Minor Science Addition/Remover Mod

[ZooNamedGames]

I need a small, easy to use mod which allows players from a roleplay I'm running (off this forum), and they need to be able to add/remove science from their game as part of the roleplay on the forum. So I'd like to simplify it for them so they don't have to open their persists up every other day (sometimes 3 or 4 times a day) just to add/remove science... especially since some of them don't know how to find and work all that stuff. So I'd like a mod which opens a small window, with a button which says "Addition" and when clicked, which switch to "Remove". Below that button, will be a textbox so that they can enter how much they want to add/remove, and then below the textbox, will be a button which says "Modify Science".

Its a small mod, but it does take some minor skills... but its too much for me. So any help? Again, this isn't for personal use, its for my roleplay forum.

[RAINCRAFTER]

One of my friends has released a basic part mod and he wants to learn more, but he is AFK right now. (He is Irish, and he has a cousin from the USA coming over, and he also has to go to a new school, so he needs time away from a computer to experience these things.)

[ZooNamedGames]

Well still, I need someone to help here.

[PringleMan]

If you want something a little less cheaty than manually adding science, there is the Kerbal Science Exchange mod, which lets you exchange funds for science at a rate that improves with higher and higher reputation.

You could also make a small mod for yourself that copies some small experiment like the thermometer. Make it be a repeatable experiment with no decay modifier, so that it never loses its value. Play with it a bit and make it be worth 10 science or whatever for a launchpad experiment and recovery. Then they could add science by launching a pod covered in the things, run the experiment, and recover.

I wish there was a F12 menu cheat button that added individual science though. Not that I would use it, it just seems like that is something that you would be able to do.

[ZooNamedGames]

If you want something a little less cheaty than manually adding science, there is the Kerbal Science Exchange mod, which lets you exchange funds for science at a rate that improves with higher and higher reputation.

You could also make a small mod for yourself that copies some small experiment like the thermometer. Make it be a repeatable experiment with no decay modifier, so that it never loses its value. Play with it a bit and make it be worth 10 science or whatever for a launchpad experiment and recovery. Then they could add science by launching a pod covered in the things, run the experiment, and recover.

I wish there was a F12 menu cheat button that added individual science though. Not that I would use it, it just seems like that is something that you would be able to do.

However none of those options truly does what I need- which is a mod which adds and REMOVES science easily. As there are costs in the roleplay which burn science. So I need something that works both ways and the KSE mod doesn't work since it requires a full career mode. But since money is being managed on the forum, they are using the game's science mode, not the full career. Having a repeatable experiment is not an option as it doesn't offer anyway to REMOVE science. Lastly, I cant make a mod so save my life, hence why I'm asking.

[hab136]

There's A funds, science & rep cheat menu for testing purposes, but it only adds science.

[ZooNamedGames]

There's A funds, science & rep cheat menu for testing purposes, but it only adds science.

I need it to remove too. If it was only addition it would be easier.

Is NO ONE willing to MAKE this mod? I know it doesn't exist, and I cant make it, so can someone else make it? Please?

[Mad Rocket Scientist]

I can't do it, but I would use it!

[PringleMan]

I need it to remove too. If it was only addition it would be easier.

Is NO ONE willing to MAKE this mod? I know it doesn't exist, and I cant make it, so can someone else make it? Please?

Calm down friend. The common response that will be "Make it yourself." We are trying to give you ideas. Have you tried my method with a negative science value? Does that even work?

You are looking for a fancy plugin when such a thing might not even be necessary. It might be possible with just some CFG editing.

edit: So I started playing with it, my idea was to have a negative Xmit scalar to have the game transmit a negative science value. However there is not a way to do that because the game normalizes it to a 0 science value. If they have a line in the base code for the science system that prevents a negative science value for experiments, with subtractions only existing in the research center (which would make sense in order to prevent NaN errors) then it really WILL take a fancy plugin to achieve what you are looking for.

I also tried making a science node in the tech tree that had a negative value, you cannot do that either as near as I could tell

Edited August 8, 2015 by PringleMan

[ZooNamedGames]

Calm down friend. The common response that will be "Make it yourself." We are trying to give you ideas. Have you tried my method with a negative science value? Does that even work?

You are looking for a fancy plugin when such a thing might not even be necessary. It might be possible with just some CFG editing.

Im slightly edgy since Ive been sitting in the same spot for almost 4 hours (2 1/2 of which was during launch) for this never ending mission of mine...

