Solar panels are blocked by decoupler

[leilders]

While on my way to duna i ran out of energy

My solar panels are blocked by an inline decoupler?

Clearly they have some exposure.

Stock KSP

build id = 00842

2015.05.01 at 21:02:12 CEST

Branch: master

[Alshain]

The common logic would have you believe if 1/3 of the panel is covered it should provide 2/3 power, right? That is simply not the case because of the way solar technology works.

In the real world solar panels have contiguous receptors, if even a portion of the solar panel is in a shadow, it drastically reduces their output. The closer the shadow is to the connection point, the worse it gets. If it covers the connection point it should be 0.

I can't tell which panel you are clicking on, but that one that is top center and the one to the left of it should both have an output of 0 if the game models how the real thing works.

EDIT: On second thought, I suppose those look like several panels in an array, in which case only the panel that has shadow would be rendered ineffective IF (and only if) it were wired in parallel. If it is wired in series it would have the same effect of 0 power.

Edited May 12, 2015 by Alshain

[leilders]

The common logic would have you believe if 1/3 of the panel is covered it should provide 2/3 power, right? That is simply not the case because of the way solar technology works.

[snip]

EDIT: On second thought, I suppose those look like several panels in an array, in which case only the panel that has shadow would be rendered ineffective IF (and only if) it were wired in parallel. If it is wired in series it would have the same effect of 0 power.

And as an engineer you'd know that when developing your panel, puting all the connectors on the bottom part where shadow is bound to happen regularly, is not realy a good idea!

Thus the logic that the panels are not completely in series (one faulty one would break the chain anyways?) . If looking at the ones i use here (1x6) its a good guestimate that all the 6 panels are wired in parallel so if one of those squares would be fully covered with sunlight it would generate at least 1/6th of electricity.

So its :

1) total crazy kerbal engineer wired it all in series with the connector part in the shade

2) a bug

3) suggestions?

Edit: (shouldn't have left the SAS on of course)

EDIT: Its not a crazy kerbal! The outer 3 parts in the sun, and the lower 3 gives an exposure of 0.9!! (Crazy high)

Edited May 12, 2015 by leilders
textual

[Alshain]

And as an engineer you'd know that when developing your panel, puting all the connectors on the bottom part where shadow is bound to happen regularly, is not realy a good idea!

You don't really have a choice. Where else would you put them?

Thus the logic that the panels are not completely in series (one faulty one would break the chain anyways?) . If looking at the ones i use here (1x6) its a good guestimate that all the 6 panels are wired in parallel so if one of those squares would be fully covered with sunlight it would generate at least 1/6th of electricity.

What makes you say that? Series and Parallel are not something you just do because it is convenient. It would be dependent on voltage or charge rate requirements (which to be honest, we don't know in this game). Imagine two AA batteries, they have 1.5 Volts 2000 Amp hours each. If you wire them in parallel (positive to positive and negative to negative) you end up with 1.5 Volts 4000 amp hours. If you wire them in series (positive to negative) you have 3 volts 2000 Amp hours. Now in the case of a solar panel, it's charge rate not amp hours, but it works the same. If you need a higher voltage, you have to wire them in series.

My point is, if you put a shadow on a solar panel, it is unpredictable. You do not know how much power it will actually generate based on a percentage of shadow coverage. It's not a direct correlation, so the game is not wrong. Simply put, don't block the solar panels or reorient your craft so they aren't blocked.

[leilders]

You don't really have a choice. Where else would you put them?

you could easily make a connector for a series of cells (panel) on that panel itself then use a wire of some sort (wouldn't make a difference if its in shade) so you could place it anywhere (if it's practical that depends of course).

What makes you say that? Series and Parallel are not something you just do because it is convenient. It would be dependent on voltage or charge rate requirements (which to be honest, we don't know in this game). Imagine two AA batteries, they have 1.5 Volts 2000 Amp hours each. If you wire them in parallel (positive to positive and negative to negative) you end up with 1.5 Volts 4000 amp hours. If you wire them in series (positive to negative) you have 3 volts 2000 Amp hours. Now in the case of a solar panel, it's charge rate not amp hours, but it works the same. If you need a higher voltage, you have to wire them in series.

take my example from above, you don't have to physically make contact for cells to put in series, AFAIK you'd put multiple cells in series, and then put those parallel. if one of the circuits in series is in shade the other will still generate power. (you could even make it redundant in case if one of the panels would fail over time)

My point is, if you put a shadow on a solar panel, it is unpredictable. You do not know how much power it will actually generate based on a percentage of shadow coverage. It's not a direct correlation, so the game is not wrong. Simply put, don't block the solar panels or reorient your craft so they aren't blocked.

There you are wrong, it is not unpredictable you can in fact perfectly calculate it.

My point is that the game tells you there's ZERO sun exposure, when in fact you can see with your own eyes, that at least a part is exposed.

The whole: "will it generate power" is indeed a question to how it's build (if they even thought about that, there is some kind of calculation based on the exposure, as it gives you, sun exposure, energy flow and status).

In my case, ALL panels were 0 exposure, all were blocked by a decoupler, which is in line, so this is very unlikely scenario imho.

btw: I know how solar cells work to the photon-electron level, I get your point, but its not the issue here

EDIT: If a Cell is in shade, the module will likely not produce electricity, if at least one of the modules in the array is fully lit, the solar array will produce some amount of electricity. (thats what im trying to tell )

Edited May 12, 2015 by leilders

[Alshain]

I'm not sure I'm following your example, but a solar panel is what you are calling module so that may be why you are confused.

I've worked with these things my entire adult life so you are just going to have to take my word for it, that is how they function.

[leilders]

but a solar panel is what you are calling module

If you want to put it like that: My solar array states ZERO exposure, but in fact 5/6th of the solar panels are exposed.

It's still a bug

Of topic: That is a reference picture from NASA, I also know how they work, I've designed them . I also don's see what's the issue here, its about exposure, the one thing you did not comment on.

Also, on a second craft, 3/6th of the solar array was exposed, and the game states it had 0.9 exposure. Sure there's something wrong with the way the exposure is calculated.

Edited May 13, 2015 by leilders