used to, after seeing my old-style rocket builds launch without problems (Except I use quit a bit of dV to get up there). Quicksave is once more my best friend, until I fully understand the new system.

[joespeed52]

That's why I'm not directly updating. 😉

[codefox]

But shouldn't it be a bit of common sense that opening a parachute while your spaceship is on fire is no good thing? I've kept wondering about this for a bit. :S

Actually, the parachutes were way too overpowered in 1.0 - I could just instantly brake during reentry when I opened my chutes. That was just stupid, I didn't even need heat shields when I had chutes.

[SelectHalfling0]

Mine works fine if I don't deploy them until I'm going 220 m/s.

[DepletedUraniumPenetrator]

You actually can deploy them way earlier, at like ~900m/s on ~10.000m height.

[Habalabam]

Question: Exactly HOW is a chute deployed at high velocity in upper (thin) atmosphere supposed to act? It seems weird to me that you have reentry heat before significant drag effect from the parachute. If you deploy it LKO, shouldn't the parachute start to work the moment you start grazing into the atmosphere? Granted that it should be destroyed, but shouldn't it tear up because of the unrealistic deceleration rather than burning up?

[boborene]

The problem is now is burning before start deploying. And that is complete wrong.

[Temeter]

The problem is now is burning before start deploying. And that is complete wrong.

That's a bug. But one which doesn't really change anything since your chute would burn up anyway on actual deployment.

[Torquemadus]

I'm staging my parachute at the same time I separate the capsule from my final stage to expose the heatshield. The parachute is set to deploy at 0.5 atmospheric pressure. This gives the craft enough time to slow down after entry heating has ended.

I've been using the heating overlay to monitor part temperatures. The heatshield is the only part that shows noticeable heating.

[78stonewobble]

Ok, not quite the same thing, but maybe a hint that parachutes need a little further "balancing". I just landed a large pod, with the heatshield, a mechjeb pod and the large parachute. It touched down at around 10 m/s and trashed the heatshield. Seems a little bit too high for a parachute that seems designed for that capsule.

[Temeter]

Ok, not quite the same thing, but maybe a hint that parachutes need a little further "balancing". I just landed a large pod, with the heatshield, a mechjeb pod and the large parachute. It touched down at around 10 m/s and trashed the heatshield. Seems a little bit too high for a parachute that seems designed for that capsule.

Heat shields are heavy, I think the 2.5m one weighs 1.8 tons with full ablator.

[micr0wave]

Before 1.0 i played with DRE/NEAR/Real Chutes and i have almost no problem at all.

I just let the pod slow down to mach 1 before i activate the parachutes, might be pretty low altitude by then (below 10km), but at lower altitude atmosphere gets a lot thicker and slows you down even more.

[Taki117]

If you're chutes are deploying too early increase the air pressure deployment (I usually increase it to full) so that, even if they are staged, they won't deploy until about 3km.

[78stonewobble]

Heat shields are heavy, I think the 2.5m one weighs 1.8 tons with full ablator.

True and I probably could have built in another stage or added more parachutes, but it seems a bit excessive to have to do that, not for bringing back alot of extra stuff, but the bare necessity to get back.

I think less than 10 burned off the ablator.

[MacroNova]

Last night I was deploying at relatively high pressure (~.4 - .6) but if I left it at 500m I barely slowed down in time to splash down safely. If I was over land, the chutes didn't reach full deployment and I came in too fast. I had to change them to 1000m.

[Captain H@dock]

Anyone else finding the default deployment height of 500m actually results in slamming into the ground now?

I have bugs with the deployment height today. In my case i was returning from orbit and from the mun. It wasn't left at default height (sometime 50, sometime 2800), but was never completely deploying.

Only now (from reading here) do I realise there was an update last night, which might account for the very different behaviour i'm seeing on my career craft. But the chutes seem to have a problem... (radial also failed to deployed completly. I'm off to reproduce now)

EDIT: From reading the rest of this thread, this might not be a bug, but a feature (chutes now slowing you down a lot more progressively?) Very un-expected... But then I had never used heat shields so far, so the chute sure needed some nerfing!

Still i feel for the poor new player that is one week through his career, and suddenlty doesn't understand what is going on....

Edited May 2, 2015 by Captain H@dock

[Claw]

Yes, deployed chutes are now subject to heating and can burn up rather quickly. But the blunt capsules (and other parts) should also be a bit better at slowing down. So you should be able to wait longer now before deploying chutes.

Although I would agree. If chutes are burning up while staged (but still stowed), that's a problem. It's hard for me to tell from this thread if that's actually the case...?

Cheers,

-Claw

[Dorlarin]

Yes, deployed chutes are now subject to heating and can burn up rather quickly. But the blunt capsules (and other parts) should also be a bit better at slowing down. So you should be able to wait longer now before deploying chutes.

Although I would agree. If chutes are burning up while staged (but still stowed), that's a problem. It's hard for me to tell from this thread if that's actually the case...?

Cheers,

-Claw

I can verify that a Mk16 on the small capsule and heatshield burn up while it is still stowed

[Captain H@dock]

I've done a bit of testing, and i'm unable to reproduce what I've experienced on my career craft. A simple pod with a mk16, two solar panels, a goo and a heatshield should work with the mk16 default settings (and have slow down enough by 140 above sea level).

Full report in the support section post: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/118682-Mk16-Parachute-Slow-To-Fully-Deploy

[Zeratul_r]

But then I had never used heat shields so far, so the chute sure needed some nerfing!

Still i feel for the poor new player that is one week through his career, and suddenlty doesn't understand what is going on....

That is exactly what happened to me. Yesterday I was able to bring 2 pods from the orbit safely by pressing space and deploying parachutes at 35 km and 2300 m/s speed and today all it gave me was a message "parachute was destroyed by heat and something"... I reloaded a save made after launch. I thought that both passengers were doomed because the only option was to aerobrake until the speed was around 500 m/s and the fiery effects died down. The only problem was that my vessel didn't have a heat shield. I gave it a go anyway and after the couple of tries it worked! I lost some small parts like batteries and solar panel mounted on the sides but the engine (which was turned prograde and, if I understand it correctly took the largest amount of heat) didn't even start to overheat (the red icon didn't appear). It's possible that it wouldn't work on return trip from the Mun due to higher speed so I think that in future I will make all crafts with shields just to be safe.

[Captain H@dock]

I've seen someone say he returned from the edge of Kerbin SOI without a heat shield. As long as it's just a return pod (decouple all engines and tanks), you should be fine. The heat has reduced a lot with the latest updated (more accurately, I'd say the drag has increased, which means you're spending a lot less time at hypersonic speeds, which was where the heating was really dangerous).

So give it a try. Though at this rate I wouldn't be suprised is there's a 1.0.3 to rebalance a bit the heat. I spent the entire week being scared of re-entry, and now I seem to be be able to apply the old 0.90 strategy (just wait for the low atmo to slow you down, then open the chute). Of course that wouldn't work with the entire rocket stage still attached to your pod.