Anyway, the issue is I cant make mods... So not an option there. I could give your idea a shot... but I'd like to have someone on stand by so I don't end up flat footed when it doesn't work. And lastly, manually editing save files is something I know, but its not me knowing that's an issue, its that some of my forum members might not. Some of them don't know and it could take a long time to teach one and as more and more members join it will become impossible to teach them all (one by one) how to do this. I need a mod to do it for me.

[PringleMan]

Im slightly edgy since Ive been sitting in the same spot for almost 4 hours (2 1/2 of which was during launch) for this never ending mission of mine...

Anyway, the issue is I cant make mods... So not an option there. I could give your idea a shot... but I'd like to have someone on stand by so I don't end up flat footed when it doesn't work. And lastly, manually editing save files is something I know, but its not me knowing that's an issue, its that some of my forum members might not. Some of them don't know and it could take a long time to teach one and as more and more members join it will become impossible to teach them all (one by one) how to do this. I need a mod to do it for me.

Why are you unable to make mods? Do you mean you don't have the knowledge to write a plugin? Because what I was suggesting, CFG editing, is just utilizing a text editor. You can create new parts that are duplicates of existing parts with different values extremely easily, without even having knowledge of coding. Just change the value you need. It is possible that I am utilizing the wrong values in the science files with my attempts, so I would not totally hold out that it cannot be done without a plugin.

edit: I dug around through the API in the classes related to science and experiments, and to be honest I don't even see a function that would allow you to directly subtract science without doing some crazy thing. Though granted I have not looked too closely at it. Anyone else have some ideas?

Edited August 8, 2015 by PringleMan

[ZooNamedGames]

I DON'T know how to make mods- any idea or suggestion that I can/could is wrong.. I know how to config, but I DONT want to teach EVERY member of my RP how to do it themselves. I literally cant make this anymore clear on the subject.

I don't need parts, I need a simple mod which adds a box which has two buttons and a text box. Its a heck of lot easier than teaching every forum member how to change their save file's science data every single time. One by one. So please... please just stop trying to offer what I don't need since you obviously are not understanding.

[Windspren]

There's no need to overreact, it hasn't even been a day yet. And anyway, if they can download mods, they should be able to double click on a text file.

[ZooNamedGames]

There's no need to overreact, it hasn't even been a day yet. And anyway, if they can download mods, they should be able to double click on a text file.

You say don't overreact, but you make me say the same thing, again, and again, and again.

They WONT KNOW HOW TO. And Im not teaching every member how to.

[Windspren]

So they know how to access their KSP folder to install mods, extract them and place them in the right folder, but don't know how to open a text file? All you need to do is put a single post on your RP forum telling them to open their persistant file and change a single line of text. In all this time, you could have easily posted that and answered any questions. It's not like its rocket science, right?

- - - Updated - - -

Here's something you can copy and post:

1. Go to your KSP folder (they should know where this is if they can install mods)

2. Go to "saves"

3. Select the save you're using for the RP

4. Open persistant.sfs

5. Hover over "Edit" and type in "Science"

6. Change the Science value to whatever you want

7. ???

8. Profit (or lose science )

[RAINCRAFTER]

Originally, I was going to put an angry post here that basically said that I was a member of the RP that he was talking about, I didn't want to go into the save file to do this stuff every time I got science, the others won't even know how, it is inexcusable that people are saying that he should make it on his own, and that a stock-alike menus creator hasn't gotten here yet to help him. I ragged against those people pretty hard in that first draft of this post, and I would've gotten a not friendly response from the mods. At first, I was just writing in anger to defend my friend who needed help with something. After I mostly wrote it though, logic was thrown into my brain, and I decided to revise the post so it looks better and more sensible than a lot of my other posts. My opinion from the first draft is the same, it's just not as strong. To explain the difference, at the end of that post, I would have probably put this there;

Now though, all I have to say about this big mess is this;

Cheers, Raincrafter.

[DMagic]

I DON'T know how to make mods- any idea or suggestion that I can/could is wrong..

So learn how. It's not that difficult.

Most people make mods because they want them for themselves, not because somebody asks for it. Don't expect anyone to jump at your request unless they have some interest in the idea for themselves.

[ZooNamedGames]

So learn how. It's not that difficult.

Most people make mods because they want them for themselves, not because somebody asks for it. Don't expect anyone to jump at your request unless they have some interest in the idea for themselves.

