Designing a Venus Cloud Base

[Dr.K Kerbal]

On 16 January 2016 at 1:42 PM, AngelLestat said:

Well I could find some extra data about the biggest Venus issue.. how to get water.
At altitudes below 30km up to 10km, in afternoon, is possible to find high (for venus) concentrations of water (without h2so4). Amounts that goes from 50 ppm to 100ppm, This is equal to 50 to 100 grams of water by m3 (15m3 for each liter). The good news is that "afternoon" in venus may last some months if you are anchored to land. Winds are just 10m/s at that height and you can even use some mountains to reduce the cable needs, not sure the best way to collect it, with a scoop or with a big surface a bit more colder to condensate the water.
At 48km, we have the biggest h2so4 precipitation, this is just 10 to 20 ppm, but we don't need extra energy to collect it, only to separate water in case we don't want the acid.
 

Mr. Rubisco,
Is really annoying when you drop numbers without have a real idea or reference of what are you talking about
I made the math, for a 5000 tons habitat, which might be 150m x 150m x 2 floors + 100 people (or more floors and less area, this saves insulation), we need between 0,5mw to 1,3mw. (no gigawatts).
Now this cooling air machine may weight 2 or 4 tons, I will said 1 or 2 if we make it lighter.
Plants can help in the cooling needs, If we have all our roof surface with plants (where habitat air can not flow with the plants and envelope air, but you can visit this section using doors. What happens is that plants receive light and water.. they evaporate that water carrying that heat to the top of the envelope, this cool down few degrees the plants layer and the human habitat below.
If we use the special emissivity cover to radiate heat directly to space, then that is all we need for plants and us. 
A 40m x 12m kite at 48 kmh wind, can generate 8 mw.. So energy in venus is not a real problem.

I am an evidence machine, is time that you provide once a while some evidence.. "as the 1gw air conditioner."
Take a look to the amount of radiation that people receive in airplanes.. then reduce a bit the altitude and increase the time exposure by 50 years. 
Then try to convince all inhabitants they will not die from cancer.

The higher cities are at 4000m in bolivia.  You may have some towns at 5000m but without much stadistic data. At 5000m you have 2 times the shielding than at 7500m.
Is easy to notice this just studying the atmosphere density curve and the area below:
Maybe if instead 57km, you place it at 54,5 may have more sense.

Helium and hydrogen lifting capacity is reduced. Air may increase.. not sure.. if is at higher temperature. You still can do that at 54km, you dont include the habitat inside the lifting envelope, but you deposite there all your waste heat from the machines and you apply special emissivity coefficients to the envelope (different top from bottom) to harvester heat.

Is a good idea, but like different layers means different speeds, you may need to wait quick a lot to to have an interception window (the same as orbits).
if you low the whole lading base for short amount of time (for all kind of isru bases or floating industries), then you might be wasting similar energy in changes of altitude for transport "goods" that the one you waste in cooling. But well, is pointless try to be so energy accurate now.

Almost all problems have solution, the factor here is find the one that is most cost efficient.

The envelope needs certain thick to support the structure, you can divide that thick in 2 or 3 layers.....

I don't understand, now you want a city at 65km?  Reduce the day/night cycle is welcome.. but not really necessary.. I will put this as last of requirements.
About wind speed, I am not interested in wind speed at certain layer.. I am interested in wind gradient.. the difference of wind speed at different layers.. that is the energy you can harvester.
At lower altitudes from 48 to 50, is when most of the speed change happen.

heh, I was trying to said volcano

Ah with electrodynamic tether, yeah I know that technique. but yeah, there is no magnetic field here, also.. we know very little about this.. how much damage might receive this skimming trying to trap super fast particles.

As you can see, we already solve those issues you mention.. we need some chemist.. also other kind of ideas or math is welcome.

Oh my gOSH!!WHY DO YA ALWAIS TOIP HYJE SENTENSES???

...................WHY DO YOU ALWAYS TYPE HUGE SENTENCES???

[Findthepin1]

11 hours ago, Dr.K Kerbal said:

Oh my gOSH!!WHY DO YA ALWAIS TOIP HYJE SENTENSES???

...................WHY DO YOU ALWAYS TYPE HUGE SENTENCES???

As you can see, the sentence you are reading, this quite long one which I wrote to demonstrate this fact that speaking long sentences sounds somewhat more sophisticated than a shorter one; as opposed to a shorter sentence which can mistakenly imply that a speaker wont to forming short sentences might not be able to come up with a more substantial one.

This sentence is shorter. It doesn't sound as smart. That should answer your question. 

Edited February 7, 2016 by Findthepin1