I don't have time to learn. Moreover, its not something I've ever been good at. Some people are good at some things, and others are not. Nevertheless, even if it was a strong point, I don't have time. Remember, I have a forum to run.

I'm to get interest so someone will jump at it by asking a community, not one person. I'm waiting for someone to take it.

[kmMango]

I don't have time to learn. Moreover, its not something I've ever been good at. Some people are good at some things, and others are not. Nevertheless, even if it was a strong point, I don't have time. Remember, I have a forum to run.

I'm to get interest so someone will jump at it by asking a community, not one person. I'm waiting for someone to take it.

I tried making a mod once. After two days of loading and reloading KSP, praying to every deity I know of, and then just cursing at my computer, I quit. The only other option I could think of was a blood sacrifice to the Unity Gods, but I couldn't get my evil psychopathic cat to stay still for the ritual.

I know you can add science using the F12 Menu, but I'm not sure about removing it.

[SmashingKirby148]

One of my friends has released a basic part mod and he wants to learn more, but he is AFK right now. (He is Irish, and he has a cousin from the USA coming over, and he also has to go to a new school, so he needs time away from a computer to experience these things.)

Again, I'm not gone, it's just that video making is time consuming so I'm taking a break. It's only Youtube.

[RAINCRAFTER]

Again, I'm not gone, it's just that video making is time consuming so I'm taking a break. It's only Youtube.

Ok ok, yay! Do you have any interest in making this mod? (All it is is a simple menu, other people!)

[PringleMan]

Ok ok, yay! Do you have any interest in making this mod? (All it is is a simple menu, other people!)

Friend, it is not a "simple" matter, or I would happily make one for you. As it stands, I also am a pretty crappy programmer. My...issue(?)...is that ZooNamedGames has not shown any input into this other than saying he has to have someone else do it. He has not demonstrated that he has tried to come up with any solutions himself, be it through part editing (like I tried), science nodes, or any other gimmick. Those are all things that, if they worked, could have been done with single value changes to existing CFG files. Some copy and pasting would have created a new part and then hitting save in a text editor. That does not require substantial programming knowledge, it mostly just requires being able to read english.

I can get behind not wanting to try and get everyone else to change save files. But if you look back over the thread, only one single person suggested a save file edit on page 2. And mostly they were saying that if people were able to install a mod, they should be able to edit their save. A justifiable statement.

And ZooNamedGames, as someone who operates several servers for everything from Ark to Jedi Academy, and admins a forum, you do have time to work on this yourself. If it matters to you, take it out of some of your play time.

As it stands, friends, I am not sure that this IS something that can be done the way you want it to be done, as I said before. Looking over the API, I don't see a function in any of the classes that would really allow us to subtract science. I did not look at it too deeply, but it looks like the functions in the classes for science are there to say how much it is worth, and the experimentation I already did has shown that it will not take a negative value. There does not seem to be a hook for the science deduction from buying a node in the tree, but I could be very very wrong.

What that all means, there is not an apparent way to even make the text box with 2 buttons like you want. It is not a matter of the interface, it is the part where you actually have it do something. As near as I can tell, the game will not take a negative science value input without accessing the persist anyways. At that point, it actually will be easier to just open the persist file.

edit: I also tried seeing if science was stored on the same float value every time using Cheat Engine. The answer is no, so making a cheat table for cheat engine is out too.

edit 2: I tried feeding a negative science value into the latest cheat happens trainer for Kerbal, which allows for custom science amounts. The game once again just turned it into a 0 value.

Edited August 9, 2015 by PringleMan

[PringleMan]

I am making a second post because it is sufficiently different.

I had one last idea that I think will work well enough for what you want. IIRC, KSP Interstellar allowed you to upgrade parts in flight, consuming science in the process. The one specifically I am thinking about is the computer core which could be upgraded to an AI core, consuming 100 science. In later version of the mod, it pulled from the actual science pool rather than a resource that he had defined. I have no idea how he managed that, because like I said I don't see a hook in API for that, so his plugin may have been altering the persist directly. IDK.

I think your best bet would be utilizing that. I don't know what the license was on his plugin, but you could probably strip out all of the other parts and resources leaving just the actual plugin. Then just make a copy paste of an existing stock part with whatever cfg module handles the upgrade part from KSP Interstellar. If someone else would like to look in to that, I think that is a good approach. I have given my share to this though, and I am too nervous about messing with another modder's stuff.

Edited August 9, 2015 by PringleMan